Should Nonconsensual Stories Be Placed in BDSM Category?

[GoonerFool]

Just a question; if a story is fundamentally NC, does it belong in BDSM?

 

[KindredFlame]

Both

Just a question; if a story is fundamentally NC, does it belong in BDSM?

I suppose you are right, however if the non concent leads into them being used in a bdsm way doesn’t it belong in bdsm?

 

[KinkyChefGaia]

When I'm reading BDSM stories I often think they should be in Non-consent, particularly if the "slave" is an unwilling one. I think this makes it easier for BDSM readers who want to assume that SSC or RACK is observed in that category. I also don't think many Non-con readers would be upset if they encountered BDSM in a story that is premised on Non-con, but the same isn't true for BDSM readers that end up unexpectedly reading a story that is premised on something that goes against the core values of BDSM.

 

[Bramblethorn]

I suppose you are right, however if the non concent leads into them being used in a bdsm way doesn’t it belong in bdsm?

What's the difference between "in a BDSM way but without consent" and plain old "sexual assault"/"domestic violence"?

Different folk have different definitions, but I think a lot of BDSMers would say that consent is the element that distinguishes "BDSM" from rape/assault.

(Which is not to say that abusers don't use "BDSM" as an excuse; that certainly does happen.)

 

[AlwaysFara]

Nope. 2 different animals.

 

[Miles Long]

Nope. 2 different animals.

Animals are a completely different species.

 

[AlwaysFara]

Animals are a completely different species.

Maybe the same genus.

 

[clistenovena]

Maybe the same genus.

~laughs and laughs~

One big happy family?

Happy phylum?

Kingdom? Oh! I bet there was loads of non-con in some of those kingdoms back when.

But back to the OP's query.


Non-con http://axiomaction.com/wp-content/uploads/Not-equal-symbol.jpg BDSM.

They each have their own place.

 

[JaneRamsey]

I agree with the above. I actually really hate reading bdsm that clearly is just a non con story.

 

[DVS]

Just a question; if a story is fundamentally NC, does it belong in BDSM?

Where would you expect it to be placed, if not in BDSM? I do think they are in their own subcategory, because this fetish is closely related to BDSM, even when consensual, as when a submissive or especially a slave is included. Some slaves consider their master's will to be over and above their own and so many things could be considered NC, but the slave allows it, because she considers herself to be property or just a body to be used for the master's enjoyment.

Bondage is also used a lot in BDSM and in NC stories, bondage is also prominent. I enjoy bondage a lot, but I only like to imitate NC sex or at least have control, unless my submissive has an issue that needs addressed.

In many cases, NC won't worry about the submissive's needs. Some get into the fake rape scene, and that can get pretty violent. It goes back to the slave participation and what the master wants, the master gets.

 

[lilcuriouscatt]

I don't feel that non-con is a part of BDSM. Even if a couple have the understanding that the dominant has a free hand, usually the sub has agreed to that at some stage. In my thinking, something that is non-con is rape and abuse.

 

[Nezhul]

Yes, a non-con story can feature BDSM themes.

If bondage is used as means to an end to keep the victim helpless and have your non-con way with them - then it belongs into a non-con category.

For me personally, to have a BDSM story both parties should be interested in exploring that aspect, i.e. consenting. If bondage is merely a tool applied to a non-consenting victim - it's still a non-con story. After that, it could be lesbian or gay or incest - it doesn't matter, really. Non-con tends to overshadow everything and becoming the main feature of any story it's present in.

Exceptions could be longer stories where non-con scene is only a small part of it, and serves to move the plot somehow, rather than being the main focus of the story. But I believe that it's too niche of a thing to include in a story on a side-role. Even people who like non-con would probably be distracted by the sudden change of tone and pace. And people who don't like it will hate your entire story because of it. So it's a rare exception.

That said, I find that a lot of people fantasize about BDSM in terms of non-con scenes or settings. Prisons, slavery, rape... People who aren't really into the lifestyle but have such fantasies tend to mix things up and to not see a difference. To them, a girl tortured in a dungeon is BDSM, and it doesn't matter that she didn't agree to it.
Like with games, one of the main drivers of fiction is pretending, or in other words our ability to get immersed in the story and put real value and weight into fictional things.
Public perception doesn't really help. BDSM is still kind of a taboo topic. In fact, I bet you many people who fantasize about it may not even realize that all of that can be practiced in a safe way with consenting partner. I was like that. I always used to imagine scenes of holding a woman down, stripping panties off of her and then havind sex with her while she cries "No! No...!" And for a longest time I thought I was a bit of a freak, not even thinking once that there are girls who WANT that same thing as I do.

 

[Threadbare42]

While I agree non-con stories that feature someone tied up or any other common BDSM motif do still belong in non-con, as some readers definitely want to keep well away from it, I'd like to raise a point here. In the various places I've seen BDSM discussed on the internet, including here, the topic of non-consent, or CNC to be specific, gets brought up frequently, and as such it can at least be viewed as a very niche sub-category of BDSM. There is a crossover there. Now you might argue CNC is consensual, but it's still about indulging the fantasy of someone overpowering you or vice-versa, and most people read non-con stories, I would imagine, for a similar reason.

 

[Bramblethorn]

While I agree non-con stories that feature someone tied up or any other common BDSM motif do still belong in non-con, as some readers definitely want to keep well away from it, I'd like to raise a point here. In the various places I've seen BDSM discussed on the internet, including here, the topic of non-consent, or CNC to be specific, gets brought up frequently, and as such it can at least be viewed as a very niche sub-category of BDSM. There is a crossover there. Now you might argue CNC is consensual, but it's still about indulging the fantasy of someone overpowering you or vice-versa, and most people read non-con stories, I would imagine, for a similar reason.

I think non-con is very common as a fantasy for BDSM play, and I'm sure there are a lot of BDSMers reading the NC section avidly for that reason. Me included, when I have reading time

But I draw a distinction between the two categories for the same reason that I draw a distinction between "pretending to rape somebody who pretends to be unwilling" and "actually raping somebody who is actually unwilling".

 

[FurryFury]

I've certainly written some non consent or reluctant consent and / or general mind fuckery that I put in the BDSM category. That's how they felt in my mind and my kink and that's where I enjoyed them being when I conceived them. Mostly as a function of our rape / say no society and pre self acknowledgement of and finding terms for my own kink. At one time I thought of these fantasies as shameful and then I shared them. I was terrified that people would hate them. But, and I admit I choose carefully, most were also turned on by it. So I can see it both ways.

I've read a metric fuck ton of BDSM stories and novels. What bothers me far more in BDSM, is everyone being rich, beautiful, not using protection, trusting complete strangers, having no boundaries, and so on and on . . . Gah!

 

[DVS]

I've certainly written some non consent or reluctant consent and / or general mind fuckery that I put in the BDSM category. That's how they felt in my mind and my kink and that's where I enjoyed them being when I conceived them. Mostly as a function of our rape / say no society and pre self acknowledgement of and finding terms for my own kink. At one time I thought of these fantasies as shameful and then I shared them. I was terrified that people would hate them. But, and I admit I choose carefully, most were also turned on by it. So I can see it both ways.

I've read a metric fuck ton of BDSM stories and novels. What bothers me far more in BDSM, is everyone being rich, beautiful, not using protection, trusting complete strangers, having no boundaries, and so on and on . . . Gah!

Hi, sweetie. Long time no see.
I once wrote a non-consent story that was truly non-consensual until the very end. It was about a white supremacist group of sorts, who sexually tortured a couple of women that they thought knew something about the group and had informed the FBI.

One woman agent infiltrated the group and she was eventually found out and also tortured. But the troops were watching and they were able to break up the group and arrest them all. Well, except for the leader, who got away.

In the story, bondage was used, mental and sexual torment was used and electroplay (my favorite kind of torment) but nobody was permanently hurt or killed. And in the end, the bad guys lost.

My story was rejected by Literotica as being too non-consensual for the non-consensual section. It was suggested that I remove the bondage parts, and they would then publish it. Well, without the bondage, it was no longer non-consensual, so I refused.

I did post it on Fetlife, in my story section over there. If you are a member there, and you want to read it, I'm DVS over there, too.

I never really understood the reason my story wasn't published. My guess is they didn't read to the end and made their decision from one of the first few chapters. If they had read the whole story, maybe it would have changed their minds. Who knows.

I still think non-consensual stories should be within the BDSM realm. They have all of the main aspects of a BDSM story...sexual acts, bondage, a victim and a perpetrator, which would be dom and sub in some stories, and in the end, everybody is happy.

 

[AllenWoody]

I agree one hundred percent with what Nezhul wrote above. If the only reason bondage is employed is to restrain someone while forcing sex on them then it's a non-con story.

I've also had non-con stories rejected because, in so many words, they were asymmetrical. The first story I submitted for example got sent back because the female being taken advantage of was portrayed too clearly as a victim. I had to rewrite portions of the story to demonstrate that she at least received sexual pleasure.* I find this to be a bit contrived.


*I'd like to clarify that I respect the wishes of the Lit editorial staff and don't mind writing within their guidelines. I enjoy writing and being 'published', so...

 

[FurryFury]

I check it out though I admit, these days I'm afraid of reading many things, and white supremacist might trigger me. Damn these nasty political days.

Hi, sweetie. Long time no see.
I once wrote a non-consent story that was truly non-consensual until the very end. It was about a white supremacist group of sorts, who sexually tortured a couple of women that they thought knew something about the group and had informed the FBI.

One woman agent infiltrated the group and she was eventually found out and also tortured. But the troops were watching and they were able to break up the group and arrest them all. Well, except for the leader, who got away.

In the story, bondage was used, mental and sexual torment was used and electroplay (my favorite kind of torment) but nobody was permanently hurt or killed. And in the end, the bad guys lost.

My story was rejected by Literotica as being too non-consensual for the non-consensual section. It was suggested that I remove the bondage parts, and they would then publish it. Well, without the bondage, it was no longer non-consensual, so I refused.

I did post it on Fetlife, in my story section over there. If you are a member there, and you want to read it, I'm DVS over there, too.

I never really understood the reason my story wasn't published. My guess is they didn't read to the end and made their decision from one of the first few chapters. If they had read the whole story, maybe it would have changed their minds. Who knows.

I still think non-consensual stories should be within the BDSM realm. They have all of the main aspects of a BDSM story...sexual acts, bondage, a victim and a perpetrator, which would be dom and sub in some stories, and in the end, everybody is happy.

 

[DVS]

I check it out though I admit, these days I'm afraid of reading many things, and white supremacist might trigger me. Damn these nasty political days.

To be honest, I don't remember if it was a white supremacist group or something else that needed to be kept in the shadows from the law. The story had nothing to do with that, anyway. It was just an angle so the rest of the story could unfold as I wanted it to. The different group members and the women victims were the bulk of the story.

You should know me by now. It involves some interesting electrical torment.