Continuing a story that isn't yours?

[Grandeman]

Hi all, longtime lurker attempting to become a first time writer here. There's a serialized story on here that I consider a masterpiece that drops off at a point where it appears to me the original author lost interest. This is the author's only story and, as is common, they've left a way to contact them but they no longer answer. I've been looking at how I would continue this series for over a year and am finally ready to begin the continuation.

What steps would you take to make this happen? In order to get the sequel series associated with the original would I need to get the original author's blessing? If I don't get that blessing, can I still go ahead and write it and cite the original series in my intro? Can anyone point me to some examples of different ways this has been done? I know I've seen it done once with a sci fi series on here, but I didn't take note of it at the time and now I can't find it.

Thanks
G

 

[RejectReality]

If you don't have the original author's permission to continue their story, you shouldn't do it.

You don't know the circumstances behind why it stopped. Maybe it was written for or about someone, and the person passed away. You could be ripping open a raw wound. An extreme example, yes, but entirely plausible.

 

[SimonDoom]

If you continue the author's story without the author's permission, you are infringing the author's copyright in the story. Don't do it. You might also run afoul of this site's owner's rules.

Don't do this without permission.

 

[KeithD]

It's unethical, but it's not a copyright issue. (You can't copyright a title or a theme or a general characterization. You could copyright a specific created character, but that would have to be formally applied for, which is unlikely to happen with a Literotica story.) There are cases in which it would be a trademark issue, but it's highly unlikely any of these Literotica stories are trademarked. (A trademark isn't easy to justify or to get.)

But it's unethical.

 

[ChloeTzang]

It's unethical, but it's not a copyright issue. (You can't copyright a title or a theme or a general characterization. You could copyright a specific created character, but that would have to be formally applied for, which is unlikely to happen with a Literotica story.) There are cases in which it would be a trademark issue, but it's highly unlikely any of these Literotica stories are trademarked. (A trademark isn't easy to justify or to get.)

But it's unethical.

It's a bit of a grey area isn't it? I'm looking at published novels, and the Flashman series by George MacDonald Fraser.

Now, I'm looking at another author, Robert Brightwell and his "Thomas Flashman" series

In his Amazon bio, he says "George MacDonald Fraser was an exceptional writer and he developed a character that he took from Tom Brown's School Days into a truly legendary figure. While Harry Flashman might not have been a typical Victorian, he certainly brought the period to life. For me the Regency/Napoleonic era was one of even greater colour and extremes and so I have created a new earlier member of the family: Thomas Flashman."

What Brightwell has done is piggyback of another author's success with a new character, a slightly different era etc etc but he's credited Fraser and Flashman as his inspiration. Now to me, that's a bit grey but I think obviously it passes the legitimacy test. I actually just ran into these, and I'm going to pick the first couple up and read them just to see how good they are.

I agree that it'd be unethical to pick up another writer's story without permission, but the OP could try this approach perhaps.

 

[ishtat]

Apart from the ethical issues - whether you believe in them or not, there is something else; there are numerous examples of writers who have decided to do this with very poor results. A good example is VertigoJ's "Party of Five" This was a very popular series some 12/14 years ago and there have been at least two attempts to finish it.

Both attempts were hopeless, instead of there being a favourable comparison they were entirely unfavourable and fans of the original story did not hesitate to say so. The finishers thought to use the existing fan base - in reality the idea blew up in their faces.

On the other hand there is a well known and popular author who regularly pinches plots from others successfully. However, firstly he always acknowledges the original author, and secondly he had a pre-existing and good reputation as a writer.

Not worth the risk perhaps.

 

[Maeven_quinn]

Hi all, longtime lurker attempting to become a first time writer here. There's a serialized story on here that I consider a masterpiece that drops off at a point where it appears to me the original author lost interest. This is the author's only story and, as is common, they've left a way to contact them but they no longer answer. I've been looking at how I would continue this series for over a year and am finally ready to begin the continuation.

What steps would you take to make this happen? In order to get the sequel series associated with the original would I need to get the original author's blessing? If I don't get that blessing, can I still go ahead and write it and cite the original series in my intro? Can anyone point me to some examples of different ways this has been done? I know I've seen it done once with a sci fi series on here, but I didn't take note of it at the time and now I can't find it.

Thanks
G

It's not something I would want done with my work, even abandoned worked that I've had on other sites.

If you want to write a story, write a story. Write your own story. That's what this site is for.

 

[SimonDoom]

It's a bit of a grey area isn't it? I'm looking at published novels, and the Flashman series by George MacDonald Fraser.

Now, I'm looking at another author, Robert Brightwell and his "Thomas Flashman" series

In his Amazon bio, he says "George MacDonald Fraser was an exceptional writer and he developed a character that he took from Tom Brown's School Days into a truly legendary figure. While Harry Flashman might not have been a typical Victorian, he certainly brought the period to life. For me the Regency/Napoleonic era was one of even greater colour and extremes and so I have created a new earlier member of the family: Thomas Flashman."

What Brightwell has done is piggyback of another author's success with a new character, a slightly different era etc etc but he's credited Fraser and Flashman as his inspiration. Now to me, that's a bit grey but I think obviously it passes the legitimacy test. I actually just ran into these, and I'm going to pick the first couple up and read them just to see how good they are.

I agree that it'd be unethical to pick up another writer's story without permission, but the OP could try this approach perhaps.

Reading the blurb that he wrote, I'm surprised he did this and got away with it. I think what he did pushes right up against the line of copyright infringement, although perhaps the characters and events are so different that he felt it was OK.

But this is different from continuing another author's ongoing story with the same characters and continuation of the plot. That's much more likely to be copyright infringement if the copyright in the original work is still in force.

Keep in mind too that giving someone credit doesn't remedy copyright infringement. It's irrelevant.

 

[Areala-chan]

Not to dogpile, but this is really not a good idea, for a variety of reasons. You don't know the author's original intentions for the story's continuation, you don't know why they stopped writing it, and if that's a temporary or permanent break from the site.

Not that any of my stuff was worth continuing, but I took an eleven year vacation from Literotica between posting my first couple of stories back in '03 and my return in 2014. I'd have been livid to find someone writing sequels to my stuff without my permission, and rightfully so.

If you absolutely must write a continuation of the story, write it for yourself and leave it on your own computer. Piggybacking off someone else's work isn't contributing to the site, it's contributing to your own ego at best. Pen something that stands on its own, take the comments and suggestions you receive to heart, and work to produce something better. Lather, rinse, repeat. That author's story and characters are tools for producing their own creative works, and they belong to them. Don't take someone else's tools to use for yourself, even if it looks like they're just lying there, abandoned. Get your own tools. Your work will be a thousand times better for it, and it will succeed or fail on its own merits.

Consider the possibilities if you do continue this person's work. Let's say it gets a great response: how much of that response is due to the work you did, and how much of it can be laid at the feet of the writer who left such an entertaining world open? How do you know how much of that success can be claimed by you, versus the world the original storyteller built?

By contrast, suppose it fails spectacularly: how much of that is your fault, and how much of it is the fault of the writer who came before? You don't know the original author's intent and mindset when it came to their characters...are you sure you captured them properly, or did you miss some nuances that original readers latched on to and bombed you for overlooking?

When you aren't using your own tools, you can never be sure how much of the credit or blame you as author are worthy of. You may think you did wonderfully, but you're manipulating unfamiliar equipment on the basis of having watched someone else do it instead of training on it yourself.

Bring your own tools. That way, if you succeed, you know it was 100% due to your efforts. Likewise if you fail, you can modify your writer's toolbox and do better next time. But don't take someone else's stuff without asking. That ain't cool.

 

[MelissaBaby]

I am about halfway through a long series. I know the major events that have yet to occur, and I know how it ends. If something should happen to me before the story concludes, I could not prevent someone else from finishing it. But whatever they wrote would probably be wrong.

 

[AfterDusk]

I think the resounding answer is no, you should not do this. I commend you for asking for an opinion, though, instead of investing your time and publishing only to get negative comments and feedback as a result.

Writing is a very personal thing for most authors; we create, we breathe life into characters, we pull magic out of thin air and turn it into a universe. For someone else to take that away from us is akin to the worst kind of theft because they stole something that was entirely our own.

I have never been a fan of regurgitated/refurbished stories to begin with, fan fiction included. Make something of your own, come up with a unique idea and go from there--don't take from someone else.

While this has been done with some success before (I'd point out Robert Ludlum's Bourne series) I honestly think it is pretty tacky. I know I'd be furious if someone did this to my work, even posthumously.

 

[Grandeman]

Thanks everyone for your input. I respect the ethics of the situation and would never seek to publish as proposed without permission. I think I know what I'm most likely to do next in the following order:

A. Nothing. Most times in seeking out a detail for my imagined continuation I get lost in the original and nothing comes of it. I could probably do that until I find another inspiring story.

B. This:

If you absolutely must write a continuation of the story, write it for yourself and leave it on your own computer.

Considering the suggestion that it may have been discontinued out of some kind of trauma, I'll probably make one last effort at seeking permission (after all, the author(s) haven't removed the story or their contact info) and then proceed with whatever that results in. If they don't deem it good enough, I have the events I need for my personal closure. If it inspires them out of retirement or if they want to collaborate, yahtzee.

C. Write something else. To me, the original story is the most exciting thing I've read in the realm of erotic fiction. It speaks to an understanding of the darker side of what I'm into (and not proud of) that makes me feel a little less alone in the world. For me, the story hints at things to come yet never gets there. I expect that's true for a lot of stories to a lot of people on this site. So, I think I need to finish that journey for myself. And I can see how the pitfalls of finishing someone else's story isn't really finishing my own journey. But right now, I have a bunch of half finished way too autobiographical stories of my own that I don't feel worthy of the world. I think seeing this one through (with or without permission) IS the first step on my own journey. Ultimately the goal is to write something satisfying on my own and have that be the next step on my journey. But I feel I can't ignore the way this story constantly calls to me.

Again, thanks everybody. Keep the input coming. I appreciate all of it.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Reading the blurb that he wrote, I'm surprised he did this and got away with it. I think what he did pushes right up against the line of copyright infringement, although perhaps the characters and events are so different that he felt it was OK.

But this is different from continuing another author's ongoing story.....

Totally agree. I thought it was pushing right up against the boundary of that grey line myself, and I'd suspect that's about as far as one should go.

To the OP. Yes, that was a good question and a good idea to ask first. The consensus is pretty much no, you shouldn't continue someone else's story without permission.

But on the other hand, stealing the plot is totally acceptable. Use the plot outline and just write your own story and see how that shakes down. Nothing wrong with stealing plots, if Shakespeare did it, it's good enough for us

 

[ElectricBlue]

C. Write something else. To me, the original story is the most exciting thing I've read in the realm of erotic fiction. It speaks to an understanding of the darker side of what I'm into (and not proud of) that makes me feel a little less alone in the world. For me, the story hints at things to come yet never gets there. I expect that's true for a lot of stories to a lot of people on this site. So, I think I need to finish that journey for myself. And I can see how the pitfalls of finishing someone else's story isn't really finishing my own journey. But right now, I have a bunch of half finished way too autobiographical stories of my own that I don't feel worthy of the world. I think seeing this one through (with or without permission) IS the first step on my own journey. Ultimately the goal is to write something satisfying on my own and have that be the next step on my journey. But I feel I can't ignore the way this story constantly calls to me.

Again, thanks everybody. Keep the input coming. I appreciate all of it.

It seems to me that you have sufficient personal motivation to write your own story, which ultimately would shine far brighter as it would have your truth at the heart of it, not someone else’s. Besides, if you can’t trust yourself to do justice to your own work, how on earth can you do justice to another writer’s work? Believe in yourself, write your own. That’s what we all do .

 

[AfterDusk]

But I feel I can't ignore the way this story constantly calls to me.

This is what makes a good story a great story. There have been several over the years that have haunted me in this way and it helps to spur me to create anew--because I want to do this for someone else. Good luck in your endeavors.

 

[Hypoxia]

I have invited readers to continue certain of my stories. I would not go ballistic if a random scribbler built on a storyline of mine without asking me -- I don't get paid and I would at least want to be cited as the source. But I would only extend another's storyline 1) with explicit permission, or 2) as an obvious parody. Try WAR AND PEACE AND STRAP-ONS.

 

[ChloeTzang]

This is what makes a good story a great story. There have been several over the years that have haunted me in this way and it helps to spur me to create anew--because I want to do this for someone else. Good luck in your endeavors.

Yes, I'm with you on that. That's actually how I got started here with my very first story ("Hayley's Party"). I started with someone else's story that I really liked and sat down and used it as the starting point. The first couple of try's actually got rejected for plagiarism (duh! I had no idea) but eventually my rewrites were original enough that Laurel passed it. Back then I had no idea the AH even existed or that there was somewhere to ask stuff like this so I just kept trying... and trying to figure out the rules for submissions as I went.

Guess it worked... eventually.

 

[Hypoxia]

Yes, I'm with you on that. That's actually how I got started here with my very first story...

My first series (which got bumped to second for good reason) arose because I read LIT tales with bad orthography and thought, "I can write better than that!" I copied only myself and I'm a bad model. I recall James Thurber being told how much a reader loved a French translation. He replied, "Yes, I suffer in the original." That's me.

Do LIT stories exist that I'd like to extend? Sure. Would I bother? Nope.

 

[LupusDei]

Just one little point about possible reasons of abandonment that haven't been mentioned, I think.

There's possibility the story already have continuation, but just haven't it published here.

I know at least one story that was left in the middle here, while eventually sold as a book in the entirety. Now, several years later, author is publishing new chapters here as well. In this or similar case you likely could contact the author. However, all there is, is an email account linked to site account on creation, it may get lost or left unattended for long periods.

Or, suppose the ending was written, but rejected by the site for publication, for exceeding it's stated limits. Instead of rewriting it author took it elsewhere or kept for himself. In this case author may even ignore this site on purpose. Taking the story down require a request, on this site accounts don't die out of old age on their own.


As far I understand, you want to write a new story about something that happened after where the original story was left to be. Do you really require the original involved for that? Perhaps you can define your own characters that have histories somewhat similar to events in that story, without referencing it verbatim? That gives, even encourage, liberties with the source of inspiration in ways attempt of explicit continuation would forbid. I'm a littke unsure how 'grey' such approach could turn out to be, I suppose taking the basic pith, general plot line and life situation would be OK, but way too much exactly matching detail might raise concerns.

 

[KeithD]

I don't think any reasoning is needed on why a series here hasn't been continued here. The ethics of the issue is that the ball is in the court of the one wanting to piggyback on someone else's work. It's up to them to actively obtain permissions. It doesn't matter if the original author doesn't answer. Barring that, it's unethical to do (except, as noted before, in parody form--then it most likely is just rude). Laurel doesn't have to justify not accepting the continuation or build by another author if she decides she doesn't want to accept it.

 

[Son_of_Battles]

To the op. If a story speaks to you this much that you want to continue, then follow Chloe's advice. Take the basic plot and make it your own.

Before I even thought about writing, and I was still just lurking the halls of this site, I ran across the story 'Kim gets off to college'. It was about a bouy accidental accepted to an all girls school with a full scholarship, and him turning himself into a girl so he could still go. I tried to contact the author for ages to see if I could continue it to no avail, so I wrote my own story about the same thing. New characters, new personalities, and new conflicts. Women's Studiesis now over 250k words long with 12 chapters posted, and while it retains the basics of the story that inspired it, it has become so much more.

My advice, find out what about this story you enjoyed so much and take that 'thing' and see if you can create your own story around that idea. There might be nothing no new under the sun, but you can 'turn' something so the light hits it in a new and different way.

SoB

 

[Kantarii]

No unfinished story has ever moved me want to finish what the original author wrote. That doesn’t, however, mean it didn’t inspire me in some way being relatable to my own life events. Still, I wouldn’t cross the lines and try to finish someone else story. I would write my own. Only I know what my characters thoughts and emotions would be in certain situations within the story I’m writing.
Kant.

 

[Hypoxia]

Sufficient universes float in my head that I rarely need pilfer one from outside. I did write a SF series set in a world where KING KONG and JURASSIC PARK were documentaries and I suppose it could be seen as a sequel to the first KONG flick. But nobody else had done a BRIDE OF KONG and I figured, why not? Call it homáge and be done.

 

[Charmolypi]

I have such a draft on my computer and so far I’ve shared it with no one. It was surprisingly satisfying just to write if for myself. I have considered contacting the author and asking permission to to share it with him alone. Best case scenario being he takes it as flattery for creating a compelling story. Or it could be misconstrued as attempt to steal a story. I’m not sure I’m willing to risk the current contentment I have with it right now.

 

[Handley_Page]

It's a bit of a grey area isn't it? I'm looking at published novels, and the Flashman series by George MacDonald Fraser.

Now, I'm looking at another author, Robert Brightwell and his "Thomas Flashman" series

In his Amazon bio, he says "George MacDonald Fraser was an exceptional writer and he developed a character that he took from Tom Brown's School Days into a truly legendary figure. While Harry Flashman might not have been a typical Victorian, he certainly brought the period to life. For me the Regency/Napoleonic era was one of even greater colour and extremes and so I have created a new earlier member of the family: Thomas Flashman."

What Brightwell has done is piggyback of another author's success with a new character, a slightly different era etc etc but he's credited Fraser and Flashman as his inspiration. Now to me, that's a bit grey but I think obviously it passes the legitimacy test. I actually just ran into these, and I'm going to pick the first couple up and read them just to see how good they are.

I agree that it'd be unethical to pick up another writer's story without permission, but the OP could try this approach perhaps.

Would that be in the manner of the Bear's "Tales from the Guilds", being a good bit of writing in the 'ethos' of the late Terry Pratchett ?
As long as the OP makes it abundantly clear that it's almost a 'homage' to the original, I cannot see too many problems.