How To Get To Heaven When You Die

[phrodeau]

God wants a relationship with you!



He wants a relationship with you too. It's interesting to me that after all your negative ranting the sentence you end with doesn't say there's absolutely no God, but it says that he almost certainly doesn't exist. I think. Hmmm almost. What if he does?

Some good reading if you want to look into it further is The Case for Christ by Lee Strobel. Lee Strobel was an atheist that worked for the Chicago Tribune. He was not thrilled when his wife became a Christian. He began on a journey of looking at the evidence for Christ. Cold-Case Christianity: A Homicide Detective Investigates the Claims of the Gospels by J. Warner Wallace is another good one. J. Warner Wallace was an atheist homicide detective who decided to look at the case for Christ like a cold Case. Lastly is a book called Evidence that Demands a Verdict by Josh McDowell. As a young man, Josh McDowell considered himself an agnostic. He truly believed that Christianity was worthless. However, when challenged to intellectually examine the claims of Christianity, Josh discovered compelling, overwhelming evidence for the reliability of the Christian faith.

The additional evidence that I can give is a life changed.......mine. I truly wish you every happiness in your journey.

Kath

Then be sure to buy the video, the commemorative candle, the special shawl and the beads that were touched by a celebrity.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Are you willing to bet your Soul on that?

My soul is with the true God of the Bible, The Lord Jesus Christ through faith in Him and His death, burial and resurrection for my sins.

 

[Led_Astray]

It's interesting to me that after all your negative ranting the sentence you end with doesn't say there's absolutely no God, but it says that he almost certainly doesn't exist.

That's because, unlike the religious, I know don't claim to KNOW things that are unprovable. There might be a god. It might be Yaweh (or Allah, to use his other common name). Iit might be Shiva. it might be Woden, or Cthulhu. There might also be a teapot floating midway between earth and mars, but I don't intend to let something so ephemeral and unproven dominate my life.[/QUOTE]

What's also interesting is that you write off as "ranting" my (very short) list of terrible things that God certainly did, if you believe the stories in the Bible.

Why is that?

The additional evidence that I can give is a life changed.......mine.

I personally know two people who changed, after being brought up non-religious, into practicing muslims. If we get to include "God changed my life" as evidence, my evidence suggests Islam is twice as likely to be the correct religion as Christianity.

 

[Tryharder62]

Then be sure to buy the video, the commemorative candle, the special shawl and the beads that were touched by a celebrity.

Are you from Colorado? Quit smoking that stuff! Actually, I'm buying potatoe chips looking for a sign.

https://youtu.be/zslgqpQFw8k

 

[Tryharder62]

Led_Astray
What's also interesting is that you write off as "ranting" my (very short) list of terrible things that God certainly did, if you believe the stories in the Bible.
Why is that?

Because you dwell in the Old Testement. Read the whole book. *Spoiler Alert!* Good triumphs over evil.

I personally know two people who changed, after being brought up non-religious, into practicing muslims. If we get to include "God changed my life" as evidence, my evidence suggests Islam is twice as likely to be the correct religion as Christianity.

So you never did tell me....what do you believe? What is your truth? Why?

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

God is searching for me? I'm pretty sure He has my address. His sales reps come to my doorstep often enough.

And just for fun, he uses competing third party contractors. Catholics, JWs, Mormons, Baptists, all third parties.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

5 must-see Christian movies coming this fall

Read more at https://www.wnd.com/2018/08/5-must-see-christian-movies-coming-this-fall/#xcXvwLTToW3ubzfh.99

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

George Carlin called it, folks.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8r-e2NDSTuE

 

[Led_Astray]

Because you dwell in the Old Testement. Read the whole book. *Spoiler Alert!* Good triumphs over evil.

Wait, so the good god of the New Testament comes along and triumphs over the bad god of the old testament? What happened to there being only one god? Or did he beat himself up?

Or did the "infallible" evil murderous god suddenly realise that maybe murdering innocent babies, setting bears on children, and condoning rape and slavery were wrong, and become a reformed character?

It's irrelevant anyway. If I wrote a book about a serial killer in which many horrible deeds were done, but in the second half of the book he does no more killing and instead starts voluntary work helping orphaned puppies, I wouldn't expect people to end the book thinking that those murders don't matter. I wouldn't expect my publisher to sell it as a book about how fulfilling voluntary work is, and get annoyed when people point out the horrible murders. I certainly wouldn't be reading it to children and telling them "This is a person you should model yourself on".

So you never did tell me....what do you believe? What is your truth? Why?

I believe we are products of evolution (for which there is a ton of evidence), formed from atoms forged in the hearts of stars (evidence), with one life to live.

I believe in that which can be observed, tested and measured.

I believe each of the major religion has been used as a tool to bully, browbeat and coerce people throughout history, all the way up to modern day (cf the people in this thread telling us we are going to hell if we don't believe in the same mythology as them) and that we would be better off without them.

But I believe that you are free to believe whatever you like as long as that belief does not cause you to harm or attempt to control others. But if you make public announcements about your faith being the only correct one you'd better have some evidence if you don't want to be challenged and ridiculed.

 

[Tryharder62]

5 must-see Christian movies coming this fall

Read more at https://www.wnd.com/2018/08/5-must-see-christian-movies-coming-this-fall/#xcXvwLTToW3ubzfh.99

Oooooooh! They look good don't they!

 

[Tryharder62]

I believe we are products of evolution (for which there is a ton of evidence), formed from atoms forged in the hearts of stars (evidence), with one life to live.

I believe in that which can be observed, tested and measured.

I believe each of the major religion has been used as a tool to bully, browbeat and coerce people throughout history, all the way up to modern day (cf the people in this thread telling us we are going to hell if we don't believe in the same mythology as them) and that we would be better off without them.

But I believe that you are free to believe whatever you like as long as that belief does not cause you to harm or attempt to control others. But if you make public announcements about your faith being the only correct one you'd better have some evidence if you don't want to be challenged and ridiculed.

I don't see any empiracle evidence that we came from stars. No evidence that was observed tested and measured. No one was there.

Empirical (or operational) science involves:

Repeatable observation and measurement followed by analysis, hypothesis building and testing. These activities can only be done in the present.
Empirical science is responsible for developing all the laws of physics and chemistry and all of modern technology and medicine.

Historical (or forensic) science involves:

Unobservable and unrepeatable events of the past. The distant past is neither observable nor repeatable so scientists must make multiple assumptions, inferences, extrapolations, and conjectures about what sequence of past events might lead to present observation.
Historical science tells us something about where we came from, who we are (or ‘should’ be), and where we might (or ‘should’) go from here. These are intensely interesting and often controversial issues. These issues involve worldviews and religious positions.

We are both in the historical evidence boat.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Oooooooh! They look good don't they!

Oh yes they do!

 

[Led_Astray]

I don't see any empiracle evidence that we came from stars. No evidence that was observed tested and measured. No one was there.

Empirical (or operational) science involves:

Repeatable observation and measurement followed by analysis, hypothesis building and testing. These activities can only be done in the present.
Empirical science is responsible for developing all the laws of physics and chemistry and all of modern technology and medicine.

Thing is, you can come up with a theory about what might have happened in the past, (eg, the big bang) then think about what you would expect to find in the present if the theory was true. There is a ton of stuff (The redshift of distant galaxies, the presence of background cosmic radiation, the extant ratios of certain elements) that supports the Big Bang Theory of creation.

So, no, we are not both in the historical evidence boat.

In fact, neither of us are. I'm in the "modern observational evidence" boat and you are in the "We have a special book" boat.

Anyway, its been fun, but I'm going away for a few days. If you do manage to come up with that one thing I have been asking for - evidence of your faith being the one true faith that a member of another faith could not equally claim, then I look forward to seeing it.

(A handy way for you to tell if its evidence worth presenting - if you, personally, would not dismiss if it were presented by a member of another faith, about their faith, then it might be good evidence)

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Wait, so the good god of the New Testament comes along and triumphs over the bad god of the old testament? What happened to there being only one god? Or did he beat himself up?

Or did the "infallible" evil murderous god suddenly realise that maybe murdering innocent babies, setting bears on children, and condoning rape and slavery were wrong, and become a reformed character?

It's irrelevant anyway. If I wrote a book about a serial killer in which many horrible deeds were done, but in the second half of the book he does no more killing and instead starts voluntary work helping orphaned puppies, I wouldn't expect people to end the book thinking that those murders don't matter. I wouldn't expect my publisher to sell it as a book about how fulfilling voluntary work is, and get annoyed when people point out the horrible murders. I certainly wouldn't be reading it to children and telling them "This is a person you should model yourself on".




I believe we are products of evolution (for which there is a ton of evidence), formed from atoms forged in the hearts of stars (evidence), with one life to live.

I believe in that which can be observed, tested and measured.

I believe each of the major religion has been used as a tool to bully, browbeat and coerce people throughout history, all the way up to modern day (cf the people in this thread telling us we are going to hell if we don't believe in the same mythology as them) and that we would be better off without them.

But I believe that you are free to believe whatever you like as long as that belief does not cause you to harm or attempt to control others. But if you make public announcements about your faith being the only correct one you'd better have some evidence if you don't want to be challenged and ridiculed.

The God of the OT IS the same God of the NT. He's not bad, mankind is bad. God isn't a murderer, He's God. He allows things for a reason. You need to trust Him. You say that you believe in what can be observed, measured and tested, but you seem to believe in the God of the Bible, you just don't like Him because you can't control Him. Of course we are free to believe what we want, BUT, there are dire consequences if you choose not to believe in the God of the Bible. God could force you to love Him, but He doesn't do that. Free will, but we aren't set free of the consequences of out choices.

 

[Tryharder62]

Anyway, its been fun, but I'm going away for a few days. If you do manage to come up with that one thing I have been asking for - evidence of your faith being the one true faith that a member of another faith could not equally claim, then I look forward to seeing it.

(A handy way for you to tell if its evidence worth presenting - if you, personally, would not dismiss if it were presented by a member of another faith, about their faith, then it might be good evidence)

I enjoyed talking to you too. Have a good few days.

So it is up to me what evidence is worth presenting? Yippeee! Let me tell you about a man named Jesus

 

[runsilent]

I enjoyed talking to you too. Have a good few days.

So it is up to me what evidence is worth presenting? Yippeee! Let me tell you about a man named Jesus

God knows what you do in the quiet times. On the internet. Do you think he would approve?

 

[Tryharder62]

God knows what you do in the quiet times. On the internet. Do you think he would approve?

I have answered this question already, but thank you for your concern for me!

 

[Led_Astray]

Still here, waiting for my travel companions to arrive

God isn't a murderer,

Every innocent child at the time of the flood would disagree.

Every first born child of Egypt just before the exodus would disagree.

The kids who got ripped apart by bears for making fun of a bald guy would disagree.

Anyone who happened to be looking in the wrong direction at the time of Sodom and Gamorah would disagree.

Every child who had their brains dashed against rocks as commanded by your god would disagree.

Every woman stoned to death for not being a virgin on her wedding day, as instructed by your god, would disagree.

So it is up to me what evidence is worth presenting? Yippeee! Let me tell you about a man named Jesus

OK. And let me tell you about a man named Nanak. Who was drawn up to heaven for three days to speak directly with God, then returned to become a Guru, and preach a creed of acceptance and tolerance for all others no matter their faith. (Instead of telling everyone else they were going to hell).

Why should I give Jesus my loyalty when you wont give Guru Nanak yours? The dude actually spoke to God!

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Still here, waiting for my travel companions to arrive



Every innocent child at the time of the flood would disagree.

Every first born child of Egypt just before the exodus would disagree.

The kids who got ripped apart by bears for making fun of a bald guy would disagree.

Anyone who happened to be looking in the wrong direction at the time of Sodom and Gamorah would disagree.

Every child who had their brains dashed against rocks as commanded by your god would disagree.

Every woman stoned to death for not being a virgin on her wedding day, as instructed by your god, would disagree.



OK. And let me tell you about a man named Nanak. Who was drawn up to heaven for three days to speak directly with God, then returned to become a Guru, and preach a creed of acceptance and tolerance for all others no matter their faith. (Instead of telling everyone else they were going to hell).

Why should I give Jesus my loyalty when you wont give Guru Nanak yours? The dude actually spoke to God!

Paul writes this to Born Again Believers:

1Co 2:14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is judged by no man. 16 For who has known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct Him? But we have the mind of Christ.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Paul writes this to Born Again Believers:

1Co 2:14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned. 15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is judged by no man. 16 For who has known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct Him? But we have the mind of Christ.

In other words, you’ll agree once we’ve brainwashed you.

 

[Tryharder62]

OK. And let me tell you about a man named Nanak. Who was drawn up to heaven for three days to speak directly with God, then returned to become a Guru, and preach a creed of acceptance and tolerance for all others no matter their faith. (Instead of telling everyone else they were going to hell).

Why should I give Jesus my loyalty when you wont give Guru Nanak yours? The dude actually spoke to God!

Well maybe because Jesus is God and Nanak isn't. It looks like the overwhelming evidence for Nanak's trip to heaven is that he said so. No eye witnesses ...nothing. What I think atracts people to this is the feel good notion that everything is OK with God, even if you don't believe in him. Not true.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

If there were any eyewitnesses for Jesus, they were dead long before the Gospels were even written. Mainstream research has concluded that the references to him in Josephus were added later by Christian historians, so there are actually no secular sources to demonstrate that he even existed, let alone as a supreme being.

 

[phrodeau]

(edited)

Every innocent child at the time of the flood would disagree.

Those kids were all the products of sin, and deserved to die.

Noah's sons, however, were allowed to survive even after one committed a horrible sin and received Noah's curse, because Noah was perfect in his generations.

 

[SEVERUSMAX]

Those kids were all the products of sin, and deserved to die.

Noah's sons, however, were allowed to survive even after one committed a horrible sin and received Noah's curse, because Noah was perfect in his generations.

In other words, "bad seed" theory. Bunch of bullshit.

 

[xfrodobagginsx]

Those kids were all the products of sin, and deserved to die.

Noah's sons, however, were allowed to survive even after one committed a horrible sin and received Noah's curse, because Noah was perfect in his generations.

They were ALL welcome on the ark. Only Noah and his family chose to go on the ark, but it was open for all. They wouldn't believe Noah. Christ is the Ark today, people are being warned, but most choose not to accept Christ and will perish.