Why would an editor be so stupid and mean?

[ThatsTheGuy]

The deal was "disc or manuscript by snail mail only".

This happened thru another sight. I've been trying to publish several novels. This particular one was the only one I submitted for review and editing via an editor I found on another site. I expected a long, tedious process.

After sorting through a few editors before finally deciding upon one, this particular one and I have had in depth conversations via phone and email. Several snail mail exchanges served to prolong the process. The agreement in each coversation being disc or manuscript only. I prefer such things to be done in person w/each prepared beforehand.

What surprised me was the final version coming back sections at a time via internet and somehow through the site I discovered said editor. The final version has been altered considerably different to the point of where it's not recognizable. Some of the grammar corrections are so terrible, a 10 year old could spot it. Many of the corrections she made were intentionally against several characters who are what they are because of the way they speak and the area they're from. Many were intentional and she knows this.

I know my grammar and spelling can be horrible, but not this bad. I'm in the habit of using a real dictionary, thesaurus, and encyclopedias for the basis of most facts within a story of fiction. I don't want to come off as stupid or clueless to readers who have more knowledge than myself. I want them to relate to it and enjoy. My spelling is horrible as I write or type the original manuscript. It's not near as bad as the final version that came back with notable subtleties within the corrections. (Example: effect vs affect). Which was in addition to the obvious ones.

I always make a copy of the original, with all it's mistakes and footnotes before making corrections. She tried to change my style as well w/out notice. That's not going to happen. I'm targeting everyday, normal people who can actually think and believe whatever they're reading is actually possible. Or whomever is interested in reading it.

Either she didn't expect me to read it over or thought I was so eager I'd agree to anything.

 

[Blind_Justice]

So, let me try to get this straight: You found an editor on another site who agreed to polish your story and (s)he fucked it up, right? Why bring this here? What kind of solution do you expect? You said you communicated beforehand, so you should be able to get in touch with him/her and sort it out like adults. Try it.

If you're trying to solicit a new editor, you've posted in the wrong forum. *points* The Editor's Forum is that-a-way, please be so kind and include a few words in regards to your story. What category you're aiming for, word count, kinks, etc. Make sure to have PM's enabled in your Control Profile.

Hope that helps.

 

[ThatsTheGuy]

So, let me try to get this straight: You found an editor on another site who agreed to polish your story and (s)he fucked it up, right? Why bring this here? What kind of solution do you expect? You said you communicated beforehand, so you should be able to get in touch with him/her and sort it out like adults. Try it.

If you're trying to solicit a new editor, you've posted in the wrong forum. *points* The Editor's Forum is that-a-way, please be so kind and include a few words in regards to your story. What category you're aiming for, word count, kinks, etc. Make sure to have PM's enabled in your Control Profile.

Hope that helps.

Thanks, but no. You're response is more of an accusation than reasoning. This is NOT a solicitation for editing. It's an attempt to converse constructively with writers and/or authors whom have a similar experience. You're defense is admirable, but misplaced.

My apologies for giving you the wrong impression. I don't know of any means to more properly convey it to you. Maybe it's something with the wording of the OP?

Let me get this straight: You read the entire post and failed to correctly interpret it? Been there, done that w/said editor. There's many good ones who can constructively convince a writer to change whatever should be changed. No editor I've heard of would knowingly put their own spin on it while adding themselves crediting the editing. Heated discussions are highly probable to ensue. None of those discussions should end with obvious tampering outside of any agreements or editing agreed upon before final approval of both parties involved.

If you've had any experience with editors there are indeed a few who will stick up for other editors knowing nothing about them nor the situation. A few, not all or most. Much in the same manner you have w/out even reviewing the material. I'm not here to write another book about the book.

And, uh, yeah....the CP...that's on as well. That would be a technical issue not relevant to the topic. If said PM you suggested may be off, then it's not because of whatever is happening on my end. I've made the correct choices/options available.

On the PM topic as well, it's well known some Authors, writers, and editors HERE at Lit are not open to PMs nor willing to engage in that respect. It's also well known PMs HERE at lit are subject to evesdropping for whatever reasons.

If one reasonably considers all of the above as it pertains to Literotica, this seems to be the most logical choice.

My posting here is not to be considered a story, book, or poem in any shape, form, or fashion. It should be void of any editing attempts in that respect.

Thanks for your input. Sorry if you feel it was a waste your time.

 

[NotWise]

Thanks, but no. You're response is more of an accusation than reasoning. This is NOT a solicitation for editing. It's an attempt to converse constructively with writers and/or authors whom have a similar experience. You're defense is admirable, but misplaced

I think there's something wrong with you.

 

[Blind_Justice]

Yes, I was hard-pressed to find your actual point in the first message. Since I don't know the editor you mentioned nor what you have agreed upon beforehand, I tried to offer the most common-sense solutions to what seemed to be a problem.

As far as my experience is concerned, both as an author and sometimes-editor, it can be summed up as "Communication is key." As an author, it's my job to let the editor know what exactly I want. Do I want a simple copy-edit (i.e. grammar, spelling, sentence structure fix) or more input in regards to plot, characters and flow? And I should have the courtesy to respect my editor's time and effort. Unless you pay for edits, they're doing it out of the kindness of their hearts and (sometimes) exposure.

But as a freelance author, you always, always have the final word on which changes (if any) to implement in the version you're publishing.

All the editors I have worked with in the past have either kept their changes in a separate document or used the edit tools in Word where you can sign off on changes one at a time or document wide. Your editor made things more difficult for the both of you in insisting on hardcopies per snail mail.

 

[ThatsTheGuy]

I think there's something wrong with you.

Your thinking would be correct. The feeling would be mutual in this respect. Thank you for attempting to stay on topic.

Yes, I was hard-pressed to find your actual point in the first message. Since I don't know the editor you mentioned nor what you have agreed upon beforehand, I tried to offer the most common-sense solutions to what seemed to be a problem.

As far as my experience is concerned, both as an author and sometimes-editor, it can be summed up as "Communication is key." As an author, it's my job to let the editor know what exactly I want. Do I want a simple copy-edit (i.e. grammar, spelling, sentence structure fix) or more input in regards to plot, characters and flow? And I should have the courtesy to respect my editor's time and effort. Unless you pay for edits, they're doing it out of the kindness of their hearts and (sometimes) exposure.

But as a freelance author, you always, always have the final word on which changes (if any) to implement in the version you're publishing.

All the editors I have worked with in the past have either kept their changes in a separate document or used the edit tools in Word where you can sign off on changes one at a time or document wide. Your editor made things more difficult for the both of you in insisting on hardcopies per snail mail.

Thank you so much Blind_Justice. Sometimes I think the editor could be so busy, she simply forgot. But not so in this case. I've taken time to research books she credited herself for editing. I managed to contact lesser known authors on that list who were surprised I found them as a fellow writer and not a fan nor anyone soliciting them for monetary gain. W/out relaying my particular situation, they were quite open about their disdain for her on the same exact subject in their experience(s). Within the same conversations, I was warned to stay away from that particular editor.

I believe I've made a friend or 2 there. At least one has suggested a collaboration or partnered writing project I'm very open to. We've started sharing some of our research material and a few sources. I wish I weren't so protective of this particular book. My bias gets in the way at times. But writers/authors do that and some have grown accustomed to rejection until they get a lucky break.

I figure it never hurts to ask so long as I'm not out to trash the editor due to my personal experience. I may be like "Oh well. Live and learn."

 

[Handley_Page]

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[ThatsTheGuy]

I still don't get it completely (what is the mean part?) but it seems like another rant about the quality of something that came for free.

Did the editor put the story on the site; by whose name? Was it a story you wanted to sell or post for free on that site? Why avoiding email conversations with the editor? (or, actually, why is that relevant in this rant?)

Is your first post representative for how you write your stories?

Not exactly free. More like a mutual agreement based upon the finished product. Or if it gets published, she would be entitled to some type of payment we've agreed upon in the event I submit it somewhere and it's published for a profit - based upon royalties.

No to the question about puting it on another site. If she has, that's another matter to contend with. We haven't been avoiding emails. This pertains to the back and forth exchange of the book/manuscript itself w/no other parties involved at this point.

And NO, my posts are very little like how I write my stories or not at all. How I converse in conversation is far different than what or how I write.

Each one is different, yet w/the same distinctive style. Several are nothing like what I seem in r/l. That's what makes those so cool. Several are easily attributed me once someone knows me well enough.

When I start to write something alone or whenever my mind isn't in the conversation, then I know I'm writing another story or adding something to 1 I've started.

If how I'm writing/posting now looks fine to some, I'd consider it. Maybe I already have and don't realize it yet. I can separate the issues, blend them together, or reserve them (in my mind) for something entirely different from whatever is seen.

I'm told that aspect of my mindset as a writer is a unique, wonderful, and rare gift. I take a little pride in that w/out consciously trying to nurture it.

 

[ThatsTheGuy]

I think you have not done this in what I'd call the 'best method'.
Perhaps it might have been better to commence your description by asking if any Lit authors have problems with with editors ?.

I wonder if you use a computer to write your texts ?
We all have problems with spelling, but many of the problems can be mitigated by careful use of a 'Spell Checker'. Not that this tool will cure all of it ('Your' as opposed to 'You're', for example).

Possibly. I'm definitely open to that w/out damaging the imagination or reality of it.

Yeah! I get what you're saying about Lit authors. It didn't dawn on me that way. I assumed Lit authors would understand what I was on about. I assumed they wrote for other sites as well as this on. Thank you so much for that input. Dang, I feel stupid now.

A computer for texts? For the most part, yes. I speed type. I don't really like phones or tablets. On tablets or something similar, I tend to over do it. My hands and fingers are rather strong and not too gentle when typing. Especially when I'm excited. If I do so autonomously or w/out thinking, I don't have a problem there. I try not to think so hard, but when I do I'm subject to long pauses.

I've learned spellcheckers are an increasing source of agitation for me. I see an auto correction or a symbol that suggests it's wrong, and I know it's not or I go nuts trying to correct it. Possibly why I favor printed spellings or dictionary type books over spellcheckers.

 

[ThatsTheGuy]

I have to go for now. Thanks for contributing.

 

[sr71plt]

Did you ask for credentials (an editor isn't a competent editor just because she says she is--especially on a site like Literotica)? Did you ask her to do a sample edit? No, a real editor doesn't change meaning on his/her own, so it doesn't sound like you matched with a real editor. Next time ask for credentials or a sample of an edit beforehand, especially if your agreement includes a possible passing of profit, as tenuous at that sounds in this instance. But it also sounds like you were asking for far too much personal attention than you should expect in a free edit.

 

[SimonDoom]

It sounds frustrating, but maybe also a good learning experience, and something other writers can profit from knowing about. So, it's good that you posted this.


I suppose it makes sense for the author and editor to communicate in some depth about mutual expectations to make sure the job gets done to everyone's satisfaction. I haven't asked anyone to edit one of my stories, but I think I will soon. I have edited one story, and I often was uncertain how much the author wanted me to do. The process went more slowly than it would have otherwise, in part because of my uncertainty and in part because the draft the author gave me was pretty rough.

We should all keep in mind that we're all doing this for free. I have a day job. I wanted to do a good job editing the story that was given to me, but I'm not a professional, and I couldn't make it my top priority. It took longer than I expected to complete it, even though it wasn't a very long story.

 

[Bramblethorn]

Not exactly free. More like a mutual agreement based upon the finished product. Or if it gets published, she would be entitled to some type of payment we've agreed upon in the event I submit it somewhere and it's published for a profit - based upon royalties.

Did you ask for credentials (an editor isn't a competent editor just because she says she is--especially on a site like Literotica)? Did you ask her to do a sample edit? No, a real editor doesn't change meaning on his/her own, so it doesn't sound like you matched with a real editor. Next time ask for credentials or a sample of an edit beforehand, especially if your agreement includes a possible passing of profit, as tenuous at that sounds in this instance. But it also sounds like you were asking for far too much personal attention than you should expect in a free edit.

The nature of the deal is also a big clue that this isn't a professional editor.

I do freelance editing. Sometimes it's interesting stuff that I enjoy reading along the way, sometimes it's not. But either way it's work and I expect to get paid for it. As soon as possible after the job's done, and regardless of what they do with the material after I've done my bit. They can sell a million copies, they can chuck it in the bin, either way I still expect to be paid for my work.

I'd never ever sign up some sort of "share of the royalties if and when this gets published" deal - why should my pay be dependent on the quality of your marketing, and why would I want to wait months or years to get paid for the job I did?

When I do professional editing, I have a contract up front that specifies exactly what kind of editing I need to do, when it's due, and when/how much I get paid.

Granted, my work is almost all technical editing, and maybe things are a little different in literary editing, but it would astound me if anybody who treated editing as a job would sign up for a deal like this.

It's like those stories you see every so often about some guy who tries to save money by hiring a "doctor" off Craigslist to do surgery on the cheap. At least with this you can just restore to an earlier version. Chalk it up to experience and move on.

 

[Voboy]

Wow.

I’m not sure I’ve got any idea what I just read. There’s a special sort of irony when aspiring novelists cannot make themselves easily understood in writing.

Good luck, OP. Editors are clearly an important part of your writing process, and I hope you find someone worth more than you’d like to pay.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Yes. I've edited and proof read a couple of books for a publisher and expectations were very clear. I do the occasional piece of volunteer editing as well and I don't have any issues. I also use a really good volunteer editor for some of my work (where there's time) and it's always worked really well - but I was also really picky. Not just the first one that came along.

Sorry for the OP but I don't think that sounds like a good arrangement and it was all a bit confusing. Are you looking for advice or a sympathetic ear? Or just sounding off? Which is what it sounded like to me.

 

[Haulover]

Thanks, but no. You're response...

Your right.

You're grammar definitely needs editing.



I hope you find a better editor.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Your right.

You're having fun with your grammar but in days of yore, with a good editor, all your mistakes would be identified before your writing yawed so wildly but I guess you're aware that you're encouraging me to be silly here. It's your fault I'm doing this, Neil. You're bad!

 

[Kantarii]

I think there's something wrong with you.

Hahaha... That fucking killed my ribs laughing at your comment. I had to take off my corset.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Hahaha... That fucking killed my ribs laughing at your comment. I had to take off my corset.

Now there's a detail us vanilla writers would never think of!

 

[ChloeTzang]

Now there's a detail us vanilla writers would never think of!

You know I don't think I even know what a corset looks like. Going to have to look that one up.

 

[ElectricBlue]

You know I don't think I even know what a corset looks like. Going to have to look that one up.

Ah, Mistress Chloe, slightly more vanilla than I .

Ask Kant for links...

 

[JasonClearwater]

I do freelance editing. Sometimes it's interesting stuff that I enjoy reading along the way, sometimes it's not. But either way it's work and I expect to get paid for it.

This. ^^

Whenever I engage a paid editor, I'm at war with the fact that on the one hand, it's a lot of money I know I'll never recoup. But on the other hand, some poor bastard has to read my entire manuscript, word for word, whether it interests them or not.

I used to think I wanted to be an editor when I was at Uni, but now I put it right up there with writing scripts for the shopping network, and watching Justin Bieber music videos with the sound turned on.

I have the utmost respect for anyone who takes this on as a profession, and is good at what they do. They earn every cent I can afford to pay them.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I put it right up there with watching Justin Bieber music videos with the sound turned full up, way past ten, cranking it and annoying the neighbours. Go the Beeb, oh my days, oh my goodness. The Beeb's just the best!

Just fixed your auto-correct mistakes, mate .

 

[JasonClearwater]

Just fixed your auto-correct mistakes, mate .

Cock.

You'll keep.

 

[sr71plt]

some poor bastard has to read my entire manuscript, word for word, whether it interests them or not.

They have to read it at least twice if they have any notion what an editor is supposed to do.