Has feminism won?

[Matthew Craig]

Or is this just penis envy on steroroids?

 

[adrina]

Define "this".

 

[Matthew Craig]

Define "this".

It seems as if no longer providing for your family through the sweat from your brow is good enough or respectable anymore. No longer honorable.

 

[sweepthefloor]

it's all so complicated.

 

[Libsam]

Men stay fertile longer than women, much longer.
The sexes will be more equal when we figure out how to remove the fertility glass ceiling.

 

[Matthew Craig]

Men stay fertile longer than women, much longer.
The sexes will be more equal when we figure out how to remove the fertility glass ceiling.

That's already been solved though. Women can freeze thier eggs.

 

[adrina]

It seems as if no longer providing for your family through the sweat from your brow is good enough or respectable anymore. No longer honorable.

What makes you say that?

 

[Matthew Craig]

What makes you say that?

When i walk, in a public place, the feeling i get from women in this society is fear. I'm tall, built, good looking - But most often viewed as an 'opressor' and not celebrated for my strength. Fear... Is what i sense.

 

[adrina]

When i walk, in a public place, the feeling i get from women in this society is fear. I'm tall, built, good looking - But most often viewed as an 'opressor' and not celebrated for my strength. Fear... Is what i sense.

So you want to be "celebrated for your strength"? And not viewed as an "oppressor"?

Considering that men's strength has been a tool long used in women's oppression that is a rather big request.

I wonder if that's at all related to how women would like to not be considered sex objects and leered at in public? Or how we'd like to not be continually sexualized. Or rated and valued based on our looks.

Interesting conundrum there Mr Craig.

And I'm still left wondering how this is the "fault" of feminism.

 

[MGurkus]

Men stay fertile longer than women, much longer.
The sexes will be more equal when we figure out how to remove the fertility glass ceiling.

The fertility ceiling is a myth. Once a woman reaches a certain age, she becomes less desirable to men. When men no longer want to shoot their loads in an old woman, they fake it. When the woman doesn't get pregnant, we blame it on the dried up uterus and have a giggle behind women's backs.

 

[Matthew Craig]

So you want to be "celebrated for your strength"? And not viewed as an "oppressor"?

Yes..

 

[adrina]

Yes..

And that you are not is the fault of feminism how exactly?

 

[EternalFantasies]

Or is this just penis envy on steroroids?

The latter.

The former will never be.

 

[LJ_Reloaded]

Or is this just penis envy on steroroids?

Feminism is doomed. Ironically, though, Conservatism's war on women is keeping it alive.

You want to kill feminism for good? Destroy Conservative culture and all that it stands for.

 

[Matthew Craig]

And that you are not is the fault of feminism how exactly?

Because it doesn't matter anymore? Strong men are no longer needed.

 

[EternalFantasies]

Feminism is doomed. Ironically, though, Conservatism's war on women is keeping it alive.

You want to kill feminism for good? Destroy Conservative culture and all that it stands for.

"Conservatism" doesn't have any wars on women.

Because it doesn't matter anymore? Strong men are no longer needed.

Don't be so positive now...

 

[adrina]

Because it doesn't matter anymore? Strong men are no longer needed.

I think you are mistaken that strong men aren't needed. At least physically strong men are needed. We need "strongmen" like Trump and Duterte like we need a hole in the head.

I think what you may be feeling is an equalization of value - where strong men are not over-valued just for their strength.

I can tell you as someone that has repeatedly witnessed and experienced the devaluation, denigration and dismissal of the feminine... well if the masculine is valued a little less and the feminine valued a little more, we might actually get close to understanding and achieving this whole equality thing.

 

[Matthew Craig]

I think you are mistaken that strong men aren't needed. At least physically strong men are needed. We need "strongmen" like Trump and Duterte like we need a hole in the head.

I think what you may be feeling is an equalization of value - where strong men are not over-valued just for their strength.

I can tell you as someone that has repeatedly witnessed and experienced the devaluation, denigration and dismissal of the feminine... well if the masculine is valued a little less and the feminine valued a little more, we might actually get close to understanding and achieving this whole equality thing.

But equality is an imposibility. Much like perfection, fairness and all those other 'dreams'.

Let me tell you a little secret about where the end result of feminism leads.. Androgyny

 

[adrina]

But equality is an imposibility. Much like perfection, fairness and all those other 'dreams'.

Let me tell you a little secret about where the end result of feminism leads.. Androgyny

I'm sorry but I think you're full of shit.

How is equality an impossibility?

And you'll also have to demonstrate how feminism leads to androgyny.

Unless you mean that women need to behave like men in order to be treated in an egalitarian manner?

But again... the trace back to feminism isn't really being demonstrated here.

 

[Matthew Craig]

I'm sorry but I think you're full of shit.

How is equality an impossibility?

No two people are born equal, proportions vary, IQ, skin color and the list goes on. All throughout life.

Perfection is unknowable. What is perfect?

Feminism is a fight for equality which is an unachievable thing due to these differances.

Same pay for same job.. sure i agree with that. But there are some jobs women lack the physical strength to do.

Strongmen are feared, thier reproductive rights are rejected due to feministic values and a world of androgynous people are born.

 

[adrina]

No two people are born equal, proportions vary, IQ, skin color and the list goes on. All throughout life.

Perfection is unknowable. What is perfect?

Feminism is a fight for equality which is an unachievable thing due to these differances.

Same pay for same job.. sure i agree with that. But there are some jobs women lack the physical strength to do.

Strongmen are feared, thier reproductive rights are rejected due to feministic values and a world of androgynous people are born.

We seem to not have a problem treating a dumbshit white guy and an average white guy pretty equal before the law - that is if one isn't rich.

Don't mistake equality of character, abilities etc with being treated equally before the law.

I'm still not seeing the a + b = c here.

The reality is that we do not value the feminine as much as we value the masculine. What I'm hearing from you is that we need to value the masculine more to make sure we don't end up androgynous.

Which... is nonsensical at best.

 

[Matthew Craig]

What I'm hearing from you is that we need to value the masculine more to make sure we don't end up androgynous.

Which... is nonsensical at best.

I never said that. What i said is both need to be celebrated equally, but in this day-in-age, celebrating the masculine is being squashed by feminism.

 

[adrina]

I never said that. What i said is both need to be celebrated equally, but in this day-in-age, celebrating the masculine is being squashed by feminism.

They are not celebrated equally.

Don't be a pussy. C'mon it's better to be a dick. You sound just like a woman. Men don't cry. Etc.

For a woman to be compared to a man is a compliment. For a man to be compared to a woman is an insult.

Celebrating the feminine is squashed by just about every element in society.

Unless it's to show out tits so we can sell a car or a burger.

 

[Matthew Craig]

They are not celebrated equally.

Don't be a pussy. C'mon it's better to be a dick. You sound just like a woman. Men don't cry. Etc.

For a woman to be compared to a man is a compliment. For a man to be compared to a woman is an insult.

Celebrating the feminine is squashed by just about every element in society.

Unless it's to show out tits so we can sell a car or a burger.

I'm sorry you feel this way.

 

[adrina]

I'm sorry you feel this way.

It's not a matter of just feeling... that is the reality.

I can like it, hate it, love it or be apathetic towards it... none of that will change it. This is the reality we live in.

Are you trying to tell me that if someone called you a "woman" or told you that you were acting just like a woman or a girl that you would say "hey thanks!"

I'm not seeing that reality.