Don't understand why story was rejected.

[ausfet]

Sorry if this is the wrong place to post, but is there any avenue to dispute or query a rejection? The final chapter of one of my pieces was rejected due to mention of sexual activity involving minors. While there are references to two incidences (the main character struggling with a son who pursued a relationship with a minor, and sexual abuse of the minor when he was 15), there is nothing descriptive nor is it a 'sexy' topic.

I guess what I'm trying to figure out is a) which of the underage mentions os a problem and b) why were they acceptable to mention in chapter two but not chapter three?

 

[jaF0]

When in doubt, leave it out.

NO reference to kiddie stuff AT ALL.

 

[Deeplust]

I had a story rejected because one of the characters was young. The character was not involved in sex nor was referenced in any sexual reference, the story was rejected.

Best thing to do is under moderator notes is to tell the moderator that there is a young character and there is no underage sex. I find this works, as I think the moderator using a program to scan the story instead of reading the whole thing.

 

[NotWise]

Sorry if this is the wrong place to post, but is there any avenue to dispute or query a rejection? The final chapter of one of my pieces was rejected due to mention of sexual activity involving minors. While there are references to two incidences (the main character struggling with a son who pursued a relationship with a minor, and sexual abuse of the minor when he was 15), there is nothing descriptive nor is it a 'sexy' topic.

I guess what I'm trying to figure out is a) which of the underage mentions os a problem and b) why were they acceptable to mention in chapter two but not chapter three?

Posting here is not a way to appeal. The only way to appeal anything is to PM Laurel.

If they passed in earlier chapters but not in the last then it's probably because she missed it while skimming the first two, but caught it in the last. There may also be a word choice that triggered her rejection, e.g. giving the age at which a specific act was committed--regardless of whether or not you think it's sexy.

 

[Zodia195]

Yeah, the same happened to me in a similar situation. For a prologue of a story I was working on at the time (I don't plan on doing it now), I had a sex scene happened between two unknown characters with no knowledge of their ages. They would have been over the age of consent, but since I didn't mention that, it got the boot, especially since my main characters were teenagers.

 

[sr71plt]

You can PM the editor, Laurel, direct to question the rejection--the Private Message system, upper right hand of this page. You can also resend the item back with discussion points in the Notes column for her attention. As far as why left in chapter two and not in this one, it might have been missed by the editor in chapter two. You might wind up having to adjust in two chapters.

 

[ausfet]

Thanks for the advice. Will PM Laurel.

 

[uksnowy]

Tel me about it!
Young people do not exist in this place - active. passive, in the the same room, dumb, blind or any which way.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Tel me about it!
Young people do not exist in this place - active. passive, in the the same room, dumb, blind or any which way.

Exactly. Easiest thing to do is just not have any characters under 18 in anything sexual. Full stop. The rules are easy to follow, it's when you skate on the edges that the fun starts.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Tel me about it!
Young people do not exist in this place - active. passive, in the the same room, dumb, blind or any which way.

Snowy, them's the rules, they ain't going to change. Save your breath, or take your wares elsewhere. As Chloe says, "no sexual activity under eighteen" isn't a hard concept to understand.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Snowy, them's the rules, they ain't going to change. Save your breath, or take your wares elsewhere. As Chloe says, "no sexual activity under eighteen" isn't a hard concept to understand.

Yep. Me, I'm working on a story where the girl is under 18 but I'll probably either change her age to post here or just put it somewhere else.

 

[Handley_Page]

At the risk of p1$$ing everyone off, the following is a distillation of comments on the "under 18" rule:-

On 18
________________________________________
[stock reply, skip if you’ve seen it]

This is a privately owned site. All of Literotica is moderated by a single person, who goes by the name of Laurel. She makes her livelihood from it and is an owner. All that gives her the unquestionable and unlimited right to set rules, and reject or subsequently delete any story, forum post or comment she thinks isn't in the site's best interest. She and she alone gets to decide what that means.

One of the biggest surprises people get on coming here as a writer, is the "18" rule. As the rule is written, no character in a story can be under 18 if they are exposed to sexual situations of any sort.

You are not the first person to ask about this rule. You probably aren't the first person in the last 30 days, which is why some replies you get from other authors may seem grumpy. We see these questions a lot.

The 18 rule, like everything else here, is interpreted and applied by Laurel, and she takes a conservative stance with this one - if she thinks a story is going to encourage people to think about sex with people under 18, she'll generally reject it. That means that it's not enough to state your character is 18+. He or she has to act 18+ as well. In Laurel's opinion, not yours.

Note that this rule isn't in place because of any existing laws. (There are few if any countries where a written story describing sex between seventeen years olds is illegal.) The argument "but the law says it's legal!" is meaningless here. This is Laurel's site, it’s her personal property, and she's not required to accept stories just because the law doesn't forbid them. This is not a free speech issue because private properties (like Literotica) are not required to honor anyone’s free speech laws. (The internet in general is not a haven for free speech - someone owns those servers you are using, whatever site you go to, and that gives them the right to filter content they don't like. The rules are just more pronounced here than you may be used to.)

Note that the rule has nothing to do with paedophilia.
Paedophilia is an interest in pre-pubescent children, formally defined as age 12 and younger. The under 18 rule is in response to different concerns - but it should be trivially apparent that an actual paedophilia story is beyond unacceptable here. Don’t even attempt to post one.

Evidence suggests Laurel is firm, but reasonably even-handed, in implementing her interpretation of her "18" rule. If you're here because the story was rejected, you probably weren't singled out and you're definitely not alone. Rewrite your story until it passes muster. Or take it to a site without such rules. Those are your only options.

Because the interpretation of the rule is not negotiable, it’s important to write carefully in certain settings:


1. Characters in High school. Some authors here feel strongly that any mention of high school is an attempt to imply to the readership that your "18 year old" is really younger, in short that you're speaking in a kind of code and attempting to get people to think about underage characters. Be careful to be very clear about ages in these stories. Some high school seniors are 18 by graduation. Leave those sophomores alone.

2. Characters described as having physical characteristics that sound more like 14 than 18. Slight breasts on someone just turned 18, a beard just starting to come in, excessively juvenile behaviour - all these are going to look to many people like you're attempting to sneak an underage character in, and are very likely to get a story rejected.

3. Historical setting for stories. Romeo and Juliet is probably not what you'd consider racy filth; but Juliet lost her virginity at fourteen. That story would certainly be rejected here. It has a fine moral message, it was startling but not shocking when it was written, and it's clearly a well crafted story, but none of that matters. All that matters is by Laurel’s rules, it’s an underage story.

4. Incest stories. In the real world, incest is almost always tied to underage sexuality and is abusive by definition. Despite the fact that the site has an Incest category, stories in that category should never depict incest as it most commonly occurs in the real world.

5. Fantasy stories. The story “The Time Machine” by H. G. Wells had Eloi, a race of innocents; a fanfic based on it with any sexual content would likely be rejected here. Don’t assume you’re on safe ground with human-like species or alien cultures.

6. First time stories. Statistically speaking, in the US at least, you probably lost your virginity at an age younger than 18. (That is, just over 50% of men and women in the US who are sexually active, lost their virginity at 17 or earlier, as of 2010). If you write your first time account here, you must write it so all characters involved are explicitly past their 18th birthday.


7. Recollections. A character can mention a sexual encounter before age 18, but not dwell on it or describe it. “I lost my virginity at 16. Bob was… persuasive. But I’ve learned to value myself a little more.” isn’t likely to be a problem. “I lost my virginity at 16, and, um… wow. Bob was just so kind and amazing.” is at best problematic. Anything more explicit will not pass muster. You may be able to work around this by leaving out ages.

When in doubt, check with Laurel first, via a Private Message (PM).

Please note that occasionally an underage story gets past Laurel, and gets posted. If you see one, report it using the [!] reporting mechanism at the bottom of most pages.
Finding such stories doesn't give you permission to write under 18. It gives you an obligation to report it, so people don't get confused about the rules.


Please do NOT respond to this post with complaints, Whys, What Ifs, etc.. This post has covered everything you need to understand. This topic is considered dead by all long-time members; it’s been examined from every possible angle; and Laurel has shown absolutely no inclination to soften her stance. Sincere questions can be sent directly to Laurel; the rest of us (whether or not we agree with the rule’s implementation) don’t want this topic argued here. You will be Ignored and perhaps Banned if you insist on talking about this.

======== ========= ==========

Nezhul:-

Kids don't do sex, they don't know about sex, they don't know what the other gender is for and have absolutely no desire to explore it. They are completely asexual. Let alone acts - even thoughs of sex is far beyond them.

Kids can only play with the ball somewhere in the background. They are hardly even allowed a cameo in a story - if there are children - then they either always stay in the background or are just mentioned. Any dialogue with a child, or any more or less important role for him/her - is not allowed in an erotic story.

They are not permitted in a cannon shot distance of any character who might have sex in the next week, or think about sex, or masturbate, or whatever.

Now, as soon as they turn 18, a divine insight is bestowed on the kids by the heaven, which converts them into a horny looking-for-sex barely-legal adults. Before that - no, they just simply dissolve as soon as there is anything sexual mentioned, because Kids and sex can not coexist in the universe.

That said, an adult may mention his/her childhood as a character building. You can even mention the age the virginity was lost. But in a very brief way and with no details whatsoever.

Why? Because. No use arguing with that. Just accept it or post your story someplace else.

=========
See also:- http://www.literotica.com/subguide.shtml
===== ======


Lori the Hoosier:-

Everyone read, and got, your post; what's unclear is why people persist in flogging this particular dead horse, so get this straight; on this site, underage sex, the possibility of including underage sexual activities, the possibility of referring, even obliquely, to on-going underage sexual activity, the potential for future inclusion of underage sexual activities, is not going to happen: Ever.

Mentioning that a girl has a previous teenage sexual history is acceptable, if a little weaselly, and, by your lights, probably a little double-standard in nature; after all, the site is littered with stories about 18 year-old guys with hot 34 year-old moms, implying the mom was underage (by the site's rules) when she had him, but there's absolutely no exploration of that previous history permitted; mention it, and move on. These are the rules, both explicit and tacit, Laurel wants it that way, this site is not a democracy, and there's no room for negotiation on this point; for good or bad, what Laurel says, goes, and if you don't or can't accept that, then go elsewhere.

One has to wonder just what agenda you're trying to promote here, or what kind of support you're hoping to garnish; if you want to read and indulge in underage sexual fantasies, find one of the myriad sites that cater to your obvious need to indulge this appetite. Over here, never, something you've been told time and again, and re-couching the same questions repeatedly is both annoying and, frankly, almost autistic in it's monotonous reiterations of the same points again and again. Either quit it, now, or find somewhere else to push your views. What happens elsewhere is outside the purview of this site, and is a meaningless debate in the context of this site, given the above, so let it go, or just go.

Whether you like it or not, Laurel's rules are the only rules here, you have no freedom of speech or expression here, this is a privately owned site, not a government or public organ, and if you contravene Laurels rules she will take action, period. Live with it, or leave, it's up to you.

Was that explicit and unequivocal enough for you?

== end of file ==

 

[NOIRTRASH]

This may be helpful:

Laurel gets tired from all the lame crap people submit. Many write much about nuthin. wears her down and she see's shit that aint there.

I don't include nuthin about babies, kids, pets, and death in the same city as a bed.

And never forget, quality is a micro-aggression here.

 

[Bramblethorn]

At the risk of p1$$ing everyone off, the following is a distillation of comments on the "under 18" rule:-

[sensible stuff from HitD and Lori snipped]

Nezhul:-

Kids don't do sex, they don't know about sex, they don't know what the other gender is for and have absolutely no desire to explore it. They are completely asexual. Let alone acts - even thoughs of sex is far beyond them.

Rule of thumb, best to take any info from Nezhul with a large grain of salt; he has a long-running habit of posting things that simply aren't true. So it is here.

Laurel has stated that it's okay to acknowledge that under-age sex happens. You just can't get into the graphic details. My first story here makes mention of a fourteen-year-old who's being bullied for being a lesbian, and a grandmother who got married at sixteen and had her first kid six months later. I had no trouble getting that through moderation.

(Laurel does skim when moderating, so sometimes stories with kids do get blocked by mistake, but that's not site policy. If you resubmit with a note clarifying what the content is, that's usually enough.)

Kids can only play with the ball somewhere in the background. They are hardly even allowed a cameo in a story - if there are children - then they either always stay in the background or are just mentioned. Any dialogue with a child, or any more or less important role for him/her - is not allowed in an erotic story.

This is also false. Another of my stories involves a schoolteacher who ends up getting it on with a class visitor. Most of the first page is a classroom scene with a horde of seven-year-olds, and several of them get dialogue.

Here's another by Rutger5 in which a child plays a major role, with plenty of dialogue. Tommy's age isn't specified but he's clearly pre-teen. There are plenty of other stories where children play an important part, away from the bedroom.

 

[NotWise]

This is also false...

I just checked. If you group chapters together I have ten stories on Lit. Five of them have children in significant roles.

 

[rutger5]

Laurel has stated that it's okay to acknowledge that under-age sex happens. You just can't get into the graphic details. My first story here makes mention of a fourteen-year-old who's being bullied for being a lesbian, and a grandmother who got married at sixteen and had her first kid six months later. I had no trouble getting that through moderation.

This is also false. Another of my stories involves a schoolteacher who ends up getting it on with a class visitor. Most of the first page is a classroom scene with a horde of seven-year-olds, and several of them get dialogue.

Here's another by Rutger5 in which a child plays a major role, with plenty of dialogue. Tommy's age isn't specified but he's clearly pre-teen. There are plenty of other stories where children play an important part, away from the bedroom.

What Bramblethorn said. I was going to say something similar until I got to Bramblethorn's post and saw it was already said/written. I intended on using a story of mine as an example but Bramblethorn beat me to that also and helpfully included a link to my story (which is more than I would have done). So thanks Bramblethorn for the free publicity - even though you thought I should have killed Tommy before the story began.

 

[Jay626]

Dont feel bad, I just got my story rejected for BULLSHIT reasons. I had no underage characters in the story and then it got rejected for having an underage sex. I even put in a note to admin that there was no underage sex.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Dont feel bad, I just got my story rejected for BULLSHIT reasons. I had no underage characters in the story and then it got rejected for having an underage sex. I even put in a note to admin that there was no underage sex.

Where you skate the edge be explicit about age. All of my stories have heroines(?) around the 18-25 age. I always work their actual age somewhere early on in the story. Makes it simple for everyone. The main challenge is to not make it blatant. I never ever have characters under 18. Except for something like "I swerved my Mustang around the escaped wannabe hood ornament."

 

[Jay626]

I had ages in the story which confuses me. If I stated ages above 18, then why reject the story?

 

[sr71plt]

I had ages in the story which confuses me. If I stated ages above 18, then why reject the story?

We don't know, because we haven't seen the actual story. I've had writers blow up about nothing underage in their story and it turned out that the writer didn't see that a preteen watching a couple having sex and stroking himself off was a sex act.\

So, this is just you blowing off steam and nobody here having reason to assume you are right in doing so.

 

[Jay626]

When not a single character in the story is underage it is hard to have underage sex. Not even a reference of a child at all is in the story.

 

[sr71plt]

When not a single character in the story is underage it is hard to have underage sex. Not even a reference of a child at all is in the story.

Well, tell Laurel about via PM. It's not doing you any good to keep posting about to the board.

 

[XirixSeven]

ausfet:

I don't know how to PM you. I wanted to discuss MFM that becomes MMF, encouraged by the woman who loves every bit of watching this.

I have one event to share.

[personal info including email or other address posting prohibited per our forum guidelines]

if you write, say you are ausfet.

Tom

 

[oggbashan]

ausfet:

I don't know how to PM you. I wanted to discuss MFM that becomes MMF, encouraged by the woman who loves every bit of watching this.

I have one event to share.

xirix@gmx.com.

if you write, say you are ausfet.

Tom

To send a private messge PM to anyone, first you must turn them on.

Go to User CP; then Edit Options; and tick the box Enable Private Messaging.

 

[TamLin01]

Just so we're clear:

1. You are DEFINITELY allowed to have underage characters in stories. People who tell you otherwise are purposefully spreading misinformation. These characters may exist, they may be prominent, they may have dialogue, they may be central to the plot, and they may even be your main character.

2. These characters MAY NOT have sex, witness sex, or talk about sex in an explicit manner. But that is not a blanket ban on such characters existing. This is all very plain and easy to understand.

3. If your story got flagged by mistake, correcting this is very easy. Submit again and in the NOTES section, just explain very simply what's going on in the story and then specifically point out the important parts.

For example, an upcoming story I'm submitting for the Halloween contest will include this message in the NOTES:

"At story's start both of the main characters are children, but there are no references to sexual activity in these first 2,000 words. After the break the story picks up again ten years later, and we're expressly told that the characters are now 20 and 21 here [insert quote from story] and here [insert second quote]."

It's as simple as that. This has worked every time for me. It will work again just fine this time, and if you try it I assume it will work for you. If anyone tells you it doesn't work and that any of the above violates any alleged rule, they are simply wrong.

Good luck with it. Cheers.