Ethics Just Get In The Way.

[rawsilk]

Donald Trump’s Son-in-Law, Jared Kushner, Tests Legal Path to White House Job

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/18/u...version=Full&region=Marginalia&pgtype=article

Very interesting and informative article if anyone is interested in ethics. Seems ethics and politics is an oxymoron.

 

[underguy1]

Donald Trump’s Son-in-Law, Jared Kushner, Tests Legal Path to White House Job

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/18/u...version=Full&region=Marginalia&pgtype=article

Very interesting and informative article if anyone is interested in ethics. Seems ethics and politics is an oxymoron.

Look up the recent business history of Hunter Biden.

America's political and business model is fraud.

 

[rawsilk]

Look up the recent business history of Hunter Biden.

America's political and business model is fraud.

I am not getting a whole lot of quality info about him when I google, I get nothing truly informative. An article from Popular Mechanics and another from the Huffington Post. I don't use information from youtube as it is mostly junk and propaganda so please don't post links to it.

The worst I can find is he sniffs cocaine occasionally and got chucked out from a short term sign up with the military forces. Sniffs cocaine, well Dah! I thought that was the drug of choice for this country!

 

[JackLuis]

Ethics lawyers in both parties said that such an arrangement would violate a federal statute designed to prevent family ties from influencing the functioning of the United States government. Under a 1967 law enacted after John F. Kennedy installed his brother, Robert F. Kennedy, as attorney general, no public official can hire a family member — including one related by marriage — to an agency or office over which he has authority. A separate statute also makes it a crime, punishable by a fine and up to two years of prison time, for government employees to accept voluntary services that are not authorized by law, except in emergency situations.

Yep, we can impeach Trump for violation of the virginity of American Politics! Then put his ass in jail and attach his assets and let him hang on the liabilities!

Brilliant!

 

[underguy1]

I am not getting a whole lot of quality info about him when I google, I get nothing truly informative. An article from Popular Mechanics and another from the Huffington Post. I don't use information from youtube as it is mostly junk and propaganda so please don't post links to it.

The worst I can find is he sniffs cocaine occasionally and got chucked out from a short term sign up with the military forces. Sniffs cocaine, well Dah! I thought that was the drug of choice for this country!

Well you're internet is being censored or you're censoring yourself.

 

[sr71plt]

Kushner getting Christie tossed out of the mix (although it's fine with me that he has been) is interesting in view of what people are saying about loyalty being the number one test with Trump. Christie has prostituted himself to Trump for months. If Kushner was going to get him dumped and loyalty was an important issue, they shouldn't have enslaved Christie all those months. I guess it was a function of Trump not thinking he was going to need a transition plan. Sort of goes with how worried he's looked since the election realizing he is actually expected to do a tough job he knows nothing about if he's won the election.

 

[JackLuis]

Kushner getting Christie tossed out of the mix (although it's fine with me that he has been) is interesting in view of what people are saying about loyalty being the number one test with Trump. Christie has prostituted himself to Trump for months. If Kushner was going to get him dumped and loyalty was an important issue, they shouldn't have enslaved Christie all those months. I guess it was a function of Trump not thinking he was going to need a transition plan. Sort of goes with how worried he's looked since the election realizing he is actually expected to do a tough job he knows nothing about if he's won the election.

Yeah, he's starting to sweat now!

The Times just put up his (projected) short list of cabinet picks.

Oh Christ! are we fucked!

The Military Industrial Complex is less sleazy that his cabinet selections.

 

[rawsilk]

Well you're internet is being censored or you're censoring yourself.

I was hoping for some intelligent, quality, informative and well respected links from you pertaining to your comment, which was off topic but I accepted that. It may have become relevant somewhere along the line. Looking forward to informative, intelligent links from you. Excluding youtube or any other
propagandist links of course. Quality information only please.

 

[rawsilk]

Yeah, he's starting to sweat now!

The Times just put up his (projected) short list of cabinet picks.

Oh Christ! are we fucked!

The Military Industrial Complex is less sleazy that his cabinet selections.

Only one woman on that list to be considered for a post. She is very pretty and quote Ann Coulter Trump’s #1 fan Coulter got animated while discussing Haley’s comments, and went so far as to call her a “bimbo.” After John Gibson asked that she shy away from such language, Coulter offered an alternative description of “woman who was accidentally elected because she’s pretty and isn’t very bright”…. Fox news so meh, but a bit of fun to be had by all!http://radio.foxnews.com/2016/01/14/ann-coulter-bimbo-nikki-haley-should-be-deported/ Will she be a winner or just remain one of the finalists vying for the job!

Just reading through that quote again, The only female finalist for a cabinet post is described as a bimbo, she is pretty, and isn't very bright.


You may be right Jack Luis.

 

[underguy1]

I was hoping for some intelligent, quality, informative and well respected links from you pertaining to your comment, which was off topic but I accepted that. It may have become relevant somewhere along the line. Looking forward to informative, intelligent links from you. Excluding youtube or any other
propagandist links of course. Quality information only please.

I'd hazard a guess that anything that doesn't conform to your view of things or is independent of the US media cartel would be classed as a 'propagandist link'.

You've posted a link to the New York Times, which is the premier propaganda outlet for the US military industrial complex.

If you can't find Hunter Biden's connections to post-coup Ukraine on a google search then you must be self censoring.

I think you're not really after information. Just party political gossip.

 

[rawsilk]

I'd hazard a guess that anything that doesn't conform to your view of things or is independent of the US media cartel would be classed as a 'propagandist link'.

You've posted a link to the New York Times, which is the premier propaganda outlet for the US military industrial complex.

If you can't find Hunter Biden's connections to post-coup Ukraine on a google search then you must be self censoring.

I think you're not really after information. Just party political gossip.

Thank you for the extra information re post-coup Ukraine, that may help with the google search. Just his name alone was not sufficient to throw up much information in my search. I think google throws up different info in different countries, not related to censorship. I have found information on fairly innocuous subjects, seems to vary from country to country, on the google search engine. I often ask people in different countries to do a search for stuff for me. I really can assure you, I loathe censorship in any form and would certainly never self censor information. At least the New York Times isn't owned by Rupert Murdoch...yet.
You say it has Military links? Interesting. More elaboration on that would be interesting if you have the time.

 

[underguy1]

Thank you for the extra information re post-coup Ukraine, that may help with the google search. Just his name alone was not sufficient to throw up much information in my search. I think google throws up different info in different countries, not related to censorship. I have found information on fairly innocuous subjects, seems to vary from country to country, on the google search engine. I often ask people in different countries to do a search for stuff for me. I really can assure you, I loathe censorship in any form and would certainly never self censor information. At least the New York Times isn't owned by Rupert Murdoch...yet.
You say it has Military links? Interesting. More elaboration on that would be interesting if you have the time.

The NYT is the bugle of the War Party. There's never been a US war of aggression that they haven't pumped.

 

[rawsilk]

Thank you for the extra information re post-coup Ukraine, that may help with the google search. Just his name alone was not sufficient to throw up much information in my search. I think google throws up different info in different countries, not related to censorship. I have found information on fairly innocuous subjects, seems to vary from country to country, on the google search engine. I often ask people in different countries to do a search for stuff for me. I really can assure you, I loathe censorship in any form and would certainly never self censor information. At least the New York Times isn't owned by Rupert Murdoch...yet.
You say it has Military links? Interesting. More elaboration on that would be interesting if you have the time.

With thanks to underguy1 for bringing this to our attention.

Hunter Biden

My impression of Hunter Biden as assessed between these two online newspapers and three articles, which is limited and not deep analysis, agreed.

I am seeing a business man doing business as usual. Being offered a board position on a strategic privately owned gas company, Burisma in the Ukraine.

Biden joined Burisma in the same month as the owner of the company, Mykola Zlochevsky had his assets frozen, because of investigations by British officials of money laundering. Because of the refusal by the Ukrainian prosecutor general’s office to cooperate, the case was dismissed Zlochevsky was able to recoup his legal costs.

May be government corruption may not be. Speculation is a poor substitute for proof. Is there a suggestion of Biden's appointment as guilt by association, or are there US fund managers loading the board, of an important strategic Ukrainian energy company, with corporate policemen? Who knows, calls for speculation again.

Finally Hunter Biden was discharged from the Navy Reserve after testing positive for cocaine use in 2014. If I am expected to be shocked by this information, I am not. It seems to be the norm not the exception these days.

In an effort to add, what some may call balance, I have included this link which contains disconcerting levels of rhetoric and hyperbole, along with conspiracy theories. However it may have some merit or not. https://wikispooks.com/wiki/Document:Stench_of_Corruption




Hunter Biden

This is a series of excerpts from NYTimes, which may be seen by some as an undesirable source but it is still informative. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/09/w...-ukraine-joe-biden-son-hunter-biden-ties.html

But the credibility of the vice president’s anticorruption message may have been undermined by the association of his son, Hunter Biden, with one of Ukraine’s largest natural gas companies, Burisma Holdings, and with its owner, Mykola Zlochevsky, who was Ukraine’s ecology minister under former President Viktor F. Yanukovych before he was forced into exile.

Hunter Biden, 45, a former Washington lobbyist, joined the Burisma board in April 2014. That month, as part of an investigation into money laundering, British officials froze London bank accounts containing $23 million that allegedly belonged to Mr. Zlochevsky.

Britain’s Serious Fraud Office, an independent government agency, specifically forbade Mr. Zlochevksy, as well as Burisma Holdings, the company’s chief legal officer and another company owned by Mr. Zlochevsky, to have any access to the accounts.

But after Ukrainian prosecutors refused to provide documents needed in the investigation, a British court in January ordered the Serious Fraud Office to unfreeze the assets. The refusal by the Ukrainian prosecutor general’s office to cooperate was the target of a stinging attack by the American ambassador to Ukraine, Geoffrey R. Pyatt, who called out Burisma’s owner by name in a speech in September.

It is not known how Mr. Biden came to the attention of the company. Announcing his appointment to the board, Alan Apter, a former Morgan Stanley investment banker who is chairman of Burisma, said, “The company’s strategy is aimed at the strongest concentration of professional staff and the introduction of best corporate practices, and we’re delighted that Mr. Biden is joining us to help us achieve these goals.”

Joining the board at the same time was one of Mr. Biden’s American business partners, Devon Archer. Both are involved with Rosemont Seneca Partners, an American investment firm with offices in Washington.

In 2014, he was discharged from the Navy Reserve after testing positive for cocaine use. He received a commission as an ensign in 2013, and he served as a public affairs officer.

Asked about the British investigation, which is continuing, Mr. Toohey said, “Not only was the case dismissed and the company vindicated by the outcome, but it speaks volumes that all his legal costs were recouped.”

Burisma is working to bring the energy sector into the modern era, which is critical for a free and strong Ukraine.”

There is also some more from the Guardian which appears as though it is written for the reading comprehension challenged. There are a couple of interesting points.https://www.theguardian.com/busines...ob-board-ukraine-biggest-gas-producer-burisma And another article from the Guardian which is just marginally better written but with a good picture of the man. http://www.businessinsider.com.au/h...gas-company-burisma-holdings-2014-5?r=US&IR=T

 

[underguy1]

With thanks to underguy1 for bringing this to our attention.

Hunter Biden

My impression of Hunter Biden as assessed between these two online newspapers and three articles, which is limited and not deep analysis, agreed.

I am seeing a business man doing business as usual. Being offered a board position on a strategic privately owned gas company, Burisma in the Ukraine.

Biden joined Burisma in the same month as the owner of the company, Mykola Zlochevsky had his assets frozen, because of investigations by British officials of money laundering. Because of the refusal by the Ukrainian prosecutor general’s office to cooperate, the case was dismissed Zlochevsky was able to recoup his legal costs.

May be government corruption may not be. Speculation is a poor substitute for proof. Is there a suggestion of Biden's appointment as guilt by association, or are there US fund managers loading the board, of an important strategic Ukrainian energy company, with corporate policemen? Who knows, calls for speculation again.

Finally Hunter Biden was discharged from the Navy Reserve after testing positive for cocaine use in 2014. If I am expected to be shocked by this information, I am not. It seems to be the norm not the exception these days.

In an effort to add, what some may call balance, I have included this link which contains disconcerting levels of rhetoric and hyperbole, along with conspiracy theories. However it may have some merit or not. https://wikispooks.com/wiki/Document:Stench_of_Corruption




Hunter Biden

This is a series of excerpts from NYTimes, which may be seen by some as an undesirable source but it is still informative. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/12/09/w...-ukraine-joe-biden-son-hunter-biden-ties.html

But the credibility of the vice president’s anticorruption message may have been undermined by the association of his son, Hunter Biden, with one of Ukraine’s largest natural gas companies, Burisma Holdings, and with its owner, Mykola Zlochevsky, who was Ukraine’s ecology minister under former President Viktor F. Yanukovych before he was forced into exile.

Hunter Biden, 45, a former Washington lobbyist, joined the Burisma board in April 2014. That month, as part of an investigation into money laundering, British officials froze London bank accounts containing $23 million that allegedly belonged to Mr. Zlochevsky.

Britain’s Serious Fraud Office, an independent government agency, specifically forbade Mr. Zlochevksy, as well as Burisma Holdings, the company’s chief legal officer and another company owned by Mr. Zlochevsky, to have any access to the accounts.

But after Ukrainian prosecutors refused to provide documents needed in the investigation, a British court in January ordered the Serious Fraud Office to unfreeze the assets. The refusal by the Ukrainian prosecutor general’s office to cooperate was the target of a stinging attack by the American ambassador to Ukraine, Geoffrey R. Pyatt, who called out Burisma’s owner by name in a speech in September.

It is not known how Mr. Biden came to the attention of the company. Announcing his appointment to the board, Alan Apter, a former Morgan Stanley investment banker who is chairman of Burisma, said, “The company’s strategy is aimed at the strongest concentration of professional staff and the introduction of best corporate practices, and we’re delighted that Mr. Biden is joining us to help us achieve these goals.”

Joining the board at the same time was one of Mr. Biden’s American business partners, Devon Archer. Both are involved with Rosemont Seneca Partners, an American investment firm with offices in Washington.

In 2014, he was discharged from the Navy Reserve after testing positive for cocaine use. He received a commission as an ensign in 2013, and he served as a public affairs officer.

Asked about the British investigation, which is continuing, Mr. Toohey said, “Not only was the case dismissed and the company vindicated by the outcome, but it speaks volumes that all his legal costs were recouped.”

Burisma is working to bring the energy sector into the modern era, which is critical for a free and strong Ukraine.”

There is also some more from the Guardian which appears as though it is written for the reading comprehension challenged. There are a couple of interesting points.https://www.theguardian.com/busines...ob-board-ukraine-biggest-gas-producer-burisma And another article from the Guardian which is just marginally better written but with a good picture of the man. http://www.businessinsider.com.au/h...gas-company-burisma-holdings-2014-5?r=US&IR=T

What constitutes a 'conspiracy theory' in your mind?

Anything that goes against the official US narrative I suspect.

And what in that particular piece are you alleging/smearing as conspiracy theories.

Do you not think that the coup in Ukraine was a US operation? Is Joe Biden not the head of the Democratic part of the NED aka regime change R us and thus must have been involved in the coup?

 

[rawsilk]

What constitutes a 'conspiracy theory' in your mind?

Anything that goes against the official US narrative I suspect.

And what in that particular piece are you alleging/smearing as conspiracy theories.

Do you not think that the coup in Ukraine was a US operation? Is Joe Biden not the head of the Democratic part of the NED aka regime change R us and thus must have been involved in the coup?

Thank you for asking, always good to clarify these things.

The link I put in for wikispooks felt like a full time conspiracy theorist writing his pieces.

My definition of a conspiracy theory is based on volume of innuendo, implication, insinuation linking things by potential and not fact. An undertone of substantial rhetoric with not a whole lot to back it up, mixed in with some verifiable facts, pomposity, character aspersion, vilification, pejorative attitude, correlation or simply coincidence? Lack of solid and conclusive evidence.

The last test I have for a potential conspiracy theory is, does it feel exhilarating with a potential for truth? Once I see all these things come together in an article or post then I begin to feel they are running a conspiracy theory.

The verifiable facts of any matter, once laid out in consecutive order tend not to be exhilarating, at best interesting at worst boring.

As to your last question regarding Joe Biden, I would have no idea. That would be something for persons, who are in possession of far more tangible evidence, that would need to be able to stand up in a court of law. Without that firm and clear evidence, I would never be able to offer an opinion, as it would be inappropriate and foolish. It is all to do with ethics.

 

[JackLuis]

Only one woman on that list to
-
Just reading through that quote again, The only female finalist for a cabinet post is described as a bimbo, she is pretty, and isn't very bright.


You may be right Jack Luis.

Connie Chung: Only woman who won the election is Kellyanne Conway who ‘manipulated her boss perfectly’

TV anchor Connie Chung joined MSNBC’s Steve Kornacki on Friday afternoon to discuss the results of the 2016 Election and what the media may have missed in the process.

“It is the burning question for all of us in the media,” Chung said. “What happened early on for instance during the Republican primaries, is the media really unwittingly became promoters of Donald Trump.”

Asked "What was the one thing that went wrong with Hillary?"

“She was the wrong woman,” Chung said. “She was the wrong woman eight years ago and she was the wrong woman this time too. People just obviously didn’t trust her. That’s the thing that we all know so clearly.”

She continued, laughing, “There was only one woman who won this election and that was Kellyanne Conway. She manipulated her boss so perfectly.”

 

[underguy1]

Thank you for asking, always good to clarify these things.

The link I put in for wikispooks felt like a full time conspiracy theorist writing his pieces.

My definition of a conspiracy theory is based on volume of innuendo, implication, insinuation linking things by potential and not fact. An undertone of substantial rhetoric with not a whole lot to back it up, mixed in with some verifiable facts, pomposity, character aspersion, vilification, pejorative attitude, correlation or simply coincidence? Lack of solid and conclusive evidence.

The last test I have for a potential conspiracy theory is, does it feel exhilarating with a potential for truth? Once I see all these things come together in an article or post then I begin to feel they are running a conspiracy theory.

The verifiable facts of any matter, once laid out in consecutive order tend not to be exhilarating, at best interesting at worst boring.

As to your last question regarding Joe Biden, I would have no idea. That would be something for persons, who are in possession of far more tangible evidence, that would need to be able to stand up in a court of law. Without that firm and clear evidence, I would never be able to offer an opinion, as it would be inappropriate and foolish. It is all to do with ethics.

How can you ascertain the difference between fact and fiction under your epistemological method?

You can't.

Your pronouncement of 'conspiracy theories' is purely subjective and based entirely on your bias.

You choose to denigrate those who you just feel don't make sense.

 

[underguy1]

As to your last question regarding Joe Biden, I would have no idea. That would be something for persons, who are in possession of far more tangible evidence, that would need to be able to stand up in a court of law. Without that firm and clear evidence, I would never be able to offer an opinion, as it would be inappropriate and foolish. It is all to do with ethics.

You can't be for real.

The NED is real. It does overtly what the CIA used to do covertly (in its own words).

Look it up, do a bit of research. None of it is secret except to those who don't want to believe it.

It is easier though to just sneer 'conspiracy theory' and go with the flow.

 

[rawsilk]

You can't be for real.

The NED is real. It does overtly what the CIA used to do covertly (in its own words).

Look it up, do a bit of research. None of it is secret except to those who don't want to believe it.

It is easier though to just sneer 'conspiracy theory' and go with the flow.

I have no interested in it. With respect, I have other things I would prefer to think about. I shall bow politely to your greater knowledge on the subject and leave you to concern yourself over it.

 

[phrodeau]

Only one woman on that list to be considered for a post. She is very pretty and quote Ann Coulter Trump’s #1 fan Coulter got animated while discussing Haley’s comments, and went so far as to call her a “bimbo.” After John Gibson asked that she shy away from such language, Coulter offered an alternative description of “woman who was accidentally elected because she’s pretty and isn’t very bright”…. Fox news so meh, but a bit of fun to be had by all!http://radio.foxnews.com/2016/01/14/ann-coulter-bimbo-nikki-haley-should-be-deported/ Will she be a winner or just remain one of the finalists vying for the job!

Just reading through that quote again, The only female finalist for a cabinet post is described as a bimbo, she is pretty, and isn't very bright.


You may be right Jack Luis.

There's a good description of Donald Trump - accidentally elected because he's pretty and isn't very bright.

And NED stands for "not enough data."

 

[JoanneA]

Asked "What was the one thing that went wrong with Hillary?"

"She was the wrong woman," Chung said. "She was the wrong woman eight years ago and she was the wrong woman this time too. People just obviously didn't trust her. That's the thing that we all know so clearly."

She continued, laughing, "There was only one woman who won this election and that was Kellyanne Conway. She manipulated her boss so perfectly."

Dark... humour.

 

[underguy1]

I have no interested in it. With respect, I have other things I would prefer to think about. I shall bow politely to your greater knowledge on the subject and leave you to concern yourself over it.

As I suspected, you are merely a partisan hack.

 

[1sickbastard]

As I've repeatedly demonstrated, I am merely an attention seeker.

Fypyw.
Also for the attention (afta).

 

[rawsilk]

How can you ascertain the difference between fact and fiction under your epistemological method?

You can't.

Your pronouncement of 'conspiracy theories' is purely subjective and based entirely on your bias.

You choose to denigrate those who you just feel don't make sense.

My apologies, I missed this post until now.

To your first comment. All I ask for is hard evidence as prescribed by law:http://dictionary.findlaw.com/definition/standard-of-proof.html

Your statement about 'conspiracy theories' is correct.

If you feel I have been denigrating in my treatment of yourself or anyone else, I truly apologize. I am here to debate, in a respectful and reasonable manner. I find it pointless to argue over the unknown or unproven. It then falls into an argument over opinions. I feel everyone has a right to an opinion particularly when it is debated in a calm and respectful manner. However I have no opinion or interest in the matter of which you were speaking, so it would be pointless for me to enter into a dialogue on the subject.

 

[underguy1]

M I have no opinion or interest in the matter of which you were speaking, so it would be pointless for me to enter into a dialogue on the subject.

Exactly. You're only interested in running Trump down. Democratic Party corruption is AOK with you.