This whole 'Free Speech' thing.

[Five_Inch_Heels]

I know is doesn't really apply in the UK or much of Europe. Certainly not in most Asian, African or South American countries But it's supposed to be protected in the US, or so they say.

In fact, it does not. I was thinking about it this morning and about how many things you really cannot say, type, or even utter in public. I'm not talking about criminal things or libel/slander. There are things you might not be arrested for, but could be confined for, or taken to court over. Things that could cost you a great deal, lose a job over, be blackmailed with, etc.

Yes, I know the First is limited to Government actions and doesn't apply to private entities, but the various levels of Governments can act to 'silence' you in other ways.

And of course there are things you can't even say here. Not that they're against board policy, but because someone may 'report' you to authorities who could obtain court orders for site records, etc. Not specifically this site either, but any site.

In summary, you really cannot speak truly freely anywhere. Again not talking about criminal things like planning bad deeds, but even expressing feelings and emotions.


Kind of a fucked up world over all.

 

[RoryN]

Us Americans are shockingly ignorant when it comes to the First Amendment. And that is pathetic.

Your First Amendment rights do not apply to private citizens who wish to silence you, nor private entities who wish to do the same. You certainly might have a case for a resulting course of action - like litigation - depending upon the circumstances, but it won't be with the help of the First Amendment.

Invoking Freedom of Speech per the First Amendment where it doesn't apply is alarmist, and exposes your poor education.

 

[BotanyBoy]

I know is doesn't really apply in the UK or much of Europe. Certainly not in most Asian, African or South American countries But it's supposed to be protected in the US, or so they say.

In fact, it does not. I was thinking about it this morning and about how many things you really cannot say, type, or even utter in public. I'm not talking about criminal things or libel/slander. There are things you might not be arrested for, but could be confined for, or taken to court over. Things that could cost you a great deal, lose a job over, be blackmailed with, etc.

Yes, I know the First is limited to Government actions and doesn't apply to private entities, but the various levels of Governments can act to 'silence' you in other ways.

And of course there are things you can't even say here. Not that they're against board policy, but because someone may 'report' you to authorities who could obtain court orders for site records, etc. Not specifically this site either, but any site.

Got any examples or you just swinging in the dark out there hoping to connect?

Is this a Men In Black conspiracy thread or some shit?

In summary, you really cannot speak truly freely anywhere. Again not talking about criminal things like planning bad deeds, but even expressing feelings and emotions.

Bullshit.

 

[Aella_]

Got any examples or you just swinging in the dark out there hoping to connect?

Is this a Men In Black conspiracy thread or some shit?


Bullshit.

What are you talking about, , BB ?
Can you tell your boss -to their face- "I think you're an asshole?" Without any consequences down the line, like performance reports that are less good than they should be, or a bad letter of reference when changing jobs?

She's right. On an explicit level, they claim that you can (the law is on your side blah blah blah). But one often ends up paying some sort of price, in the end.

 

[yossi]

What are you talking about, , BB ?
Can you tell your boss -to their face- "I think you're an asshole?" Without any consequences down the line, like performance reports that are less good than they should be, or a bad letter of reference when changing jobs?
She's right.

Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequences.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequences.

If it doesn't it's not free.

 

[BotanyBoy]

What are you talking about, , BB ?
Can you tell your boss -to their face- "I think you're an asshole?" Without any consequences down the line, like performance reports that are less good than they should be, or a bad letter of reference when changing jobs?
She's right.

Well....I'm my own boss so I can and do talk shit to myself regularly.

If you want to look at my customers as my bosses (I do) of course there are consequences. I could lose money.

But I could also call every one of them a shit eating prick and that's still all I'd lose.

You can't go to jail or be cleaned out in court for being an asshole.

If you go to far you can get in trouble but FIH specifically stated not stuff that's not criminal.

Which means the worst that can happen to you is you lose money/reputation....something even in the most open concepts of "free speech" have never (theoretically) protected you from and certainly not the legal concept of it as it applies to US law.

 

[lovecraft68]

Political correctness has destroyed freedom of speech.

Look at the examples of Donald Sterling and HUlk Hogan. Two people taped without their knowledge in the privacy of their own homes utter a racial slur and they are ruined.

In Sterling's case he's mid eighties,. losing his marbles and if you listened to the tapes he was led into it by the gold digging whore he married.

They tried to ruin Chik filet because heaven forbid the guy expressed his religious beliefs, same for duck dynasty.

YOu can only speak freely if the castrated people of the US agree with what you say.

Oh, but its okay to publicly lobby for rape to be made legal, just ask Sean Renaud, he;ll tell you all about how progressive that is

 

[Liar]

I know is doesn't really apply in the UK or much of Europe.

And that's where I stopped reading.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Political correctness has destroyed freedom of speech.

Look at the examples of Donald Sterling and HUlk Hogan. Two people taped without their knowledge in the privacy of their own homes utter a racial slur and they are ruined.

In Sterling's case he's mid eighties,. losing his marbles and if you listened to the tapes he was led into it by the gold digging whore he married.

They tried to ruin Chik filet because heaven forbid the guy expressed his religious beliefs, same for duck dynasty.

YOu can only speak freely if the castrated people of the US agree with what you say.

Oh, but its okay to publicly lobby for rape to be made legal, just ask Sean Renaud, he;ll tell you all about how progressive that is

No he won't. Hell tell you that all associate with that chain are scum. Along wth Sterling and Hogan who were both punished for their deeds.

LC is just angry for reasons I can't comprehend to be honest. Here is claiming that Hogan and Sterling were wrongfully accused but the argument we had was that Trump should be defended for his anti-Muslim rhetoric because. .. honeslty I never thought LC was a bigot. Overly zealous sure but hey I guess I'm guilty of benefit of the doubt and really need to fix that.

 

[RoryN]

Political correctness has destroyed freedom of speech.

Look at the examples of Donald Sterling and HUlk Hogan. Two people taped without their knowledge in the privacy of their own homes utter a racial slur and they are ruined.

This has nothing to do with Freedom of Speech, as defined in the United States by the First Amendment.

 

[NOIRTRASH]

As a rule I speak my mind, and I reserve the right to be mute when it suits me. Ima a pitiful liar so deceit for me is a struggle. Instead of lying I say something true but not really the answer to the question you asked.

Like: DOES THIS MAKE ME LOOK FAT? I say, YOU HAVE THE MOST GORGEOUS ASS ON EARTH! I like fat asses.

But I stay in trouble for my bald honesty. People learn to ask my opinion when they want confirmation of what they know for real.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Political correctness has destroyed freedom of speech.

Then we never had it to begin with.....PC is and always has been around.

If it's good or bad is just a matter of perspective. If PC was still lynching nigrahz and slapping hoe's back into the fuckin kitchen where Jesus commanded their asses to be the Right wing of the US would be all happy go lucky "Life is great!" and everyone left of theocratic nut job would be bitching about how PC was keeping the country in the fuckin' dark ages.

But instead now we have to treat everyone like human beings...even the gheyz and the PC shower joyously in 'conservative' tears.

 

[Aella_]

Well....I'm my own boss so I can and do talk shit to myself regularly.

If you want to look at my customers as my bosses (I do) of course there are consequences. I could lose money.

But I could also call every one of them a shit eating prick and that's still all I'd lose.

You can't go to jail or be cleaned out in court for being an asshole.

If you go to far you can get in trouble but FIH specifically stated not stuff that's not criminal.

Which means the worst that can happen to you is you lose money/reputation....something even in the most open concepts of "free speech" have never (theoretically) protected you from and certainly not the legal concept of it as it applies to US law.

Indeed. Even if one ends up paying some sort of price for that, the legal consequences are much less dire in western countries as opposed to closed societies.
I guess the OP had that in mind as well, but she did not convey that too clearly.

And you're right about the fact that one's social status plays a big role in this - whether one can or cannot afford to speak up their mind.
Fewer negative consequences for someone who's independent or established in their career than, let's say, someone who's in training or who works in a hierarchical, military-type of work environment. Or Donald Trump - he's rich, he can shoot his mouth and say as many outrageous things as he pleases. And if he crosses the line - he'll either hire a top lawyer or settle (aka bribe).

 

[Aella_]

EDIT.
I guess I'm using PCnness in a different sort of way than you guys. I use it when I'm referring to hypochritical double-talk. As opposed to a genuinely respectful attitude towards minorities and so on.

 

[Sean]

And that's where I stopped reading.

Pretty much.

 

[doowdniw]

Just don't mention the word "bomb" when going through security at the airport.

 

[Aella_]

Or in this forum, don't mention the word "paed…
Oops, did I just say that loud?

 

[Liar]

Paedocypris is a small fish which is a distant cousin to the common carp.

 

[Wings]

Learn what the fuck the first amendment means you twatwaffles.

 

[Aella_]

Learn what the fuck the first amendment means you twatwaffles.

Why? Wanna give us a free lesson?
I always bowed to your aaaawesome general knowledge.

 

[badbabysitter]

I know is doesn't really apply in the UK or much of Europe. Certainly not in most Asian, African or South American countries But it's supposed to be protected in the US, or so they say.

In fact, it does not. I was thinking about it this morning and about how many things you really cannot say, type, or even utter in public. I'm not talking about criminal things or libel/slander. There are things you might not be arrested for, but could be confined for, or taken to court over. Things that could cost you a great deal, lose a job over, be blackmailed with, etc.

Yes, I know the First is limited to Government actions and doesn't apply to private entities, but the various levels of Governments can act to 'silence' you in other ways.

And of course there are things you can't even say here. Not that they're against board policy, but because someone may 'report' you to authorities who could obtain court orders for site records, etc. Not specifically this site either, but any site.

In summary, you really cannot speak truly freely anywhere. Again not talking about criminal things like planning bad deeds, but even expressing feelings and emotions.


Kind of a fucked up world over all.

Not fucked up at all

freedom of speech does not mean freedom from consequence

you want to say something truly stupid, dont come crying to me about how mean everyone is to you

 

[cleaver]

it ain't here
so go look elsewhere...

you fuckers are loud with your nigger about it.

 

[Vagina_Dentata]

I can sit here in my living room and say anything I want and absolutely nothing is going to happen. Can't get much freer than that.

 

[Ishmael]

Freedom of speech doesn't mean freedom from consequences.

^^ This.

Ishmael