Requesting payment

[LilMissNerd1]

There is an author on this site, in order for his readers to obtain new chapters prior to them being posted on literotica.com, asks that they "voluntarily" pay him $5/chapter or $30 as a one time fee. This is a free site. A lot of its readers and members utilize this site to be published, have their work recognized or even to enjoy the imagination of others. I know of one author who removes her work that she feels is succesful, and actually publishes it and sells her work. But, this author, demands votes and comments and feedback via email. All understandable, we all need a push to keep going. And Lord knows, this doesn't pay. But to blatantly tell your readers that they will have to pay money in order to read something, I just find it baffling. Why would you do that to your readers, why make some more privileged than others just because they're willing and able to spare $X and pay for something, when not everyone can afford to do so. It is a veritable slap to the face and I have thus refused to read this authors work furthermore, even though I truly enjoyed his work.

 

[sr71plt]

Doesn't sound to me like anyone is "forcing" you to do anything. I'm not sure what is actually going on, but I put most of my stories out for a fee for months before putting them here on Lit. for FREE (and some I never offer for FREE). I don't tell readers here they have to pay for them if they want to read them before they are put on Lit. for FREE, but that's what it amounts to. All you have to do is to wait to get it for FREE. If you can't wait to read it for FREE, yes, you can jolly well pay for it. I don't owe it to you ten minutes after I've written it. I don't owe it to you at all.

 

[le_kitty]

I really don't know how to feel about this.

We live in a world where the internet has made everything accessible. Everything.

It breeds a sense of entitlement.

Perhaps the author you speak of came across a little harsh in his wording, or chose a wrong way to go about this. But effectively, asking compensation for hours committed and work produced, is not wrong.

I'm a student, so I would know about a budget. $5 or even $30 is not a lot, personally, I've given more to charity, but again, I would not be that willing to even fork out a few dollars to watch a film unless at the box office.

It's not about making some more privileged than others pay, if they pay, they've chosen to pay, they think that his work is worth the money they're going to fork out. And they can afford to, great! And at least, they've already had a taste of his work. You could make a case for buying a lot of published author works on the strength of a blurb. A fiction book (whether good or terrible) is easily $20.

I don't know. Everyone needs to live.

Kit

 

[observer7]

Hahahahaha!
Ah, I love the entitled Millennials.

Wait, no, I don't.

Sr7ilot said it best. Go on a hunger strike if you must, it won't change anything and the author isn't doing anything wrong. You are basically saying you want the same privileges as those who willingly support an author without having the pay for them. Sounds like a whiny twit to me.

Just don't pay, wait, and read them when they post. Duh.

 

[jsmiam]

Turn them in, and see if anything comes of it. i don't see anything wrong with being annoyed by it. It's stepping outside the intentions of the site.

 

[jsmiam]

Turn them in, and see if anything comes of it. i don't see anything wrong with being annoyed by it. It's stepping outside the intentions of the site.

I re-read your post more carefully. But even through the fine print, the twists and turns and the bending and stretching of the rules through the voluntary subscriptions, the author is running a business off of this site.

At the same time, keep your expectations in check if you do turn them in. Don't be surprised if you are ignored by the operator, lots of people are.

 

[observer7]

I re-read your post more carefully. But even through the fine print, the twists and turns and the bending and stretching of the rules through the voluntary subscriptions, the author is running a business off of this site.

At the same time, keep your expectations in check if you do turn them in. Don't be surprised if you are ignored by the operator, lots of people are.

Business. Right. Less than $600 isn't even reported on income tax.

Also a bitchy thing to do to show how shitty of a person you are to an author whose stories you profess to enjoy. Righteous self-centered douchbaggery.

 

[sr71plt]

Turn them in, and see if anything comes of it. i don't see anything wrong with being annoyed by it. It's stepping outside the intentions of the site.

Why? Why does the Web site care as long as it is--or has been--offered here in its entirety for free? I do see a problem, but the OP didn't cover it. I think putting a chapter or a couple of chapters here for free and then telling readers they have to go pay for the rest of it if they want to finish the story is not legitimate. But the OP doesn't mention this. (I was personally burned even further by this, having edited a chaptered series that that author was posting to Lit. and then posted a small part of it here and took it to the marketplace in its entirety. So, I essentially edited for free a book being published for money--just none of it to me.)

If after a period of time you post something here for free that you've had in the marketplace, I see nothing wrong with that nor do I see why the Web site would see anything wrong with that either. And I do that. I'm giving reads for free to those accessing them here that others are paying for for a packaged version. How entitled does a reader here have to be to think I'm cheating them of anything rather than gifting them my stories? (or the Web site that is making money off of them?)

If you post stories for free here and different stories for money, I don't see anything wrong with that--or why the Web site (or free-read readers) wouldn't be delighted that you were posting free stories here as well as publishing other stories for money.

If an author pulls stories from here to sell in the marketplace, I don't see anything wrong with that (incidentally, I've never done that--I've never pulled a story from this Web site for any reason) and I don't see anything against the rules here (other than doing it with contest wins for a period of time) and I don't see why the Web site (or readers) shouldn't be happy they got the stories for free for a period of time.

So, although I can see a problem, it isn't a problem the OP brought up. All I saw in the OP was "you owe me free reads." Nertz to that. I also see "I'm forced to do this and that because someone demands it," which I just see as dumb. You can't be forced to send an author anything.

 

[jsmiam]

Business. Right. Less than $600 isn't even reported on income tax.

Also a bitchy thing to do to show how shitty of a person you are to an author whose stories you profess to enjoy. Righteous self-centered douchbaggery.

Are you the author? You seem to know a lot about this. And have mighty strong opinions.

Also, the author is pressuring his/her minions to commit review fraud. Are you defending that also

 

[jsmiam]

Why? Why does the Web site care as long as it is--or has been--offered here in its entirety for free? I do see a problem, but the OP didn't cover it. I think putting a chapter or a couple of chapters here for free and then telling readers they have to go pay for the rest of it if they want to finish the story. But the OP doesn't mention this. (I was personally burned even further by this, having edited a chaptered series that that author was posting to Lit. and then posted a small part of it here and took it to the marketplace in its entirety. So, I essentially edited for free a book being published for money--just none of it to me.)

If after a period of time you post something here for free that you've had in the marketplace, I see nothing wrong with that nor do I see why the Web site would see anything wrong with that either. And I do that. I'm giving reads for free to those accessing them here that others are paying for for a packaged version. How entitled does a reader here have to be to think I'm cheating them of anything rather than gifting them my stories? (or the Web site that is making money off of them?)

If you post stories for free here and different stories for money, I don't see anything wrong with that--or why the Web site (or free-read readers) wouldn't be delighted that you were posting free stories here as well as publishing other stories for money.

If an author pulls stories from here to sell in the marketplace, I don't see anything wrong with that (incidentally, I've never done that--I've never pulled a story from this Web site for any reason) and I don't see anything against the rules here (other than doing it with contest wins for a period of time) and I don't see why the Web site (or readers) shouldn't be happy they got the stories for free for a period of time.

So, although I can see a problem, it isn't a problem the OP brought up. All I saw in the OP was "you owe me free reads." Nertz to that.

You are one of the biggest advocates of the existence of voting blocks and conspiracy theories in scores. The OP alluded to the author requiring votes too. I'm surprised you are defending this.

 

[sr71plt]

You are one of the biggest advocates of the existence of voting blocks and conspiracy theories in scores. The OP alluded to the author requiring votes too. I'm surprised you are defending this.

I have done no such thing. I posted nothing about that. I'm surprised that you have swallowed the OP's position and claims without question.

An adult would just ignore the "demands" for anything the OP claims and go read other authors--there are some 60,000 of them who have posted stories here.

Do you also think you are entitled to free reads?

Stop taking pot shots and respond to what I laid out in my post, or butt the hell out. Your shot about voting blocks is totally irrelevant to this discussion.

 

[RejectReality]

I've been watching this play out in the feedback portal for a little while now. The chapters are all being posted to Lit. ( so far ) The payments are for early access.

 

[jsmiam]

I've been watching this play out in the feedback portal for a little while now. The chapters are all being posted to Lit. ( so far ) The payments are for early access.

I'll reply to the thread topic by saying that the alleged (or actual, as confirmed by RejectReality) conduct by the author in question could be viewed (potentially) as a violation of item 6, and (stretching further) item 7 of the Forum Guidelines, viewable at http://www.literotica.com/support/forum_rules.shtml. It's more proactively seeking out payment through Literotica interactions than just providing links to published works, which many authors do.

Mostly though, I don't care that much. I would ignore the author and/or their panderings. My choice in ignoring hot winds blowing elsewhere in this thread shows that I'm pretty good at ignoring the ignorable.

 

[sr71plt]

I would ignore the author and/or their panderings.

In other words, you now agree with me. (You just can't be gracious about it.)

No I don't think authors should do this; no I don't think it's against the rules here if they eventually do fill out the series here for free read. BUT, I think readers should take responsibility for themselves and use common sense. If they salivate after the series and want to pay an extra fee to read it before it's offered for free, that's their business. I think they are chumps for doing so when there's so much other material here they could be reading before that one becomes available for free--but that's their business and responsibility. Again, the author isn't forcing them to do anything as long as it's eventually fully posted for free. If it isn't fully posted for free, yes, I think that's wrong and they should be banned. If you give into their pressuring to do anything to get an advance look at it, that's your call and choice to knuckle under to the pressure.

That said, where's the reticence in identifying the author doing this if you're going to bring it up at all? It's not me doing it, so why should there be any question of who is doing it and who isn't--if you have to bring it up and don't just choose to not be suckered into it?

 

[Etaski]

Hmm. I know who she is talking about. If his profile is accurate, he is in Nigeria.

A contribution of $5 from US readers may stretch farther for him than it does for the readers who trade with him for his stories. Fair enough to bargain, and the internet helps spread the wealth a bit more.

 

[observer7]

Are you the author? You seem to know a lot about this. And have mighty strong opinions.

HA! No, I ain't. I bet I've been around longer than the author she's jealous about. That's a mighty stupid assumption to make on the internet. People have strong opinions about many things not related to them in the slightest, so blow me.

I like to ridicule demanding, entitled kids like the OP who ridicule others and post specifically to look for others to agree with them. They make it so easy leaving themselves open.

Was sort of hoping she would respond to some very valid points others have made, but I wager she's scared shitless of the adults now.

Also, the author is pressuring his/her minions to commit review fraud. Are you defending that also

Aaaaaand nobody has to do jack-shit in response. I also don't fucking care. This is the last post I'll make about it because I'm bored with the debate (which amounts to: "Technically!" "Practically?" "…yeah."). The OP was what was funny. I read the same thing as sr7plt: "The world owes me everything for free". Low hanging fruit begging to be swatted.

See yaz.

 

[lovecraft68]

So the stories are here meaning he is not technically charging for them, he is simply requesting compensation that you can choose to or not to give? Is that what's going on because for some reason I'm a little confused by the original post.

If that's the case I see nothing wrong with it.

On the other hand if what they are saying is 'pay up or you won't see the next story' then that could be wrong as lit is set up as a free site and may take issue with an author doing that.

But even then, Laurel would be the only one who can really answer that.

Personally I could care less. I have no issue supporting authors here. That's why I have about 40 e-books on my lap top that I will most likely never read, I just bought them to support my fellow authors.

 

[lovecraft68]

. Do you also think you are entitled to free reads?

Being that lit is free I'm not sure the word entitled is accurate. People expect free reads here because, well the site is free.

Its we the authors who have to decide if we want to give it away or not. I don't get pissed at the readers for expecting to not pay for anything here, why should they?

 

[lovecraft68]

I've been watching this play out in the feedback portal for a little while now. The chapters are all being posted to Lit. ( so far ) The payments are for early access.

Ah, a sneak peek. I seemed to have missed that.

Well in that case what's the fuss? They know they will ultimately see them anyway so they are not being blackmailed and the author is not violating any lit policy so its do you want to choose to compensate the author for his time as a sign of appreciation and in return for that he gives you a little bonus of getting a look at the story before everyone else. Nothing wrong with that.

Maybe I'll go find this person and give him $5 for the hell of it. I could care less about the story, but I do pretty well in sales so I like to pay things forward a bit.

Too bad I'm a minority in that thinking.

 

[sr71plt]

Being that lit is free I'm not sure the word entitled is accurate. People expect free reads here because, well the site is free.

Its we the authors who have to decide if we want to give it away or not. I don't get pissed at the readers for expecting to not pay for anything here, why should they?

The complaint is that they have to pay (and, apparently favorably vote and review the Lit. versions) to get early access to what is eventually going to be given to them for free. Therefore they are saying they should be entitled to get this early access without paying for it when others have chosen to do so. They don't think they should have to wait to get it for free. That spells an entitlement position to me.

 

[lovecraft68]

The complaint is that they have to pay (and, apparently favorably vote and review the Lit. versions) to get early access to what is eventually going to be given to them for free. Therefore they are saying they should be entitled to get this early access without paying for it when others have chosen to do so. They don't think they should have to wait to get it for free. That spells an entitlement position to me.

Right, I caught up with that. Whining about having to wait an extra week to get it for free is a bit much.

When I had the store we were part of the Marvel sneak peek program. Each week I would get a half dozen comics that weren't due to ship until the following week so people could take a look and see if they might want to buy them-and pre order which was the benefit for me.

But people would ask to buy it and we would say no, because that violates the terms of the program and they would get pissed off about it.

The net is responsible for 'instant gratification' syndrome.

 

[jsmiam]

If the author has a mailing list of their own and minions willing to follow, he can do anything he wants. Including (unethical) review fraud via minions, which the OP implied an author does, not sure if they switched author in question or not.

I was saying one basic thing- using posts within a lit thread specifically for marketing an external money seeking site to recruit paying minions is on the outskirts of the rules, a gray enough area that the op could try their luck getting Laurels attention. Pilot and anger management patient dude didn't seem to like that.

Edits in bold

 

[lovecraft68]

If the author has a mailing list of their own and minions willing to follow, he can do anything he wants. Including (unethical) review fraud via minions, which the OP implied an author does, not sure if they switched author in question or not.

I was saying one basic thing- using posts within a lit thread specifically for marketing an external site to recruit minions is on the outskirts of the rules, a gray enough area that the op could try their luck getting Laurels attention. Pilot and anger management patient dude didn't seem to like that.

Tell that to Naoko Smith who uses this site to feed her personal blog.

So pretty much if there was an infraction here, which I'm not sire there is, nothing would be done anyway. Nothing is ever done.

As for soliciting comments/reviews we spent all of last summer pointing out the voting block here and how they pad all each others stats and people-many of them-complained to laurel- and in the end what we got was a mod who said it can no longer be discussed.

because that was easier than addressing an issue and that goes for any issue.

 

[sr71plt]

Tell that to Naoko Smith who uses this site to feed her personal blog.

Absolutely right. The last I knew if she did a review of a story from here you had to go to her blog to read it. This is on top of continually soliciting folks to switch over from here to her blog. All of which is hunky-dory with this Web site, despite having an explicit forum rule against doing it.

Other than apparently directly soliciting pay for early access and maybe conditioning even paid early access on favorable votes and reviews here, This so-far unnamed Lit. author isn't doing anything functionally different from what I do--and will continue to do and anyone who wants to read my stories can jolly well live with if they want to continue to have free access to my stories at some point. If they want earlier access, I'd be delighted that they go buy them in the marketplace. I don't directly solicit them to do so, but I do advertise here on the thread provided for that when books and anthologies have gone to the marketplace and I will continue to do so without an ounce of guilty feelings. If you want to read them before I make them available for free here, you can go buy them. You should just, I believe, be happy that I provide them free here eventually.

My contest stories usually appear here first (but there's no rule that they have to). Other stories of mine posted here have mostly appeared in anthologies published three to eight months earlier to the marketplace and are still in the marketplace (and many stories given here for free are still selling in the marketplace). If you see an announcement of the Grab Bag series on the published author's page here, for instance, you could buy that now, but you could wait for a few months and read them for free here.

My current Brambleton series posting here was published originally to the marketplace in 2013, is still there, and still has sales going. The same is true with the series I posted here prior to that, Home to Fire Island, published to the marketplace in 2012. My current Valentine's Day contest story, Puttin' On the Ritz, is already set up by my publisher to be published under my Dirk Hessian pen name as an e-book next month.

You could buy the first two of these when they first come out or you could wait and read them for free. Readers here got the third one first for a free read. If you think there's something to complain about this, I think you have a screw loose.

I don't make a secret of having them in the marketplace first (and simultaneously). In fact I frequently suggest this as a way to mitigate having your stories stolen. First, I've already made most of the money I could make off them myself before anyone would have a chance to swipe them from here and publish them, and, second, if I want to pursue the theft matter, I can point to a version that had already been published by my publisher (and, most likely, already on distribution by the distributor I'm complaining to). Can't get much better proof than that of who it belongs to.

 

[GoldenMaia]

..... in order for his readers to obtain new chapters prior to them being posted on literotica.com, asks that they "voluntarily" .....blah blah.....But to blatantly tell your readers that they will have to pay money in ....blah blah......

There is no have to. Just wait.

You can wait.

You'll be ok.