UnitedHealth says Obamacare is costing it billions

[AlexVega]

Whether the ACA exists or not, I badmouth those who choose to dump their health risk on other people. You know, moochers.

Which is why I say fair game. Don't buy in to a risk pool. But if you're down on your luck in the future, don't expect those who took responsibility for themselves to bail you out. You don't get insurance, you bear the FULL cost. No exception. It's insurance, not welfare for morons who think they're immortal or moochers who game the system. Deal?

Correction, they get other people to pay for the lion's share of their care. Because they're moochers.

Which is one of the reasons I don't like the ACA. It allows for moochers.

Ken, by being a socialist take makes you a "moochers"

 

[Liar]

Ken, by being a socialist take makes you a "moochers"

Shut the fuck up, Siri.

 

[AlexVega]

Shut the fuck up, Siri.

See Ken, there is that anger. Have you called your Doctor because you don't want to stroke out especially at your advanced age.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Whether the ACA exists or not, I badmouth those who choose to dump their health risk on other people. You know, moochers.

So the elderly and the ill?? Because those are the ones moochin.....not the young and healthy....they aren't incurring 1 1/1000th the expense that the folks who have been abusing their bodies for the past 20+ years are.

Which is why I say fair game. Don't buy in to a risk pool. But if you're down on your luck in the future, don't expect those who took responsibility for themselves to bail you out. You don't get insurance, you bear the FULL cost. No exception.

That only works if we get rid of socialism and start turning people away from hospitals to go die in the street for being poor and or not taking care of themselves.

It's insurance, not welfare for morons who think they're immortal or moochers who game the system. Deal?

It ceased to be insurance when the government put a gun to my head for it....at that point it very much became welfare IDGAF what bullshit label (D) put on it.

Get rid of all the mooching, go back to pre-Reagan care and make everyone responsible and you got yourself a deal!

Correction, they get other people to pay for the lion's share of their care. Because they're moochers.

All the numbers say the terminally ill and 50+ are the moochers....not the 22 y/o single kid in perfect health.

Which is one of the reasons I don't like the ACA. It allows for moochers.

It doesn't force enough out of the non-moochers you mean....and that's why it's broken. So they are going to penalize the non moochers for 2x as much or 2% of their income whichever is higher at that point. Which unless you make a pretty good living (in which case your employer likely already covers you) is STILL not even close LOL.

They are going to have to raise that tax revenue stream for the insurance companies to about 5,000 bucks a year + penalties for HC for it to start forcing folks to buy HC insurance.

LOL good luck!!

 

[Liar]

So the elderly and the ill?? Because those are the ones moochin.....not the young and healthy....they aren't incurring 1 1/1000th the expense that the folks who have been abusing their bodies for the past 20+ years are.

That's not how risk pools work and you know it. Please tell me you know it, and that I haven't merely mistaken you for a somewhat intelligent person all this time.

If the elderly and the ill realize that they need to be part of a risk pool right when they become elderly and ill, they're moochers. If they had coverage all along, they're responsible adults.

That only works if we get rid of socialism and start turning people away from hospitals to go die in the street for being poor.

Nope. The moochers are those who can afford to buy into the risk pool but chooses not to.

It ceased to be insurance when the government put a gun to my head for it....at that point it very much became welfare IDGAF what bullshit label (D) put on it.

How nice for you. I don't actually give a toss what label you want to put on it. A risk pool os a risk pool is a risk pool, whether it's private insurance, tax funded, or a corporatist hodgepodge like the ACA.

All the numbers say the terminally ill and 50+ are the moochers....not the 22 y/o single kid in perfect health.

If you think that, you haven't understood a single word of what I've been saying. Or you're being silly for the fuck of it.

It doesn't force enough out of the non-moochers you mean....and that's why it's broken. So they are going to penalize the non moochers for 2x as much or 2% of their income whichever is higher at that point.

Those were words. They probably even meant something. But I'll be damned if I can figure out what.

 

[BotanyBoy]

That's not how risk pools work and you know it. Please tell me you know it, and that I haven't mistaken you for a somewhat intelligent person.

If the elderly and the ill realize that they need to be part of a risk pool right when they become elderly and ill, they're moochers. If they had coverage all along, they're responsible adults.

It's not a risk pool when the government puts a gun to my head and takes it from me....it's welfare.

This is the USA, nobody has had coverage all along because the vast majority aren't responsible adults, they are diabetic, obese, cancerous baby boomers with no self control over their McD's and Marlboro habits. Not to mention their abhorrence to paying bills......welcome to reality.

Nope. The moochers are those who can afford to buy into the risk pool but chooses not to.

No the moochers are the ones who hired congress critterz to penalize those not buying into their insurance scam to cover their HC cost. Not the people giving that penalty the fingah....

How nice for you. I don't actually give a toss what label you want to put on it. A risk pool os a risk pool is a risk pool, whether it's private insurance, tax funded, or a cporporatist hodgepodge like the ACA.

No it's welfare. You can put it in an insurance dress and call it a risk pool but because the government holds a gun to my head for a buy in, it ceases to become a risk pool and now becomes a welfare pool.

If you think that, you haven't understood a single word of what I've been saying. Or you're being silly for the fuck of it.

Those were words. They probably even meant something. But I'll be damned if I can figure out what.

I understand you....you think people not paying into the program (that they don't need) are moochers.

I think the people who are using the government to FORCE people who don't need the program, to pay for their shit, are the REAL moochers.

 

[Liar]

Fine. Redefine words if it tickles your fancy. You know what I'm takling about.

I pay for a thing. That makes it mine.
If you don't pay for a thing, you shouldn't get to have it.

Unless we decree that all pay for the thing and all get to have it. You know, actual socialism. Not crappy socialism with loophopes you can drive Belgium through.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Fine. Redefine words if it tickles your fancy. You know what I'm takling about.

What word am I redefining?

It ceases to become a risk pool when I'm forced to pay into it.

Is roulette gambling or even a game if someone puts a gun to your head to play?? Most of the world would at that point call it extortion or just flat out robbery.

I pay for a thing. That makes it mine.
If you don't pay for a thing, you shouldn't get to have it.

I paid 300 bucks!!

I thought you liked socialism??

Unless we decree that all pay for the thing and all get to have it. You know, actual socialism. Not crappy socialism with loophopes you can drive Belgium through.

That would be nice, but I fear that's about as likely as us going back to pre Reagancare and letting the indigent/uninsured die. Because we let special interest groups write legislation and our elected officials just sign off on the shit without ever reading any of it.

Except the hand full of do-gooders up there who are all labeled unelectable bat shit loons.

 

[Liar]

What word am I redefining?

Welfare.

I paid 300 bucks!!

What was the actual cost?

I thought you liked socialism??

Not on principle. But I have to admit it kind of works. I like things that work.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Welfare.

Then what do you call it when the government forces money out of you to give to someone else?

What was the actual cost?

From each according to his ability

And IDK I have insurance because retired army...haven't ever used it.

I do know rebuilding my knee/hip/shoulder cash cost would have been about 220,000 bucks....but they billed the US government nearly 1.8 million for it LOL.

Not on principle. But I have to admit it kind of works. I like things that work.

In certain situations I agree....and part of the bad of socialism is it's easy to wind up in a situation that is rife with mooching, always has been always will be.

No different than capitalism leading to cruelty for a buck....it's the price you pay.

 

[Liar]

Then what do you call it when the government forces money out of you to give to someone else?

Taxes?

 

[BotanyBoy]

Taxes?

Maybe...if they were going to a public good or a nationalized program you could call it that. Single payer would be that...because then everyone would be putting in and getting something back.

But that's not what ACA is. Wayyyyyyyyyy to many private companies getting mega BUX, and a few sad hard cases who got a bump while the rest get fucked. It's a scam not progress, corporate welfare at best and a (D)amn (D)irty (D)emocrat scam to pay off their billionaire overlords if you want to be a dick about it.

 

[miles]

I have a right to free auto and homeowners insurance. Why should I have to pay for it?

Maybe Uncle Bernie will make that promise.

 

[someoneyouknow]

It's not. But if you can't pay all your bills in the worst case scenario, but refuse to pay for the common risk pool (whether that's a private insurer or a public single payer solution) you are heaping the risk and cost of that scenario over on the rest of us. You're a risk moocher.

The alternative is that you accept to not get care at all if you're ever out of money. I've continunously paid for that care, and I don't consent to give it to you.

A) I am perfectly content to be left to die if I can't pay my medical bills. I've not asked anyone to help me out (none have ever offered anyway) and since I pay my debt, if I can't pay my bill, let me die. I owe no one anything.

B) You don't consent? Fine. Where's the form I sign to make sure none of your money doesn't go towards me. Wouldn't want to be in debt to you, just like I don't like to be in debt, period.

C) Risk moocher? Wow, pulling anything out of the hat to make sure people are forced to hand over their money to a private company, aren't you? Wouldn't want people to make their own decisions now would we? Let me guess, you don't think a woman should be able to have an abortion, do you?

 

[someoneyouknow]

Taxes?

Money people are forced to hand over to private companies are not taxes. The money does not go to fund government services. Therefore it is not a tax despite what Republican John Roberts said.

 

[someoneyouknow]

United Health whining people are using the insurance they're required to pay for, which is costing the executives their bonuses:

For insurers, their issue at the moment is simply trying to remain profitable with their plans on Obamacare's marketplace exchanges. UnitedHealth Group has suggested that higher utilization of insurance and the ease with which consumers can change plans from one year to the next is making it very difficult for insurers to be profitable.

Not to mention 85% of people forced to buy insurance are leeching off others:

Through each of the first three years, somewhere in the neighborhood of 85% of enrollees via HealthCare.gov, the federally run marketplace that currently covers 38 states, have qualified for subsidies. This figure is also pretty consistent when looking at the one dozen marketplaces run by individual states.

http://www.fool.com/investing/gener...ce=yahoo&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=article

 

[phrodeau]

Funny, I thought the insurance companies were the ones pushing for the ACA. Were they not careful what they wished for?

 

[mark_j]

Funny, I thought the insurance companies were the ones pushing for the ACA. Were they not careful what they wished for?

They were fine with it until they got cut off from having the tax payers bail them out if they didn't turn a profit.

 

[Hypoxia]

Mea culpa: My partner and I were software engineers at a big insurer. (We did cars and homeowners', not healthcare or life.) My partner's sibling ran computer operations for one of THE major insurers. I have some slight insight into how the industry works.

The basic numbers: Medicare's overhead is around 3%. Before ACA, private insurers' overhead was around 23-25%. Thus one-fifth of healthcare dollars were siphoned off to stockholders and executives. Now their overhead is limited to, what, about 16%? If we take 3% as the functional cost of administering medical plans, then one-eighth of healthcare dollars are still going to line pockets rather than provide care.

Insurers who haven't learned to live with a 5% drop in fund funds must have really stupid investment plans. That's what insurers do with premiums -- they buy stocks, bonds, real estate, financial instruments, yada yada. They get stuck in the same cyclical frenzies as other big-money investors. I wonder how deep UnitedHealth is into junk paper and energy luzers?