A strange feeling.

[redzinger]

No, not my hangover.


I was at the osteopath yesterday (trapped nerve malarkey) and I happened to glance at their bookshelf. There was a paperback by a chick-lit author who I used to read ten or so years ago.

So, being bored, I picked it up. Just finished it. It was...poor.

I couldn't care less for the love of this woman's life - he has 'dark eyes', that's all we know about him. Tbh, he seems like a bit of a prick. We don't know much about the woman either. There's no feeling, the characters are like robots. It was flat.

I put it down feeling oddly deflated and frustrated. And envious - how I wish I'd started writing earlier.

 

[MSTarot]

No, not my hangover.


I was at the osteopath yesterday (trapped nerve malarkey) and I happened to glance at their bookshelf. There was a paperback by a chick-lit author who I used to read ten or so years ago.

So, being bored, I picked it up. Just finished it. It was...poor.

I couldn't care less for the love of this woman's life - he has 'dark eyes', that's all we know about him. Tbh, he seems like a bit of a prick. We don't know much about the woman either. There's no feeling, the characters are like robots. It was flat.

I put it down feeling oddly deflated and frustrated. And envious - how I wish I'd started writing earlier.

Red, I want you to take a look at a couple of things you just said.

YOU used to read her work. So at one time you didi like her. Now ... not so much. She's not changed as an author (most likely) you've changed as a quality of reader/author/critic.

So if you had started writing earlier, you would not be the writer you are now. Instead, you might be putting out stories at the level she is, and not know it's bad work. Or worse not care.

In the end what you write can and will outlive yourself. Maybe it's better that you didn't get started years ago, so that now you can do better work that will be remembered for that quality.

You're a good writer ... now. So go after that bookshelf. Now.

No seriously, now!

I don't care that you're hungover, go write something. I'm hungover too, and have to go work on a construction site for 8 hours before I can get to write a single thing.
.

.

 

[DreamCloud]

Want a real wake up call. Go to WattPad and read some of the stories with over 50 million reads. They will put you to sleep.

I have no idea how some people are able to generate such a large readership with such poor plots and boring characters. I guess it is no different than a crappy movie that someone was able to get 100 million to make.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Want a real wake up call. Go to WattPad and read some of the stories with over 50 million reads. They will put you to sleep.

I have no idea how some people are able to generate such a large readership with such poor plots and boring characters. I guess it is no different than a crappy movie that someone was able to get 100 million to make.

McDonalds! Over 1 bazillion sold.

 

[sheablue]

That's the worst, right?

It's like in Jr. High when all of my friends were going gaga over the Sweet Valley High books and I was all ... but there aren't any ghost or vampires in it?

 

[oggbashan]

I like Georgette Heyer, mainly for her precise historical accuracy.

But her characters? They are a few stock figures and her plots are very similar.

Her books still sell in large quantities.

Edgar Wallace? Read half a dozen. You don't need to bother with the rest.

Some book buyers like the familiar plots and the cut-out characters. For them the reading is escapism. They don't want to be challenged or expected to think.

In his later years my father used to like reading traditional Westerns. He knew that it didn't matter if he fell asleep reading. The hero would always have the fastest draw, would kill the villain and ride off into the sunset with the girl (or his horse!). Those Westerns were a form of relaxation. He knew they were bland rubbish but he liked reading them when he was tired.

I used to like many authors when I was younger that would annoy me now. But I too was reading them for entertainment, not for education.

 

[sheablue]

I like Georgette Heyer, mainly for her precise historical accuracy.

But her characters? They are a few stock figures and her plots are very similar.

Her books still sell in large quantities.

Edgar Wallace? Read half a dozen. You don't need to bother with the rest.

Some book buyers like the familiar plots and the cut-out characters. For them the reading is escapism. They don't want to be challenged or expected to think.

In his later years my father used to like reading traditional Westerns. He knew that it didn't matter if he fell asleep reading. The hero would always have the fastest draw, would kill the villain and ride off into the sunset with the girl (or his horse!). Those Westerns were a form of relaxation. He knew they were bland rubbish but he liked reading them when he was tired.

I used to like many authors when I was younger that would annoy me now. But I too was reading them for entertainment, not for education.

That's a good point, Ogg, sometimes you do just want to read a book to relax, something you don't want to have to put too much brain power to.

I used to read all of the Dean Koontz horror books. His first few, to my high school mind, were really excellent, and differed greatly from each other. But then as he became more successful, he settled into a formula, and now his books are basically interchangeable. But, if I were looking for something to read that I didn't have to think too much about, he would be a good choice.

 

[redzinger]

Red, I want you to take a look at a couple of things you just said.

YOU used to read her work. So at one time you didi like her. Now ... not so much. She's not changed as an author (most likely) you've changed as a quality of reader/author/critic.

So if you had started writing earlier, you would not be the writer you are now. Instead, you might be putting out stories at the level she is, and not know it's bad work. Or worse not care.

In the end what you write can and will outlive yourself. Maybe it's better that you didn't get started years ago, so that now you can do better work that will be remembered for that quality.

You're a good writer ... now. So go after that bookshelf. Now.

No seriously, now!

I don't care that you're hungover, go write something. I'm hungover too, and have to go work on a construction site for 8 hours before I can get to write a single thing.
.

.

Thanks for the pep talk.

Just feeling a little frustrated - I know I'm letting myself down on the promotional side of things, especially considering the Rugby World Cup on atm (there's a rugby theme to all my novels). Wish I could be braver.
And all the promotional stuff (blogging, social media, etc) is distracting me from the writing.

Hope you've managed to get some writing done.


(Apparently, my hangover was quite light compared to one of the other guys I was drinking with - he spent half of the day puking. For a forty-something, he's such a lightweight. Another is Scottish and had a kebab so was fine, and the other is just starting a month-long aggressive cancer treatment and ate when he arrived to soak up the alcohol.)

 

[redzinger]

Want a real wake up call. Go to WattPad and read some of the stories with over 50 million reads. They will put you to sleep.

I have no idea how some people are able to generate such a large readership with such poor plots and boring characters. I guess it is no different than a crappy movie that someone was able to get 100 million to make.

I've mentioned Wattpad on here before - the numbers are incredible considering the quality. The success of FSOG is no surprise once you hear one story there has reads on the millions.

 

[Hypoxia]

That's a good point, Ogg, sometimes you do just want to read a book to relax, something you don't want to have to put too much brain power to.

If I don't want to tax my brain I just read LIT forums.

 

[MSTarot]

Thanks for the pep talk.

Just feeling a little frustrated - I know I'm letting myself down on the promotional side of things, especially considering the Rugby World Cup on atm (there's a rugby theme to all my novels). Wish I could be braver.
And all the promotional stuff (blogging, social media, etc) is distracting me from the writing.

Hope you've managed to get some writing done.


(Apparently, my hangover was quite light compared to one of the other guys I was drinking with - he spent half of the day puking. For a forty-something, he's such a lightweight. Another is Scottish and had a kebab so was fine, and the other is just starting a month-long aggressive cancer treatment and ate when he arrived to soak up the alcohol.)

No, no. All that promotional stuff is the biggest part of being a writer for money. Look at it in the 10-30-60 marketing formula.

10% of your time should be spent doing new things. Simply living. That experience flows into your writing. Go for a hike, take a museum tour, go to a coffee house you've never been to. All of that seeing-new-stuff is time very well spent. You live a fun adventuresome life, get to see things you never would see and it will all go into your writing. Plus you might meet someone that can help your writing. Never know.

30% is the butt in the seat, fingers at work writing. Apply arse to wood and get the words out of your head.

60% that is getting your name out there. Making whatever name you want to write under a household name. Put it on every tongue. And yeah it seems like doing 60% of your time at that is a distraction from your writing but really isn't.

A writer, someone that writes just for fun. Has no need of this. They write, they do it for the joy of it the pleasure of it.

But an author ... that is a business of one. You are the CEO of yourself. From the grunt labor of twittering your fingers off; to the boardroom deals of author reviews. Public appearances on blog sites, to attending writing conventions to hand out your business cards and talk pitch idea to agents. It's all a part of that big 60%.


The hard part is that you want to be writing. I fully agree. I have a million ideas in my head and they all want to come screaming out. I wish I cloud type 10k words an hour.

Since it has to take up 60% just look for ways to make it fun. And try to mix that 10% in with it as often as you can. Multi task. Find a writers convention in a place you have never been.

Go.

Mingle, talk, be a tourist. See the sights. Remember them. They are all potential locations for stories.

Make connections along the way. Offer to help other authors along (basically what I'm doing with this small rant) . You never know, one of them might hit it big and remember and give you a boost up to the next rung in the ladder you're climbing.

Also, there is a saying I picked up, it goes basically "If you want to be rich, surround yourself with rich people."

Well, that works very well for a writer. "You want to be a writer, surround yourself with other writers."

Go on Red, you're a good author. I really enjoyed your Summer lovin story. made me smile.

Let your voice be heard and don't be afraid people won't like what you have to say. Some will, and some won't.

Find the ones that like to hear you. Make them your's.

MST

 

[DreamCloud]

I've mentioned Wattpad on here before - the numbers are incredible considering the quality. The success of FSOG is no surprise once you hear one story there has reads on the millions.

I moved one of my stories to Wattpad to see what would happen. After 6 months, I had 3 readers. In July, some weird publicity made my readership surged to 100, so I added more stories. Now I have some stories nearing 3K. I can get that many reads in half a day on Lit. I have no idea how Wattpad works. It seems to be based on luck and social. Neither of which I have in abundance.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

No, not my hangover.


I was at the osteopath yesterday (trapped nerve malarkey) and I happened to glance at their bookshelf. There was a paperback by a chick-lit author who I used to read ten or so years ago.

So, being bored, I picked it up. Just finished it. It was...poor.

I couldn't care less for the love of this woman's life - he has 'dark eyes', that's all we know about him. Tbh, he seems like a bit of a prick. We don't know much about the woman either. There's no feeling, the characters are like robots. It was flat.

I put it down feeling oddly deflated and frustrated. And envious - how I wish I'd started writing earlier.

I always wanted to be a head shrinker, and from 1966 thru the early 80s I made it happen. I have grad degrees in psychology plus rehab (psych, addictions, and brain injuries), read virtually every book on the subjects, and got trained in all the therapy sideshows, like hypnosis. One week of real therapy work convinced me I made a bad mistake. My colleagues were the most fucked up humans possible, and my patients were worse. Writing is no different.

 

[Cruel2BKind]

I heard it said somewhere that no artist/content creator can stand any piece of art they've made more than five years ago. I joined in 2011, and some of my earliest stuff makes me cringey inside. It's just SO bad. I think the same holds true for art that you consume, but I think that stuff you like holds out a bit longer.

Hell, when I was eleven, my favorite movie in the world was fuggin' Ferngully. My favorite book was Eragon. Ironically, the movie version of Eragon was the first time I was ever disappointed by a movie. What finally kick-started my standards.

 

[lovecraft68]

50 shades is the ultimate in frustration to any person attempting to make some money writing(and I suppose even to some who have had some form of success)

Horribly written, totally inaccurate, one character a disgusting abusive piece of shit whose not in jail because he is a millionaire and the girl so pathetically stupid you have the urge to beat her as bad as he does

Yet look at the success of it.

Never mind it would not exist without another authors efforts(and a case can be made that Meyers own Twilight is as frustrating, but seeing her work was aimed at teenage girls I give it a pass shades was written for alleged adults)

Going further look at her new book Grey-which although I am sure it is selling quite well at least we are not hearing anything about it. Its not being hyped anywhere near the way the first series was and I think the bad reputation the movie gave the series might have calmed down the pr push

But the premise? Same story as 50 shades but from his POV

so this is EL James formula to success...

Re write a best selling work into fan fic-even using their names

re write your own fan fic into an identical book, but change names and replace supernatural with domestic violence that she called BDSM

Now re wrote your own series from another perspective, but the same story.

Now if that is not the frustrating to any author both who has worked hard on actually trying to write well and be original I don't know what is.

On the plus side unless there is a cat in shades whose POV she can write next we have seen the last of her series.

 

[Messier82]

There's no shortage of highly successful bad authors.

Stephen King has been quite open about his views on this. Click

I'm in complete agreement with him on James Patterson, I gave JP a good bit of leeway, but after six books I'd had enough, utterly ludicrous plots.

David Baldacci was an even worse reading experience, he got one chance and that was enough: True Blue, utter tripe with the most ridiculous plastic characters.

Having said all this, which of us would object to being a penny behind these guys?

 

[Messier82]

so this is EL James formula to success...

Re write a best selling work into fan fic-even using their names

I'll confess my ignorance; what was the original best selling work?
My very limited understanding was that she wrote it in direct response to an online fan-base of some earlier stuff.

 

[lovecraft68]

I'll confess my ignorance; what was the original best selling work?
My very limited understanding was that she wrote it in direct response to an online fan-base of some earlier stuff.

Her fan fic "Master of the universe" was a close to copy paste version of the Twilight series.

Then James rewrote that into 50 shades and indy published it and it was picked up by random house who for some reason saw fit to not edit it at all(because if this was edited the original must have been totally illiterate)

But the myth this helped indy authors or was a good success story are myths. James was a UK television producer with a lot of contacts, and indy authors are still on the hit list of the big six, just see amazon's kindle games for proof of that.

I also strongly disagree shades did anything for true erotica. The only door it opened was for abusive men who now benefit from a bunch of girls thinking being stalked and beaten is romantic.

What James succeeded in doing is making money for herself and I don't fault her for it, and I think its her PR people, not her, touting the incredible 'impact' of a forgettable series.

But back to the OP point if you read even a couple of chapters from that book you will coem away thinking there is some thing to that "if you sit a thousand monkeys behind typewriters you could get a novel.'

 

[Messier82]

I struggled through about half of 50 Shades before binning it, it was IMO just Mills and Boon with some BDSM topping.

But I agree, 'well done her' for making lots of dosh. There's hope for us all

 

[lovecraft68]

I struggled through about half of 50 Shades before binning it, it was IMO just Mills and Boon with some BDSM topping.

But I agree, 'well done her' for making lots of dosh. There's hope for us all

Yup, kudos for lightning in a bottle. I never begrudge someone for making money off total cheese, be it music, movie, books.

My issue with shades was the non stop hype and claims of how this book 'important' it was.

,

 

[Handley_Page]

Yup, kudos for lightning in a bottle. I never begrudge someone for making money off total cheese, be it music, movie, books.

My issue with shades was the non stop hype and claims of how this book 'important' it was.

,

I agree. The hype was frantic, but despite the story's being violent, I didn't hear one feminist complain. . . .

 

[lovecraft68]

I agree. The hype was frantic, but despite the story's being violent, I didn't hear one feminist complain. . . .

Listen more closely....there was actually a book burning done by a group in the UK I believe

The biggest complaints came from the BDSM community, fet life alt.com the boards here. I don't know one person in the lifestyle that did not beat the crap out of it what Gray was was not a master or dom, but a obsessive stalker who abused this girl and because he was a billionaire in a suit it was 'hot'

The movie caused much more of a hue and cry from women's groups-and men as well because the movie could not be interpreted it was an in your face thing and it seems the directors vision of the book was accurate he was a creepy abuser.

Something that flies under the radar I picked up on was the girl...she was supposedly 22(but had no idea what an e-mails was, I am not kidding) but acted about 15 and I have no doubt in James mind she was about 15 and she changed the age for print, but not the behavior

Twilight's Bella was a girl in high school and of course that was "Anastasia's" origin character so I saw a lot of poorly masked under age in the segments I read of it.

But hey, it sold, it just gets me it sold masked as something it was not "a romance"

 

[redzinger]

I agree. The hype was frantic, but despite the story's being violent, I didn't hear one feminist complain. . . .

Ummm, I've heard loads of complaints. There's also all this kind of stuff:

https://www.goodreads.com/review/show/340987215


Although, tbf, I've heard very little criticism from many traditionally-published authors and many publishers have actively sought to jump on the bandwagon.

 

[Carnal_Flower]

Bwa ha ha ha ha ha !! Still laughing

Ummm, I've heard loads of complaints. There's also all this kind of stuff:

https://www.goodreads.com/review/show/340987215


Although, tbf, I've heard very little criticism from many traditionally-published authors and many publishers have actively sought to jump on the bandwagon.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Holy crap! So many. So many copyright violations on that Wattpad! Holy crap!

People just using anyone's picture for a cover...holy shit!

Here are just a few...I'm pretty sure none of them gave their permission to use their image or trademarked icon on the cover of any of theses ebook.

https://a.wattpad.com/cover/31865693-208-k697496.jpg https://a.wattpad.com/cover/42827177-208-k13819.jpg https://a.wattpad.com/cover/26329714-208-k604330.jpg https://a.wattpad.com/cover/6391704-208-k62595.jpg https://a.wattpad.com/cover/27958772-208-k190176.jpg
https://a.wattpad.com/cover/45355317-208-k435086.jpg https://a.wattpad.com/cover/14449246-208-k564654.jpg https://a.wattpad.com/cover/2492178-208-k800116.jpghttps://a.wattpad.com/cover/32583292-208-k580724.jpghttps://a.wattpad.com/cover/21855013-208-k479749.jpg