Why we need Socialism in America, in one picture.

[LJ_Reloaded]

https://41.media.tumblr.com/f84295aca365efa11b69f8853c625d6d/tumblr_nribjwx3Qf1r3aa23o1_1280.jpg

 

[Mello_SixtyNine]

Actually, that graphic details why we need Capitalism.

Lasik surgery is a great example of Capitalism in Healthcare. When Lasik was first introduced, it cost about 5 grand per eye. Since it was an elective procedure, free market Capitalism brought about competition which in turn lowered prices down & the quality up over the years. Now you can get Lasik surgery for both eyes @ around $1,800+. Now compare that to Cataract surgery. It doesn't matter where you go, the surgery is going to be costly even if you magically doubled the amount of eye surgeons in the US. Since it's covered under medicare/medicaid, the free market can't bring the prices down/quality up.

The reason college tuition is raising faster than inflation is because the U.S. government backs student loans. If they stopped, colleges would be forced to lower tuitions or go under. Peter Schiff explains in detail:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3hc6LoAlu0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXpwAOHJsxg

 

[Mike_Yates]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social_Darwinism

And...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Survival_of_the_fittest

And...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics

 

[oggbashan]

The same statistics apply in so-called Socialist states.

The rich get richer; the poor get screwed - but the poor might have health care and a safety net to stop them becoming totally destitute.

 

[LJ_Reloaded]

Actually, that graphic details why we need Capitalism.

Lasik surgery is a great example of Capitalism in Healthcare. When Lasik was first introduced, it cost about 5 grand per eye. Since it was an elective procedure, free market Capitalism brought about competition which in turn lowered prices down & the quality up over the years. Now you can get Lasik surgery for both eyes @ around $1,800+. Now compare that to Cataract surgery. It doesn't matter where you go, the surgery is going to be costly even if you magically doubled the amount of eye surgeons in the US. Since it's covered under medicare/medicaid, the free market can't bring the prices down/quality up.

The reason college tuition is raising faster than inflation is because the U.S. government backs student loans. If they stopped, colleges would be forced to lower tuitions or go under. Peter Schiff explains in detail:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3hc6LoAlu0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXpwAOHJsxg

Fat lot of good that Capitalism does if you're too poor to afford it.

And colleges are getting more expensive because of underfunding. That's why, despite the rising prices, they're laying off professors and switching to lower paid adjuncts.

The for-profit colleges are actually closing down. Corinthian Colleges, Education Management Corporation, and Career Education Corporation, for starters.

The same statistics apply in so-called Socialist states.

The rich get richer; the poor get screwed - but the poor might have health care and a safety net to stop them becoming totally destitute.

Since when are there even rich people in Socialist nations?

 

[Mello_SixtyNine]

Underfunding my ass!!! When I went to college to get a Bachelor of Arts degree for graphic design, my classes were $300 each. My niece is paying five times that for the exact same degree. Her art supplies didn't increase five times. Her Macbook Pro and Adobe software didn't cost five times as much as my PowerMac 7100/66. (I paid close to 4 grand for that computer along with a printer.) I was using Photoshop 2.5. FYI, version 3 got layers. The idea that you think college tuition is through the roof because of underfunding demonstrates that you are a fucking moron.

 

[hashtag45]

You're right, LJ, and just sidetracking a wee bit, on a more global level, we also see this sad gradual destruction of the arts and humanistic studies.

Don't get me wrong, every job has it's own value, but it's sometimes annoying to see that jobs in marketing business retail etc. are much more valued and better paid than jobs as a teacher, artist, etc etc. And that the only people who make it big nowadays are sharks like the apprentice gurus Donald Trump or Allan Sugar

 

[PatriotLover]

Underfunding my ass!!! When I went to college to get a Bachelor of Arts degree for graphic design, my classes were $300 each. My niece is paying five times that for the exact same degree. Her art supplies didn't increase five times. Her Macbook Pro and Adobe software didn't cost five times as much as my PowerMac 7100/66. (I paid close to 4 grand for that computer along with a printer.) I was using Photoshop 2.5. FYI, version 3 got layers. The idea that you think college tuition is through the roof because of underfunding demonstrates that you are a fucking moron.

My man, Scott Walker, just cut the UW budget by 16%. The last thing we need is a bunch of college kids thinking they know things.

 

[Saint Peter]

300 per class does not cover the costs. Buildings. Software. Water. Salaries.

Education is not cheap.

 

[Whiskey1965]

For those that are slow and refuse to learn Socialism does not work,it fails everytime!
Education cost so much because the teachers are all greedy socialist, which is kinda funny.
Housing cost so much because we gave everyone loans and they couldn't pay the bank.
Taxes that pay for our defense and our nations needs are going to feed people who refuse to work and they breed more people that refuse to work and create more need,crime and stupid people that think socialism is a good idea!

Getting a tax return when you don't pay taxes is so very dumb!
Its the circle of stupid until those that work die and then those that freeload starve to death!

 

[SgtSpiderMan]

For those that are slow and refuse to learn Socialism does not work,it fails everytime!
Education cost so much because the teachers are all greedy socialist, which is kinda funny.
Housing cost so much because we gave everyone loans and they couldn't pay the bank.
Taxes that pay for our defense and our nations needs are going to feed people who refuse to work and they breed more people that refuse to work and create more need,crime and stupid people that think socialism is a good idea!

Getting a tax return when you don't pay taxes is so very dumb!
Its the circle of stupid until those that work die and then those that freeload starve to death!

How are teachers greedy AND socialist?
If person A doesn't pay for their house, how does that make the house more valuable?
How can you get a tax return if you didn't pay taxes?
How does anyone not pay taxes? (I've been asking this question for years)

 

[Sean]

How can you get a tax return if you didn't pay taxes?
How does anyone not pay taxes? (I've been asking this question for years)

Apparently the trick is to be a massive corporation.

 

[SgtSpiderMan]

Apparently the trick is to be a massive corporation.

OK, besides them.

 

[oggbashan]

...


Since when are there even rich people in Socialist nations?

Russian Oligarchs who buy the most expensive properties in London; Chinese Party Members who buy expensive real estate in Australia; Greeks who own luxury yachts despite their declared income being less than the crew's wages...

I could go on and on.

Rich people have lawyers and accountants to play the tax systems even in socialist countries.

 

[Mello_SixtyNine]

300 per class does not cover the costs. Buildings. Software. Water. Salaries.

Education is not cheap.

It covered them 18 years ago. The same buildings are still there so I don't know what your costs you're referring to. Salaries didn't increase 5 times in the past 18 years. Software? It cost me $300 to get the student editions of Photoshop & Illustrator when I was in school. My niece got the entire design suite for $200 I believe. Tuition has artificially been inflated by colleges because they knew that the US was covering the loans. Also the college I attended was not in the desert so water rates have consistently been low.

Student loan debt is higher than credit card debt today.

 

[hashtag45]

Russian Oligarchs who buy the most expensive properties in London; Chinese Party Members who buy expensive real estate in Australia; Greeks who own luxury yachts despite their declared income being less than the crew's wages...

I could go on and on.

Rich people have lawyers and accountants to play the tax systems even in socialist countries.

adding my own ammendment :
Crooks and sharks who misuse any social system.

 

[oggbashan]

adding my own ammendment :
Crooks and sharks who misuse any social system.

They are small beer compared to the rich.

Yes, they exist, but a whole street of them fiddling the social system wouldn't pay a single rich man's tax accountant.

 

[hashtag45]

They are small beer compared to the rich.

Yes, they exist, but a whole street of them fiddling the social system wouldn't pay a single rich man's tax accountant.

yes, true

 

[pointless]

russia? senility is a terrible thing.

 

[hashtag45]

They are small beer compared to the rich.

Yes, they exist, but a whole street of them fiddling the social system wouldn't pay a single rich man's tax accountant.

You're right.
But I was thinking… In the case of any social system that goes wrong (be it socialism, capitalism etc. etc.),
1.- you start with the founders who were idealists (like Marx, whose doctrine was also philosophical with reference to existentialism also heaps of writers were inspired by Marx)
2.- and next comes an army of either impractical idealists or of antisocials who use the system towards their own needs (to gain power or material assets)

So
1.- I see the theory of socialism as being good, although a bit too idealistic at times, for the real world.
2.- The way that it's been applied, however, was bad.

(I'm not a socialist, btw - just came across some interesting readings)

 

[pollynova]

That's not really a picture, it's just text. You could get the same point across by typing that information out.

 

[Aglaopheme]

For those that are slow and refuse to learn Socialism does not work,it fails everytime!
Education cost so much because the teachers are all greedy socialist, which is kinda funny.
Housing cost so much because we gave everyone loans and they couldn't pay the bank.
Taxes that pay for our defense and our nations needs are going to feed people who refuse to work and they breed more people that refuse to work and create more need,crime and stupid people that think socialism is a good idea!

Getting a tax return when you don't pay taxes is so very dumb!
Its the circle of stupid until those that work die and then those that freeload starve to death!

Education costs have skyrocketed due to administrative costs. Add, like good ole Walker did, a decline in state funding.


I would love for you to show me anywhere that professor's salaries are to blame.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424127887323316804578161490716042814

Many of the newly hired, it turns out, were doing little teaching. A Wall Street Journal analysis of University of Minnesota salary and employment records from 2001 through last spring shows that the system added more than 1,000 administrators over that period. Their ranks grew 37%, more than twice as fast as the teaching corps and nearly twice as fast as the student body.

Across U.S. higher education, nonclassroom costs have ballooned, administrative payrolls being a prime example. The number of employees hired by colleges and universities to manage or administer people, programs and regulations increased 50% faster than the number of instructors between 2001 and 2011, the U.S. Department of Education says. It's part of the reason that tuition, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, has risen even faster than health-care costs.

During the 2001 to 2011 time period, state funding per student fell $3,081 at research universities and $2,067 at nonresearch universities, a decline that was “in near lockstep with tuition increases,” according to the report. The result is a “dramatic shift” in who is paying for the cost of a public education.

As states divest in public higher ed, Hiltonsmith says colleges can either cut expenses or raise tuition to make up for the lost revenue.

“If there isn't a lot of fat to cut, then their only option is to raise tuition or lose quality of education,” he said.

More than half of core educational expenses at public four-year universities are now funded through tuition. In 2011, 57 percent of tuition at research universities -- and 52 percent at nonresearch colleges -- was derived from tuition, according to the report. A decade earlier, those figures were at 34 percent and 36 percent respectively.

 

[LJ_Reloaded]

Russian Oligarchs who buy the most expensive properties in London; Chinese Party Members who buy expensive real estate in Australia; Greeks who own luxury yachts despite their declared income being less than the crew's wages...

I could go on and on.

Rich people have lawyers and accountants to play the tax systems even in socialist countries.

Oligarchs came into existence after Russia dumped Communism.

The same with China. You don't have a socialist system when you have 'free enterprise zones' that produce a giant chunk of your economy.

Greece doesn't have anything close to a socialist system - its government doesn't own the means of production.

 

[LJ_Reloaded]

Education costs have skyrocketed due to administrative costs. Add, like good ole Walker did, a decline in state funding.


I would love for you to show me anywhere that professor's salaries are to blame.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424127887323316804578161490716042814

State funding cuts. THAT is what is fueling college price increases.

 

[oggbashan]

Oligarchs came into existence after Russia dumped Communism.

The same with China. You don't have a socialist system when you have 'free enterprise zones' that produce a giant chunk of your economy.

...

Wrong on both counts. Senior Party members were rich in the USSR, as were Chinese Communist Party leaders. Both had standards of living that were hundreds of times more wealthy than the workers.

All that has changed is that some of them can now take their wealth out of their countries.

Whatever the declared political system, there are a few very rich and a majority who are at a basic level. That basic level might be much higher in Western countries, but compared to the really rich the basic level is poor.