Is it possible for a woman to have zero sexual thoughts?

[subwannabe]

Over the last few years by wife has had little interest in sex but recently it has gone from infrequent sex of a couple of times per month to zero. We both work full time jobs and share housework and taking the care of the kids. It's pretty even, in fact I could easily argue that I do more than she does. We are both somewhat depressed that there are only 24 hours in the day and that no matter how hard we work it's like living paycheck to paycheck. We both have some health issues that put monkey wrenches in our love lives and have two kids around 9.

BUT, I still think about sex and get horny, probably every day. I realize that guys are more visual than woman so a lot of instances creep up that make me horny. I really don't think she has any sexual thoughts, ever, or ever gets horny. I really don't. I try finding excuses to have sex. She tries to find excuses not to have sex. If I were on my deathbed in the hospital I would still try copping a view of my nurses breasts and think about something sexual from time to time. Is it really possible that she NEVER thinks about it or gets horny at all?

To cut some people off at the pass, I'm really just looking for an answer to my question and not advice but to satisfy them:

1. No, I'm not romantic anymore although I tried holding hands and her, kissing, etc. out in public the other day. No go. The fact is over the years I have just grown tired of being the one who has to do all the work. It's always me that has to get the ball rolling, being romance or whatever and I've just gotten tired of it. I used to be good in the romance department but I don't understand why it always has to be me. Oh, I think I already said I probably do more housework than she does and watch the kids more than she does.

2. I'm an average guy. I don't look like Fabio and I don't work out and have a hot bod. I've got a small belly and slightly overweight but I'm not a dirty unbathed slob and she is more overweight than I am and doesn't work out either.

3. I seriously doubt that she has someone on the side. That's only a 1 % chance. I just don't see it.

4. She enjoys sex when we do do it and has multiple orgasms, not faked.

5. We really don't have any marital troubles any more than any other couple. Nothing's perfect in any relationship. I just really want to know if it is possible that she NEVER has any sexual thoughts of any kind, EVER.

 

[fire_breeze]

Over the last few years by wife has had little interest in sex but recently it has gone from infrequent sex of a couple of times per month to zero. We both work full time jobs and share housework and taking the care of the kids. It's pretty even, in fact I could easily argue that I do more than she does. We are both somewhat depressed that there are only 24 hours in the day and that no matter how hard we work it's like living paycheck to paycheck. We both have some health issues that put monkey wrenches in our love lives and have two kids around 9.

BUT, I still think about sex and get horny, probably every day. I realize that guys are more visual than woman so a lot of instances creep up that make me horny. I really don't think she has any sexual thoughts, ever, or ever gets horny. I really don't. I try finding excuses to have sex. She tries to find excuses not to have sex. If I were on my deathbed in the hospital I would still try copping a view of my nurses breasts and think about something sexual from time to time. Is it really possible that she NEVER thinks about it or gets horny at all?

To cut some people off at the pass, I'm really just looking for an answer to my question and not advice but to satisfy them:

1. No, I'm not romantic anymore although I tried holding hands and her, kissing, etc. out in public the other day. No go. The fact is over the years I have just grown tired of being the one who has to do all the work. It's always me that has to get the ball rolling, being romance or whatever and I've just gotten tired of it. I used to be good in the romance department but I don't understand why it always has to be me. Oh, I think I already said I probably do more housework than she does and watch the kids more than she does.

2. I'm an average guy. I don't look like Fabio and I don't work out and have a hot bod. I've got a small belly and slightly overweight but I'm not a dirty unbathed slob and she is more overweight than I am and doesn't work out either.

3. I seriously doubt that she has someone on the side. That's only a 1 % chance. I just don't see it.

4. She enjoys sex when we do do it and has multiple orgasms, not faked.

5. We really don't have any marital troubles any more than any other couple. Nothing's perfect in any relationship. I just really want to know if it is possible that she NEVER has any sexual thoughts of any kind, EVER.

I am truly sorry that you are going through this . I really do hope that your wife and you are able to figure this out so that you are back on track of a healthy, communicative relationship.

I am not a medical or psychological professional, so all I can offer is my observations.

You mention that you are both pretty depressed that there are only 24 hours in a day, that you are living pay-cheque to pay-cheque, have young children and that there are some health issues. It is possible that this is causing actual depression for your wife? That she is has issues with depression (or maybe is on medication) that is affecting her libido?

It has nothing to do with men being more visual than women, but rather the factor of stress in one's life and how one deals with stress and depression. I am bit like you that when I am exceedingly stressed, I crave touch and intimacy (aside from the norm). Some people (including men as well as women) cannot stand even the idea of sex, let alone the actual act, when stressed. This is hardwired.

Another thing that jumps out is your first point, that you are not romantic anymore. Is it possible that you both have fallen out of displays of affection and that you're trying to rekindle it is just too much all of a sudden? Think of it this way: if you haven't eaten meat (no pun intended) for years and all of a sudden you reintroduce a 8-oz steak or a pound bacon into your diet, it's going to be weird. It's going to sit oddly in your stomach. But if you slowly increase the portions, you are going to react better. If you haven't been romantic for a long while, and then all of a sudden you're kissing and holding hands with her in public when you haven't for years... it's going to be odd. Baby steps. Gradual touches. And again, I don't know your history, but your wife may not be into PDA, and that's fine too.
As for you always having to initiate, there are a myriad of reasons why, but it's quite possible (again, just observation) that you fell into a routine, and I hate to say it, but humans don't usually like to break routine. Routine is safe and familiar and most animals don't like to deviate away. If this was your routine for years, then that is what is safe and familiar.

Another thing is that she may be doing romantic things for you, but you are not noticing them. People have different language of love , usually a combination of several. So maybe she is giving you words of affirmation, or quality time, and you are not noticing it because you speak physical touch. It's just a thought to explore, and the quiz is fun to do.

Looks have little to do with it. You love each other, I assume. If (and I'm not saying you are! but IF) you are pointing out her weight... well, I can tell you, nothing kills libido faster than comparison.

The only way you can find out if she ever had sexual thoughts or not is to ask her. We are not mind readers. She may have had, and then stress took its toll (this is what I initially assumed, from your opening paragraph, that you both were happy sexually then life took a turn and dumped stress onto you. I could be wrong). OR, maybe she never did. Maybe she identifies as asexual or is just not interested in sex. Some people are like that, women AND men.


Bottom line. Yes, some women and some men, do not have sex on the brain. Some of them don't think about it at all, some do not hold sex as a priority, and some of them don't in times of stress. All I can suggest is an honest and open conversation with your wife, get a check up and if depression is the source, then maybe therapy or counselling.

I don't know if this helped. I tried. And good luck

 

[subwannabe]

Wow. Thanks for the thoughtful and non-accusatory response. I hesitated posting because I really didn't want to hear a bunch of posts saying it's all my fault and I should be more romantic or help around the house more, etc. Her sexual desire really started going downhill when the kids were born and has been less and less ever since. At first I thought it was just the kid thing but for several years now I have highly suspected it had something to do with her IUD, which releases small amounts of hormones. Add some depression to that to top it off. I guess everyone handles depression differently and there are different amounts of depression. She's not on any meds for it and honestly, I don't think she needs any either. While some meds help with depression they come with their own set of side effects (including low libido) so, often times it's just trading the relief of some symptoms for getting a whole other set of symptoms or turning the person into a zombie who has no feelings of any kind so they can't get depressed. She's also not on any other meds.

Also add to that that I have become less romantic over the years. In the first few years sex was great but then after those years it finally dawned on me that I was doing all the work, even verbally. I have told her I loved her a million times and a million times she has told me she loved me, AFTER I first told her. Almost never has she said anything first. Ditto our sex life. I was always the one who was romantic, made the moves, did the planning and on and on. Apparently that has never just been her style as she once told me, during one of our many discussions on the subject, that she isn't good with coming up with ideas or making the first move. The farther we got into the relationship the more I longed for someone that would tell me she loved me, planned a romantic encounter, ripped off my clothes and threw me down on the bed, or initiated something in any way. It got to the point where I realized if I didn't do all the work we would never have sex and eventually got to the point where I just didn't want to initiate myself anymore. Right now we have degressed to the point where I just ask he if she has any energy for playing around or not and then if she does we do it, if not then we don't, which has been the case more and more.

I guess it all boils down to my question of do some women really have zero sexual thoughts, because I don't think she does. She waits for me to turn her on because I don't think she has any thoughts about it herself, ever. Everyday events don't make her horny or give her any ideas or anything. It's like she's completely asexual unless I want to do all the work of being romantic, iniating, etc. and I'm just tired of being the only one who does it. Talked and talked and talked until they're ready to take me away to the funny farm for constantly talking to a brick wall but since she seems to have zero thoughts on sex so we never get anywhere.

 

[Conager]

Over the last few years by wife has had little interest in sex but recently it has gone from infrequent sex of a couple of times per month<counselors call anything less than 10x per year a sexless marriage. you were in a sexless marriage already before it hit zero> to zero. We both work full time jobs and share housework and taking the care of the kids. It's pretty even, in fact I could easily argue that I do more than she does. <don't worry, the landmark study on that subject probably is totally different for you than the 10,000 respondents.> We are both somewhat depressed that there are only 24 hours in the day and that no matter how hard we work it's like living paycheck to paycheck. We both have some health issues that put monkey wrenches in our love lives and have two kids around 9.

BUT, I still think about sex and get horny, probably every day. I realize that guys are more visual than woman so a lot of instances creep up that make me horny. I really don't think she has any sexual thoughts, ever, or ever gets horny. <You seem super insightful about her. I am sure you would know if something that was not you caught her attention.> I really don't. I try finding excuses to have sex. She tries to find excuses not to have sex. If I were on my deathbed in the hospital I would still try copping a view of my nurses breasts and think about something sexual from time to time. Is it really possible that she NEVER thinks about it or gets horny at all?<You said you really don't think so and you are the authority on what she thinks and feels, without reporting any conversations about what she actually thinks and feels. I'm sure you must be sure you are right>

To cut some people off at the pass, I'm really just looking for an answer to my question and not advice but to satisfy them:<Nods. sorry first time through, I missed that you are only looking for bias confirmation, and do not want to actually improve your sex life. Again, sorry. carry on.>

1. No, I'm not romantic anymore although I tried holding hands and her, kissing, etc. out in public the other day. No go. The fact is over the years I have just grown tired of being the one who has to do all the work. It's always me that has to get the ball rolling, being romance or whatever and I've just gotten tired of it. I used to be good in the romance department but I don't understand why it always has to be me. Oh, I think I already said I probably do more housework than she does and watch the kids more than she does. <It's a shame that the majority of guys that do that report that they have less sex in their marriages than guys that do less.. Probably no correlation.>

2. I'm an average guy. I don't look like Fabio and I don't work out and have a hot bod. I've got a small belly and slightly overweight but I'm not a dirty unbathed slob and she is more overweight than I am and doesn't work out either.<Again, I apologize about my suggestion that a course of self improvement might cause a spark of arousal in her loins,( if she thought there was a prayer in the world that you had a shot at anyone else)... Besides, as long as she is worse, you are golden. Good plan!! I am sure she appreciates you making sure you stay slightly less out of shape than her. I am sure that when she looks at you to decide if she finds you personally sexually attractive she weighs her innate, biological desires against any low self esteem issues she has and just grades you on a curve.>

3. I seriously doubt that she has someone on the side. That's only a 1 % chance. I just don't see it. <Funny, that is exactly what every guy who found out his wife was cheating said. "I just didn't see it." As you say, you are hotter than her, so therefore she cant possibly pull someone more interesting to her, and as a man you must know exactly what qualities might make some other guy attractive to her.>

4. She enjoys sex when we do do it and has multiple orgasms, not faked.<nods. A man can always tell. If her body responds while she is thinking about something (that I am sure is totally all you because you are as good ass she could possibly settle for,) she must find you attractive.>

5. We really don't have any marital troubles <other than bed death.> any more than any other couple. Nothing's perfect in any relationship. I just really want to know if it is possible that she NEVER has any sexual thoughts of any kind, EVER.

It is entirely possible that your (more out of shape than you and therefore probably having some self esteem issues) wife who is capable of orgasm and enjoys sex on the rare occasion that she deigns to fuck you is simply unaware until she is mid orgasm that sexual feelings are fun and exciting.

To sum up, It is definitely not you, it is probably totally just her and some weird quirk that every time she is around you she happens to not be thinking about sex.

I need to talk to your self-esteem coach. I hit on a lot of women and a fair percentage of them don't seem to want to fuck me. It never occurred to me that those women probably NEVER think about sex.

 

[fire_breeze]

Wow. Thanks for the thoughtful and non-accusatory response. I hesitated posting because I really didn't want to hear a bunch of posts saying it's all my fault and I should be more romantic or help around the house more, etc. Her sexual desire really started going downhill when the kids were born and has been less and less ever since. At first I thought it was just the kid thing but for several years now I have highly suspected it had something to do with her IUD, which releases small amounts of hormones. Add some depression to that to top it off. I guess everyone handles depression differently and there are different amounts of depression. She's not on any meds for it and honestly, I don't think she needs any either. While some meds help with depression they come with their own set of side effects (including low libido) so, often times it's just trading the relief of some symptoms for getting a whole other set of symptoms or turning the person into a zombie who has no feelings of any kind so they can't get depressed. She's also not on any other meds.

Also add to that that I have become less romantic over the years. In the first few years sex was great but then after those years it finally dawned on me that I was doing all the work, even verbally. I have told her I loved her a million times and a million times she has told me she loved me, AFTER I first told her. Almost never has she said anything first. Ditto our sex life. I was always the one who was romantic, made the moves, did the planning and on and on. Apparently that has never just been her style as she once told me, during one of our many discussions on the subject, that she isn't good with coming up with ideas or making the first move. The farther we got into the relationship the more I longed for someone that would tell me she loved me, planned a romantic encounter, ripped off my clothes and threw me down on the bed, or initiated something in any way. It got to the point where I realized if I didn't do all the work we would never have sex and eventually got to the point where I just didn't want to initiate myself anymore. Right now we have degressed to the point where I just ask he if she has any energy for playing around or not and then if she does we do it, if not then we don't, which has been the case more and more.

I guess it all boils down to my question of do some women really have zero sexual thoughts, because I don't think she does. She waits for me to turn her on because I don't think she has any thoughts about it herself, ever. Everyday events don't make her horny or give her any ideas or anything. It's like she's completely asexual unless I want to do all the work of being romantic, iniating, etc. and I'm just tired of being the only one who does it. Talked and talked and talked until they're ready to take me away to the funny farm for constantly talking to a brick wall but since she seems to have zero thoughts on sex so we never get anywhere.

The funny thing with depression is that often what you see is the tip of the iceberg. People who have depression often hide it - and hide it well - from those they love. It is, unfortunately, very much stigmatised. And it's exhausting. When I struggled with depression, it took every thing I possessed just to go through the day and not break down, or let anyone around me know what's going on. By dinner time, I was barely able to eat. I was dead on my feet. Meds, for me, helped me to get over the lump and I was able to finish the big project and then wean myself off of them. Meds did not turn me into a zombie - just the opposite, in fact. The fog lifted, I was able to focus on what I had to do, and then work on myself. Not all medication is the same (my libido was not effected, for example), and not everyone turns into a zombie. When one does take medication for depression, it's very VERY much a trial and error to get the right dose. Unless it is severe depression (and only a qualified person in the field can say that), medication should not turn someone into a zombie. And besides, there are lot of alternatives to meds: CBT, acupuncture, talk-therapy and so forth. Meds should be the last resort.
And it's quite possible, as I'm typing this, that your wife has an underlying medical condition. Hypothyroidism, for example, has similar symptoms as depression. So does anaemia, low blood pressure, Vitamin D deficiency - even her IUD - and many others that are not serious, but can be easily corrected. A trip to her doctor would be sound. And if it is depression, then there are a myriad of options to try.

My friend, I really think that you owe you and your wife an honest discussion. Is it possible that she just simply doesn't know that you don't want to do all the work? Of your frustrations? Women, just as men, can be thick and dense creatures when it comes to cues such as these. Trust me. Hinting at it won't work; calmly, lovingly, honestly telling her what you need and asking her what she needs will.
Again, it may be that the language of love is different: she may be showing her love (and being equally frustrated) in a completely different way than you.

Also, SweetErika and many wise How-Toers would point out that problems in the bedroom mirrors problems in the relationship. I am not suggesting that your relationship is on the rocks; instead, I am suggesting that you talk it out and figure out what's going on outside of the bedroom to make you both stronger.

I do not have children, but I do know that mental preoccupation can hinder spontaneity and bedroom theatrics. Some people cannot just let go the eleventy billion things that are running through their heads. Some people can. If she is the former, then it will be very hard to get in the mood as she's thinking about whether or not there's enough money to pay the bills, plus to make sure Susie's braces will be okay, little Billy just outgrew his shoes, your health issues and damn it, there's those appointments next week. Not everyone can let go of that.

Again, none of us can say whether or not your wife has sexual interest or not. It's something you have to ask her. Yes, there are people for whom sex is not a priority (or they just don't want sex at all). For some, there's an outside reason (depression, stress, exhaustion, trauma); for others, the interest is just not there. By the way: some women do not have sexual thoughts, but so do some men. Just really have to get that out of the way, because the gender stereotype bothered me (and just pointing it out, definitely not blaming you!)

I do hope that you'll take the time to talk this out with your lady wife. Listen to her. Clearly and lovingly state what's bothering you. Clear the air and figure out what you can do together to improve your relationship (and I strongly suggest a complete check up for you both!). Talk about how you both can work together to create a stronger you. But for that to happen, you need to sit down with her and discuss. And that, my friend, is something scary but it has to be done. There is no magical act or words. It's the simplest, more clear and honest way.

Assuming that she doesn't have any sexual thoughts because you do all the work is dangerous and will create a rift between you both. And you will start to resent each other and that's not good. She very well may have sexual thoughts but don't know how to act upon them, or she's assuming that you don't want her to take control. Assuming is an extremely dangerous game to play, and it almost never ends well. So don't, and ask instead.

Good luck, my friend. I really do hope you talk with your lady wife and figure it out .

ETA:I just read your response a bit more carefully and noticed that while you did discussed it with your wife, you mentioned that as you further got into the relationship, you desired someone to rip your clothes and so forth. Did you tell her that? Did you describe your fantasies? It may be quite possible that she just doesn't know exactly what you want. If you say "I want you to be more in control", what exact does that mean? Calling all the shots? Ripping off your clothes? Ordering you to draw her a bath? Dress you up in a Fozzie the Bear's outfit with a French maid's apron while she swats your ass with a Swiffer? What? Once she has a better idea of what you mean by initiating (or whatever), and start doing them, she may come up with a few of her own. This is where conversations and honest discussions will come into play. Most couples will talk about their fantasies (and don't necessarily press her for hers) or what they mean so that eventually, they will find a rhythm that suits them both. But unless you teach her the initial moves, she will not know what dance you wish to dance. It's when you master the basic steps of the tango or the waltz or the swing can you start to embellish and improvise.

 

[subwannabe]

Thanks for everyone's thoughts. I took everything in the spirit it was intended. I don't think it has anything to do with an unattraction toward me. That was the main question I had because I don't think she has a sexual attraction for anyone or anything, ever. Zero. Zip. Notta. Could be along the lines of depression but neither her nor I are big believers in anti-depression meds accept for those with more serious problems. Frankly, I would prefer her the way she is than to go down that road and fight and fight to get the right balance of meds which seems to be a never ending battle, bigger than what we're going through now. Once you start going down this road you can't ever turn off. As I stated in my previous post, they're almost ready to put the white coat on me and take me away to the padded room for having numerous conversations with a brick wall. We have had many discussions and in depth talks but it all boils down to she has never known how to initiate and she has zero interest in learning or even trying, not even in a 10/90 relationship. It is engrained in her sole to be a follower and not a leader and I've grown tired of constantly having to be the leader, hence my user name, subwannabe.

 

[DancingSquirrel]

I also have an IUD as my form of birth control because I found it a pain to remember to take the pill at the same time everyday when my schedule was always different. When I was doing my research on the IUD, I read a bunch of stuff online from women that actually have it. Some of the women did find that their sex drive did go down, some more than others, once they got the IUD and others didn't have that problem. My friend also got an IUD, the plastic one with the hormones, and it affected her sex drive. She talked to her doctor who said that it could be the IUD causing this. She switched to the metal IUD and her sex drive has gone back up. Both kinds work the same. The plastic just has some hormones and the metal one doesn't.

This is just my experience with IUDs. Hope it makes sense.

 

[GrrlFriday]

Subwannabe, do you believe people can change?

 

[subwannabe]

Thanks for the insight on the IUD. I really believe this has been a very major part of the problem but it took me several years to figure out this as being a real possibility. It's also another reason not to jump on anti-depressants when that avenue might not even be the real problem. Everyone gets depressed from time to time so I don't want to just start popping pills everytime something bad happens and neither does my wife. She is in her mid 50's now and I believe this year or next she is going to her OB to get tested for Menapause and have the IUD removed if she has reached that part of her life. I don't really know how going through menapause effects sex drive if you have a hormonal IUD. At this time she may also talk about her lack of desire with the doc. Maybe afterwards she will turn into a sexual animal and , with my luck, I'll probably suffer a mild heart attack or something.

GrrlFriday: I don't understand your question as it sounds loaded to me so that any way I answer it it will somehow be my fault. I was hesitant to even start this thread out of fear that people would come out of the woodwork giving me advice while implying at the same time that I'm doing something wrong or it is my fault in some way. I do appreciate that that hasn't really happened so far. Thanks for everyone's thoughtful responses.

 

[pplwatching]

I'll spare you all of the details, which I've written about elsewhere around here. To answer your question, yes it is possible. My wife is a woman who has zero sexual thoughts. When we were dating she loved sex, but never thought about sex. If I initiated it she would enthusiastically play, but outside of the bedroom the thought never entered her mind. I would ask about her fantasies, and she'd tell me that she didn't have any.

After we were first married she loved sex, but still never thought about it until we wanted to start having kids. Thinking about getting pregnant made her think about sex, but not in the "what delightfully wicked fun can we have tonight?" kind of way. Then her hormones took a dive, and not only didn't she think about sex but she wasn't able to get aroused even if I initiated.

She lost all interest in sex. Not only didn't she think about sex, but she didn't want me to initiate it and couldn't enjoy it when we tried. Loving patience didn't work. Doing housework didn't work. Date nights didn't work. I did all the "good husband" stuff, and it all backfired. We were in a pretty bad place. Now she thought about sex, but not in a good way. Tough times, indeed.

Then we had a serious talk about how badly our marriage needed sex. It wasn't like she needed to hear that, because she knew that a marriage needed sex. She just didn't have any idea how to fix the problem any more than I did. But, to her credit she agreed that we would make a serious effort to have a good sex life. Her commitment to me and our marriage got sex off of top dead center, but "good sex" took quite a bit of time. However, she still never thought about sex. Instead, she made a commitment not to reject me or my sexual advances, and we spent a lot of time on foreplay with no guarantees that she'd get aroused.

Then along came uterine fibroids, bleeding from hell, operations, and finally a hysterectomy (where thankfully she chose to keep her ovaries). We were finally able to work on having a good sex life. She hasn't rejected my sexual advances in a very long time, and I think that she may be starting to have sexual thoughts outside of the bedroom.

Even so, I purchased some "lover's cards" designed for pillow chat and when she drew "tell your lover about your fantasies" the night came to a screeching halt because her lack thereof makes her very self-conscious now. I have to tread lightly in that regard, but at least I don't have to walk on eggshells anymore.

Sometimes it's not about being a good husband, or a good or even exciting lover - although making sure your game is in top form is certainly always a good thing. Sometimes we just have to go with what we know, and what I know is that if I initiate then she will enjoy sex. I can bring out the toys, or suggest new things and she's both a good sport and a willing playmate, but it's up to me to initiate. She has initiated a few times in the past 6 months, in ways that make me think there's some motivation beyond making sure that we don't fall into a sexual rut again.

So, the short answer is "yes".

 

[Noor]

In answer to you question, yes, it's possible. For the past year I have had close to zero if left to my own thoughts. I am in mourning, I clicked off the day he did.

That isn't to say I can't have them if initiated by someone else whom I already know and was involved with in the past. He is no doubt just as sexy or perhaps more than he always has been, but outside of our interactions, I really have no sexual thoughts.
I imagine that will improve with time.

As to your wife. She is probably at least peri-menopausal, which can shut her down.
Also, as you said she is stressed. As to whether she needs drugs, therapy or not, I would say only a therapist would know, and it's never good to treat your own family if you are actually a therapist.

In addition, you changed the equation you had with her of you being the initiator and her being the one who responds.
It probably isn't what she signed up for. She may not have that in her to be the initiator and seems unfair to expect that of her now.

Hi Breezy! and Sid!

 

[pplwatching]

The IUD is actually the one very brief counter-example to my post. When my wife had her IUD, she was much more aggressive sexually. A month or so after the Dr gave the OK for sex without condoms, though ... we were pregnant again which pretty much eliminated that option.

Other forms of hormonal birth control never seemed to make much difference with respect to her libido. However, we did learn that many women discover that it puts the brakes on their libido so we went back to condoms (until the hysterectomy).

 

[subwannabe]

Noor: You are so right. It was me who changed the equation so in that respect it is my fault and you are right again that she did not sign up for that. I was blind in love and having great sex and it took me several years before I realized that I was the one who was doing all the work and she would just go with the flow. I'm OK with a 10/90 relationship in that regard but damn, can't she, just once in a while, plan something or come up with an idea herself or initiate something? I would be so floored if she just once ripped the buttons off my shirt, threw me down on the bed, and fucked my brains out, or at least planned something, anything. I get so tired and bored having to choreograph everything myself. I have talked to her about this before but her best response was that she's just never been very good at it and seems to have no interest in even trying.

I'm starting to realize here that I actually have a two pronged problem, one being Noor's observation and two being a lack of interest, which I highly suspect has something to do with the hormonal IUD or menapause or both. Does anyone have any knowledge of how menapuase (while on a hormonal IUD) can effect sex drive?

 

[GrrlFriday]

GrrlFriday: I don't understand your question as it sounds loaded to me so that any way I answer it it will somehow be my fault. I was hesitant to even start this thread out of fear that people would come out of the woodwork giving me advice while implying at the same time that I'm doing something wrong or it is my fault in some way. I do appreciate that that hasn't really happened so far. Thanks for everyone's thoughtful responses.

Sorry, I know it's coming out of the blue as a question, but I'm a bit worried. It seems to me that a lot of the things you've been posting, both here and in others' threads, imply that once a woman loses her spontaneous sexual drive, it's gone forever, that people can't change. Believing that people can't change has been shown to add to depression. (Ok, so the study was with teens, but it can probably be applied more generally.) I'm not trying to make this into your fault, but perhaps trying to notice the changes that your wife has made for you over the years might help restore your faith in her a bit.

 

[Conager]

I'll spare you all of the details, which I've written about elsewhere around here. To answer your question, yes it is possible. My wife is a woman who has zero sexual thoughts. When we were dating she loved sex, but never thought about sex. If I initiated it she would enthusiastically play, but outside of the bedroom the thought never entered her mind. I would ask about her fantasies, and she'd tell me that she didn't have any.

After we were first married she loved sex, but still never thought about it until we wanted to start having kids. Thinking about getting pregnant made her think about sex, but not in the "what delightfully wicked fun can we have tonight?" kind of way. Then her hormones took a dive, and not only didn't she think about sex but she wasn't able to get aroused even if I initiated.

She lost all interest in sex. Not only didn't she think about sex, but she didn't want me to initiate it and couldn't enjoy it when we tried. Loving patience didn't work. Doing housework didn't work. Date nights didn't work. I did all the "good husband" stuff, and it all backfired. We were in a pretty bad place. Now she thought about sex, but not in a good way. Tough times, indeed.

Then we had a serious talk about how badly our marriage needed sex. It wasn't like she needed to hear that, because she knew that a marriage needed sex. She just didn't have any idea how to fix the problem any more than I did. But, to her credit she agreed that we would make a serious effort to have a good sex life. Her commitment to me and our marriage got sex off of top dead center, but "good sex" took quite a bit of time. However, she still never thought about sex. Instead, she made a commitment not to reject me or my sexual advances, and we spent a lot of time on foreplay with no guarantees that she'd get aroused.

Then along came uterine fibroids, bleeding from hell, operations, and finally a hysterectomy (where thankfully she chose to keep her ovaries). We were finally able to work on having a good sex life. She hasn't rejected my sexual advances in a very long time, and I think that she may be starting to have sexual thoughts outside of the bedroom.

Even so, I purchased some "lover's cards" designed for pillow chat and when she drew "tell your lover about your fantasies" the night came to a screeching halt because her lack thereof makes her very self-conscious now. I have to tread lightly in that regard, but at least I don't have to walk on eggshells anymore.

Sometimes it's not about being a good husband, or a good or even exciting lover - although making sure your game is in top form is certainly always a good thing. Sometimes we just have to go with what we know, and what I know is that if I initiate then she will enjoy sex. I can bring out the toys, or suggest new things and she's both a good sport and a willing playmate, but it's up to me to initiate. She has initiated a few times in the past 6 months, in ways that make me think there's some motivation beyond making sure that we don't fall into a sexual rut again.

So, the short answer is "yes".

Doing all the things that one would do if one were trying to bed a random woman that you met in a bar still applies (and I would submit more so) after you have a ring on her finger.

It is neither biologically or culturally unusual for the male to have to initiate.

Your situation sounds promising. I wish you two all the best.

I was once in a situation in need of rejuvenating. A little progress led to major breakthroughs and it was truly amazing the transformation to a level I had no hope of aspiring to. Sadly, subsequent events led to (what seemed to me) to be a very good thing unraveling, but for a time it was bliss.

 

[LallyH]

I went completely off sex for a few years when my kids were younger, which was a radical change from my pre-kids self. To clarify, I thought and fantasised about sex on a daily basis until the children arrived but then it just stopped. It was nothing to do with hubby or me, or any particular problems we had, although we were similar to you with fatigue, both working full time and money concerns. I just didn't have desires and needs any more.

But then it changed back - again, there was no road to damascus moment, but as gradually as my libido had slunk off, it slunk back in again.

All of which is no help, I know, other than to reassure that you're not the only couple that this has happened to, and don't give up the thought that this is (hopefully) a temporary situation.

 

[DesEsseintes]

I have nothing useful to contribute ("What's changed, Des?" go up a thousand eager voices) but I just wanted to thank the OP and all contributors for a fascinating, occasionally depressing, thoughtful and kind set of responses. It strikes me that this sort of thread is exactly what HT ought to be about.

You are all surpassingly lovely.

 

[eric60red]

Yes my wife never thinks about sex anymore

 

[PattiJolene]

l don't believe you loose the thought completey...l was sex crazy when l was young...my hub couldn't keep up to me. Then my kids came along. l believe a woman's sexual desires naturally fluctuate over the years. Highs and lows commonly coincide with major life changes in our bodies, such as pregnancy, menopause or illness. l truely believe its not that you loose your sex drive...lts just you have no energy left at the end of the day to embrace in a wonderful session of love making....think about it. l know myself after teasing and pleasing each other for hrs and finally reaching the point of no return you are totally drained..... l think Its very important to keep the communcation open between you and your partner. Find out what can be done to bring back the tingles....Watch a porn together...go shopping for some toys...Use that imaination. Whoever said marriage was going to be easy....its like a job, you have to work at it everyday. Remember you committed yourself for a lifetime.....

 

[subwannabe]

GrrlFriday:

Yes, of course I believe that people can change. I've been waiting for change for several years now and so far we're still on the downward spiral. I'm not exactly pessimistic but I'm also realistic as well. Some people call that negative. I'm hoping that when the IUD comes out things will change and we will have gone around the corner and started back uphill again. I have to be optimistic that that will happen before we're getting around on walkers.

 

[pplwatching]

Change is a funny thing. It only seems to happen when we least expect it, or maybe only when we don't want it. The times when my wife and I have 'agreed to change' something (sexual or otherwise) we usually discover that inertia is a biatch. Change doesn't seem to come easily to either of us, which is human nature I suppose.

Communication, perseverance, and forgiveness seem to be the currency of changes. We both have to want it, work at it, and be willing to forgive each other when we fall back into old habits. There needs to be good enough communication to express our needs without either person feeling singled out or hurt. Sometimes one of us is happy with the way that things are though, or at least doesn't see a reason to change things. That's when we each need to make a serious effort to see things from the other's perspective, which isn't always easy but is a part of a healthy marriage.

I found that patiently (and eventually impatiently) waiting for change was poison for both of us. I was quietly hoping that she would become interested in sex, more sexually assertive, adventurous, and a few other sexual adjectives. Things eventually got twisted around to the point where she felt like any intimate contact from kissing to back rubs meant that I wanted sex, so she started avoiding those too. That exacerbated the problem and led to her finding reasons not to have sex.

While every situation is different, I have tremendous empathy for what you are going through. I don't really have any advice to offer other than to say that in my own case I have found that rather than impatiently waiting for change I needed to accept who she is as a sexual creature, because (IMHO) that's part of the definition of marriage. It can be argued that she needs to likewise accept who I am sexually, and we have talked about it. We've made progress in that department, but only when I initiate sex. Some of the things that I like are now on the sexual menu, but the fact that I need to initiate seems to be a constant for the most part.

The middle ground for us is that she makes a conscious effort to be open and receptive to having sex, even if she's not feeling it at the moment that I am. Most of the time she warms up to it, although sometimes that takes quite a bit of foreplay. If she doesn't, then I back off without any hard feelings. That seems to take the pressure of her, and she doesn't find reasons not to at least try.

I don't imagine that any of that helps, but know that your marriage has a lot in common with many others. It is a challenge to meet each others sexual needs when just getting through the day is exhausting. There doesn't seem to be a prescription to fix it, other than to keep renewing our commitment to each other.

 

[coati]

Ahhh, the joys of monogamy...

 

[La damnee elle la licorne]

 

[eric60red]

My wife may have given it up but I haven't

 

[coati]

I don't think its necessarily monogamy in all cases. When low libido has struck me big impacts included the pill or other hormonal contraception, a big pain when one is single or in a relationship, but in a long term relationship a partner is often more willing to help find solutions that work better for the couple. These truely wonderful inventions just don't suit me sadly, they work as contraceptive....but in totally the wrong way! I just don't want sex. . Also all the other things people relate, over tiredness, emotion, feeling somehow disconnected from a partner, health.

Hi,

My comment about monogamy was a reaction to what pplwatching said. My 22 year experience with marriage taught me that I am not programmed for exclusive lifetime sexuality contracts. Yes, I understand that there are ebbs and flows in libido, and that some people seem to be in an extended or permanent ebb.

I'm just not into basing my primary relationship on sex any more. I'd rather have it be based upon just liking the person and finding intellectual stimulation with them. I don't like the societal construct of only being allowed to be sexual with one person, for your whole fucking life. That seems weird to me. If you base your marriage on sexual fidelity, you set yourself up for a constant struggle, especially if the other person is in what seems like a permanent ebb.

I decided not to get married again, mainly because so many people define marriage as being a sexual fidelity contract. I love my partner, and we both love to get it on, but we have a whole lot of other positive things happening both in our life together and in our lives apart. That is so difficult to communicate to others in this very straight society, where people are taught that they should somehow live happily ever after in exclusive "mating" pairs. That does not work for many people.