What happened to all of the doom and gloom economic threads?

[kbate]

So wasting billions on trying to de-fund obama care, and failing every time is responsible governing in what way?

The law was passed, and it is the congresses duty to do their job and pass a budget funding all mandated spending.

You said that, I did not. I blame both houses of congress and the president for this shutdown and impasse.

I'm sorry your beloved party lost the house in 2010 and their super majority when Kennedy died and had to go to extraordinary measures to pass the ACA.

This is the other side's extraordinary measure to remind them of those great days.

Maybe Obama can outlaw 2 party government by executive order and save the world.

 

[richard_daily]

You said that, I did not. I blame both houses of congress and the president for this shutdown and impasse.

I'm sorry your beloved party lost the house in 2010 and their super majority when Kennedy died and had to go to extraordinary measures to pass the ACA.

This is the other side's extraordinary measure to remind them of those great days.

Maybe Obama can outlaw 2 party government by executive order and save the world.

As usual, you avoided the argument presented to you, and went off on some sort of tangent.

Now all that's left is for you to hurl and insult, and declare victory and we'll have a typical kbate argument cycle complete.

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

Perhaps if the Senate didn't demand that the budget be "Their" budget. . .

and around and around and around we go!

It's the responsibility of the House to pass a budget bill and send it to the Senate. If they send a bill KNOWING that the Senate will reject it because of language attempting to defund/delay/repeal something that they can't otherwise get the votes to do then I place the blame squarely on the House. The Senate looked at their bill, voted, and rejected it just as the House majority knew that it would.

Why should I blame the Senate for rejecting a bill that was designed to be rejected?

As it stands right now there are votes in both the House and Senate to pass a clean CR to fund the government and continue budget talks. The House GOP will not take up a clean CR because they KNOW it will pass easily. They would rather hold the economy hostage to try to get something that they don't have the votes to get done otherwise.

 

[RobDownSouth]

You said that, I did not. I blame both houses of congress and the president for this shutdown and impasse.

I'm sorry your beloved party lost the house in 2010 and their super majority when Kennedy died and had to go to extraordinary measures to pass the ACA.

This is the other side's extraordinary measure to remind them of those great days.

Maybe Obama can outlaw 2 party government by executive order and save the world.

What "extraordinary measures" are we talking about here?

The original bill was passed by a majority vote in both the House and the Senate.

The reconciled bill was passed by a majority in the Senate.

Do you have issues with the concept of "majority rule"? Hmmm?

 

[RobDownSouth]

It's the responsibility of the House to pass a budget bill and send it to the Senate. If they send a bill KNOWING that the Senate will reject it because of language attempting to defund/delay/repeal something that they can't otherwise get the votes to do then I place the blame squarely on the House. The Senate looked at their bill, voted, and rejected it just as the House majority knew that it would.

Why should I blame the Senate for rejecting a bill that was designed to be rejected?

As it stands right now there are votes in both the House and Senate to pass a clean CR to fund the government and continue budget talks. The House GOP will not take up a clean CR because they KNOW it will pass easily. They would rather hold the economy hostage to try to get something that they don't have the votes to get done otherwise.

One gets the impression that kbate relishes the opportunity to pontificate on the drama. "Both side must compromise" is a shallow, albeit effective, trolling position.

 

[kbate]

As usual, you avoided the argument presented to you, and went off on some sort of tangent.

Now all that's left is for you to hurl and insult, and declare victory and we'll have a typical kbate argument cycle complete.

I didn't insult anyone. I didn't hurl anything or declare victory. Have you forgotten how to read and become a complete idiot (rather than your usual idiot).

Now I have insulted you. I win!!!!

Is that more to your liking?

 

[richard_daily]

I didn't insult anyone. I didn't hurl anything or declare victory. Have you forgotten how to read and become a complete idiot (rather than your usual idiot).

Now I have insulted you. I win!!!!

Is that more to your liking?

Apparently you have trouble reading... I said "Now all that's left". That was what we call a "prediction".

You have fulfilled your duty here. You're dismissed.

 

[kbate]

It's the responsibility of the House to pass a budget bill and send it to the Senate. If they send a bill KNOWING that the Senate will reject it because of language attempting to defund/delay/repeal something that they can't otherwise get the votes to do then I place the blame squarely on the House. The Senate looked at their bill, voted, and rejected it just as the House majority knew that it would.

Why should I blame the Senate for rejecting a bill that was designed to be rejected?

As it stands right now there are votes in both the House and Senate to pass a clean CR to fund the government and continue budget talks. The House GOP will not take up a clean CR because they KNOW it will pass easily. They would rather hold the economy hostage to try to get something that they don't have the votes to get done otherwise.

You blamed the House for not passing the "Jobs bill" which was written to be rejected as a political stunt. How is this different?


The talks will cease as soon as a clean CR is passed until the next time it comes around.

 

[richard_daily]

One gets the impression that kbate relishes the opportunity to pontificate on the drama. "Both side must compromise" is a shallow, albeit effective, trolling position.

I'd say that "she knows better", but after this last response of hers, I'm thinking that maybe she has a learning disability, so maybe I should take it easy on her.

 

[kbate]

Apparently you have trouble reading... I said "Now all that's left". That was what we call a "prediction".

You have fulfilled your duty here. You're dismissed.

you presented no argument. I simply state that both sides are inflexible and we are going to eat shit because of them.

You wish to blame for political purposes. Fine. Blame away.

I'd rather see them both move and do something besides play your game of "we have to get our way."

 

[richard_daily]

you presented no argument. I simply state that both sides are inflexible and we are going to eat shit because of them.

You wish to blame for political purposes. Fine. Blame away.

I'd rather see them both move and do something besides play your game of "we have to get our way."

There is no "we have to get our way" coming from the democrats. This is a done deal. It's a law that was passed and congresses job is to pass a budget including all legally mandated spending.

That's all there is to it.

The only ones playing games with it are the republicans, and they're the ones smelling like shit on this, just like in the late 90s. Unfortunately, like usual, the republicans ignored history, and waded in expecting a different result for trying the same thing.

There have been billions spent by the republicans trying to repeal obamacare... That effort has failed. It's time for them to put on their grown up pants and deal with that.

I don't usually think the democrats do a good job, but in this case, they deserve credit for not caving to the unreasonable and childish demands of the republicans.

 

[kbate]

I'd say that "she knows better", but after this last response of hers, I'm thinking that maybe she has a learning disability, so maybe I should take it easy on her.

You presented a rhetorical question based on an assumption and logical fallacy, "So wasting billions on trying to de-fund obama care, and failing every time is responsible governing in what way?"

And I'm to consider that a deep and well thought out 'argument'?

indeed.

And when I posted the aside about the passage of the PPACA in response to this: "The law was passed, and it is the congresses duty to do their job and pass a budget funding all mandated spending."

as a possible reason for the intransigence of the republicans, it was an off on a tangent, as if "The law was passed" isn't a tangent irrelevant to the current discussion or your "declaration of victory"?

Really?

 

[kbate]

There is no "we have to get our way" coming from the democrats. This is a done deal. It's a law that was passed and congresses job is to pass a budget including all legally mandated spending.

That's all there is to it.

The only ones playing games with it are the republicans, and they're the ones smelling like shit on this, just like in the late 90s. Unfortunately, like usual, the republicans ignored history, and waded in expecting a different result for trying the same thing.

There have been billions spent by the republicans trying to repeal obamacare... That effort has failed. It's time for them to put on their grown up pants and deal with that.

I don't usually think the democrats do a good job, but in this case, they deserve credit for not caving to the unreasonable and childish demands of the republicans.

In the late 90s, a briefly balanced budget occurred because they fought about budgets and money. How horrible. Wait - you credit that 100% to Clinton. Sorry.

 

[richard_daily]

In the late 90s, a briefly balanced budget occurred because they fought about budgets and money. How horrible. Wait - you credit that 100% to Clinton. Sorry.

You can't possibly be this dense. That was your entire takeaway from my post?

Seriously kbate, let's get you Hooked on Phonics. I think you need it.

 

[RobDownSouth]

you presented no argument. I simply state that both sides are inflexible and we are going to eat shit because of them.

You wish to blame for political purposes. Fine. Blame away.

I'd rather see them both move and do something besides play your game of "we have to get our way."

Perhaps, with your sooperior academic pedigree, you could explain to us unwashed masses exactly what the Democrats should concede this time in order to get the Republicans to do their jobs?

We'll just wait here very patiently for your magic answer....

 

[richard_daily]

Perhaps if the Senate didn't demand that the budget be "Their" budget. . .

and around and around and around we go!

So wasting billions on trying to de-fund obama care, and failing every time is responsible governing in what way?

The law was passed, and it is the congresses duty to do their job and pass a budget funding all mandated spending.

You said that, I did not. I blame both houses of congress and the president for this shutdown and impasse.

I'm sorry your beloved party lost the house in 2010 and their super majority when Kennedy died and had to go to extraordinary measures to pass the ACA.

This is the other side's extraordinary measure to remind them of those great days.

Maybe Obama can outlaw 2 party government by executive order and save the world.

As usual, you avoided the argument presented to you, and went off on some sort of tangent.

Now all that's left is for you to hurl and insult, and declare victory and we'll have a typical kbate argument cycle complete.

I didn't insult anyone. I didn't hurl anything or declare victory. Have you forgotten how to read and become a complete idiot (rather than your usual idiot).

Now I have insulted you. I win!!!!

Is that more to your liking?

Here it is, the entire chain that you threw out false equivalency in, had trouble following what I wrote, and then responded with what apparently you thought that I wrote instead.

I bolded the parts that you should focus on, since you have trouble.

I'm sorry I've picked on you in the past, I didn't realize you had a condition.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Here it is, the entire chain that you threw out false equivalency in, had trouble following what I wrote, and then responded with what apparently you thought that I wrote instead.

I bolded the parts that you should focus on, since you have trouble.

I'm sorry I've picked on you in the past, I didn't realize you had a condition.

She's trying the AJ/Vetty trick of attempting to move the debate into an area she's more comfortable with, and havin' a hissy fit when you try to keep her on topic.

She really should study some of Vetteman's techniques if she wants to topic-shift.

Edited to Add: The Daily Show deconstructs kbate's "but but both sides!" herpaderp in 90 seconds: "Don't Fart And Blame The Dog"

 

[JohnnySavage]

Busybody, call your office!

WTI is about to hit $100

 

[unregistered]

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

Why not criticize Obama for submitting a budget that no Democrat could vote for?

The House is under no constitutional obligation to submit a budget the President likes. It's job is to represent the interests of it constituents in the financial direction of the government within the framework of the Constitution. It doesn't matter if it makes Obama happy or not.

Non-responsive non-squitur. I expected as much from you.

The President's budget request was submitted. The House is charged with creating a budget bill that has a snowballs chance in hell of passing. So far they have failed to submit a bill to the Senate that would pass.

It has nothing to do with the budget request of the President, but the failure of the House to create an acceptable bill. So far all they have done is submit bills that they knew already would fail in the Senate. Then refused to vote on the revised bills sent back to them in favor of creating yet another bill that they know will not pass the Senate.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Why not criticize Obama for submitting a budget that no Democrat could vote for?

The House is under no constitutional obligation to submit a budget the President likes. It's job is to represent the interests of it constituents in the financial direction of the government within the framework of the Constitution. It doesn't matter if it makes Obama happy or not.

Tell us again how the Senate and the President have an obligation to rubberstamp the House's budget.

Extra credit! How many times did Republican senators block "unanimous consent" needed to start a House-Senate budget reconciliation?

 

[unregistered]

 

[RobDownSouth]

Where can I lay my hand on that article in the Constitution where this passage can be found:

"The House is charged with creating a budget bill that has a snowballs chance in hell of passing."

Tell us again how the Senate and the President have an obligation to rubberstamp the House's budget.

Extra credit! How many times did Republican senators block "unanimous consent" needed to start a House-Senate budget reconciliation?

BE A BRAVE "MARINE"!!

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

Where can I lay my hand on that article in the Constitution where this passage can be found:

"The House is charged with creating a budget bill that has a snowballs chance in hell of passing."

It's not there smart ass, it's just common sense. Which seems to be in short supply on the right

If you actually want to pass a budget bill you should probably send one to the Senate that they might pass in a million years. But the objective of the House GOP was to hold the economy hostage. They aren't and haven't been interested in passing a budget.

Unfortunately for them, the American public isn't as stupid as they would like to think. The majority is laying this shutdown at their doorstep, and rightly so.

 

[mercury14]

In the late 90s, a briefly balanced budget occurred because they fought about budgets and money. How horrible. Wait - you credit that 100% to Clinton. Sorry.

This shutdown is unique though in that it's not about the budget. It's about the minority party trying to force the majority to legislate against its will on a law that has nothing to do with the CR or any kind of discretionary spending. Therefore there's no comparison to what happened in the 90s.