Checking On New Story Status

[Darkniciad]

One element everyone seems to be forgetting with regards to speeding up posting:

The daily postings generally fill a full page on the new stories list.

How many would go into full-blown rage mode if their story was one of those pushed onto Page 2 on Day 1 by processing the queue faster?

If you've ever had a story post low on the list vs. one that posted high, imagine how much difference it would make to be on the page that a majority are used to being "yesterday's" stories.

 

[sr71plt]

Probably "forgetting" about it because the story list isn't really relevant to all of the bits of broken functions waving around on the Web site. (Which you yourself point to periodically.)

That one aspect of the Web site is being pointed to as proof that the Web site is "all go" on functionality. It's a "fire, what fire?" shell game.

 

[Darkniciad]

*sigh*

I commented on that one specific thing because it's the original subject of the thread, and has dominated the discussion for the most part.

It was in no way directed at you, nor was it meant to invalidate any complaint. The whole point was to bring up the downside of more stories posting per day.

 

[sr71plt]

*sigh*

I commented on that one specific thing because it's the original subject of the thread, and has dominated the discussion for the most part.

It was in no way directed at you, nor was it meant to invalidate any complaint. The whole point was to bring up the downside of more stories posting per day.

True. But it comes out as under-the-rug sweeping.

I could suggest that the submissions be relieved one of two ways: expand the editors processing stories or limit the number of stories an account can submit in a month. I'd suggest that if the suggestion wouldn't just be sinking into a "take it or leave it" void.

 

[Darkniciad]

More editors runs into the "Page 2" problem ( unless it meant more stories getting rejected for poor grammar, in which case I would suggest those new hands on deck take the time to add specific examples to the boilerplate rejection notices when they give a story the boot )

Limits could work. It could even be a floating point based upon the current load on the queue, and generated automatically via code. It could possibly even attempt to apply a single limit to authors who have multiple pen names like me via IP cross-referencing.

For the most part, actions taken through our private author pages are probably a drop in the bucket so far as processor tics go, so adding code to those isn't nearly as much of a problem as adding code to something that's accessed far more frequently by the majority of Lit's visitors.

I like contemplating the possibilities, even if it does float off into the void

 

[SamScribble]

I think that there is a good argument for setting the bar for submissions a bit higher. I am all for encouraging new writers; but, as things stand, many of the submissions are poorly written and more than a few are atrociously written. Of course, stricter entry criteria still places a load on the editor/s. But at least it would limit the load on the daily ‘New’ list.

 

[Catchalot]

I doubt too many people would notice if the new stories pages were longer, to accommodate more stories. In fact, I bet most people wouldn't even notice. You could also add a second column of stories, which would use up some of that wasted real estate. Even a New Stories page with links to each category of new stories would be nice.

I know this isn't a suggestion thread, I'm just saying I don't buy the excuse that we're just stuck with 80-100 stories a day for the rest of time, because they'd get pushed to a second page. There are way too many ways around that.

 

[Darkniciad]

You really think a longer list is a solution?

I can't think of anywhere else I've been that has a content listing even a fraction of the length of Lit's as it is now. There's a reason for that.

The stories in the middle of the pack already suffer almost as much as if they were on page 2. Making the page longer would only multiply that.

Eventually, people might grow used to a shorter page length and more pages, but for a while ( probably a long while ) there would be screaming from every rooftop by authors who got "screwed", even more accusations of favoritism, etc.

 

[Laurel]

See this, up here ^^^^, would have me over banning him for a year. From the whole site. By IP and Name.

Yeah, there are webmasters that do that, and that's their right. We allow people to criticize the site and us, so long as they don't break the Forum Rules. There are users on the forum who've spent years insulting Lit and/or me. I don't ban them. I don't engage them either.

Like I said before, I'm not a customer service agent. It's not my job to take unconditional insults in my direction. I'm more than open to suggestions and bug reports. But if you're going to insult me and my motives or offer non-specific "everything sucks" criticisms, that's not constructive or helpful. I don't enjoy those type of arguments. I'd rather spend my free time laughing at Tumblr gifs.

One element everyone seems to be forgetting with regards to speeding up posting:

The daily postings generally fill a full page on the new stories list.

How many would go into full-blown rage mode if their story was one of those pushed onto Page 2 on Day 1 by processing the queue faster?

If you've ever had a story post low on the list vs. one that posted high, imagine how much difference it would make to be on the page that a majority are used to being "yesterday's" stories.

I doubt too many people would notice if the new stories pages were longer, to accommodate more stories. In fact, I bet most people wouldn't even notice. You could also add a second column of stories, which would use up some of that wasted real estate. Even a New Stories page with links to each category of new stories would be nice.

I know this isn't a suggestion thread, I'm just saying I don't buy the excuse that we're just stuck with 80-100 stories a day for the rest of time, because they'd get pushed to a second page. There are way too many ways around that.

That's actually something we've spent literally hours discussing. I've been pushing to expand the New Stories pages to accommodate 100 stories per page. My developer dude has been showing me stats which show that because of the Search, Tags, Category Hubs, and mobile devices, the New pages are becoming less and less important, and that expanding them would be problematic for various complicated reasons. The way people navigate Lit - and the Internet in general - has changed dramatically over the last few years. We're trying to work to accommodate these changes.

And our incremental changes are working. We've had more 2+ million unique visitor days (hundreds of millions of pageviews) lately. We're hitting another mini-growth bump, thanks mainly (I think) to hardware upgrades which have drastically improved site speed. These upgrades were actually done in prep for the big sitewide changes we have planned. Once we get to the point where we can actually roll out these big changes, I think things will improve much more.

 

[HeyAll]

That's actually something we've spent literally hours discussing. I've been pushing to expand the New Stories pages to accommodate 100 stories per page. My developer dude has been showing me stats which show that because of the Search, Tags, Category Hubs, and mobile devices, the New pages are becoming less and less important, and that expanding them would be problematic for various complicated reasons. The way people navigate Lit - and the Internet in general - has changed dramatically over the last few years. We're trying to work to accommodate these changes.

And our incremental changes are working. We've had more 2+ million unique visitor days (hundreds of millions of pageviews) lately. We're hitting another mini-growth bump, thanks mainly (I think) to hardware upgrades which have drastically improved site speed. These upgrades were actually done in prep for the big sitewide changes we have planned. Once we get to the point where we can actually roll out these big changes, I think things will improve much more.

Hey Laurel,

Thanks for the info. I've always been interested in the stats of Lit. And I've wondered about how people get their new stories. It was discussed recently and people brought up (Darkncaid I think) that people use Hubs and Top Lists to look for their new reading.

I also agree that putting too many stories in one day would be a problem. They wouldn't even fit on the Hubris page. There would be too many stories.

Personally, I think the answer is to tighten up the standard. Too many poorly written stories are being posted and that brings down the quality of the site in my opinion, and it takes up extra space with stories that no one likes.

Just a thought.

Can you tell us about these changes!?!

Thanks!

 

[Laurel]

You really think a longer list is a solution?

I can't think of anywhere else I've been that has a content listing even a fraction of the length of Lit's as it is now. There's a reason for that.

Yeah, that was our programmer's argument as well.

Erotica readers are extremely specific. They generally want to read exactly what they want to read, and don't even want to see other topics. When given ways to more specifically navigate by story content - i.e. Search and Tags types of navigation, and even the Hubs, which are still in beta but I think will be very popular once they're fully ready - readers use these ways more and more. The readers who still use the New pages generally are unaware of the other ways to find stories. When they do discover the Search, the Tags, or the Hubs, they tend to use the New pages less and less.

Once we roll out the Subscribe to Author - as separate from "Favorites" - and author message boards, I think readers will take to these ways of content navigation very quickly.

 

[Laurel]

Hey Laurel,

Thanks for the info. I've always been interested in the stats of Lit. And I've wondered about how people get their new stories. It was discussed recently and people brought up (Darkncaid I think) that people use Hubs and Top Lists to look for their new reading.

I also agree that putting too many stories in one day would be a problem. They wouldn't even fit on the Hubris page. There would be too many stories.

Personally, I think the answer is to tighten up the standard. Too many poorly written stories are being posted and that brings down the quality of the site in my opinion, and it takes up extra space with stories that no one likes.

Just a thought.

Can you tell us about these changes!?!

Thanks!

I'd love to! As things get rolled out, I'll totally pop in here and tell you all what's coming. I can't really detail everything we have going on right now because 1) it would take pages and pages to tell you it all, and 2) the specifics of the plans change as we figure out what will and work.

But do know things are in the works.

 

[HeyAll]

Thanks! Those ideas sound interesting.

Quick question: Why are incest stories & nonconcent posted towards the bottom of the new list?

Even with contests, incest stories and nonconsent are put at the end. Is there a reason for this? It was theorized that these catagories can scare away certain readers, is that the answer?

Just curious. Thanks.

 

[xelliebabex]

Once we roll out the Subscribe to Author - as separate from "Favorites" - and author message boards, I think readers will take to these ways of content navigation very quickly.

Wow that sounds great

 

[lovecraft68]

Just going to toss my two cents on one what I feel is the "broken" aspect that should be corrected.

Apparently the contact us does not work. When people come to these boards with a problem they say they cannot contact the site with their story issues.

They are told to PM laurel and it goes from there.

But my thing is this. How many people have stories that never posted because they have an issue and get a hold of no one?

Not everyone comes to these boards. many have no clue they exist.

Larasscasse had an issue where his story posted under another author's name (different title)

he knew to contact laurel, but imagine being this other author with another story other than their own posted under their title and getting beat up for it. What did they do? Even when it got fixed they were scrwed because it was off the new story listing by then.

How many people have been rejected, not understood why, and never gotten a reply? They end up leaving with not just a bad taste in their mouth, but were probably very excited about posting and "Oh, well"

I think that really needs to be fixed. I can't imagine how many people have not gotten ontp this site because of that and worse, they then spread the word, "Lit? Don't bother"

And that falls under the general "Hey, lit's the biggest, we don;t need you go home"

But on that note I have never heard laurel say that. That statement is usually made by a couple of people here who seem to think its their site

Anyway I would fix it so people can "contact you" without coming here. I think that's more important than "new searches" and more bells and whistles when the very basics don't work.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I'm reminded of the website I operated 15 years ago.

The site featured black genealogy.

I spent every Saturday at the University of Florida extracting info from the Old Newspaper File, then spent Sundays posting the records to the site. Marriage, Death, etc.

Blacks loved it, one patron told me that any info was welcome, regardless of the subject or content. What I got from it was a deep understanding of the times. White boyz eloped with their slave lovers to Mexico, white girlz jumped aboard river boats with their lovers and fled to the North, then Canada. All kinds of stuff. Slaves executed for drowning Ole Massa.

But liberals went crazy. They demanded that I change the records to remove Negro, Colored, Nigger, etc. Ever hear of AFRAM? AFRAM was the preferred WORD around 1816. Most American sailors then were black. Anyway, the liberals squealed and threatened and insisted. The Florida Education Association black-listed me. I love liberals.

 

[Darkniciad]

One thing I think is worth mentioning here: Some categories may need an expanded "recent" story listing in the hubs. Incest and Loving Wives in particular.

For most categories, what's there now is sufficient. Those two are the main examples, but there may be one or two others ( Erotic Couplings, most likely ) where the number of stories that post in a category on any day exceeds the length of the list on a fairly regular basis.

This is just general observation, and not anything I've tracked carefully, but it's something you might suggest the devs track ( if they haven't been already ) to see if the number of new stories needs to be tweaked upward.

I'd noticed the shift to the hubs as well. The way Lit is segregated, it's a natural evolution. Readers and Writers alike tend to stick to certain genres, and it's far easier to locate new stories from the Hubs than the new story listing.

The boost in readership that top-o-the-new-list posting from contests, Es, and just plain old good luck demonstrates that the list isn't dead yet, though. Enough readers are obviously still using that page for placement on it to matter.

*praying that a point-n-click editing process is one of the changes that's coming, even though it will put me out of a "job" providing that information every few days on the forum*

That's actually something we've spent literally hours discussing. I've been pushing to expand the New Stories pages to accommodate 100 stories per page. My developer dude has been showing me stats which show that because of the Search, Tags, Category Hubs, and mobile devices, the New pages are becoming less and less important, and that expanding them would be problematic for various complicated reasons. The way people navigate Lit - and the Internet in general - has changed dramatically over the last few years. We're trying to work to accommodate these changes.

 

[Laurel]

Thanks! Those ideas sound interesting.

Quick question: Why are incest stories & nonconcent posted towards the bottom of the new list?

Even with contests, incest stories and nonconsent are put at the end. Is there a reason for this? It was theorized that these catagories can scare away certain readers, is that the answer?

Just curious. Thanks.

Some story categories, for various reasons, need more thorough checking than others.

Wow that sounds great

Just going to toss my two cents on one what I feel is the "broken" aspect that should be corrected.

Apparently the contact us does not work. When people come to these boards with a problem they say they cannot contact the site with their story issues.

They are told to PM laurel and it goes from there.

But my thing is this. How many people have stories that never posted because they have an issue and get a hold of no one?

Not everyone comes to these boards. many have no clue they exist.

Larasscasse had an issue where his story posted under another author's name (different title)

he knew to contact laurel, but imagine being this other author with another story other than their own posted under their title and getting beat up for it. What did they do? Even when it got fixed they were scrwed because it was off the new story listing by then.

How many people have been rejected, not understood why, and never gotten a reply? They end up leaving with not just a bad taste in their mouth, but were probably very excited about posting and "Oh, well"

I think that really needs to be fixed. I can't imagine how many people have not gotten ontp this site because of that and worse, they then spread the word, "Lit? Don't bother"

And that falls under the general "Hey, lit's the biggest, we don;t need you go home"

But on that note I have never heard laurel say that. That statement is usually made by a couple of people here who seem to think its their site

Anyway I would fix it so people can "contact you" without coming here. I think that's more important than "new searches" and more bells and whistles when the very basics don't work.

I receive and respond to dozens of mails a day through our various contact forms online, so most authors and readers are able to contact us. I think this problem will be resolved once we implement the new sitewide headers/footers, which will provide login from any page on the site as well as navigational/contact links.

One thing I think is worth mentioning here: Some categories may need an expanded "recent" story listing in the hubs. Incest and Loving Wives in particular.

For most categories, what's there now is sufficient. Those two are the main examples, but there may be one or two others ( Erotic Couplings, most likely ) where the number of stories that post in a category on any day exceeds the length of the list on a fairly regular basis.

This is just general observation, and not anything I've tracked carefully, but it's something you might suggest the devs track ( if they haven't been already ) to see if the number of new stories needs to be tweaked upward.

I'd noticed the shift to the hubs as well. The way Lit is segregated, it's a natural evolution. Readers and Writers alike tend to stick to certain genres, and it's far easier to locate new stories from the Hubs than the new story listing.

The boost in readership that top-o-the-new-list posting from contests, Es, and just plain old good luck demonstrates that the list isn't dead yet, though. Enough readers are obviously still using that page for placement on it to matter.

*praying that a point-n-click editing process is one of the changes that's coming, even though it will put me out of a "job" providing that information every few days on the forum*

I agree. I think the Hubs New list is much too short, and I've expressed this many times to our developer. It should be long enough to show all the New stories in a category for a full week. This is something I'm working on fixing. The Hubs are, like I said, still in beta, so there's much tweaking to be done. However, I think that once they're ready for prime time, they will a great place for like-minded people to read, share, and discuss.

And a more automated way to edit stories is in the works as well. However, all edits will still need to be approved by us to prevent ne'er-do-wells from replacing story text with spam or inappropriate content.

 

[lovecraft68]

Laurel

I'll toss one more thing out there that I know has been asked about quite often and would make a lot of authors very happy.

Can it be done so that authors can see how many fav pages they are on? Right now only the top 250 can and it would be pretty cool if people who aren't could find out as well.

 

[Laurel]

Actually, we're in the process of reworking that. The idea of "Favoriting" an author will likely be a thing of the past because it has no meaning. Instead, readers will be able to "Subscribe" to an author, which means they will be made aware of any new stories by that author and - once we have author comment boards - any new comments by that author.

As for story and poem submissions, in the future there will be two main lists: a Favorites list, and a Reading list. Right now, many readers are using the Favorites list as a To-Read list. This will hopefully end this and make the Favorites list more accurate.

Additionally (and this is all non-final so the specifics could change with implementation), readers will be able to create their own lists of stories, which they will be able to share publicly, with Friends, or keep private.

 

[Darkniciad]

And a more automated way to edit stories is in the works as well. However, all edits will still need to be approved by us to prevent ne'er-do-wells from replacing story text with spam or inappropriate content.

Oh, I never expected instant, unapproved edits. Having an edit link on approved stories that goes to a point-n-click interface for submitting edits would make a world of difference.

The process as it is now is confusing, and leaves a lot of openings for human error. Having the original story information come up in the interface and remain attached when it enters the queue upon submission would eliminate a lot of that human error potential.

Of course, making the editing process easier is also going to increase the size of the queue.

 

[Laurel]

Oh, I never expected instant, unapproved edits. Having an edit link on approved stories that goes to a point-n-click interface for submitting edits would make a world of difference.

The process as it is now is confusing, and leaves a lot of openings for human error. Having the original story information come up in the interface and remain attached when it enters the queue upon submission would eliminate a lot of that human error potential.

I agree.

Of course, making the editing process easier is also going to increase the size of the queue.

This is true. But if implemented properly, the new system would hopefully be easier for me to process edits, which would hopefully compensate for the volume. Another thing we hope to add is the ability to save each version of a story - so that you could "roll back" to the previous version if you wanted to.

 

[Laurel]

What y'all (I'm not Southern, but I love the plural 'You' of "y'all") need to know is that the site was originally handcoded by Manu and I, then another programmer built the bare bones of the automated submission process onto that, then some other folks have sort of attached features to it here and there for years - so the site is this huge fiasco of code. For the past couple years, we're working with an actual developer to completely unify all these various things into one working, functional system. We've made insane amounts of progress, but unfortunately it's all under the hood, so to speak. But we can't move forward until this under-the-hood stuff is completed.

In the meantime, we've also been planning all sorts of new stuff. Now we're at the stage where were prioritizing and implementing things. The hubs, friendly story URLs, tags, a better search and top list improvements are some of the things that have been made public. But that's a sliver of what needs to be done and what we imagine for the site. We want it to be a true community of authors and readers. That's the goal.

 

[sr71plt]

For the past couple years, we're working with an actual developer to completely unify all these various things into one working, functional system. We've made insane amounts of progress, but unfortunately it's all under the hood, so to speak. But we can't move forward until this under-the-hood stuff is completed.

So, at least you no longer are railing at the simple statement that some of basic functions on this site just don't work and users are confused (and irritated) by this and the forum regulars, while being told to "take it or leave," are taking the brunt of trying to calm them down, justify why basic functions (e.g., the contact system; that the "author search" doesn't locate authors) and programs (e.g., the monthly and annual best contests; the integrity of a sponsored editor's program; the meaning and process of rejections; the opacity of the contest vote sweeping) don't work, and hold their hands to the "secret" pathways to some sort of admin response.

At least there's talk as this thread continues. Unfortunately, historically, talk has mostly been just that. Talk of the future doesn't help much until it happens and unless the fixes actually fix the basic functional problems that exist now. The "favoritist" listings, for instance, have been a hidden "sneak peek," "soon to come" feature for the seven years I've been on the site. Doesn't evoke much confidence in what's going to happen when.

Pointing to the maybe future doesn't negate acknowledging the present situation with brinkmanship stonewalling and getting indignant. That's what I referred to as a shell game.

 

[Laurel]

http://farm1.staticflickr.com/97/252849242_373d779ccd.jpg