How to talk a man out of suicide?

[subdued_passion]

Twenty years ago I got a priceless compliment from a man. He had called the hospital drunk, threatening suicide. After he was passed around the cowards he ended up with me.

I appreciate a great opening and hook, and his was good: I GOT A FUCKING GUN AND I'M GONNA BLOW MY GODDAMNED HEAD OFF. Most people default to their OH SHIT setting. But the opening is a good dramatic opener, and I concluded he was simply drunk and histrionic. So I said, GOOD, and hung up on him. You could hear assholes puckering for a mile.

So he calls back. He cant believe what he heard. So I say, DO IT IN THE KIDS WADING POOL OUTSIDE. And hung up on him again.

So he calls back to let me know that I'm a cold blooded heartless bastard. I say, TOO BAD YOU GOTTA DIE, CUZ YOU HAVE SOME DIAGNOSTIC TALENT. Then he begs me to listen to his troubles. I say FIVE MINUTES, I GOT WORK TO DO. So he whines about how his wife left him cuz he's an alcoholic and cant keep a job. And I say, GEE! WHATS WRONG WITH HER, EVERY WOMAN WANTS A MAN LIKE YOU. So he hangs up.

He calls me the next day. You remember me? He says. I say, WHAT HAPPENED? YOU FUCK UP THE SUICIDE TOO? He says, Stop it! You saved my life. I say NOW I'M DEPRESSED. He says, when I called you I had a gun and planned to shoot myself on the phone but I didn't cuz I wanted to kill you more but was too drunk to drive down there. So what do I do now? I says GET IN THE TRUCK, COME ON DOWN, AND LET ME PUT YOU IN DETOX.

This really deserved it's own thread.

 

[Emerson40]

This really deserved it's own thread.

No, it didn't.


It would've fit in just fine in that other thread full of this bigot's malarkey and bullshit stories that you started in the HT Cafe.




http://31.media.tumblr.com/e5faccca81a37fbd24ef3ed9bcc2ddcb/tumblr_ms7ii8nKHm1rxvpseo1_500.jpg

 

[subdued_passion]

No, it didn't.


It would've fit in just fine in that other thread full of this bigot's malarkey and bullshit stories that you started in the HT Cafe.

YEah, you're right. I just felt like starting a new thread and I just happened to spot a How To.

Odd coincidence the post was on a thread where JBJ was accused of being a racist.

And Pmann started the whole thread business you know.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Its a true story.

 

[TeaforMe]

The point is no one gives a fuck about reconstituting JBJ quotes 24/7 on the How To forum. It didn't work in the Cafe portion of HT and it certainly does not belong here. People used to come here for a variety of issues, but all of this JBJ stalking has no business here and dumbs down the purpose of HT.

Go put it on the GB on PG or even Lit Personals, but stop clogging up this board with shit most of us never wanted to read once let alone have it regurgitated.

 

[Recidiva]

I wouldn't say that story is untrue. There are several types of people who threaten to or go through with committing suicide.

For some people they need someone to listen patiently so they feel heard, then they feel better.

For others, really, if they're so deep into a sympathy funk that someone kicks them in the ass, they might have a spurt of anger that kicks them out of depression. As an emotion, anger is more proactive than depression. It's actually a step up.

Of course, without a good reading of character, you could push someone into suicide. It's really damned hard to "talk" someone out of suicide. It's probably an unpopular opinion, but someone calling a hotline may be only in the "listen to me" or "kick me in the ass" phase.

For most people truly serious about it with a plan and a mission, you can't say much of anything at all that would change their mind, nor would they call a stranger in an attempt to get saved.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

The point is no one gives a fuck about reconstituting JBJ quotes 24/7 on the How To forum. It didn't work in the Cafe portion of HT and it certainly does not belong here. People used to come here for a variety of issues, but all of this JBJ stalking has no business here and dumbs down the purpose of HT.

Go put it on the GB on PG or even Lit Personals, but stop clogging up this board with shit most of us never wanted to read once let alone have it regurgitated.

I'm more interesting than you is the why. I mean, what in hell do you know about anything? DONT BE BORING! Jeff Bezos

 

[Emerson40]

Hey mythomaniac, stick to your ‘maters, manure, and melons. Even other misogynists, bigots, and racists find you hackneyed and don’t believe any of your anecdotes and porkies.

The only thing more tiresome than your presence here is your constant disparagement of women and provocative posting.

 

[Gobblings]

Tell them to wait 24 hours. Thats what prevented me from going through with it in my darkest hours.

 

[NightL]

I'm more interesting than you is the why. I mean, what in hell do you know about anything? DONT BE BORING! Jeff Bezos

Well you are certainly interested in yourself, posting 47 times in that thread.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Well you are certainly interested in yourself, posting 47 times in that thread.

Use the IGGY button to help with your obsession for me.

 

[subdued_passion]

Ok, so most of the time the stuff that JBJ says sounds like utter BS... but if you ignore the foul stench you can find some wisdom there some time.

The OP whether true or not would work. Because like Recidiva said anyone calling a helpline is looking to be talked out of what they are doing. They are looking for an excuse. They don't want to take an extreme step but they don't know how else to get someone to listen to them.

Listen.

LISTEN.

Shut up and listen.

Because the guy who wants to ends his life will do it and not stop to call for help.

 

[subdued_passion]

Tell them to wait 24 hours. Thats what prevented me from going through with it in my darkest hours.

You're right. Thank you for sharing.

 

[Recidiva]

Ok, so most of the time the stuff that JBJ says sounds like utter BS... but if you ignore the foul stench you can find some wisdom there some time.

The OP whether true or not would work. Because like Recidiva said anyone calling a helpline is looking to be talked out of what they are doing. They are looking for an excuse. They don't want to take an extreme step but they don't know how else to get someone to listen to them.

Listen.

LISTEN.

Shut up and listen.

Because the guy who wants to ends his life will do it and not stop to call for help.

I'm not saying it's a good thing to do, just that there's no reason it couldn't be a true story. Suicide runs fairly deep in my family, and my brother killed himself. I spent a majority of my life being suicidal over chronic pain issues.

He never made threats, only attempts, and finally succeeded. I talk about it and if I get close to that zone I will fess up to those close to me, but I have never considered involving a stranger.

Calling a hot line for him or for me would never have occurred to us. My brother and my mother and cousin and I all know that life is worth living if you have people that love you, but it's just truly too damned hard for some people.

For someone determined, they won't be found on a hotline. But if the hot line helps some people who are feeling lonely and despairing, and human contact will help them tap into something new and needed, then yeah, they can be of use.

Sometimes I stopped my own ideation by telling myself "Then fucking stop thinking about it and do it, quit fantasizing and deal with the reality." And it would work to make me realize I'm romanticizing the issue and wasting my time and I should get on with living. "Put up or shut up" IS absolutely effective in people who are perseverating on the issue.

Thoughts of suicide and death for me are deeply comforting and thinking of them can be a meditative state with the mantra of "This will all end and all I have to do is wait for that to happen."

The good news is that every suicidal person will eventually get what they want.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I'm not saying it's a good thing to do, just that there's no reason it couldn't be a true story. Suicide runs fairly deep in my family, and my brother killed himself. I spent a majority of my life being suicidal over chronic pain issues.

He never made threats, only attempts, and finally succeeded. I talk about it and if I get close to that zone I will fess up to those close to me, but I have never considered involving a stranger.

Calling a hot line for him or for me would never have occurred to us. My brother and my mother and cousin and I all know that life is worth living if you have people that love you, but it's just truly too damned hard for some people.

For someone determined, they won't be found on a hotline. But if the hot line helps some people who are feeling lonely and despairing, and human contact will help them tap into something new and needed, then yeah, they can be of use.

Sometimes I stopped my own ideation by telling myself "Then fucking stop thinking about it and do it, quit fantasizing and deal with the reality." And it would work to make me realize I'm romanticizing the issue and wasting my time and I should get on with living. "Put up or shut up" IS absolutely effective in people who are perseverating on the issue.

Thoughts of suicide and death for me are deeply comforting and thinking of them can be a meditative state with the mantra of "This will all end and all I have to do is wait for that to happen."

The good news is that every suicidal person will eventually get what they want.

Suicides call hotlines all the time. Some even drive down to the ER with their meds and a carton of beer, and check out on the lawn, beneath a tree.

My most challenging suicide involved a guy who called from a Podunk place we couldn't trace. He said he took all his meds plus beer. I got him to reveal the meds, and we (staff) searched the pharmacy log for those prescriptions. We got name and his chart with address. I called 911 in his county, and they sent a deputy. The deputy tooted his siren, I heard it over the phone, and the guy lived.

People like SP have small funds of experience, and talk out their asses, cuz they don't really know, and have nothing to contribute but ignorant opinion.

 

[Recidiva]

Suicides call hotlines all the time. Some even drive down to the ER with their meds and a carton of beer, and check out on the lawn, beneath a tree.

My most challenging suicide involved a guy who called from a Podunk place we couldn't trace. He said he took all his meds plus beer. I got him to reveal the meds, and we (staff) searched the pharmacy log for those prescriptions. We got name and his chart with address. I called 911 in his county, and they sent a deputy. The deputy tooted his siren, I heard it over the phone, and the guy lived.

People like SP have small funds of experience, and talk out their asses, cuz they don't really know, and have nothing to contribute but ignorant opinion.

When my second marriage was falling to pieces, my husband called me at work and made the classic "goodbye" call. I convinced my boss to let me go home, and I found him with a plastic bag and having taken a load of sleeping pills. (He read my copy of Final Exit)

He made me promise not to intervene, and I lied like crazy, told him I respected his choice, but didn't he want to say goodbye to my daughter? He agreed. No cell phones, he'd cut the phone lines and destroyed the fuses.

I helped him out to the car and drove to the daycare, said I'd bring her out, went in and called an ambulance.

Lying is a good skill to have.

 

[subdued_passion]

Suicides call hotlines all the time. Some even drive down to the ER with their meds and a carton of beer, and check out on the lawn, beneath a tree.

My most challenging suicide involved a guy who called from a Podunk place we couldn't trace. He said he took all his meds plus beer. I got him to reveal the meds, and we (staff) searched the pharmacy log for those prescriptions. We got name and his chart with address. I called 911 in his county, and they sent a deputy. The deputy tooted his siren, I heard it over the phone, and the guy lived.

People like SP have small funds of experience, and talk out their asses, cuz they don't really know, and have nothing to contribute but ignorant opinion.

Hey, I was agreeing with you and Recidiva!

And I do have experience dealing with this issue. Which is why I'm saying that a person who is committed to executing this deed is not the person who will call. The ones calling for help... want to be saved. Hence the call... for help.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

When my second marriage was falling to pieces, my husband called me at work and made the classic "goodbye" call. I convinced my boss to let me go home, and I found him with a plastic bag and having taken a load of sleeping pills. (He read my copy of Final Exit)

He made me promise not to intervene, and I lied like crazy, told him I respected his choice, but didn't he want to say goodbye to my daughter? He agreed. No cell phones, he'd cut the phone lines and destroyed the fuses.

I helped him out to the car and drove to the daycare, said I'd bring her out, went in and called an ambulance.

Lying is a good skill to have.

Sure!

Most therapists memorize the BS/CYA scripts they get in school, but IRL isn't scripted, its Life or Death. And you gotta trust the Force to save the day.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Hey, I was agreeing with you and Recidiva!

And I do have experience dealing with this issue. Which is why I'm saying that a person who is committed to executing this deed is not the person who will call. The ones calling for help... want to be saved. Hence the call... for help.

Youre an ignorant bit of fluff.

 

[Recidiva]

Hey, I was agreeing with you and Recidiva!

And I do have experience dealing with this issue. Which is why I'm saying that a person who is committed to executing this deed is not the person who will call. The ones calling for help... want to be saved. Hence the call... for help.

Yup. I'm mostly saying that I didn't think the story was unbelievable.

I think your best course is to have a lot of education in the different mindsets and make the call. People do have free will and you can't stop everyone from ending the life they want to eject. Sometimes I don't think you should, because there are things worse than death, lots of them.

For some people, a cup of hot cocoa and a hug and a smile will do the trick, but for others there's nothing you can say that will change the essential character of their life or brain that drives them to that point.

I think suicide and assisted suicide should be legal to give families a chance to be there for the people in their lives who are in too much pain to continue.

It's one of the things that was the most devastating about my brother's suicide, I spent so much time with him talking about it and helping him through issues that I didn't get a goodbye call at all. He knew I'd know and talk him out of it and he didn't want me to get the chance to do it.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Yup. I'm mostly saying that I didn't think the story was unbelievable.

I think your best course is to have a lot of education in the different mindsets and make the call. People do have free will and you can't stop everyone from ending the life they want to eject. Sometimes I don't think you should, because there are things worse than death, lots of them.

For some people, a cup of hot cocoa and a hug and a smile will do the trick, but for others there's nothing you can say that will change the essential character of their life or brain that drives them to that point.

I think suicide and assisted suicide should be legal to give families a chance to be there for the people in their lives who are in too much pain to continue.

It's one of the things that was the most devastating about my brother's suicide, I spent so much time with him talking about it and helping him through issues that I didn't get a goodbye call at all. He knew I'd know and talk him out of it and he didn't want me to get the chance to do it.

Many use suicide attempts to seriously damage the lives of the people they 'luv.'

 

[Recidiva]

Many use suicide attempts to seriously damage the lives of the people they 'luv.'

Yes, and that's an entirely different set of personalities and circumstances.

There are those who want to die just to make whatever it is that causes them pain to stop.

Yes, I'm a suicide elitist, I suppose. I despise the people who just want to make a huge mess as a final "fuck you" to the world or to another person. That's what my second husband's attempt was.

I did attempt suicide once through hypothermia, but it turned into a whole life-affirming hallucinatory event. That was surprising. Convinced me not to try again.

I just wanted to be found as a frozen body in the woods. No blame, just over.

 

[subdued_passion]

Yup. I'm mostly saying that I didn't think the story was unbelievable.

I think your best course is to have a lot of education in the different mindsets and make the call. People do have free will and you can't stop everyone from ending the life they want to eject. Sometimes I don't think you should, because there are things worse than death, lots of them.

For some people, a cup of hot cocoa and a hug and a smile will do the trick, but for others there's nothing you can say that will change the essential character of their life or brain that drives them to that point.

I think suicide and assisted suicide should be legal to give families a chance to be there for the people in their lives who are in too much pain to continue.

It's one of the things that was the most devastating about my brother's suicide, I spent so much time with him talking about it and helping him through issues that I didn't get a goodbye call at all. He knew I'd know and talk him out of it and he didn't want me to get the chance to do it.

I am sorry for your loss and for stirring some painful memories.

I agree with you on assisted suicide and how for some people releasing them from their pain and misery would be the more compassionate thing to do. At the same time I am afraid of legalizing it because I can see the potential for abuse.

I didn't find JBJ's story unbelievable either... it's just that coming from him I doubt many would believe it to be true.

My experiences have been more in person and few over the phone or internet. So, I can tell the difference between someone who you catch trying to commit the act vs someone who calls asking for help.

 

[Recidiva]

I am sorry for your loss and for stirring some painful memories.

I agree with you on assisted suicide and how for some people releasing them from their pain and misery would be the more compassionate thing to do. At the same time I am afraid of legalizing it because I can see the potential for abuse.

I didn't find JBJ's story unbelievable either... it's just that coming from him I doubt many would believe it to be true.

My experiences have been more in person and few over the phone or internet. So, I can tell the difference between someone who you catch trying to commit the act vs someone who calls asking for help.

Truth comes from many sources and although you may not like its herald, "liking" truth and its herald is a bit of a trap if you want to recognize it.

In game alignment, I'm not lawful good. I'm chaotic neutral. That means if God tells me to sacrifice a child I can tell them to fuck off, and if Satan tells me to brush my teeth, I'll agree with him that that is good advice.

I'll also probably think God and Satan have some...issues.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I usta go to training where we spent a week reviewing medical records and autopsy reports and police reports, to try and learn why medical professionals miss obvious abuse. And I had some violent quarrels with MDs about real and imagined abuse.

I recall one case where a 2 year old had a saddle injury. His crotch was bruised. Not his legs, not his butt, not his penis, not his abdomen. The specialist said that someone kicked the kids groin. I said BS, SHOW ME HOW YOU CAN DO IT. He couldn't, because it cant be done without assistance and the cooperation of the child. That is, someone needs to hold the kid, and the kid needs to spread his legs.

The kids babysitter told me that the child climbed a ladder and jumped onto an aluminum handrail. That would do it. Or if the child was standing atop the bathtub and slipped, that would do it.

MDs are forever getting it wrong, because they don't know how to think about what they observe.