Tracy K. Smith--2012 Pulitzer in Poetry

[Tzara]

Tracy K. Smith was awarded the 2012 Pulitzer Prize in Poetry for her collection Life on Mars. Here's a couple of her poems:

• Sci-Fi

• Duende

 

[PandoraGlitters]

Thanks, Tzara!

 

[corndog_]

Wow! Thanks for this, Tristan! She is amazing.

 

[bogusagain]

I feel like I should like her work but I don't. It doesn't give me an emotional fix and Sci-Fi doesn't seem to have any internal logic to it (though I am sure it does) and Duende doesn't attract me and isn't that what the poem is about, the power to attract? I'm bitching but I have similar problems with much officially sanctioned poetry. It doesn't speak to me and it makes me feel somehow inadequate that it doesn't. It feels like it comes from some parallel world that I know well but is offset, not quite tuned in to the reality I experience.

Can anyone convince me otherwise?

 

[corndog_]

I feel like I should like her work but I don't. It doesn't give me an emotional fix and Sci-Fi doesn't seem to have any internal logic to it (though I am sure it does) and Duende doesn't attract me and isn't that what the poem is about, the power to attract? I'm bitching but I have similar problems with much officially sanctioned poetry. It doesn't speak to me and it makes me feel somehow inadequate that it doesn't. It feels like it comes from some parallel world that I know well but is offset, not quite tuned in to the reality I experience.

Can anyone convince me otherwise?

Nope. Only you know what you like.

Apparently we've both at sea awhile-- good to see you again!

 

[Maria2394]

I feel like I should like her work but I don't. It doesn't give me an emotional fix and Sci-Fi doesn't seem to have any internal logic to it (though I am sure it does) and Duende doesn't attract me and isn't that what the poem is about, the power to attract? I'm bitching but I have similar problems with much officially sanctioned poetry. It doesn't speak to me and it makes me feel somehow inadequate that it doesn't. It feels like it comes from some parallel world that I know well but is offset, not quite tuned in to the reality I experience.

Can anyone convince me otherwise?

I can't. I feel the same way about her work. It really did nothing for me. I am wondering if she has a MFA in creative writing?

just curious....

but, congrats ( to her) on winning.

 

[bogusagain]

but, congrats ( to her) on winning.

Someone has to win so why not her but I always think arts prizes say more about the jury than the poet/artist/writer.

Maybe I'm just too cynical.

 

[Epmd607]

Prose poetry is still popular

 

[Tzara]

I can't. I feel the same way about her work. It really did nothing for me. I am wondering if she has a MFA in creative writing?

She not only has an MFA (from Columbia University), she teaches creative writing at Princeton.

I know some people here think of an MFA as a negative.

 

[Tzara]

Someone has to win so why not her but I always think arts prizes say more about the jury than the poet/artist/writer.

Maybe I'm just too cynical.

No, I think that is true of arts awards in general, from the Nobel Prize for Literature down to local county fair award winners. I'm not sure I can see how it could be any different, as there are no objective criteria for judging art.

I use awards like the Pulitzer as a way of finding out new poets. I may or may not like their poetry, but at least it suggests some new poets to look at.

 

[bogusagain]

I use awards like the Pulitzer as a way of finding out new poets. I may or may not like their poetry, but at least it suggests some new poets to look at.

Good point Tzara. I don't know the situation in the States but in Britain in most book shops the choice of poetry books is lamentable. Pointless talking about Berlin, where there is obviously no choice for English readers. My German isn't up to speed to enjoy poetry in German unfortunately.

 

[Tzara]

Good point Tzara. I don't know the situation in the States but in Britain in most book shops the choice of poetry books is lamentable.

I'm quite lucky that way, actually. One of the two (there might now be three--I think one opened in Boulder, CO) poetry specialty bookstores in the United States is about two miles from my house and the University of Washington bookstore, which also has a pretty good poetry section, is about the same distance away.

A bit further afield, Powell's City of Books in Portland, OR has a big poetry section as well.

Pointless talking about Berlin, where there is obviously no choice for English readers. My German isn't up to speed to enjoy poetry in German unfortunately.

I hear you. I wish I could read German if for no other reason than to read Rilke in the original.

 

[Maria2394]

She not only has an MFA (from Columbia University), she teaches creative writing at Princeton.

I know some people here think of an MFA as a negative.

I don't really think of it as a negative, but i have read loads of really awful poetry from people who had to be taught to be creative and that just seems wrong somehow.

I do know that I have been shunned by some poets because I don't have a degree and to me, that's just dumb, but I guess if someone spends 100k on a degree they can't see beauty in a good poem even if it is written by an "uneducated" person who taught herself. I will admit, it has made me feel inadequate because I married and had kids, raised a family and didn't have the money to go to school but if I had, it wouldn't have been creative writing, it would have been psych or geology.

However, maybe I just didn't like the examples I read. maybe some of her poetry would rock my world!

Oh hell, I just bared my soul....

 

[bogusagain]

I do know that I have been shunned by some poets because I don't have a degree and to me, that's just dumb, but I guess if someone spends 100k on a degree they can't see beauty in a good poem even if it is written by an "uneducated" person who taught herself.

This doesn't only apply to poetry, in the visual arts, so much visual art is judged by listening rather than seeing or who you know. The people that count, don't look. Thirty years making art, knowing a whole load of artists, dealers, academics and critics and being an avid gallery visitor has convinced me of that. Reading articles on poetry and the politics of poetry have convinced me the poetry world is the same.

I will admit, it has made me feel inadequate

It is they that are inadequate.

if I had, it wouldn't have been creative writing, it would have been psych or geology.

And it would probably served you better as a poet too.

I always wanted to be an artist and spent six years studying but on reflection, I think the worst education for being an artist is an education in fine art.

However, maybe I just didn't like the examples I read. maybe some of her poetry would rock my world!

It is not a crime not to like someone's work. No one seems to raise their eyebrows if someone doesn't like a particular musician or style of music.

Oh hell, I just bared my soul....

At least it wasn't something more embaraasing you bared, though I doubt you would get any complaints on this site.

 

[Maria2394]

This doesn't only apply to poetry, in the visual arts, so much visual art is judged by listening rather than seeing or who you know. The people that count, don't look. Thirty years making art, knowing a whole load of artists, dealers, academics and critics and being an avid gallery visitor has convinced me of that. Reading articles on poetry and the politics of poetry have convinced me the poetry world is the same.



It is they that are inadequate.



And it would probably served you better as a poet too.

I always wanted to be an artist and spent six years studying but on reflection, I think the worst education for being an artist is an education in fine art.




It is not a crime not to like someone's work. No one seems to raise their eyebrows if someone doesn't like a particular musician or style of music.




At least it wasn't something more embaraasing you bared, though I doubt you would get any complaints on this site.

You are such a dear man! And there is an av of me naked on a hunter's platform up in a tree.

 

[corndog_]

I'm quite lucky that way, actually. One of the two (there might now be three--I think one opened in Boulder, CO) poetry specialty bookstores in the United States is about two miles from my house and the University of Washington bookstore, which also has a pretty good poetry section, is about the same distance away.

A bit further afield, Powell's City of Books in Portland, OR has a big poetry section as well.
I hear you. I wish I could read German if for no other reason than to read Rilke in the original.

A sorry comment about the marketability of poetry: my best selections are always in used-book stores. But those are always the most interesting stores anyways. There is something about having to move books to get at other books that appeals to me.

 

[twelveoone]

Prose poetry is still popular

That's a bingo

 

[twelveoone]

She not only has an MFA (from Columbia University), she teaches creative writing at Princeton.

I know some people here think of an MFA as a negative.

as far as solely writing poetry is it a positive?

 

[PandoraGlitters]

as far as solely writing poetry is it a positive?

Any MFA program forces the candidate to become more familiar with the field and should also provide avenues for practice that might not otherwise be available so, I suppose, it should be a positive. Not the only path but a possible path. Should any possible path be written off if it is a viable way for some people?

 

[Tzara]

as far as solely writing poetry is it a positive?

Any MFA program forces the candidate to become more familiar with the field and should also provide avenues for practice that might not otherwise be available so, I suppose, it should be a positive. Not the only path but a possible path. Should any possible path be written off if it is a viable way for some people?

I agree with what Dora said.

I have not been in a poetry MFA program, of course, and don't personally know anyone who has been in one. I do know that (probably) the majority of contemporary poets whose work I particularly admire have MFAs. This doesn't necessarily mean that the MFA helped them to be better poets (it could just mean, for example, that entering into the professional academic network of poets makes it more likely for them to get their work published and noticed), but I think the training likely has made them better poets than they would have been without the MFA experience. Note that I include in that not just the teachers, but fellow students, visiting lecturers, the focus on reading and writing poetry more or less continuously, constant examination and criticism, etc.

It's not magic.

There are other paths/experiences that might be equally effective in developing one's poetry writing skills. DeepAsleep, for example, was heavily into the slam poetry/open mic experience and he spent a lot of time hearing other poets, thinking about other poets, etc. Is that a possible path to improvement as a poet? Absolutely.

I've thought quite a bit about trying to get into an MFA program, but I don't feel skilled enough (or, perhaps, mature enough) to do so as yet.

 

[twelveoone]

I agree with what Dora said.

I have not been in a poetry MFA program, of course, and don't personally know anyone who has been in one. I do know that (probably) the majority of contemporary poets whose work I particularly admire have MFAs. This doesn't necessarily mean that the MFA helped them to be better poets (it could just mean, for example, that entering into the professional academic network of poets makes it more likely for them to get their work published and noticed), but I think the training likely has made them better poets than they would have been without the MFA experience. Note that I include in that not just the teachers, but fellow students, visiting lecturers, the focus on reading and writing poetry more or less continuously, constant examination and criticism, etc.

It's not magic.

There are other paths/experiences that might be equally effective in developing one's poetry writing skills. DeepAsleep, for example, was heavily into the slam poetry/open mic experience and he spent a lot of time hearing other poets, thinking about other poets, etc. Is that a possible path to improvement as a poet? Absolutely.

I've thought quite a bit about trying to get into an MFA program, but I don't feel skilled enough (or, perhaps, mature enough) to do so as yet.

they do become adept
at writing grant applications

 

[Tzara]

they do become adept
at writing grant applications

And, I hope you would agree, there is nothing wrong with that.

In fact, knowing how to successfully get grants (residencies, visiting lectureships, even sponsored or just prominent readings) is useful knowledge for someone wanting to "make a career" as a poet, just as it is essential knowledge for an academic in any other field. Believe me, if I had stayed in academic psychology as a career and didn't learn how to get a grant, however small, I would not get a teaching position anywhere other than The Good Intentions Driver's School.

Frankly, if I'm a career counselor, I'm suggesting anything from an engineering degree to welding school as a better bet than an MFA, but if someone really wants to be a poet, he or she needs to know how to get grants. And readings. And publication, especially in book form.

Doesn't mean Joe Anybody can't write poems, though, just that he might find it a bit more difficult to get hisself published.

 

[ishtat]

It depends.

My experience was that of someone who studied mathematics. After completion of 5 years post grad I realized that I was nothing special as a mathematician and gave away an academic career for business - initially corporate, later on my own account. In my thirties I did a masters in history because I enjoyed it and wanted to understand modern research and study methodologies.

All my adult life I have written poetry though I hardly ever publish anything any more. This is because, in truth, it's written for an audience of one, myself. I get tremendous satisfaction from the process of looking inwards and the alone-ness of the experience.

I know that's entirely selfish, but for me the process of writing is probably more important than the result. I feel that when I am engaged in that process I am completely engrossed in the experience, and sometimes a bad end product can in the creative process be more important to me. than a good product from which I learned little.

The kind of course Tzara suggested may be essential to some careers and it could manufacture (I think) a good artisan poet, especially in that it would teach technique. But, if a great poet emerged from such a course I would suspect that they might not have needed it in the first place.

 

[twelveoone]

And, I hope you would agree, there is nothing wrong with that.

In fact, knowing how to successfully get grants (residencies, visiting lectureships, even sponsored or just prominent readings) is useful knowledge for someone wanting to "make a career" as a poet, just as it is essential knowledge for an academic in any other field. Believe me, if I had stayed in academic psychology as a career and didn't learn how to get a grant, however small, I would not get a teaching position anywhere other than The Good Intentions Driver's School.

Frankly, if I'm a career counselor, I'm suggesting anything from an engineering degree to welding school as a better bet than an MFA, but if someone really wants to be a poet, he or she needs to know how to get grants. And readings. And publication, especially in book form.

Doesn't mean Joe Anybody can't write poems, though, just that he might find it a bit more difficult to get hisself published.

this is publication
I believe I asked
"as far as solely writing poetry is it a positive?"

now if i remember i think PG had said something about a feed back loop
and this was probably covered years ago
any feed back loop that is a closed circle is limited and inherently self destructive.
here or anywhere.
specifically in your case it has been one short brick followed by one long brick, inside a proscribed wall.
the bricks are not hardened but are rather ambiguous and the walls have been under assault for 100 years, starting with ee cummings, Frost, Yeats (even Yeats) et al.
now i think Tracy K. Smith may have done a few sonnets, at this point i can't verify, but my memory is rather good. Have you seen?