What happened to all of the doom and gloom economic threads?

[Sean Renaud]

I wouldn't put it past our leftist state to seize them all and house the homeless in them.

You should. Nobody in America is nearly that far to the left.

 

[coastal-boy]

I wouldn't put it past our leftist state to seize them all and house the homeless in them.

Actually, the siezing of private property for Gov't use has its roots more tightly associated with the Confederate States, which today is the bastion of the GOP. Ironic isn't it?

 

[mercury14]

There is NO growth among small business, employers are not re-stocking the shelves. Trust me, I know. Companies are NOT growing, theyr'e hanging on, trying to survive until it "gets better". Ok, this year is not a normal year due to the election, but the CEO's I speak with all say the same things... Combine this stuff with higher taxes, higher gas prices, its just gets worse.

Did you just say your evidence is "trust me"?

 

[mercury14]

I think, or rather hope they debate Obama's record. Im starting to wonder if Romney is that smart....fact is, NOBODY is wishing for bad news to continue, thats Democrat propaganda while painting ALL Republicans as wealthy and catering to the rich....which is insane.

Romney mentions Obama's record all the time. Or at least his own campaign trail propaganda version of it. But by denying that the economy under Obama is picking up real steam he stops making sense. Instead of saying "yes the economy is starting to recover nicely but if we had my policies in place it would be even better", he attacks the veracity of the BLS report and focuses on increasingly obscure and cherry-picked data points. And because of this he's just not credible.

Almost all Republican candidates, leaders, and Lit cons do this. But they're having to work harder and harder every day to try to maintain their narrative that things are horrible.

 

[NeverEndingMe]

wait are you left wing nuts

so tell me, are you nut jobs for or against wall street making money?

last week you idiots are touting that the market is up. make up your mind, are you for or against wall street?

 

[mercury14]

What people may not realize is, the longer this goes on, the more taxes we pay...gas tax, re tax, etc. The cost of living is rising pretty fast. Your State not balancing its budgets? Guess where the difference comes from....and this is just the beginning. In my State they're worred about Transgenders using the ladies room, giving free tuition to illegal immigrants.....good stuff

The cost of living is not rising fast. That's just a story conservatives want to be true, just like their myth that the Fed created a bunch of inflation. It's regional so some places are fast, others are slow. If you ever want to look at data instead of parroting this conservative bullshit, here's the latest CPI page:

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/cpi.nr0.htm


There's also a classic Republican catch-22 here. Energy prices plummeted during the global recession due to low demand. So if the recession dragged on, the plan is to immediately blame Obama for a bad economy. If the recovery picks up steam it's WHAAAAA!!! ENERGY PRICES ARE INCREASING!!!

Yeah you all had that worked out pretty well didn't you?


Today, 02:52 PM
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NeverEndingMe
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[coastal-boy]

so tell me, are you nut jobs for or against wall street making money?

last week you idiots are touting that the market is up. make up your mind, are you for or against wall street?

I have no problem making money...just as I have no problem paying taxes on what I make, irregardless of how it was made. Yes, I do believe that investment income should be taxed at the same rate as personal income from wages. After all, income is just that...income. Last week, we were talking about how Mitt's income was based predominately on carried interest. That means it wasn't his money, but he got a kick-back on the profits from that money simply because he was the "manager". Yes, that should be taxed as personal income. Is that simple enough for you?

 

[Avg_American_Joe]

I don't agree with what you said. The cost of living comment is going up. Life is getting more expensive from food to gasoline, and soon taxes (both sales, property, and income tax).

Property taxes will be going up, as Counties and States struggle to deal with the lack of revenue, so either the millage will be increased or they will hit home owners with assessments.

The cost of living is not rising fast. That's just a story conservatives want to be true, just like their myth that the Fed created a bunch of inflation. It's regional so some places are fast, others are slow. If you ever want to look at data instead of parroting this conservative bullshit, here's the latest CPI page:

http://www.bls.gov/news.release/cpi.nr0.htm


There's also a classic Republican catch-22 here. Energy prices plummeted during the global recession due to low demand. So if the recession dragged on, the plan is to immediately blame Obama for a bad economy. If the recovery picks up steam it's WHAAAAA!!! ENERGY PRICES ARE INCREASING!!!

Yeah you all had that worked out pretty well didn't you?


Today, 02:52 PM
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NeverEndingMe
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[Ulaven_Demorte]

I have no problem making money...just as I have no problem paying taxes on what I make, irregardless of how it was made. Yes, I do believe that investment income should be taxed at the same rate as personal income from wages. After all, income is just that...income. Last week, we were talking about how Mitt's income was based predominately on carried interest. That means it wasn't his money, but he got a kick-back on the profits from that money simply because he was the "manager". Yes, that should be taxed as personal income. Is that simple enough for you?

Pet peeve, "irregardless" is not a word, you mean regardless or irrespective.

According to webster, it is a word, but since the prefix "ir" and the suffix "less" mean not and without respectively, they cancel each other out (a double negative), so what you end up with is regard. When you use this to try to say you don't care about something, you end up saying that you do.

 

[Avg_American_Joe]

I don't agree with how the 1% has been demonized. It feels like we are no longer Americans but "Us" vs "Them"

Maybe, but that's just my opinion

I have no problem making money...just as I have no problem paying taxes on what I make, irregardless of how it was made. Yes, I do believe that investment income should be taxed at the same rate as personal income from wages. After all, income is just that...income. Last week, we were talking about how Mitt's income was based predominately on carried interest. That means it wasn't his money, but he got a kick-back on the profits from that money simply because he was the "manager". Yes, that should be taxed as personal income. Is that simple enough for you?

 

[mercury14]

I don't agree with what you said. The cost of living comment is going up. Life is getting more expensive from food to gasoline, and soon taxes (both sales, property, and income tax).

Property taxes will be going up, as Counties and States struggle to deal with the lack of revenue, so either the millage will be increased or they will hit home owners with assessments.

If you read the BLS report I linked, you would see that the cost of living is indeed going up slowly. And that's normal. In fact it's a sign of a growing economy. When prices increase businesses becoming more profitable and the value of goods and services grows. We don't want the consumer price index to rise overly fast but... it's not doing that.

You haven't shown that there's any problem here.

 

[Sean Renaud]

I don't agree with what you said. The cost of living comment is going up. Life is getting more expensive from food to gasoline, and soon taxes (both sales, property, and income tax).

Property taxes will be going up, as Counties and States struggle to deal with the lack of revenue, so either the millage will be increased or they will hit home owners with assessments.

Gas so far seems to holding steady and have been for some time. Food costs roughly the same as well. Taxes may or may not go up but I doubt they'll go up much for the common person.

I don't agree with how the 1% has been demonized. It feels like we are no longer Americans but "Us" vs "Them"

Maybe, but that's just my opinion

The one percent hasn't been demonized. Not in any significant way anyhow. They have however been asked to do their job and take care of everybody to some extent and that's their fucking job.

As for the us vs them it's always been that way and always will be that way. Nobody really like their boss or their job and the goals of a worker aren't the same as the goals of an employer. They want as much work for as little money as possible and we we want as much money for as little work as possible. That's just the nature of reality.

 

[mercury14]

I don't agree with how the 1% has been demonized. It feels like we are no longer Americans but "Us" vs "Them"

Maybe, but that's just my opinion

Demonized? Because the majority of Americans think the 1% shouldn't pay 13% taxes while the middle class pays 28%? That's what you call demonized?

May I suggest you grow a thicker skin?

 

[Sean]

I don't agree with how the 1% has been demonized. It feels like we are no longer Americans but "Us" vs "Them"

Maybe, but that's just my opinion

It's been "us versus them" for a long time. Americans are just starting to wake up to the fact. Hence the demonisation of the OWS people.

 

[mercury14]

It's been "us versus them" for a long time. Americans are just starting to wake up to the fact. Hence the demonisation of the OWS people.

This guy is parroting boring Limbaugh... verbatim. How many more seconds until we see a class warfare post?

 

[Ulaven_Demorte]

I don't agree with how the 1% has been demonized. It feels like we are no longer Americans but "Us" vs "Them"

Maybe, but that's just my opinion

They aren't being "demonized". Most people expect them to pay the same rate of income tax regardless of where the money comes from.

The majority of the 1% make their money from capital gains when assets are sold (an increase in value in capital assets (investments or real estate) is a capital asset gain). Long term Capital Gains are taxed at a lower rate (15%) than regular income (35%). Both figures are at the highest marginal tax rate.

Some on the right want to abolish capital gains taxes altogether! Which would put the 1% effectively paying zero taxes on the vast majority of their income. I can understand why they would find that attractive, and why those with more than three brain cells in the 99% think it's utter bullshit.

I don't know whether it's party affiliation or basic intelligence to blame that would have some ranting about how the 99% want free handouts, after the US has reduced Capital Gains taxes (revenue) over thirty years to the point the wealthiest 1% have seen their incomes increase by 275% — while the rest of the population's has gone nowhere during the same interval.

Statistic after statistic show that the majority of handouts have gone to the über-rich.

Most of the richest Americans pay lower overall tax rates than middle-class Americans do. And this is one reason the gap between the wealthy and the rest of the country is widening dramatically.

 

[coastal-boy]

Pet peeve, "irregardless" is not a word, you mean regardless or irrespective.

According to webster, it is a word, but since the prefix "ir" and the suffix "less" mean not and without respectively, they cancel each other out (a double negative), so what you end up with is regard. When you use this to try to say you don't care about something, you end up saying that you do.

you are right

 

[mercury14]

They aren't being "demonized". Most people expect them to pay the same rate of income tax regardless of where the money comes from.

The majority of the 1% make their money from capital gains when assets are sold (an increase in value in capital assets (investments or real estate) is a capital asset gain). Long term Capital Gains are taxed at a lower rate (15%) than regular income (35%). Both figures are at the highest marginal tax rate.

Some on the right want to abolish capital gains taxes altogether! Which would put the 1% effectively paying zero taxes on the vast majority of their income. I can understand why they would find that attractive, and why those with more than three brain cells in the 99% think it's utter bullshit.

I don't know whether it's party affiliation or basic intelligence to blame that would have some ranting about how the 99% want free handouts, after the US has reduced Capital Gains taxes (revenue) over thirty years to the point the wealthiest 1% have seen their incomes increase by 275% — while the rest of the population's has gone nowhere during the same interval.

Statistic after statistic show that the majority of handouts have gone to the über-rich.

Most of the richest Americans pay lower overall tax rates than middle-class Americans do. And this is one reason the gap between the wealthy and the rest of the country is widening dramatically.

And somehow the rich shifting the tax burden off themselves and onto the middle class doesn't count as class warfare.

Class warfare is simply when the rich are asked to pay the same tax rate as everyone else.

 

[unregistered]

 

[Sean Renaud]

THEN RE-WRITE THE FUCKING LAW ASSHOLE, AND STFU.

That's the goal.

 

[mercury14]

This upswing is at 10,860 though. In September. Despite your narrative that the market was reacting negatively to Obama.

Well, it did react negatively, as we have been chronicling.

Three things to keep in mind.

1. Anticipation of accelerated profits ahead of new taxes (as discussed much earlier in this thread).

2. Anticipation of a Republican Congress, the antithesis of that which you allude to and which we discussed earlier.

3. The Fed buying stock to create false optimism.

In short, it's another bubble, but the short-sellers will make money...

How did your bubble at 10,800 turn out? Any day now the market is going to come back to earth at 9k, right?

 

[unregistered]

 

[unregistered]

 

[Sean Renaud]

Lets stop pretending people are breaking the law or doing something illegal.

Who exactly is pretending that people are doing something illegal or breaking the law. I see a lot of people claiming (while I agree with them it's still a claim and not a fact) that what some people are doing is both wrong and fundamentally unfair. Some people happen to think for example that actual work should be rewarded more than simply having money to begin with and letting your money make more money. I certainly don't see anybod on television nor on this board claiming that the law was broken only that the law in this case is wrong.

 

[Sean]

Lets stop pretending people are breaking the law or doing something illegal.

Illegal, no. Immoral, definitely.