What happened to all of the doom and gloom economic threads?

[busybody..]

Is it just me or is Vette barely trying these days?

Hey NIGGERPOONZANDI tell us about teh Summers memo's

I know, IM ON IGGY.........Yeah, RIGHT

 

[RobDownSouth]

Is it just me or is Vette barely trying these days?

He hasn't been the same since he discovered he was a homo.

 

[NeverEndingMe]

He hasn't been the same since he discovered he was a homo.

wow, I think you wet yourself every time you say that.

 

[unregistered]

 

[RobDownSouth]

Yeah, Rob's been sentenced to an eternal fruitless search for kindred spirits. He loves to ascribe to others behaviors and personality disorders near and dear to his heart. In this particular case, his asshole. Judging by the number of foul and gaseous posts he emits, I'd have to surmise his has probably been plundered and torn asunder to the point of failure.

Even when you have me on ignore you can't stop talking about me.

Must be part of that new homo lifestyle of yours.

 

[richard_daily]

Even when you have me on ignore you can't stop talking about me.

Must be part of that new homo lifestyle of yours.

Notice how he mentioned your asshole... it probably gave him a hard on.

He's almost cute... If he'd just make that final push and come out of he closet, he could become a respectable member of society finally, rather than sneaking around at the glory hole.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

No less than three logical fallacies above.

1. They don't use inflation-adjusted dollars.
2. They use a stacked-deck of data (relevance of first-three-years-of-presidency-aggregation vs. last year of Bush?)
3. They cherry pick just the items that have shown the greatest price increases.

Wrap it all up and you have one tailor-made poutrage for pathetic sons-of-bitches like Koalabear and Vetteman.

Also, Vetteman cybered a dude.

If we used inflation-adjusted dollars, then you wouldn't see any inflation.

This is beyond brilliant.

We should have some sort of award for this type of thinking; I'm thinking Darwin...

In a separate statement of its long-range goals and strategy, the FOMC specified a 2 percent goal for inflation, as measured by the annual change in the price index for personal consumption expenditures.

“Communicating this inflation goal clearly to the public helps keep longer-term inflation expectations firmly anchored, thereby fostering price stability,” the panel said in a statement. It also enhances “the committee’s ability to promote maximum employment in the face of significant economic disturbances.”

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-...will-remain-low-until-at-least-late-2014.html

If you want to see the inflation, just look to the stock market as the "free" money pours into it well in excess of the actual "growth rate" which is not even a decent replacement rate for natural population growth.

When the economy actually takes off and that money starts working its way into the economy, the inflation is going to be even higher and more noticeable as manufacturers and merchants begin to compete for the freshly printed and newly available dollars knowing that their future raw material prices are going to rise as well as labor costs to reflect the effects of fiat inflation.

You see, the problem here is that the fiat theory is that in bad times, inflation is a good thing that can be pulled back in good times, the problem being that when good times come, no one wants to trigger a bear market, so you get permanent low interest rates and permanent inflationary policy which helps only those closest to the point of inflation and punishes the consumer-voter who tends to get more and more angry, and then, eventually (for Patrick), to lose confidence in the commodity known as money.

 

[patrick1]

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-...will-remain-low-until-at-least-late-2014.html

If you want to see the inflation, just look to the stock market as the "free" money pours into it well in excess of the actual "growth rate" which is not even a decent replacement rate for natural population growth.

When the economy actually takes off and that money starts working its way into the economy, the inflation is going to be even higher and more noticeable as manufacturers and merchants begin to compete for the freshly printed and newly available dollars knowing that their future raw material prices are going to rise as well as labor costs to reflect the effects of fiat inflation.

You see, the problem here is that the fiat theory is that in bad times, inflation is a good thing that can be pulled back in good times, the problem being that when good times come, no one wants to trigger a bear market, so you get permanent low interest rates and permanent inflationary policy which helps only those closest to the point of inflation and punishes the consumer-voter who tends to get more and more angry, and then, eventually (for Patrick), to lose confidence in the commodity known as money.

The original article we're picking over here, by a writer who is also a committed young Austro-libertarian, cherry-picked certain items which have undergone large price inflation in the period since Obama took office. There is no evidence that any actions by the government caused or hindered the inflation in these cherry-picked items. Actual price inflation is modest at the moment, though for someone like me who has savings, I wish it were lower for selifsh reasons.

I don't know what evidence you have for future 'permanent low interest rates and permanent inflationary policy'. In the last 30 years this has not been the case. Why do you think it will be so in the future?

Patrick

 

[NeverEndingMe]

Notice how he mentioned your asshole... it probably gave him a hard on.

He's almost cute... If he'd just make that final push and come out of he closet, he could become a respectable member of society finally, rather than sneaking around at the glory hole.

how did you become so gay? are you finally coming out of the closet? I can see you in size 10 pumps

 

[koalabear]

New home sales fall in December

New single-family home sales unexpectedly fell in December for the first time in four months and the median home price dropped, dampening some of the hopes the housing sector will boost the economy this year.

The Commerce Department said on Thursday sales decreased 2.2 percent to a seasonally adjusted 307,000-unit annual rate.

Economists polled by Reuters had forecast sales at a 320,000-unit rate. November's sales pace was revised slightly lower.

http://money.msn.com/business-news/article.aspx?feed=OBR&date=20120126&id=14730386

 

[busybody..]

Obama Issuing Two New “Green” Energy Loans, “Creates” 103 Jobs At A Cost Of $257 Million…


DONT TRUST A NIGGER WITH MONEY

Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Via Beltway Confidential:


Agriculture Secretary Tom Vilsack today announced his second bio-fuels loan guarantee in a week, revealing that the Agriculture Department (USDA) is slated to loan an Oregon biorefinery $232.5 million for a project expected to create 65 jobs and support 38 others.

“This project and others like it will help to establish a domestic advanced biofuels industry that will create jobs here at home and open new markets in the Pacific Northwest and across America,” Vilsack said in a statement. [...]

Last week, USDA appoved a conditional $25 million loan guarantee for an Iowa project expected to create 38 jobs. Combined, the two projects create 103 new jobs at a cost of $257.5 million — or, $2.5 million per job.

 

[busybody..]

Another Obama-Funded “Green” Energy Company Goes Belly Up, Ener1 Files For Chapter 11 Bankruptcy After Receiving $118 Million DOE Grant…


DONT TRUST A NIGGER WITH YOUR MONEY

Via The Foundry:


The company, Ener1, received a $118 million grant from DOE in 2010 as part of the president’s stimulus package. The money, which went to Ener1 subsidiary EnerDel, aimed to promote renewable energy storage battery technology for electrical grid use.

But despite generous federal support for the company, Ener1 was racked by problems last year. In October, NASDAQ delisted the company due to non-compliance with Securities and Exchange Commission filing requirements. A month later, the company’s president, chief executive, and top financial officer were fired.

On Thursday, Ener1 announced it will initiate a pre-packaged Chapter 11 bankruptcy plan as part of an agreement to restructure the company’s debt obligations.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

...

I don't know what evidence you have for future 'permanent low interest rates and permanent inflationary policy'. In the last 30 years this has not been the case. Why do you think it will be so in the future?

Patrick

With all central-control schemes, the first efforts at taming the business cycle happen during comparatively good economic times and are, as per Keynes et. al., kept short in duration and according to theory, but as the theory's continued requisite intervention grinds to its inescapable conclusion, the times become successively more dire until you get what we got the other day, the Fed saying that the recovery event horizon is at least three years away, but like the Great (American) Depression and Japan's Lost Decade, someday never comes, it's alway tomorrow, it's only a day away...

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

New home sales fall in December

New single-family home sales unexpectedly fell in December for the first time in four months and the median home price dropped, dampening some of the hopes the housing sector will boost the economy this year.

The Commerce Department said on Thursday sales decreased 2.2 percent to a seasonally adjusted 307,000-unit annual rate.

Economists polled by Reuters had forecast sales at a 320,000-unit rate. November's sales pace was revised slightly lower.

http://money.msn.com/business-news/article.aspx?feed=OBR&date=20120126&id=14730386

If I am to take a stab at it, let's try this:

The end of the year saw an economic uptick and I think for two reasons, one an accelerated shopping season driven by deflationary pricing, the necessary clearing of inventory to avoid taxes and terrible loss and a sense of the need to escape reality and adopt a pretense of better times by the population at large, but while, [y]ou can avoid reality, but you cannot avoid the consequences of avoiding reality[/I (Rand), now this new debt will have to be dealt with by the consumer which will cut into spending.

The second half of the uptick is the necessary and cyclical need for recapitalization of business equipment most likely accelerated by the thought that in an election year, Obama, in order to rally the base, will try and end the Bush tax cuts and raise the cost of capitalization in the new year, so there would then follow a lull in business growth, and as we saw, new unemployment claims has broken its happy trend and started moving up again.

But then, I'm not the only one saying that. There are some renegade economist out there who have gone rogue...

The economy likely grew at annual rate of 3 percent in the October-December quarter, according to a survey by FactSet. The Commerce Department will release the actual figure Friday.

The gain would represent modest improvement from this summer, when the economy grew just 1.8 percent. However, even with the strong finish, economists believe the economy expanded just 1.7 percent for the whole year - roughly half the growth in 2010.

And growth is expected to slow in the first three months of this year. A key reason is wages have failed to keep pace with inflation. That will likely force many consumers to pull back on spending after splurging over the holidays.

Consumer spending is important because it makes up 70 percent of economic activity.

Businesses are also expected to reduce spending in the first quarter after building up their stockpiles in the final months of 2011.

Richard DeKaiser, a senior economist at Parthenon Group, expects just 2 percent annual growth in the January-March quarter. But Kaiser says that should be the weakest quarter. He expects the economy to gain strength in each quarter and grow 2.6 percent for the entire year.

The year is off to a good start. Companies invested more in equipment and machinery in December. The unemployment rate fell to 8.5 percent last month - the lowest level in nearly three years - after the sixth straight month of solid hiring.

People are buying more cars, and consumer confidence is rising. Even the depressed housing market has shown enough improvement to make some economists predict a turnaround has begun.

Still, many economists worry that a recession in Europe could dampen demand for U.S. manufactured goods, which would slow growth. And without more jobs and better pay, consumer spending is likely to stagnate.

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20120127/D9SH6KT82.html

And as we clearly see there is still the other shoe of Europe and the rarely talked about impending correction in the Chinese economy.

 

[patrick1]

With all central-control schemes, the first efforts at taming the business cycle happen during comparatively good economic times and are, as per Keynes et. al., kept short in duration and according to theory, but as the theory's continued requisite intervention grinds to its inescapable conclusion, the times become successively more dire until you get what we got the other day, the Fed saying that the recovery event horizon is at least three years away, but like the Great (American) Depression and Japan's Lost Decade, someday never comes, it's alway tomorrow, it's only a day away...

I asked you for evidence for your opinion about future inflation. I think this answer means, you don't have evidence but you have a theory. Is this a Rothbard theory? I'd be happy to read what he has to say. It has a curiously flipside-of-Marxist sound ('intervention grinds to its inescapable conclusion') that claims to know the future. One odd thing about the present problems are surely that most people - whether socialist, liberal, conseervative or libertarian - didn't see it coming at all. It's easy to see inevitability retrospectively.

Additionally I believe the data are that in the higher-inflation eras preceding the 80's the average real wage of the majority of the population in both the US and the UK rose faster than they have done since then, in a lower-inflation era. Only more women entering the labour market has kept household incomes increasing, hasn't it?

Anyway, I do think that monetary policy should keep an eye on inflation, but it really isn't much of a worry at the moment - compared to the bigger worries of the economy - except for people who are sitting on a lot of cash or living off annuities.

Patrick

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

I don't need new evidence.

The Fed is saying that it is inflating the money supply. That will show up in prices. You don't exactly need Mises to explain why.

Now, on the Fed's part, they think they can manage the increase so that it will not affect us that much, the problem being that their first attempts at monetary expansion did not produce the result predicted by their static models. When it comes to Praxeology, they, and their models are clueless. Business will not expand and an economy will not grow if the investor is unsure of his ROI, be it through government edict or the class-anger of the unthinking mob set upon looting. So the Fed proposes even more free money to jump start the economy. It will be just a small, additional inflation, when the economy rebounds, hopefully, in three years, then they'll trigger a bear market by raising rates...

(NOT! The political party on power will have a cow!)

Even worse, this administration is an outright, declared enemy of traditional energy and are doing everything they can to retard it while they waste Capital outright in an attempt to create clean energy out of whole cloth sans demand for it.

Right now energy prices are high, if the economy actually begins a real expansion, they are going to shoot up creating a great inflation across the board in every aspect of our lives except wages.

Wages is why it is a big deal, they are the last to catch up; those closest to the inflation are the winners.

 

[JohnnySavage]

^

Energy prices are relatively low, and expansion of the money supply has a minor effect on domestic inflation.

The threat of inflation comes from the artificially low bond rates. As the low interest bonds come due, the rates have no where to go but up. As the cost of borrowing to replace the retired debt goes up (for the government), the commercial rates will also go up.

Watch the bond auctions this year. While the fed says it will keep rates low, they may be forced into putting more icing on the cake, which will have a ripple effect.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Relatively low compared to what?



We have set our thermostat to 60° to keep the bill at last year's level and it's been a mild winter.

$3.65 a gallon? Really man?

 

[JohnnySavage]

Relatively low compared to what?



We have set our thermostat to 60° to keep the bill at last year's level and it's been a mild winter.

$3.65 a gallon? Really man?

Gasoline has remained consistant

Natural gas is cheap

Coal is cheap

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

Gasoline has remained consistant

Natural gas is cheap

Coal is cheap

Johnny, you can shoot me all the links you want to prove the point.

I'm still paying more.

I have proof.

The bill.


OH NO MR. BILL!

 

[busybody..]

Gasoline has remained consistant

Natural gas is cheap

Coal is cheap

you have shown yourself what you are

 

[JohnnySavage]

Johnny, you can shoot me all the links you want to prove the point.

I'm still paying more.

I have proof.

The bill.


OH NO MR. BILL!

*shrugs*

Your anecdotal evidence doesn't negate the facts.

Maybe you should concentrate on conservation

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

you have shown yourself what you are

Let us guess...




A NIGGER?

 

[RobDownSouth]

Johnny, you can shoot me all the links you want to prove the point.
I'm still paying more.
I have proof.
The bill.

And that's what's wrong with your argument, little feller: You give us a personal anecdote and expect us good God-fearin' people to believe it refudiates facts.

This is one of the main reason people don't take you seriously.

 

[4est_4est_Gump]

*shrugs*

Your anecdotal evidence doesn't negate the facts.

Maybe you should concentrate on conservation

This is WITH the addition of solar generators and batteries...

We don't get natural gas (or cable).

Your own link shows gas prices are at record levels, not constant levels.

Just because they tighten the distance between years...