Sort of a poem--seeking feedback

[dawei]

I'm not sure if this is even considered a poem or poetry, but I've posted this as a poem submission.

This is pretty simple, yet cautionary I guess. What I’d like is feedback on the ending. I’ve gone back and forth on whether I should end this with the summary phrase or not. Should I keep the last four lines or should I dropped them? Any opinions would be appreciated. By the way, is this even a type of poetry? I search and found “list poem” as a type of poem. Thanks. Here is the submission:

http://www.literotica.com/p/love-is-love

love is....

love is new
love is wonderful
love is nervous
love is exciting
love is good
love is great
love is everything
love is love
love is careless
love is sorrowful
love is forgiveness
love is confusing
love is painful
love is empty
love is hurt
love is sad
love is gone

love your love
while love is love
because love
is never forever

 

[bronzeage]

The problem with list poems and the "love is" list in particular is there is very little new to be said on the subject. There have been books published full of nothing but "Love is..." sentences.

I do like the last section. If you want to develop this further, I would drop the list and concentrate on the pleasure of love while it lasts, and love's fleeting nature.

 

[dawei]

The problem with list poems and the "love is" list in particular is there is very little new to be said on the subject. There have been books published full of nothing but "Love is..." sentences.

I do like the last section. If you want to develop this further, I would drop the list and concentrate on the pleasure of love while it lasts, and love's fleeting nature.

Thanks for the comment and general information about other "love is" poems. Maybe I'll try to search through others for comparison. But initially, I didn't see any exactly like this. I don't plan on dropping the list part of this, but I may write deeper or more comprehensive poems later. Again, thanks for the opinion.

 

[bronzeage]

Thanks for the comment and general information about other "love is" poems. Maybe I'll try to search through others for comparison. But initially, I didn't see any exactly like this. I don't plan on dropping the list part of this, but I may write deeper or more comprehensive poems later. Again, thanks for the opinion.

http://photo.goodreads.com/books/1182906622l/1348194.jpghttp://www.artfulaspreycartoons.co.uk/content/photos/Love%20is/LoveisBW7.jpghttp://rpmedia.ask.com/ts?u=/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/14/Love_is.jpg/140px-Love_is.jpg

 

[_Land]

I'm not sure if this is even considered a poem or poetry, but I've posted this as a poem submission.

This is pretty simple, yet cautionary I guess. What I’d like is feedback on the ending. I’ve gone back and forth on whether I should end this with the summary phrase or not. Should I keep the last four lines or should I dropped them? Any opinions would be appreciated. By the way, is this even a type of poetry? I search and found “list poem” as a type of poem. Thanks. Here is the submission:

http://www.literotica.com/p/love-is-love

love is....

love is new
love is wonderful
love is nervous
love is exciting
love is good
love is great
love is everything
love is love
love is careless
love is sorrowful
love is forgiveness
love is confusing
love is painful
love is empty
love is hurt
love is sad
love is gone

love your love
while love is love
because love
is never forever

the problem with this is it basically says loves is great love sucks the end....................................................Love takes you up it drops you down the end............................



it isnt inspiring it has no imagery.....its more of a statement then anything...I would not consider it poetry. Poetry would say the same thing but do it with metaphores and imagery using the readers imagination to create the swing that your list plain janes to nothingness.



my two cents................thanks for asking

 

[dawei]

http://photo.goodreads.com/books/1182906622l/1348194.jpghttp://www.artfulaspreycartoons.co.uk/content/photos/Love%20is/LoveisBW7.jpghttp://rpmedia.ask.com/ts?u=/wikipedia/en/thumb/1/14/Love_is.jpg/140px-Love_is.jpg

Thanks for providing the love is... images. I suppose there are many of those. But those are all one line poems.

 

[dawei]

the problem with this is it basically says loves is great love sucks the end....................................................Love takes you up it drops you down the end............................

I disagree with this part of your comment. Love may not always be like this, but it happens this way sometime... or many times. What my imagery is, is that after love becomes everything, love may sometimes be taken for granted. Love is love, becomes blase. And with that, there are consequences. And if mistakes are made or things and problems arise it may not always be overcome. Mistakes and problems or whatever then spiral down in a painful ending. It happens this way sometimes or even often and that is what I wrote about--concisely--as a list poem.

it isnt inspiring it has no imagery.....its more of a statement then anything...I would not consider it poetry. Poetry would say the same thing but do it with metaphores and imagery using the readers imagination to create the swing that your list plain janes to nothingness.



my two cents................thanks for asking

Thanks for your two cents, but I guess there is a category of poetry or poetry style called "list poem". So I guess it belongs. Life isn't always happy, so some may appreciate the love roller coaster to "nothingness" as I described.

 

[_Land]

I disagree with this part of your comment. Love may not always be like this, but it happens this way sometime... or many times. What my imagery is, is that after love becomes everything, love may sometimes be taken for granted. Love is love, becomes blase. And with that, there are consequences. And if mistakes are made or things and problems arise it may not always be overcome. Mistakes and problems or whatever then spiral down in a painful ending. It happens this way sometimes or even often and that is what I wrote about--concisely--as a list poem.



Thanks for your two cents, but I guess there is a category of poetry or poetry style called "list poem". So I guess it belongs. Life isn't always happy, so some may appreciate the love roller coaster to "nothingness" as I described.

If you ask for crit on a poem................dont come in swingin, You asked us our opinion. I normally wouldnt give this a second look if you hadnt asked.

I didnt need you to explain your poem to me, i got it the first time.

It lacks emotion, it lacks imagery that makes me pause.

this poetry board has some very good poets on it and when you ask them for their time dont come in and discount what they have to say.

its likely they wont waste time on further poems you ask for help on.

 

[dawei]

If you ask for crit on a poem................dont come in swingin, You asked us our opinion. I normally wouldnt give this a second look if you hadnt asked.

I didnt need you to explain your poem to me, i got it the first time.

It lacks emotion, it lacks imagery that makes me pause.

this poetry board has some very good poets on it and when you ask them for their time dont come in and discount what they have to say.

its likely they wont waste time on further poems you ask for help on.

Thanks again, Land. But I don't think I'm being critical, I have tried to be courteous in my responses. Sorry if you got offended if I explained the poem, but just like you have an opinion, I do too. But specifically, I wasn't asking for a critique of the poem, I was asking about the ending. That is, to include it or not. I'm leaning on removing the last four lines since it sounds like it doesn't matter anyway.

And as for whether this is even a poem, I respect your opinion about that, so you can let that be as it is.

 

[bronzeage]

Thanks for providing the love is... images. I suppose there are many of those. But those are all one line poems.

You asked for feedback and got some. It's perfectly proper to answer questions and clarify things, but never argue with feedback.

 

[Neonurotic]

Hi dawei! Welcome to poetry and the Poetry Feedback and Discussion forum.

What I’d like is feedback on the ending. I’ve gone back and forth on whether I should end this with the summary phrase or not. Should I keep the last four lines or should I dropped them? Any opinions would be appreciated.

Nah, scrap it. It's redundant after your list poem.

By the way, is this even a type of poetry? I search and found “list poem” as a type of poem.

Mostly what I found for List Poems were in forums/articles for teachers teaching children about poetry. Some examples were listed from The Poetry of Chicago.

If you're not sure what poetry is there are many examples of fine poetry right here in the Poetry Feedback and Discussion forum. From here you can broaden your poetry knowledge for free by Google search with key phrases like "what is poetry", this is rather basic, but it would give you definition to help you write poetry. Then try searching "how to write poetry", which would give you fine examples, workshops and styles of poetry. Also, try searching "poetry forms" since there are tons of different poetry forms from free verse and poems without form to sonnets and haikus.

Poetry is a wonderful thing to experience, reading or writing it. Also, writing good poetry takes practice and willingness to absorb feedback even if you don't agree with it.

 

[dawei]

Nah, scrap it. It's redundant after your list poem.

Thanks Neonurotic for the welcome and the opinion on the ending.

Mostly what I found for List Poems were in forums/articles for teachers teaching children about poetry. Some examples were listed from The Poetry of Chicago.

If you're not sure what poetry is there are many examples of fine poetry right here in the Poetry Feedback and Discussion forum. From here you can broaden your poetry knowledge for free by Google search with key phrases like "what is poetry", this is rather basic, but it would give you definition to help you write poetry. Then try searching "how to write poetry", which would give you fine examples, workshops and styles of poetry. Also, try searching "poetry forms" since there are tons of different poetry forms from free verse and poems without form to sonnets and haikus.

Poetry is a wonderful thing to experience, reading or writing it. Also, writing good poetry takes practice and willingness to absorb feedback even if you don't agree with it.

I'm new posting here, but I've been browsing by for a while. Lately, I've been looking up some list poetry definitions. It seems to range in design. From shopping list style to repetition of key words. And like you said often it is linked with children poems, but not necessarily. I plan to write some other styles of poetry in the future.

 

[twelveoone]

I'm not sure if this is even considered a poem or poetry, but I've posted this as a poem submission.

This is pretty simple, yet cautionary I guess. What I’d like is feedback on the ending. I’ve gone back and forth on whether I should end this with the summary phrase or not. Should I keep the last four lines or should I dropped them? Any opinions would be appreciated. By the way, is this even a type of poetry? I search and found “list poem” as a type of poem. Thanks. Here is the submission:

http://www.literotica.com/p/love-is-love

love is....

love is new
love is wonderful
love is nervous
love is exciting
love is good
love is great
love is everything
love is love
love is careless
love is sorrowful
love is forgiveness
love is confusing
love is painful
love is empty
love is hurt
love is sad
love is gone

love your love
while love is love
because love
is never forever

thank you
I knew there was a reason...

I wont do either anymore

so transient, so expected

A question for you, if you read this as if someone else wrote it, why would it appeal to you?

 

[Flesh_4_Fantasy]

The comment on imagery by Land, repeated in his second post, most likely refers to concrete imagery. Your word choice leaves nothing for the reader to picture in their mind as they read the piece. You list emotional states which, while readers might empathize with (we've all been there), are ephemeral and the reader retains them little longer than it takes to read the lines themselves.

Concrete imagery is one of the cornerstones of verse. Imagine it as painting a picture for the reader to see... These images can then be manipulated and transmuted metaphorically to stand in for emotional content in a symbolic way.



Love Is...


That rose I gave to you
When first we met;
You kept it in a crystal vase
Atop your mantlepiece

I'd see it there when I picked you up,
Pale and pink - the blossom fresh
And leaves a healthy green

Late at night it blushed
A darker red
Beneath the candle's soft glow

But time has bitten it:
Soft petals fallen on the hearth,
Your slipper's imprint upon them




<edit> Not that I'm offering the above as an exemplar par excellence... Just something extemporaneous to give a concrete example...

 

[dawei]

The comment on imagery by Land, repeated in his second post, most likely refers to concrete imagery. Your word choice leaves nothing for the reader to picture in their mind as they read the piece. You list emotional states which, while readers might empathize with (we've all been there), are ephemeral and the reader retains them little longer than it takes to read the lines themselves.

Concrete imagery is one of the cornerstones of verse. Imagine it as painting a picture for the reader to see... These images can then be manipulated and transmuted metaphorically to stand in for emotional content in a symbolic way.



Love Is...


That rose I gave to you
When first we met;
You kept it in a crystal vase
Atop your mantlepiece

I'd see it there when I picked you up,
Pale and pink - the blossom fresh
And leaves a healthy green

Late at night it blushed
A darker red
Beneath the candle's soft glow

But time has bitten it:
Soft petals fallen on the hearth,
Your slipper's imprint upon them




<edit> Not that I'm offering the above as an exemplar par excellence... Just something extemporaneous to give a concrete example...

Flesh_4_Fantasy (and others), thanks for your opinion and for your explanation of what you feel is lacking. Frankly, I am not defending this little piece as being of any great literary value. It is what it is, a string of words that I wanted to tell. Furthermore, I get what you said, in that the words are too linear and not image provoking. But I plan on keeping it because, I like it for whatever it is and I feel I've read equally worse poems here.

However, just for discussion sake, let's say I were to try to defend this piece. (For reference, mainly all I wanted to achieve by this post was to get comments about the ending and not to defend it.)

One thing that strikes me is that, List Poems seem to be simpler and more restrictive in structure. Of course one could construct a list poem such that it doesn't feel like that. So, even though I liked your quick and elegant Love Is poem, to me, it seems unfair to compare poems like that since its not of the same type.


Here are some other List Poem examples I quickly found on the Internet (for comparison):

What I Love
I love my family.
I love my house.
I love to eat pancakes.
I love sleeping late on Saturday.
I love a sky full of so many stars.

Blue
My favorite color.
The sky, the water,
Robin’s eggs,
Morning glories,
My father’s eyes.
The sofa he slept on.
The suit I wore
To his funeral.

http://www.thirteen.org/edonline/adulted/lessons/lesson9_activities.html

Coming and Going (by Robert Francis)

The crows are cawing,
The cocks are crowing,
The roads are thawing,
The boys are bumming,
The winds are blowing,
The year is coming.

The jays are jawing,
The cows are lowing,
The trees are turning,
The saws are sawing,
The fires are burning,
The year is going.


In general, these are rather simple and possibly with more expression and concrete imagery than mine. Still, I will try to claim my poem is similar in nature to these and that it belongs in this Lit gallery, as like the little runt of the liter. Perhaps you disagree?

 

[Flesh_4_Fantasy]

In general, these are rather simple and possibly with more expression and concrete imagery than mine. Still, I will try to claim my poem is similar in nature to these and that it belongs in this Lit gallery, as like the little runt of the liter. Perhaps you disagree?

You'll find there are as many opinions as there are writers and readers...

Personally, I've not tried writing a list poem so I stuck with what is comfortable stylistically for me. But I felt it was a good idea to leave an illustration of my point rather than just state an opinion.

I've found that second guessing yourself is a part of the process as well. But if your offering of 'love is...' pleases you, then that is what is most important. You put yourself out there and expressed an interest in honest feedback.

I know that your original question was regarding the final stanza. I was trying to help clarify Land's comment as it seemed an important point and you might not have been expecting such feedback on the entire piece. What you were asking originally is more akin to editorial advice about trimming the summation.

That being said: editorially it makes no difference whether or not you retain the summation. It's perfectly in keeping with the style...

I'll just add: Brava for putting yourself out there and on the desire to advance your knowledge and efforts that you've demonstrated by starting this thread and the research you've been doing.

 

[dawei]

I'll just add: Brava for putting yourself out there and on the desire to advance your knowledge and efforts that you've demonstrated by starting this thread and the research you've been doing.

Thanks for the encouragement and the analysis you provided. I'll try to keep myself open to ideas and to explore creative ways to write.

 

[greenmountaineer]

The comment on imagery by Land, repeated in his second post, most likely refers to concrete imagery. Your word choice leaves nothing for the reader to picture in their mind as they read the piece. You list emotional states which, while readers might empathize with (we've all been there), are ephemeral and the reader retains them little longer than it takes to read the lines themselves.

Concrete imagery is one of the cornerstones of verse. Imagine it as painting a picture for the reader to see... These images can then be manipulated and transmuted metaphorically to stand in for emotional content in a symbolic way.



Love Is...


That rose I gave to you
When first we met;
You kept it in a crystal vase
Atop your mantlepiece

I'd see it there when I picked you up,
Pale and pink - the blossom fresh
And leaves a healthy green

Late at night it blushed
A darker red
Beneath the candle's soft glow

But time has bitten it:
Soft petals fallen on the hearth,
Your slipper's imprint upon them



<edit> Not that I'm offering the above as an exemplar par excellence... Just something extemporaneous to give a concrete example...

Nicely written. It not only illustrates the earlier point but stands alone as a well crafted poem.

 

[PandoraGlitters]

Thanks Neonurotic for the welcome and the opinion on the ending.



I'm new posting here, but I've been browsing by for a while. Lately, I've been looking up some list poetry definitions. It seems to range in design. From shopping list style to repetition of key words. And like you said often it is linked with children poems, but not necessarily. I plan to write some other styles of poetry in the future.

These are both good things: the willingness to research and to experiment. Good luck with your journey into poetry. I look forward to seeing more of your poems around, dawei.

 

[SeedReturntoSea]

Getting, accepting and learning from criticism is bread and butter too an artist.
It is very hard to find good and positive criticism and it may be even harder to let go and accept someone else opinion.

I have read this thread several times and think that you have received good reactions to your work. However you are coming over as being very defensive.

Personally I don't like the poem or the style it is written in. I am not an expert on poetry so cannot give you good feedback on style and structure. However I am a visual artist and what is most important in my work is making it personal, and that is what I am missing in the poem.
You have made it very general and I would like to hear from you.

 

[dawei]

Getting, accepting and learning from criticism is bread and butter too an artist.
It is very hard to find good and positive criticism and it may be even harder to let go and accept someone else opinion.

I’d say, I agree with most, if not 99% of that. On the flip side, being a little feisty about accepting opinions may also be good. How else is the creative juice going to flow if you just say yes to everyone?

I have read this thread several times and think that you have received good reactions to your work. However you are coming over as being very defensive.

Personally I don't like the poem or the style it is written in. I am not an expert on poetry so cannot give you good feedback on style and structure. However I am a visual artist and what is most important in my work is making it personal, and that is what I am missing in the poem.
You have made it very general and I would like to hear from you.

I’d say, that’s perfectly acceptable that you don’t like the poem or style. That’s your honest assessment. But you seem to imply that you want to know why I wrote it and I guess why I seem defensive. Well, I wrote it when I was feeling sad and down. I wrote it when I was miserable and feeling dejected. I put down my pain in words as I could comprehend what I felt--at the time. Like an artist using a drug to stimulate my creativity, I used my sadness and wrote down the phases of a relationship deteriorating. After the fact, I could have made my “poem” more expressive, more creative, more artistically appealing. Instead, I chose to leave it raw and own it. There’s really nothing more to it. I hope to write other, better poems using the ideas and suggestions I’ve been given. But I hadn’t intended on changing much of what I had done on this one. I may delete it, if I grow tired of it, but that’s the story behind it.

That said, I’m not really offended if this poem isn’t liked by others. I’d be more hurt when someone doesn’t like my other poems and stories where I have invested more time and energy trying to please the readers. Yet still, from my very limited knowledge of poetry, I think I can claim this as being a poem. I might argue if someone says it’s not.

Just for discussion, since you say you are a visual artist, I wonder what people think about combining visual assistance to poems, in general. For example, earlier I had thought about using periods (or ellipses) to add a visual framework to the poem, see below.

love is new........
love is wonderful..
love is nervous.......
love is exciting.........
love is good...............
love is great................
love is everything.........
love is love..................
love is careless.........
love is sorrowful.......
love is forgiveness..
love is confusing...
love is painful.....
love is empty....
love is hurt.....
love is sad....
love is gone.

So, in general, I don’t know if visual stimulation is something to be used and considered in poems. I suppose, it’s on a case by case situation where it might enhance a poem or it could detract from it.