What happened to all of the doom and gloom economic threads?

Status
Not open for further replies.
The truth is nobody, with the exception of Moodys, thinks it was anything except a gross waste of money, and a giant payoff to supporters of big government.


Well since he just gave you three sources other than Moody's I guess you're completely wrong again huh? Can you even find a single independent economic analysis firm whose assessment agrees with your statement? Nope you can't.

You're done here Vette. You have nothing. :cool:
 
AJ and Rightfield don't deal in reality. They have a religion.

Here's the difference between them and myself. I change my position based on what's observed. If these independent economic firms said the stimulus didn't work I would change my mind. I would spin on a fucking dime and say "Goddamit the stimulus didn't work and wasted a lot of money".

These two on the other hand (and Jen, Busy, MeeMie, off2bed, vette, you name it) do not deal in observation. They deal in "faith". And faith is the denial of observation so that belief may be preserved. They believe a certain thing because they want to. And this faith leads them to deny observable, objective analysis (Moody's) so that they can maintain their belief.

They're no different than a Christian denying the fossil record because it threatens their religious beliefs. They're no different than a Jehovah's Witness denying that being inside of a whale is a lethal experience. These guys are the "creationists" of economic debate. The lefties here might as well be trying to convince a church full of Pentecostals that snakes don't talk.

:cool:



Epic post. Can we sticky things in this forum? :)
 
then show me the #'s. how many government jobs were added by Bush? how many government jobs has obama added?

and, for fun how many private sector jobs did obama create? saying 1.9 million and the truth might be apples and oranges





If you read the report, you'd see that the jobs created/saved were primarily due to the stimulus increasing economic activity. It's a myth that the stimulus created a significant number of government jobs. And it only (or virtually only since some fed jobs were possibly preserved) preserved government jobs indirectly by giving money to the states - which then often used the money to keep public schools and police departments from closing. No state (that I know of), when faced with the financial crisis, took their federal stimuls money and created whole new sectors of government. Of course local and state governments have had to lay off workers anyway and that's fine. But they were able to avoid 1) draconian cuts in services, and/or 2) tax hikes to pay their bills.
 
then show me the #'s. how many government jobs were added by Bush? how many government jobs has obama added?

and, for fun how many private sector jobs did obama create? saying 1.9 million and the truth might be apples and oranges


Oh Jen this will not go well for you. Bush added the Department of Homeland Security and dramatically expanded the Dept of Defense, the military, CIA, FBI, etc after 911. And then No Child Left Behind expanded the Dept of Education.
 
Oh Jen this will not go well for you. Bush added the Department of Homeland Security and dramatically expanded the Dept of Defense, CIA, FBI, etc after 911. And then No Child Left Behind expanded the Dept of Education.

...and the prescription drug plan...
 
...and the prescription drug plan...


Medicare Part-D, yes that too.

Also, Bush vetoed nothing in his 8 years, the only president ever to do that. Pretty sure some government jobs snuck in somewhere.
 
Last edited:
Oh Jen this will not go well for you. Bush added the Department of Homeland Security and dramatically expanded the Dept of Defense, the military, CIA, FBI, etc after 911. And then No Child Left Behind expanded the Dept of Education.

I'm glad you live in crazyville
 
Medicare Part-D, yes that too.

Also, Bush vetoed nothing in his 8 years, the only president ever to do that. Pretty sure some government jobs snuck in somewhere.


so pretty sure that we can all agree property values have fallen, right?
if so, where are property values today? are we talking home values are down to where they were in 2008 levels? 2005?
 
You can always spot a history buff. :cool:


The fact is that in the six years with total Republican control, Bush vetoed nothing. Zilch, zero vetoes until six months after the Dems took control of congress. He signed every piece of government-expanding spending that was put in front of him by Republicans for six years. Every piece of pork - signed!
 
Last edited:
So the claim he vetoed nothing in 8 years was some monumental Merc level horse shit, right?:D

I don't know where he got his information. Why don't you ask him. And while you're at it, why did it take 6.5 years to veto anything? if the Repubs maintained control for that last 1.5 years do you honestly think Bush would have vetoed anything?

I don't.
 
Especially one listening to Jon Stewart.:D

Most of the FauxNews viewers would be better off listening to Stewart.

"Who are the most consistently misinformed media viewers? The most consistently misinformed? Fox, Fox viewers, consistently, every poll."

The quantifiable evidence is overwhelming. Eight years ago, just six months into the war in Iraq, the Program on International Policy Attitudes (PIPA) at the University of Maryland found that those who relied on the Republican network were “three times more likely than the next nearest network to hold all three misperceptions — about WMD in Iraq, Saddam Hussein was involved with 9/11, and foreign support for the U.S. position on the war in Iraq.”

An NBC/Wall Street Journal poll out [in 2009] found that Fox News viewers were overwhelmingly misinformed about health care reform proposals. A 2008 Pew study ranked Fox News last in the number of ‘high knowledge’ viewers and a 2007 Pew poll ranked Fox viewers as the least knowledgeable about national and international affairs.

The problem is actually getting worse.

In December, PIPA published a report, this time on “Misinformation and the 2010 Election” (pdf). The point was to measure Americans’ understanding of a variety of key developments that news consumers would likely be familiar with. As was the case eight years ago, Fox News viewers were “significantly more likely” to be confused about reality.

Researchers found that Americans who paid more attention to the news were more likely to know about current events. But Americans who relied on Fox News were “significantly more likely than those who never watched it to believe”:

* most economists estimate the stimulus caused job losses (12 points more likely)

* most economists have estimated the health care law will worsen the deficit (31 points)

* the economy is getting worse (26 points)

* most scientists do not agree that climate change is occurring (30 points)

* the stimulus legislation did not include any tax cuts (14 points)

* their own income taxes have gone up (14 points)

* the auto bailout only occurred under Obama (13 points)

* when TARP came up for a vote most Republicans opposed it (12 points)

* and that it is not clear that Obama was born in the United States (31 points)

This point, in particular, seems especially noteworthy: in some cases, regular Fox News viewers would have done better, statistically speaking, if they had received no news at all and simply guessed whether the claims about current events were accurate.

It would take an unlikely twist of self-reflection, but at a certain point, Fox News and its audience might take a moment to ponder why these viewers are so wrong, so often, about so much. That almost certainly won’t happen, of course, in part because the network and its viewers aren’t quite informed enough to realize they’re misinformed.

That said, Wallace is certainly correct in his observation: the network’s viewers “aren’t the least bit disappointed” with what Fox News airs.

Why would they be? Ignorance is bliss. ;)

Source
 
Most of the FauxNews viewers would be better off listening to Stewart.

"Who are the most consistently misinformed media viewers? The most consistently misinformed? Fox, Fox viewers, consistently, every poll."

The quantifiable evidence is overwhelming. Eight years ago, just six months into the war in Iraq, the Program on International Policy Attitudes (PIPA) at the University of Maryland found that those who relied on the Republican network were “three times more likely than the next nearest network to hold all three misperceptions — about WMD in Iraq, Saddam Hussein was involved with 9/11, and foreign support for the U.S. position on the war in Iraq.”

An NBC/Wall Street Journal poll out [in 2009] found that Fox News viewers were overwhelmingly misinformed about health care reform proposals. A 2008 Pew study ranked Fox News last in the number of ‘high knowledge’ viewers and a 2007 Pew poll ranked Fox viewers as the least knowledgeable about national and international affairs.

The problem is actually getting worse.

In December, PIPA published a report, this time on “Misinformation and the 2010 Election” (pdf). The point was to measure Americans’ understanding of a variety of key developments that news consumers would likely be familiar with. As was the case eight years ago, Fox News viewers were “significantly more likely” to be confused about reality.

Researchers found that Americans who paid more attention to the news were more likely to know about current events. But Americans who relied on Fox News were “significantly more likely than those who never watched it to believe”:

* most economists estimate the stimulus caused job losses (12 points more likely)

* most economists have estimated the health care law will worsen the deficit (31 points)

* the economy is getting worse (26 points)

* most scientists do not agree that climate change is occurring (30 points)

* the stimulus legislation did not include any tax cuts (14 points)

* their own income taxes have gone up (14 points)

* the auto bailout only occurred under Obama (13 points)

* when TARP came up for a vote most Republicans opposed it (12 points)

* and that it is not clear that Obama was born in the United States (31 points)

This point, in particular, seems especially noteworthy: in some cases, regular Fox News viewers would have done better, statistically speaking, if they had received no news at all and simply guessed whether the claims about current events were accurate.

It would take an unlikely twist of self-reflection, but at a certain point, Fox News and its audience might take a moment to ponder why these viewers are so wrong, so often, about so much. That almost certainly won’t happen, of course, in part because the network and its viewers aren’t quite informed enough to realize they’re misinformed.

That said, Wallace is certainly correct in his observation: the network’s viewers “aren’t the least bit disappointed” with what Fox News airs.

Why would they be? Ignorance is bliss. ;)

Source



Again, these people have a religion they're following. Fox News is their brimstone preacher indoctrinating them with the will to deny objective observation.
 
Again, these people have a religion they're following. Fox News is their brimstone preacher indoctrinating them with the will to deny objective observation.

I love it when you and UD get together, each one trying to out hate each other..................:)
 
Probably the Daily Kos, Jon Stewart, Howard Dean, the Easter Bunny.



Way to completely ignore my question.

You've been handed your ass today Vette. Remeber your line about "everybody but Moody's thinks the stimulus didn't do shit"? Remember how quickly you bailed out and pulled a Jen when asked to provide just ONE major independent economic firm that agreed with your narrative? Just ONE? But despite your claim that "everybody's" assessment was what you said it was, you dove for cover and looked like the religious zealot you are.

Go to bed.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top