NRA and Florida gag pediatricians: no more firearm safety advice for parents

[cjh]

So, how about a law requiring a doctor to inform a parent if he performs an abortion on a minor? Is that free speech interference? I thought abortion was a privacy issue. Why isn't firearms possession a privacy issue?

the minor is the patient. the duty of confidentiality extends from the doctor to the patient, not to the parent. the patient, of course, can waive that duty.

parents don't have to answer any questions.

doc: this looks like a snake bite on your toddler. did you see it?

parents: *exercise right to silence.

* * *

doc: exposure to second hand smoke can exacerbate respiratory problems like this. does anyone smoke around your infant?

parents: *exercise right to silence.

 

[koalabear]

No warrant necessary, unless the home owners deny entrance to the social workers. They ask to come in. They can't enter without permission.

If the dog hadn't stopped to shit he would have caught the rabbit.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Yes, because we have a constitutional right to keep and bear kitchen cabinets and car seats.

Dummy.

Where does it stop? Do you want to be in the doctor's office for a week listening to him lecture you on being a good parent? I don't think so. Treat my kid's illness and leave me alone.

I've never had a doctor tell us to put latches on cabinets or buy the right car seat. They treat us like responsible adults, not like ignorant morons. But if you want doctors to treat their fellow adults as if they're ignorant morons, that's your business; you must be one if that's how you want to be treated.

This is one of your dumber posts ever.

That one's even dumber than the one you quoted. Freedom of speech apparently isn't a priority for conservatives, of course we already knew this from how they handle porn and video games but still.

 

[Peregrinator]

It is not politically correct to ask about guns.

No shit. It's like the pediatrician has a whole list of risk factors:

Cleaning fluids
Medicines
Car seats
Lawn tools
Heavy equipment
Guns
Power tools
Diet
Exercise
Pets
Choking hazards
Electrical outlets




GUNS!!???!!??!??!?!?!?!!!?!? How DARE you ask about my guns?

It's as bad as the reaction of extreme lefties to any mention of race. In fact, it's identical.

 

[off2bed]

This is one of your dumber posts ever.

Only if you believe abortion doesn't hurt anybody.

 

[off2bed]

That one's even dumber than the one you quoted. Freedom of speech apparently isn't a priority for conservatives, of course we already knew this from how they handle porn and video games but still.

Let's talk about Pastor Terry Jones.

 

[koalabear]

No shit. It's like the pediatrician has a whole list of risk factors:

Cleaning fluids
Medicines
Car seats
Lawn tools
Heavy equipment
Guns
Power tools
Diet
Exercise
Pets
Choking hazards
Electrical outlets




GUNS!!???!!??!??!?!?!?!!!?!? How DARE you ask about my guns?

It's as bad as the reaction of extreme lefties to any mention of race. In fact, it's identical.

and nothing on that list is his business.

 

[Peregrinator]

Yes, because we have a constitutional right to keep and bear kitchen cabinets and car seats.

Dummy.

Where does it stop? Do you want to be in the doctor's office for a week listening to him lecture you on being a good parent? I don't think so. Treat my kid's illness and leave me alone.

I've never had a doctor tell us to put latches on cabinets or buy the right car seat. They treat us like responsible adults, not like ignorant morons. But if you want doctors to treat their fellow adults as if they're ignorant morons, that's your business; you must be one if that's how you want to be treated.

What's wrong with saying, "Doctor, you are a jackass. You're fired." and finding another doc who obeys the New Right PC principle of never asking about guns? Why do we need more government again?

Yes..

Fine. You can sue anyone for anything, but try getting any money out of someone who said "keeping your guns locked up and unloaded is safer."

Only if you believe abortion doesn't hurt anybody.

Are you really prepared to support this argument? I don't believe you've thought it all the way through.

 

[cjh]

This is one of your dumber posts ever.

i love all the rationalization in this thread.

government regulation of medicine is good!

government interference in the doctor/patient relationship is good!

laws curtailing free speech are good!

free market solutions don't work!

and though all this rationalization is offered to, supposedly, protect 2nd amendment rights, THERE IS NO SECOND AMENDMENT ISSUE in the context of private health care providers accepting private insurance.

 

[Peregrinator]

and nothing on that list is his business.

You can always say that.

That depends on whether you believe that part of a doctor's job, especially a pediatrician's job, is to teach patients--or their parents--how to avoid getting sick or injured in the first place. One of the most significant criticisms of our medical system is that we use the model that everything's fine until something breaks. I'm not at all a fan of legislation that says what kids can and can't eat, for example, but I am a HUGE fan of education for everybody in how to live healthier, longer lives. And that's all this is. Getting shot accidentally tends to make your life less healthy and in some particularly tragic cases, shorter. It's just one risk among many that parents should be cognizant of. There's no harm in a doc asking if the kids have any access to guns. The only harm is the imagined paranoia-driven conspiracy among

...

I'm not even sure who this one is supposed to be. Constitution-hating secret one-government commie anti-gun doctor insurance exec who the fuck knows.

Can one of you who's really really worried that your kid's doctor might know you own a gun please tell me who is the bad guy again?

 

[Peregrinator]

i love all the rationalization in this thread.

government regulation of medicine is good!

government interference in the doctor/patient relationship is good!

laws curtailing free speech are good!

free market solutions don't work!

and though all this rationalization is offered to, supposedly, protect 2nd amendment rights, THERE IS NO SECOND AMENDMENT ISSUE in the context of private health care providers accepting private insurance.

It's truly difficult to believe. I really can't. It has to be just a handful of posters trying to get us wound up.

 

[koalabear]

You can always say that.

That depends on whether you believe that part of a doctor's job, especially a pediatrician's job, is to teach patients--or their parents--how to avoid getting sick or injured in the first place. One of the most significant criticisms of our medical system is that we use the model that everything's fine until something breaks. I'm not at all a fan of legislation that says what kids can and can't eat, for example, but I am a HUGE fan of education for everybody in how to live healthier, longer lives. And that's all this is. Getting shot accidentally tends to make your life less healthy and in some particularly tragic cases, shorter. It's just one risk among many that parents should be cognizant of. There's no harm in a doc asking if the kids have any access to guns. The only harm is the imagined paranoia-driven conspiracy among

...

I'm not even sure who this one is supposed to be. Constitution-hating secret one-government commie anti-gun doctor insurance exec who the fuck knows.

Can one of you who's really really worried that your kid's doctor might know you own a gun please tell me who is the bad guy again?

No one gets shot accidentally, it is an act of stupidity. I think the State should take all kids at birth, then the stupid parent is out of the question.

 

[bronzeage]

Yes, because we have a constitutional right to keep and bear kitchen cabinets and car seats.

Dummy.

Where does it stop? Do you want to be in the doctor's office for a week listening to him lecture you on being a good parent? I don't think so. Treat my kid's illness and leave me alone.

I've never had a doctor tell us to put latches on cabinets or buy the right car seat. They treat us like responsible adults, not like ignorant morons. But if you want doctors to treat their fellow adults as if they're ignorant morons, that's your business; you must be one if that's how you want to be treated.

You are not the pediatrician's patient.

If you think your Doctor never treated you like an ignorant moron, you probably weren't paying attention.

 

[cjh]

It's truly difficult to believe. I really can't. It has to be just a handful of posters trying to get us wound up.

i'm not wound up.

i'm laughing.

were i a physician or parent in florida, i'd be wound up.

as a parent, i want a proactive physician who focuses on wellness and not just illness.

 

[Peregrinator]

No one gets shot accidentally, it is an act of stupidity. I think the State should take all kids at birth, then the stupid parent is out of the question.

You're confused. The solution is to pass laws about what doctors can and cannot say to their patients.

i'm not wound up.

i'm laughing.

were i a physician or parent in florida, i'd be wound up.

as a parent, i want a proactive physician who focuses on wellness and not just illness.

Me too. It's hilarious. I like thinking about the implications for different discussions. It's also funny to see how many people ignored Ishmael's post summarizing the law a few pages ago.

Exactly the point all along.

 

[koalabear]

You're confused. The solution is to pass laws about what doctors can and cannot say to their patients.


.

I agree with the NRA.

 

[bronzeage]

i'm not wound up.

i'm laughing.

were i a physician or parent in florida, i'd be wound up.

as a parent, i want a proactive physician who focuses on wellness and not just illness.

This is the basic problem of American healthcare, which no one wants to face. We will never get healthcare costs under control because sooner or later, someone will have to tell someone else they must change the way they live.

We would rather face old age with very expensive decrepit bodies which require acute medical care and the occasional dead child, than admit someone else may know better than we do.

 

[Peregrinator]

I agree with the NRA.

What, exactly, do they say that you agree with?

 

[koalabear]

What, exactly, do they say that you agree with?

Everything.

 

[Peregrinator]

This is the basic problem of American healthcare, which no one wants to face. We will never get healthcare costs under control because sooner or later, someone will have to tell someone else they must change the way they live.

We would rather face old age with very expensive decrepit bodies which require acute medical care and the occasional dead child, than admit someone else may know better than we do.

Yup. When science shows that smoking causes cancer, the answer is "ain't no gubmint egghead gonna tell me what's good for me."

 

[zipman]

i love all the rationalization in this thread.

government regulation of medicine is good!

government interference in the doctor/patient relationship is good!

laws curtailing free speech are good!

free market solutions don't work!

and though all this rationalization is offered to, supposedly, protect 2nd amendment rights, THERE IS NO SECOND AMENDMENT ISSUE in the context of private health care providers accepting private insurance.

And most of it from self-professed libertarians!

 

[koalabear]

Yup. When science shows that smoking causes cancer, the answer is "ain't no gubmint egghead gonna tell me what's good for me."

Does smoking always cause cancer?

 

[Peregrinator]

Does smoking always cause cancer?

Sometimes.

 

[coastal-boy]

a doctor shouldn't talk about any health risk?

Wow. OK. This is why we have doctors...because people are too fucking stupid to make an intelligent decision for themself, let alone for a child.

 

[sigh]

In all the doctor visits I've ever been to in my entire life, mine as well as my son's, I've NEVER had a discussion with a physician about gun safety. I've never even heard of a doctor doing this. They get what?, lees than 10 freakin minutes to see you before the clinic bean-counters are pushing them on to the next room. How many of those minutes are normally spent talking about gun safety? My guess is the average is close to zero. Does this really happen often enough to justify a law to regulate it (assuming there's any justification for the law in the first place)?

If you don't want your doc talking to your kid about gun safety, tell him/her to shut up. It's your dime. It's not like they can force-feed it to you. Why not have a random law forbidding discussion of gun-safety with...say...your hairdresser? Mine is much more talkative than any doc I've ever been to, and far more happy to discuss just about anything, including medicine.