Character development - is there such a thing as too much?

[sillypanda]

Hello everyone,

Thank you all for your kindness and assistance so far - it's been such an amazing experience these last (...counts...) 36 hours that I'm already preparing to write a second story!

But I have a question for you experienced writers (and readers) please: Does anyone have an opinion on character development and backstory?

My first story I kept this short, but in the future I'd like to spend more time on the characters and buildup.

I'd like to build up slowly, and describe the mounting sexual tension that can take place between two people in the course of, say, an hour or two, but is that enough? Is there such a thing as TOO slow a buildup, or too much development?

Is it okay to go, say, half a page to a page with nothing terribly sexual happening, or do readers lose interest and give up?

Also, while I have your attention, I'd also like to ask about language... My first story contained a few possibly offensive words here and there, but would it be better to 1) avoid them altogether, or 2) use them sparingly, or 3) let loose with whatever feels right in the situation?

If you don't mind sharing your feedback on these issues (or one), I'd greatly appreciate it! Thank you in advance, and thank you again for your hospitality and help!

-Panda

 

[sillypanda]

And why won't my uploaded Sexual Harassment Panda icon show up alongside my posts? *curses my internet ineptitude*

 

[TE999]

And why won't my uploaded Sexual Harassment Panda icon show up alongside my posts? *curses my internet ineptitude*

You need a few more posts under your belt before you can display an AV...100 as I recall.

 

[Darkniciad]

The readers aren't going to lose interest and give up. The strokers ( who form a large part of the readership ) might. Then again, a lot of them know how to skim for the "good parts" too.

The readership is more than diverese enough to get a good following with a story that doesn't jump straight into sex. If you want to develop your characters, go for it. The right balance between the two attracts both those looking for a story, and those looking for wank material. That's the sweet spot on Lit.

The same applies to language. There are readers who want romance-novel words, and those who want down and dirty. I tend to pick mine based upon the atmosphere I want to convey, and that's usually a mixture between the two.

 

[sillypanda]

You need a few more posts under your belt before you can display an AV...100 as I recall.

Ahh - thank you very much! I'll do my best not to spam the boards just to get my count up!

 

[sillypanda]

The readership is more than diverese enough to get a good following with a story that doesn't jump straight into sex. If you want to develop your characters, go for it. The right balance between the two attracts both those looking for a story, and those looking for wank material. That's the sweet spot on Lit.

The same applies to language. There are readers who want romance-novel words, and those who want down and dirty. I tend to pick mine based upon the atmosphere I want to convey, and that's usually a mixture between the two.

Very sage advice, Darkniciad - thank you very much! I suppose I'll have to play around a bit with things and see what works best with each individual story (especially in terms of language).

Thank you again!

 

[Bebeslut]

Hello everyone,

Thank you all for your kindness and assistance so far - it's been such an amazing experience these last (...counts...) 36 hours that I'm already preparing to write a second story!

But I have a question for you experienced writers (and readers) please: Does anyone have an opinion on character development and backstory?

My first story I kept this short, but in the future I'd like to spend more time on the characters and buildup.

I'd like to build up slowly, and describe the mounting sexual tension that can take place between two people in the course of, say, an hour or two, but is that enough? Is there such a thing as TOO slow a buildup, or too much development?

Is it okay to go, say, half a page to a page with nothing terribly sexual happening, or do readers lose interest and give up?

Also, while I have your attention, I'd also like to ask about language... My first story contained a few possibly offensive words here and there, but would it be better to 1) avoid them altogether, or 2) use them sparingly, or 3) let loose with whatever feels right in the situation?

If you don't mind sharing your feedback on these issues (or one), I'd greatly appreciate it! Thank you in advance, and thank you again for your hospitality and help!

-Panda

Each story is different and each writer is different. Go ahead and go with what you feel and think will make a good story. Put it up on the site. Revisit it. If you think it's no good, do something different next time.
DO NOT WRITE TO FORMULA. Depending on how you do it, a few sentences may deliver a really hot scene, or a few pages.
Character and backstory are very important. Get the characters right, you may find it easier to write the hot scenes -- or you may forgo hot scenes and let your characters play out their lives in other ways.
I have characters I like very much, and backstory for them that's never made it, so far, into the released stories.
Write your second story. Then get a new idea and write your third.

 

[sr71plt]

I'll differ with Darkinaid a bit on "readers" not going to lose interest in starting out with a few pages of backstory. A lot of readers in the current market will, in fact, lose interest. The current style is to start with action and that's exactly because of what the market is telling publishers what a significant chunk of readers is signaling they want to read.

And, yes, characters and backstory can be overdeveloped. Again, bringing current reading trends into play, description that doesn't serve the plotline is overdevelopment. Characters too come in all sizes of importance to the storyline. There's no reason to know that the waiter who brought a bottle of wine to the table on page five and then faded in the background never to appear again is living with his Aunt Mabel.

 

[sillypanda]

Each story is different and each writer is different. Go ahead and go with what you feel and think will make a good story. Put it up on the site. Revisit it. If you think it's no good, do something different next time.
DO NOT WRITE TO FORMULA. Depending on how you do it, a few sentences may deliver a really hot scene, or a few pages.
Character and backstory are very important. Get the characters right, you may find it easier to write the hot scenes -- or you may forgo hot scenes and let your characters play out their lives in other ways.
I have characters I like very much, and backstory for them that's never made it, so far, into the released stories.
Write your second story. Then get a new idea and write your third.

Thank you very much Bebe! And excellent advice - as a newbie author, I might as well try something and post it and see how people feel about it. Or perhaps I should try writing it out as I envision it and then edit it from there.

Sadly, right now my biggest shortcoming isn't ideas, it's TIME. xD Thanks again!

 

[sillypanda]

I'll differ with Darkinaid a bit on "readers" not going to lose interest in starting out with a few pages of backstory. A lot of readers in the current market will, in fact, lose interest. The current style is to start with action and that's exactly because of what the market is telling publishers what a significant chunk of readers is signaling they want to read.

And, yes, characters and backstory can be overdeveloped. Again, bringing current reading trends into play, description that doesn't serve the plotline is overdevelopment. Characters too come in all sizes of importance to the storyline. There's no reason to know that the waiter who brought a bottle of wine to the table on page five and then faded in the background never to appear again is living with his Aunt Mabel.

These are also excellent points - this is a niche market so we certainly should cater to that niche!

My biggest concern, I suppose, is centering on two characters and building the relationship, the tension, over a span of say an hour. Surely a lot of people could boil that down into a sentence or two, but others (like you said) can stretch it out for multiple pages.

Am I being too indulgent in focusing attention on many of the little details that initially turn the characters on? Hmm.

I'll try, as you and others have suggested, to strike a healthy balance and let the characters develop without trying the readers' patience.

Thank you very much!

 

[sr71plt]

These are also excellent points - this is a niche market so we certainly should cater to that niche!

My biggest concern, I suppose, is centering on two characters and building the relationship, the tension, over a span of say an hour. Surely a lot of people could boil that down into a sentence or two, but others (like you said) can stretch it out for multiple pages.

Am I being too indulgent in focusing attention on many of the little details that initially turn the characters on? Hmm.

I'll try, as you and others have suggested, to strike a healthy balance and let the characters develop without trying the readers' patience.

Thank you very much!

What I think you should try to do is not oversell to the readers or to make them think you think they have to be spoonfed to keep up. Quite often a single or a few adjectives or side action can make connections in the reader's mind that tells him all he/she needs to know about that aspect of a character (e.g. she's sweet as a lamb with him in the dining room, the phone rings, and she goes in the kitchen and is overheard being sharp and foul mouthed to the caller and then comes back and is sweet as a lamb to him in the dining room. You haven't devoted a lot of effort to paint her as two-faced, but the reader doesn't need to be told she is at great length--unless you are toying with them and she turns out to be entirely different.

To any extent that you use "show" rather than "tell" and you make the reader believe they have discovered the "realities" of the work for themselves, you are keeping your reader with you and informed and happy.

 

[Darkniciad]

I'll differ with Darkinaid a bit on "readers" not going to lose interest in starting out with a few pages of backstory. A lot of readers in the current market will, in fact, lose interest. The current style is to start with action and that's exactly because of what the market is telling publishers what a significant chunk of readers is signaling they want to read.

Who said anything about backstory?

I was working from the context of the post and the posted story. The sex comes in fairly early, and is most of the story. It's primarily a stroker, and I took the question as one wondering whether there were enough readers here who didn't just skip to the sex to warrant telling more of a story with the naughty bits.

 

[_Lynn_]

I'll differ with Darkinaid a bit on "readers" not going to lose interest in starting out with a few pages of backstory. A lot of readers in the current market will, in fact, lose interest. The current style is to start with action and that's exactly because of what the market is telling publishers what a significant chunk of readers is signaling they want to read.

And, yes, characters and backstory can be overdeveloped. Again, bringing current reading trends into play, description that doesn't serve the plotline is overdevelopment. Characters too come in all sizes of importance to the storyline. There's no reason to know that the waiter who brought a bottle of wine to the table on page five and then faded in the background never to appear again is living with his Aunt Mabel.

I agree 100% and have made note of that fact in edits many times.

 

[sillypanda]

It's primarily a stroker. . .

Ha - I confess, it was written with an audience of one in mind, but I never thought it would be summed up so succinctly. I'm not quite sure how to take that, good/bad/indifferent, other than to be shocked (and a little, dare I say, delighted?) that something that came out of my head would be classified as such.

What a couple of days it has been here. xD

But yes sir, you were exactly right about the scope of my question, and thank you again for your feedback!

And thank you as well, MistressLynn - I will do my best to keep the story tight!

 

[Weird Harold]

But I have a question for you experienced writers (and readers) please: Does anyone have an opinion on character development and backstory?

As I said on the other thread where you asked this: Use exactly as much backstory (and character development) as your story requires. No more and no less.

Many (new) authors tend to forget that erotic stories are first and foremost stories. All of the tricks and techniques that make for good adventure stories, mysteries, science fiction and fantasy stories, et al apply equally to making good sex stories.

In fact, here at Literotica, you can write adventure, science fiction, mystery, or whatever you favorite non-erotic genre might be and not worry about having to "close the bedroom door" if your characters decide they want to get sexy with each other. That's not to say you MUST write more than sexy scenes, just that there are readers for just about any degree of erotic content you might wish to include.

 

[estragon]

The readers aren't going to lose interest and give up. The strokers ( who form a large part of the readership ) might. Then again, a lot of them know how to skim for the "good parts" too.

The readership is more than diverese enough to get a good following with a story that doesn't jump straight into sex. If you want to develop your characters, go for it. The right balance between the two attracts both those looking for a story, and those looking for wank material. That's the sweet spot on Lit.

The same applies to language. There are readers who want romance-novel words, and those who want down and dirty. I tend to pick mine based upon the atmosphere I want to convey, and that's usually a mixture between the two.

Dark got it right, but as with so many things, it's much easier in the telling than in the doing. I don't mind good stroke material, but I want to see the people involved, not just cardboard cutouts or inflatable fuckdolls.

There will always be the strokers looking for prose Viagra (on the female equivalent) on this site, who will blast the serious writers. I got my share of them, and so will you.

But there will be the Grand Masters, who get it right. My favorites are dweaver999 and Sir_Nathan. And new writers like lunanul, rookie of the year.

Do what feels right. Remember Hemingway: "Write the truest sentence you know. Then another."

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

My approach is different.

I boil characters down to their essence, then add whats necessary, but no more. You want personality essentials. And what you add must be congruent with the personality.

Hemingway was 1/2 right. Start with the most interesting thing you know.

 

[littleblackdress50]

The most erotic part of a human being is the brain.... our own brain... the reader's brain....not the writers brain.

Some of the most erotic writing ever does not describe a sex act and does not use a single four letter word (unless snow or rain or wind count). If you can trigger our emotions, our feelings... leave us feeling the sexual wonder without ever describing the act... WE can fill in the blanks with the most wondrous act we can imagine!!!

If however we need to describe a sex act, and sometimes we do need to or want to.... then do what works. The dialog should be true to humanity, to the situation. It can be as clean or as filthy as required to be comfortable and true to the characters and the situation.

Character development is much the same. It must fit with the story. We need to know why a character does something, or doesn't. We need to know enough about the character to feel what the character feels. More than that is just excess words and excess words are simply boring. Having said that... it is worse than boring to not provide enough character development for the reader to empathize with the character.

It is the story that you want to tell that defines the amount of character development that is required.

 

[sillypanda]

Thank you all very much for your input! And thank you, Harold, for restating your comment for me *feels sheepish for losing track of previous thread*

I may have to enlist the assistance of an editor or two this time, rather than hurriedly posting something before I "lose my nerve" lol. So far I'm at 3,600 words and the characters have hardly touched (my last was less than 4,000), but there's a lot more sexual tension and inner turmoil, which as a reader I often enjoy more than the final coming together of characters.

On the other hand, I wonder if readers are expecting my stories to follow the same kind of arc - do you write for yourself or do you write for your readers? Can you do both and trust that your readers will give you a chance when you try something new?

As usual, I'm probably completely overthinking this lol. xD Thanks again!

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Something that helped me a lot is years of experience evaluating people at a psychiatric hospital. After a while you learn to peg them as soon as they walk thru the door. This basic information you sense is their essential personality, and it presents to the world an existential message Berne called a 'SWEATSHIRT.' With experience there's no doubt whose team they play for.

Read a copy of GAMES PEOPLE PLAY by Eric Berne, MD or WHAT DO YOU SAY AFTER YOU SAY HELLO? by Eric Berne, MD

Berne said that most of us act out fairytales and myths rather than live honest lives. So once you know a person's favorite fairytale or legend you know how to write them.

 

[sr71plt]

In fact, here at Literotica, you can write adventure, science fiction, mystery, or whatever you favorite non-erotic genre might be and not worry about having to "close the bedroom door" if your characters decide they want to get sexy with each other.

That's exactly why I've moved so far into writing erotica. For years I've written in the mainstream and always felt constrained because I had to stop at the bedroom door (or at least get awfully hazy about what was going on). Erotica is freeing in that I can write the same story plots here and just go on and write it all.

 

[sr71plt]

do you write for yourself or do you write for your readers?

If you put yourself in the place of the reader when you write, you don't have to worry much about this.

 

[GinaTina]

Lots and lots of development and plot, please.


However, that is just my personal preference. I'm a sucker for a good story. Like it's already been said, some are just here for the wank of it - so to speak.

When I write, I get fairly in depth. It's just what I like to do. And when I read the stories here, I find myself to hold the authors to a very high standard because that's what I do. Sadly, this has made me very picky and I click out on most of the stories here before I even get through the first page.

I also believe the quality of the writing is very important. Too little description and I get bored. On the other hand, if your writing is too descriptive and wordy, I get bored. You have to try and find the right balance between the two.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Dont give up the day job just yet.

 

[TxRad]

Over developed characters?

Remember, women need to be able to stand up straight and men don't need things dragging on the floor getting splinters.