Epic Oil Spill...FUCK!

[TE999]

Just speculating, but possibly the BOP could be activated and do it's job. It sounds like a progressive system failure though and the exact cause may take a long time to discern, if at all.

 

[Dragonlipz]

When gasoline costs you $5 a gallon above is what you'll be screaming.

No I won't be screaming some inanity promoted by a half-term quitter who couldn't hack it.......I'll be utilizing public transport to work and driving my Jaguar to social functions......
KMA, JimbobJohnny................................

 

[Dragonlipz]

Just speculating, but possibly the BOP could be activated and do it's job. It sounds like a progressive system failure though and the exact cause may take a long time to discern, if at all.

Sometimes in life it is more effective to remain silent and thought to be a FOOL, rather than to offer one's insight and remove all doubt.......
__________________

 

[Dragonlipz]

Excellant metaphor. This whole thing seems to have a movieish quality about it, and some of the hoopla is resulting from computer driven emulations about oil dispersion toward the coast.
The beaches will not be the problem, the bayeaux and greenery will be

Sometimes in life it is more effective to remain silent and thought to be a FOOL, rather than to offer one's insight and remove all doubt.......
__________________

 

[DeeZire]

It's a little late now, but if the last piece of gear on the BOP was a 'T' fitting with a diverter valve, it would simply be a matter of dropping a new riser from the surface, attaching it to the 'T' fitting, and then turning the valve to divert the oil into the new riser. The fact that a low-tech fail safe is not even considered says a lot about the common sense of the engineering community. When you rely exclusively on state-of-the-art technology, you risk becoming a victim of that technology. (Trysail's posts didn't indicate that the BOP weighs 450 tons - which is a helluva lot of state-of-the-art technology.)

On the issue of safety regulations, there were new government safety regulations pending, but industry opposition was unanimous. I think it's rather hypocritical that when private enterprise is successful, it is claimed that their success is achieved in spite of government regulations that stifle innovation and efficiency. But when something like this happens, the private enterprise fanboys suddenly claim the disaster is the fault of government for not having stricter regulations.

 

[TxRad]

It's a little late now, but if the last piece of gear on the BOP was a 'T' fitting with a diverter valve, it would simply be a matter of dropping a new riser from the surface, attaching it to the 'T' fitting, and then turning the valve to divert the oil into the new riser. The fact that a low-tech fail safe is not even considered says a lot about the common sense of the engineering community. When you rely exclusively on state-of-the-art technology, you risk becoming a victim of that technology. (Trysail's posts didn't indicate that the BOP weighs 450 tons - which is a helluva lot of state-of-the-art technology.)

On the issue of safety regulations, there were new government safety regulations pending, but industry opposition was unanimous. I think it's rather hypocritical that when private enterprise is successful, it is claimed that their success is achieved in spite of government regulations that stifle innovation and efficiency. But when something like this happens, the private enterprise fanboys suddenly claim the disaster is the fault of government for not having stricter regulations.

Tee Fitting????

You have no idea what you are talking about do you. This is a drilling operation. Just how the fuck do you drill with a tee fitting in the damned way. Drill pipe with a bit on the end has to go down that riser all the way to the bottom of the hole. Then that drill pipe must be able to spun or at least turn if you are using a mud motor. You can't do that through a fucking Tee.

A low-tech fail safe? Would you like to elaborate on that? The BOPs themselves are about as low tech as it gets. A series of high pressure bladders and solid steel rams and shears operated by hydraulics and high pressure air.

State-of-the-art technology. The BOPs they are using on this rig are just like the ones on my rig except their are a hell of a lot bigger. The way they are closed operates exactly the same way except the accumulators to close theirs are on the sea bottom also. The only "High Tech" is the extras added for salt water and water pressure. They must be at l;east partially closed or you would have an oil geyser and not a slow leak.

As for the political side of this post, please reference where anyone in the oil and gas industry has said it's the governments fault for not having stricter regulations. Everything was done by the book, both governmental and Coast Guard. There are more inspections on off shore drilling rigs and procedures than you can ever imagine.

 

[Handley_Page]

I'd be very interested to know how they got a 450 ton monster BOP onto the seabed 1500 feet down, and how is it held in place.
Does the oil emerge hot ?

Saw this:-

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/columnists/2010/05/03/bp-boss-blames-blow-out-preventer-for-oil-spill-91466-26364577/

 

[xssve]

Tee Fitting????

You have no idea what you are talking about do you. This is a drilling operation. Just how the fuck do you drill with a tee fitting in the damned way. Drill pipe with a bit on the end has to go down that riser all the way to the bottom of the hole. Then that drill pipe must be able to spun or at least turn if you are using a mud motor. You can't do that through a fucking Tee.

That's probably why they install them sideways.

 

[xssve]

What you need is an umbrella - stick it in the hole and open it.

 

[3113]

What you need is an umbrella - stick it in the hole and open it.

So were back to JBJ's finger?

 

[3113]

The Latest

Lest we all dig ourselves deeper with ill-informed speculation (TxRad's hands-on expertise excluded)....

Facing an unprecedented Gulf Coast environmental disaster, not to mention lawsuits, oil giant BP told NBC on Monday that while it was taking responsibility for cleaning up the giant undersea leak, the accident that triggered the disaster was not its fault. "It wasn't our accident, but we are absolutely responsible for the oil, for cleaning it up, and that's what we intend to do," BP Group CEO Tony Hayward told NBC's "TODAY" show.

The rig that exploded on April 20 and then sank was run by another company, Transocean, he reminded viewers. That rig, he said, "was run by their people, their processes." Hayward added that the failure of the rig's "blow-out preventer" — a device that should have shut off the well when the rig exploded and sank — was "unprecedented in our industry."

"What has failed here is the ultimate safety device on a drilling rig," he said. "There are many barriers of protection that you have to go to before you get to this. It isn't designed to not fail." Guy Cantwell, a Transocean spokesman, responded by reading a statement without elaborating. "We will await all the facts before drawing conclusions and we will not speculate," he said.

BP was trying to cap the smallest of three leaks with underwater robotic vehicles in the hope it will make it easier to place a single oil-siphoning container over the wreck. One of the robots cut the damaged end off a pipe at the smallest leak Sunday and officials were hoping to cap it with a sleeve and valve...The first container, or dome, is seven to eight days from being "in the field," Hayward said. That is just a temporary fix until a relief well can be drilled to plug the leaks, and that could take two to three months, Hayward said.

FUCK!
Full story here.

 

[trysail]

Potential relief well and schematic of current seafloor operations including BOP:

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4041/4558745875_fa4f8d88b4_o.jpg

The MMS rules for BOP testing for the last 20years require that he blind rams be tested, this is done with a BOP test plug, it's a solid chunk of tool steel with a couple of 'o'-rings on the outside, it's the same OD as the casing hanger pocket in the wellhead, this plug has tool joints top & bottom, normally a couple of stands of heavyweight drill pipe are attached to the bottom, and the top joint is made up loose with very little torque, this plug is run in and seated, then the running string is backed off and pulled above the BOPs the blinds closed and then tested to the required pressure through the choke or kill lines, usually both so they are tested at the same time. The shear rams are usually just stroked at this time as well, there are electronic surface indicators to show that the rams closed and opened, some are even more high tech and show the actual ram positions on a graphic display. since all reports I have seen are that this is a 20,000psi stack ,the tests pressures would be 15,500psi for 15 minutes each, this is an all day affair, as there are at least 30 tests, which includes the choke manifold and all of the subsea choke and kill line valves. In my 25 years offshore I have witnessed many hundreds of them.

From the info I have been able to gather, the 9-5/8 was already done several weeks before this happened, they had run and cemented a 7" liner the day before the incident, and the general consensus they had run a retrievable bridge plug into it, and and were preparing the wellhead and riser for running a cap, and were circulating the riser to seawater, as I previously stated in all likelihood the bridge plug did not set properly and the well pressure increasing because of the lose of 5,000ft of drilling mud hydrostatic being replaced by seawater forced it out of the liner and into the 9-5/8, or the liner hanger packer failed, either case would have the same results. The well came in and flowed oil to the surface, and if they were tripping the pipe or some other operation where the kelly was disconnected from the pipe even if the pipe rams and annulars had closed there would have been unrestricted flow to the surface through the open ended drill pipe.

The 80kpsi you are thinking of is the ASME connector flange designation. Normally the bottom joint (joint #1) of the riser is extra heavy wall 18-5/8" ID x 22" OD it is extra heavy here to withstand the forces of motion in the riser string, also since it attached directly to the LMRP ball joint it must also be thicker to withstand abrasion from the drill pipe, because as the riser bends back and forth at the ball joint the drill pipe is no longer centered in the hole, and may rub the inside of the riser, this can cause a key seat in the riser wall or eventually wear completely through it. however the rest of the riser string would be 18-5/8" ID x 21" OD, this gives a 1-1/8" wall.
A Marine drilling riser of this type VETCO HMF type H is rated at 3 million lbs pull, which is the preeminent factor in marine riser design, these tubes are not seamless pipe they are longitudinally welded, the riser on the Horizon is in 90ft sections, and has flotation collars of varying densities placed along the length of it to minimize the load both on the BOP stack and the pressure required on the tensioners which are only rated to 800kips, and to counteract bending dynamics. The Horizons riser weighed in the neighborhood of 4 million lbs without flotation

Riser pressure ratings are easily figured using ASME welded pressure vessel calculations. I stand corrected on my previous pressure, it was based on the pressure rating of the slip joint. The rating for this riser is 1468psi internal and 770psi collapse, still below what is needed to stop the well flow at 3,000psi.

 

[al_Ussa]

So were back to JBJ's finger?

Nobody wants that... nobody...

I think the easiest solution is to permaban Haliburton and Dick Cheney

 

[soflabbwlvr]

mult-thread solution

The omnibus solution to several lingering threads:

Draft everyone who ever chanted "Drill, baby, drill" -all the tea-baggers, Republicans, Sarah the Moose, Charlie Crist- put them on a boat and exile them to the Gulf. Issue them each a diving suit and a roll of paper towel, and do not let them back onto the mainland until the well is capped and the mess is cleaned up. If any of them washes ashore prematurely, round them up, put them on a truck, and send them to Mexico.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

The effing birds the Usual Suspects worship are the least of our worries. Just read that the mess is predicted to cost 100s of billions to clean up, and will take 10 years. Get ready for Great Recession II.

Prediction: Limey Oil Company will sell-out to Chavez, and Chavez will go on teevee and give Obama the finger. Doncha sometimes wish we had let Hitler have Limey Land.

 

[3113]

More News! (better news!)

BP has significantly cut the flow of oil leaking from its damaged Deepwater Horizon rig on the Gulf of Mexico sea floor, a company spokesman said this morning....the company successfully shut a set of hydraulic shears known as annular rams, helping to clamp the ruptured pipe and block the leaking oil.

...the company was still trying to activate a set of shear rams that are designed to seal the well by shearing off the drill pipe. The job is complicated, he said, because it is occurring at depths of more than 5,000 feet....BP chief executive Tony Hayward said earlier this morning that chemical dispersants being injected into the oil flow near the spill source have worked to some degree to keep oil from flowing to the surface, though he did not elaborate.

...Officials also said as BP is preparing a system never tried nearly a mile under water to siphon away the geyser of crude from a blown-out well a mile under Gulf of Mexico waters. BP officials said they hope the system could collect as much as 85 percent of oil rising from the seafloor. The plan to lower 74-ton, concrete-and-metal boxes being built to capture the oil and siphon it to a barge waiting at the surface will need at least another six to eight days to get it in place, with weather also a factor.

Here's hoping.

 

[TxRad]

The effing birds the Usual Suspects worship are the least of our worries. Just read that the mess is predicted to cost 100s of billions to clean up, and will take 10 years. Get ready for Great Recession II.

Prediction: Limey Oil Company will sell-out to Chavez, and Chavez will go on teevee and give Obama the finger. Doncha sometimes wish we had let Hitler have Limey Land.

Sorry to burst your little pea brain rant but BP is the owner of the mineral rights and any oil found.. TransOcean, an American firm that was based in New Orleans was the drilling contractor. The drilling contractor is the one who was in charge of drilling the well. BP probably had consultants of their own there but TransOcean was in charge, so the blow out is on their heads not BP.

Maybe you need to read more and shot off your mouth less.

 

[michchick98]

The effing birds the Usual Suspects worship are the least of our worries. Just read that the mess is predicted to cost 100s of billions to clean up, and will take 10 years. Get ready for Great Recession II.

In case you hadn't noticed, Jimmy, I was being sarcastic about the birds. I was taunting you in the hopes you'd literally explode.

Guess I'll have to live with the disappointment.

 

[TxRad]

Quote:
BP has significantly cut the flow of oil leaking from its damaged Deepwater Horizon rig on the Gulf of Mexico sea floor, a company spokesman said this morning....the company successfully shut a set of hydraulic shears known as annular rams, helping to clamp the ruptured pipe and block the leaking oil.

...the company was still trying to activate a set of shear rams that are designed to seal the well by shearing off the drill pipe. The job is complicated, he said, because it is occurring at depths of more than 5,000 feet....

__________________________________________________________________________________________

Blind rams are thick steel plates, one above the other that are hydraulically closed across the bore of the BOPs.

Shear rams are like jaws, with one plate curved and one circular. They do just what their name implies, they cut the drill pipe off and seal across the well bore.

Both are working against well pressure and water pressure. Well pressure is probably in the neighborhood of 3 to 6 thousand PSI. The accumulators and hydraulic pump systems must be charged up and then actuated. Not an easy task in 5000 feet of water is an understatement.

 

[trysail]

BP has significantly cut the flow of oil leaking from its damaged Deepwater Horizon rig on the Gulf of Mexico sea floor, a company spokesman said this morning....the company successfully shut a set of hydraulic shears known as annular rams, helping to clamp the ruptured pipe and block the leaking oil...

Here's hoping.

Who reported that?

If it's a reliable source and accurate, that would be very welcome news.

ETA: Be wary of unsubstantiated rumors- just sayin', that's all.

 

[3113]

Be wary of unsubstantiated rumors- just sayin', that's all.

In this case, quite right:

Spokesman David Nicholas said the rate was unchanged in response to an inquiry about another BP official, Jeff Childs, saying in an interview with an Alabama television station that the flow rate had been "significantly" cut.

"Our observations indicate no change at all, the flowrate is unchanged," Nicholas said. (Reporting by Kristen Hays and Joshua Schneyer; Editing by David Gregorio)

That's from here. But as you can see, Jeff Childs did, evidently, say that and he is a BP official (whatever that means). So the reporting was "right" (not a rumor) even if the info is wrong

 

[3113]

Fuck!

http://i.imgur.com/bzj89.jpg

 

[Dragonlipz]

The effing birds the Usual Suspects worship are the least of our worries. Just read that the mess is predicted to cost 100s of billions to clean up, and will take 10 years. Get ready for Great Recession II.

Prediction: Limey Oil Company will sell-out to Chavez, and Chavez will go on teevee and give Obama the finger. Doncha sometimes wish we had let Hitler have Limey Land.

Sometimes in life it is more effective to remain silent and thought to be a FOOL, rather than to offer one's insight and remove all doubt.......

 

[DeeZire]

Tee Fitting????

You have no idea what you are talking about do you. This is a drilling operation. Just how the fuck do you drill with a tee fitting in the damned way. Drill pipe with a bit on the end has to go down that riser all the way to the bottom of the hole. Then that drill pipe must be able to spun or at least turn if you are using a mud motor. You can't do that through a fucking Tee.

A low-tech fail safe? Would you like to elaborate on that? The BOPs themselves are about as low tech as it gets. A series of high pressure bladders and solid steel rams and shears operated by hydraulics and high pressure air.

State-of-the-art technology. The BOPs they are using on this rig are just like the ones on my rig except their are a hell of a lot bigger. The way they are closed operates exactly the same way except the accumulators to close theirs are on the sea bottom also. The only "High Tech" is the extras added for salt water and water pressure. They must be at l;east partially closed or you would have an oil geyser and not a slow leak.

You're right, I don't know what I'm talking about, but I do know the design of the BOP they're using failed. That's my point. There is speculation that the rams couldn't pinch off the pipe because part of the drill string is stuck inside. I was wondering what the BOP engineers had planned for exactly this scenario. Apparently, they had nothing planned.

My thought was if there was a T-fitting (sideways) then it could act like a relief valve, routing the uncontrolled oil flow into a new riser so the old riser that's leaking could be severed and plugged.

As for the political side of this post, please reference where anyone in the oil and gas industry has said it's the governments fault for not having stricter regulations. Everything was done by the book, both governmental and Coast Guard. There are more inspections on off shore drilling rigs and procedures than you can ever imagine.

Your own words illustrate what I was talking about: "Everything was done by the book...." This is the same logic Goldman Sachs is using, claiming they never broke the law when they fucked over everyone in the USA.

The Right Wing political pundits who are complaining about the government's role in the oil spill are focused on why Obama didn't jump on this crisis and fix it immediately - even though they're the same people who claim the government should stay out of private enterprise. WTF? They need to make up their minds. This repeating pattern of privatized gains and socialized losses is getting a little old.

I was talking to an associate who sells well-drilling equipment, and he said the word in the industry is that BP's BOP was not state of the art, it was 8 or ten years old, and that there are better BOP's available but BP didn't want to spring for a new one. That sounds about right to me. It's the Free Market way.

 

[al_Ussa]

I was talking to an associate who sells well-drilling equipment, and he said the word in the industry is that BP's BOP was not state of the art, it was 8 or ten years old, and that there are better BOP's available but BP didn't want to spring for a new one. That sounds about right to me. It's the Free Market way.

You are correct. BUT...

True free market capitalism also means you have to clean up your mess. If BP cut corners then they should absolutely be made to pay for the clean-up. Down to the last cent.

They won't of course because they have $$$ and that buys big lawyers and political connections. So instead you will either have to suffer with the effects or get further ass raped for gas money this summer. Or more likely both.