Honor Killing in Ontario, Canada.

Pure

Fiel a Verdad
Joined
Dec 20, 2001
Posts
15,135
a barbaric custom-- father and brother, aided by mother, kill daughter who's misbehaving, "bringing dishonor to the family."

[[ADDED QUESTIONS: Is this a peculiarly Muslim problem? Is this sort of thing necessarily a part of culture as we know it? Is this sort of practice have an evolutionary (positive, adaptive) aspect?]]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/parents-charged-with-murder/article1229624/

Daughter's lifestyle angered parents

Relatives of slaying victim say the Shafias disapproved of their eldest child's love interest



JILL COLVIN

With reports from The Canadian Press Last updated on Friday, Jul. 24, 2009 03:17AM EDT

Kingston police have charged the mother, father and brother of three young girls found dead with a caregiver in a car submerged in the Rideau Canal with first-degree murder.

The bodies of Zainab Shafia, 19, Sahari Shafia, 17, Geeti Shafia, 13, and Rona Amir Mohammad, 50, were discovered June 30 in a Nissan Sentra under water in the Kingston Mills locks.


At a press conference yesterday, police said they had charged Mohammad Shafia, the girls' father, Tooba Mohammad Yahya, the girls' mother, and, Hamed Mohammad-Shafia, 18, the girls' oldest brother with four counts each of first-degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder. Police also revealed that Ms. Mohammad, previously identified as a female relative, is believed to be Mr. Shafia's first wife.


While police would not confirm that the deaths had been an "honour killing," as has been suggested in reports by The Kingston Whig-Standard, they said that "the culture issue" may have played a role.


"Whether that was a part of a motive within the family based on one of the girl's or all of the girls' behaviours," police said, is "open to speculation."
They also said that, while the girls were Canadian teenagers, the family may have held different values, and "different sets of views."


Inspector Brian Begbie, of the Kingston Police Criminal Investigation Unit, said the 2004 black Nissan Sentra was discovered under water on June 30 at 9:30 a.m.

Three hours later, Mr. Shafia visited a Kingston police station with his wife and son to report that his three daughters, cousin and car had disappeared.

Mr. Shafia told police that his daughters had a history of taking the car without permission, but police confirmed that the family had been travelling together that day from Niagara Falls in two vehicles, the Nissan and a Lexus SUV. The family was last seen at a Kingston motel in the early hours of June 30.


"Investigators have been successful in linking the Lexus SUV and the three accused persons to the locks," Insp. Begbie said.


Police did not release the cause of the girls' death, but said repeatedly that the 13-man team assigned to the case faced "unique and unbelievable challenges" in conducting the investigation.
The family, originally from Kabul, Afghanistan, spent 15 years in Dubai before moving to Montreal two years ago.


In the immediate aftermath of the drowning, the surviving Shafias had grieved their loss openly and shared family photographs with the reporters they allowed into their home.

Autopsy results have not been made public so far.
=====

Daughter's lifestyle angered parents


Ingrid Peritz

Montreal — Last updated on Friday, Jul. 24, 2009 10:52PM EDT

One of the teenage girls allegedly killed by members of her Afghan-born family in Kingston, Ont., had been dating a Pakistani boy in Montreal against her parents' wishes, according to a man and woman who say they are siblings of one of the victims.

Zainab Shafia had gone out several times with the boy and even left the family home once, and was roughed up by her younger brother as a result, according to the relatives, Diba Masoomi and Wali Abdali, who live in France.

The bodies of 19-year-old Zainab Shafia and her sisters, aged 17 and 13, were found in a submerged car in a lock near Kingston last month. Rona Mohammad – the sister of Ms. Masoomi and Mr. Abdali – was also killed.

The girls' parents and 18-year-old brother Hamed Mohammad-Shafia are charged with first-degree murder and conspiracy to commit murder.

“She [Zainab] had fallen in love, like all teenagers at a certain point,” Mr. Abdali told CTV News. “The parents didn't like that she should marry a Pakistani boy without money or wealth. They didn't want it to be seen by society, or by other Afghans.”

Rona, 50, confided to her two siblings that she overheard Mr. Shafia saying he would kill his eldest daughter over her behaviour and the relationship.
 
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Ah, Ragheads.

And what were you expecting?

When Carebears adopt feral cats and bring them into their homes, the cats destroy the house and piss all over everything.
 
This is 2009, isn't it?
I mean what a atiquated way of thinking and doing things.
Put the whole family in prison for life.
 
8 year old Arizona girl is gang-raped -- then disowned by "shamed" parents.
The crime allegedly committed by the boys was horrible -- but the parents' behavior was even worse. The damage they have done to their daughter is incalculable. But there's no law against dumping your children, apparently.

http://www.azcentral.com/community/phoenix/articles/200...



Phoenix police on Wednesday announced that they arrested four neighborhood boys in connection with the incident, in which investigators said the group lured the girl into the shed with chewing gum, held her down and sexually assaulted her.




The girl and the four suspects are refugees from the war-torn West African country of Liberia, which, according to investigators, would complicate authenticating names and dates of birth.

Arizona Child Protective Services took custody of the girl after the July 16 incident at the apartment complex after her parents disowned her.

Hill said the parents blamed her for being victimized and bringing shame to the family
 
The wonderful, peaceful religion of Islam. :rolleyes:

These are the people wanting the whole world living by their rules. :rolleyes:
 
The wonderful, peaceful religion of Islam. :rolleyes:

These are the people wanting the whole world living by their rules. :rolleyes:

I suspect LIAR is hot for it. The Ragheads prob'ly think we're not worth wasting religion on. But LIAR rolls his eyes, licks his lips, and rubs his belly.
 
The wonderful, peaceful religion of Islam. :rolleyes:

These are the people wanting the whole world living by their rules. :rolleyes:

So Zeb, you can generalize about all Muslms because of the actions of one family?

But if, heaven forfend, someone generalizes about all 'conservatives' because of say, Timothy McVeigh, that's unfair?
 
Yes, I think you can. I think youre on safe ground keeping a pistol pointed at them.
 
There seems to be a complete misunderstanding about how much Middle Eastern behavior is Islamic and how much is Neolithic tribalism.
 
hey guys,

comments, and note re voluptuary's post

the point wasn't to bash muslims. too easy these days.

christian honor killing is not unknown.

http://www.copts.com/english1/index...n-honour-killing-get-same-justice-as-muslims/

turn of century, in Detroit:
http://www.powells.com/biblio/9780312334635?&PID=32568

author tintori, tells the story of the murder of her aunt, in the turn of the century Sicilian community of Detroit.
Unto the Daughters: The Legacy of an Honor Killing in a Sicilian-American Family by Karen Tintori


historically (17th century)
http://www.mercatornet.com/articles/view/the_untimely_death_of_francesca_pompilia

in a christian community, of course, it's more common to find killing the "unfaithful" (disrespectful) wife; i use the quotes, because this isn't limited to adultery, but includes a) asking for a divorce, b) "dating" another man after separation, etc.

http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/notorious_murders/family/woodchipper_murder/14.html

the killing of the adulterous wife was legal in several Western countries (Italy), as a legal exception to the law against murder,.

PS. Voluptuary, above, has made a good point. "Honor killings" are found among the Christian Kurds, for example. Outside the middle east, in India (sikh, hindu).
 
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No. I think we have our finger on the right pulse. Its the religion, stupid.
 
Actualy, it's not. It's backwardism. Comparable atrocitites happens to a similar degree among for instance Turkish kurds, Christian Assyrians, tribal Mongolians and certain rural Chinese cultures. People that can be described as moderately religious and sometimes even secular.

(pure mentioned hindi and sihk too, but they often have religion as a more solid centerpiece of their culture.)
 
note

jbjNo. I think we have our finger on the right pulse. Its the religion, stupid.

james, islam begins in the 6th century, no? honor killing long predates. so it's the PEOPLE.

further the persistence in areas NOT controlled by Islam, e.g. Kurdish, attests to a tribal and ethnic phenomenon.

--
PS. Liar makes a similar point, above. Thanks, Liar.
 
Hey! Jimmy Bob's got a good hate on happening here.

Don't interrupt his fun with facts. :D
 
So Zeb, you can generalize about all Muslms because of the actions of one family?

But if, heaven forfend, someone generalizes about all 'conservatives' because of say, Timothy McVeigh, that's unfair?

The saying is...

Not all Muslims are Terrorists is true, but MOST Terrorists are Muslims.

So you figure it out.
 
The saying is...

Not all Muslims are Terrorists is true, but MOST Terrorists are Muslims.

So you figure it out.

Then there are Christians who kill their children by "exorcising" them to death.

And then there's Timothy McVeigh and people who bomb abortion clinics.

I think crazy, narcissistic and cruel comes in all flavors and colors, creeds and countries.

My sympathies to those poor slaughtered children.
 
There seems to be a complete misunderstanding about how much Middle Eastern behavior is Islamic and how much is Neolithic tribalism.

It doesn't appear that the Muslim religion had anything to do with the killings. The girl was apparently killed because she dated a po' boy, who wasn't acceptable to the family. Judging strickly by the names, it's probable that all involved were Muslims. There's no mention of any hanky-panky. Also, the girl's sisters and the father's ex-wife were also murdered at the same time.

The question that I have is, 'Why are the taxpayers supposed to house and feed the murderers if and when they're found guilty?'
 
The saying is...

Not all Muslims are Terrorists is true, but MOST Terrorists are Muslims.

So you figure it out.
It's like the ol' feminazi chant.

Not all men are rapists, but most rapists are men.

So you figure it out.
 
I am going to say it. A certain posters racist post were reported. I for one won't sit by and watch as it happens. Sure, I could ignore it, but if everyone ignores it, it can continue. I personally want it stopped.:mad:

Edit to add:

The only part of the posts that was reported, was the racist comment. The opinion, minus the racial slur, I wouldn't care about staying. I just don't like seeing racial slurs be allowed, and apparently condoned by so many. For those who don't get it, 'raghead' is a racial slur against those of Middle Eastern Decent, often used against those of the Islamic Faith and Muslims. I won't tolerate it. I will report those slurs in a heart beat when I find them.
 
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On topic.

This is sad.

It isn't because they are Islamic or Muslim or Afghanistan's or any other thing. It's because they wanted to do what they wanted to do. They wanted to hurt the girls, to kill them and did so. Yes, it's been done in the "name of God" and other deities also, but none of them is right. I feel sad for the girls and the first wife who died. It should not have happened.

*shakes head at some of the blatant racist remarks and Islamaphobia (For lack of knowing the proper term for it)*
 
There was a similar "Honour Killing" case in UK lately. Mum (70) got 20 years.
They poured acid into his eye and down his throat.

Plain and vicious stupidity and a non-caring attitude to the country where they live (I say chuck 'em out, but. . . )
 
There were no doubt apologists for the Spanish Inquisitions and Catholicism in general.

There were apologists for the Communists following the revolution in Russia in 1917. when they 'eliminated' the royalty, the rich, the artists, the Jews.

There were apologists for the horrible antics of the Germans/Nazi's and even those who, to this day, dismiss the holocaust and slave labor camps.

There are even to this day apologists for the Catholic Priests and Nuns who molested children by the thousands and have for thousands of years and continue to do so.

So now we have our apologists for Islam; it seems there are those who will talk away any inhumanity in the name of faith and belief.

Sad Angel, I am truly disappointed in your 'reporting' what is advertised as free speech on this forum...should it ever be lost, taken away, abolished; know that you are one of those who brought it about.

Go for it, JBJ, you already know you have a right to express your opinion, most of these twits don't even get the concept, let alone the relationship between censorship and slavery.

Amicus
 
AMICUS

I did my time in the liberal barrel.

In 1971 some darkie dope fiends broke in my apartment and stole virtually everything I owned, including the sheets off my bed. I come home and the front door had been removed.

And being a compassionate, empathetic liberal I thought GEE, THESE POOR PEOPLE ARE PROB'LY HUNGRY OR NEED SHELTER OR THE KIDS ARE SICK. GOSH DARN.

I was so pathetic my liberal friends were shaking me, saying ARE YOU FUCKING NUTS, JOHNSON?

But with age I learned that stereotypes are mostly right. The average Jew makes tons more money than the average evangelical Christian. If you encounter a lion on the street the mother fucker will likely eat your ass. I mean, you can lick your pencil and do a Baye's Probability Analysis for the lion threat, so you dont seem judgmental. But you likely wont finish it.
 
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