Ok, I'm not American but...

[VelvetDarkness]

I have heard loads of reports saying that Barack Obama wouldn't have got half as far as he has were it not for Dennis Haysbert's black president character in cult series 24 paving the way. To what extent do the US citizens here think this is true? Would it be time for a black president if Haysbert hadn't cut such a compelling figure?

 

[Breaker_Morant]

I have heard loads of reports saying that Barack Obama wouldn't have got half as far as he has were it not for Dennis Haysbert's black president character in cult series 24 paving the way. To what extent do the US citizens here think this is true? Would it be time for a black president if Haysbert hadn't cut such a compelling figure?

I never watched 24 so I couldn't comment on that. Yes, I think it is time. If Colin Powell was running I would vote for him. I think most of the generations younger than the Baby Boomers (and a good deal of the Baby Boomers) are getting over their sterotypical judgments. I am seeing alot of integrated couple (whether romantic or plantonic).

I do like Dennis Haysbert as an actor, though.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

I do like Obama as a candidate but I don't know a great deal about American politics, I just follow what makes it to the news shows over here. Also, I find the Clintons generally quite insipid and arrogant but then, I can never be sure how biased the reports I have seen are.

 

[culloden]

I don't think 24 has a bearing at all. In truth, except for some redneck enclaves here and there, I don't think most white Americans are particularly racist anymore. It's certainly way better than when I was a kid thirty and forty years ago. I remember my father, his buddies, our neighbors, all being horribly racist as a matter of course. I almost never hear that today.

If I liked Obama's politics, his race would not be a factor in how I'd vote. As far as that goes, I don't like his politics, but his race matters not at all. I'd certainly vote for Condy Rice, Colin Powell, or Walter Williams.

On the other hand, I live in New England, which is historically one of the least racist parts of the US.

 

[wouldloveto]

I don't think a TV program had anything to do with it. If Geena Davis' show was successful I don't think Hillary would have been.

We Americans are not that stupid, although that is a hard point to argue given that Bush got elected twice.

 

[Breaker_Morant]

I don't think 24 has a bearing at all. In truth, except for some redneck enclaves here and there, I don't think most white Americans are particularly racist

I'm glad you qualified that.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

I don't think a TV program had anything to do with it. If Geena Davis' show was successful I don't think Hillary would have been.

We Americans are not that stupid, although that is a hard point to argue given that Bush got elected twice.

Um... pardon my ignorance but Wiki says that Geena is an actress, which leaves me confused. Would you mind elaborating?

 

[VelvetDarkness]

I don't think 24 has a bearing at all. In truth, except for some redneck enclaves here and there, I don't think most white Americans are particularly racist anymore.

To clarify, I wasn't suggesting that most Americans are racist or redneck or whatever. I was just curious about reports that Haysbert's character had unwittingly shaped American politics.

 

[Breaker_Morant]

Um... pardon my ignorance but Wiki says that Geena is an actress, which leaves me confused. Would you mind elaborating?

There was a show (Commander in Chief), short lived, where Geena Davis played a female president. I think she started out as the VP in the show but for some reason or another, she "inherited" the Oval Office.

 

[Netzach]

Maybe the N word has fallen out of favor but our institutions remain racist, our glass ceilings remain thick and anomalies like Obama's nomination doesn't mean everyone's work is over.

I think TV tends to be more of the product of the culture than the maker of the culture, though it is a tight feedback loop sometimes.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

Maybe the N word has fallen out of favor but our institutions remain racist, our glass ceilings remain thick and anomalies like Obama's nomination doesn't mean everyone's work is over.

I think TV tends to be more of the product of the culture than the maker of the culture, though it is a tight feedback loop sometimes.

I do think it's interesting that the black, rap, gangsta subculture has reclaimed the N word. I still don't understand why they apply it to themselves.

 

[Breaker_Morant]

To clarify, I wasn't suggesting that most Americans are racist or redneck or whatever. I was just curious about reports that Haysbert's character had unwittingly shaped American politics.

I'm not insulted by claiming the mantle of redneck.. I don't really qualify but then again I know the etemology of the term too.

 

[Netzach]

I do think it's interesting that the black, rap, gangsta subculture has reclaimed the N word. I still don't understand why they apply it to themselves.

That's a few books and papers worth of investigation, but I mean among whites and with an R.

 

[culloden]

To clarify, I wasn't suggesting that most Americans are racist or redneck or whatever. I was just curious about reports that Haysbert's character had unwittingly shaped American politics.

No worries. I may have read more subtext into your comment than was there. My sense, based on my extensive time in Europe (9 days in 1979), is that we're perceived as not having progressed since the Jim Crow days. We aren't perfect and never will be, but we're pretty good.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

That's a few books and papers worth of investigation, but I mean among whites and with an R.

Ok, I'm still confused. Please do pardon my ignorance. I'm on a factfinding mission, I don't pretend to know a great deal about anything happening across the pond.

 

[Breaker_Morant]

Ok, I'm still confused. Please do pardon my ignorance. I'm on a factfinding mission, I don't pretend to know a great deal about anything happening across the pond.

You think we know what goes on your side? Most of "us" would rather you ask verus assuming.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

I'm not insulted by claiming the mantle of redneck.. I don't really qualify but then again I know the etemology of the term too.

Oops. Again, it's not my intention to insult anybody, just to learn. In the UK media the term 'redneck' is used as a negative stereotype, usually portraying southern US citizens who are generally ignorant and intolerant.

 

[culloden]

I'm not insulted by claiming the mantle of redneck.. I don't really qualify but then again I know the etemology of the term too.

My father grew up a dirt farmer with a sunburned neck, so I know what you're talking about. I'm part of the first generation on his side of the family to have so much as finished high school.

Race is complicated. I detest racism, but my father was a strong racist. So, how do you love someone who does things you hate? Rodney King asked a profound question some years back. "Why can't we all just get along?"

 

[VelvetDarkness]

You think we know what goes on your side? Most of "us" would rather you ask verus assuming.

*breathes a sigh of relief*

That's cool, it's just that most political threads on Lit quickly become combative and I'm very aware that I don't really know what I'm talking about.

 

[culloden]

I'm not insulted by claiming the mantle of redneck.. I don't really qualify but then again I know the etemology of the term too.

BTW, great movie, Breaker Morant. Brian Brown at his best.

 

[VelvetDarkness]

My father grew up a dirt farmer with a sunburned neck, so I know what you're talking about. I'm part of the first generation on his side of the family to have so much as finished high school.

Race is complicated. I detest racism, but my father was a strong racist. So, how do you love someone who does things you hate? Rodney King asked a profound question some years back. "Why can't we all just get along?"

Clicky!

 

[catalina_francisco]

Ok, I'm still confused. Please do pardon my ignorance. I'm on a factfinding mission, I don't pretend to know a great deal about anything happening across the pond.

The adopted word is spelt different (nigga as opposed to nigger) and I tend to think is like gays adopted words like gay, poof, fairy etc., thus diffusing a lot of it's use as a derogatory term. Think Jonathon Ross and his 4 Poofs and A Piano band...once it would have been highly offensive, now most don't think twice about them using poof to describe their sexuality in a fun way.

Catalina

 

[VelvetDarkness]

The adopted word is spelt different (nigga as opposed to nigger) and I tend to think is like gays adopted words like gay, poof, fairy etc., thus diffusing a lot of it's use as a derogatory term. Think Jonathon Ross and his 4 Poofs and A Piano band...once it would have been highly offensive, now most don't think twice about them using poof to describe their sexuality in a fun way.

Catalina

That's very true. The N word is not really used in the UK now, even among rap artists. I find it interesting that one demographic group in the US has elected to reclaim and popularise the term and yet UK black people and musicians haven't. Regardless, it will never be acceptable for a white person to use the N word (with the possible exception of Eminem.) Not that they should want to, but it is an interesting observation for me.

 

[Breaker_Morant]

Oops. Again, it's not my intention to insult anybody, just to learn. In the UK media the term 'redneck' is used as a negative stereotype, usually portraying southern US citizens who are generally ignorant and intolerant.

lol.. and in most cases they'd be right. For me, its just a more laid back way of life - versus being uptight and living in the city.

Alot people make fun it themselves..

• http://www.redstateupdate.com/
• http://youtube.com/user/travisandjonathan
• http://www.jefffoxworthy.com/
• http://www.bluecollarcomedy.net/

 

[VelvetDarkness]

lol.. and in most cases they'd be right. For me, its just a more laid back way of life - versus being uptight and living in the city.

Alot people make fun it themselves..

• http://www.redstateupdate.com/
• http://youtube.com/user/travisandjonathan
• http://www.jefffoxworthy.com/
• http://www.bluecollarcomedy.net/

Fair enough, I enjoyed the links. I wasn't aware that there was a positive connotation to the term 'redneck.'

With the exception of this.