First story

[Gunslinger_zero]

I posted this a few weeks ago and I'm not quite satisfied with how it turned out. I'd like to see what You all think about it character wise, and how the story's pacing works. Also, I'm thinking of revising and expanding it. http://www.literotica.com:81/stories/showstory.php?id=341482&page=1

 

[mjl2010]

I posted this a few weeks ago and I'm not quite satisfied with how it turned out. I'd like to see what You all think about it character wise, and how the story's pacing works. Also, I'm thinking of revising and expanding it. http://www.literotica.com:81/stories/showstory.php?id=341482&page=2

First of all, you might want to fix your link so it points to the first page of the story, not the second.

OK. I think you have a decent story line. There are times the pacing gets slow. Parts of it read like a list. Doing this, then this, then this, then this.... I mean forever. Some of this stuff, we (the reader) just don't give a rats ass about. For example:

I walk around to the front room and then up the stairs. I go through the door to my room and pitch my bag to the floor before falling face first on my bed. I let loose a sigh of comfort rolling onto my back, the image of my girlfriend pops into my mind. I see her vividly, and I see the two of us together and what we could be doing later today. I get up off the bed and feel the cloth of my pants strain against my erection. Gee, that was fast.

I re-adjust and head back downstairs. Why do the work myself when I can have a beautiful woman to make it that much better later? Back in the kitchen, I open the fridge. First things first, I'm damn hungry. I pull out some of the deli meat, cheese, and a pickle and throw it all together on some bread to make a sandwich. As an after thought, I grab a bottle of root beer and sit down at the counter to eat.

With my sandwich finished, I grab my jacket and head back out the door to my truck. I climb in and start the engine. Luckily the cab hasn't cooled down all that much. I pull out of the driveway and onto the road again. A surge of excite flows through me leaving the landscapes a blur. I am going to see Amber again! Unconsciously my foot presses hard on the accelerator causing me to go about fifteen over the speed limit the entire trip.

You could have covered these three paragraphs in a few sentences.

"As soon as I got home, I listened to the messages on the answering machine and dumped my stuff upstairs. My thoughts once again turned to Amber and I wanted to hurry a little. Just thinking about her gave me another hard on. So after I made myself a sandwich, I jumped back in my truck and left for her place, not paying much attention to the speed limit on the way over."

Now, I'm just saying and pointing it out since you asked. Some other things you might consider. As two of your Public Comments point out, you need an editor. Get one.

This story is present tense. Learn to write in past tense.

This story is also from the First Person Point of View. Try to learn to write third person and then write most of your fiction from the third person point of view in past tense.

Why you ask? I'm glad you asked me that. Because in this story, the whole thing is from the guys point of view. So you lose fifty per cent of your readers right from the get go for one reason. Why would a woman want to read this story? What's in it for her? Why would a woman want to be in the guys shoes, which is where you put the reader.

Overall, I think your story idea is good. Yes, I think it needs redoing. Get an editor and go for past tense at least. If you really want to cut yourself a job, rewrite it in third person.

Keep writing.

MJL

 

[Singularity]

That, and also...

MJL's comments are all spot-on, gunslinger.

My suggestion is that one of the "list-y" things that should be reworked is your description of Amber. It is pretty much all packed into one introductory paragraph (paragraph 2).

Her name is Amber. She is absolutely amazing. Her eyes are the color of the Caribbean ocean with a streak of hazel to mix them up. Her hair is a wavy golden blonde with slight brown streaks to accent the color. She has a full, round face with a light complexion that always seems to sparkle when she smiles. Her body is well built. She isn't skinny, she's got curves. Just the kind of thing I like. A lot.

We don't need to get a full description of her right off the bat. It's kind of like having her introduced with one of those "Hello, My name is..." stick-on badges. Readers like to get to know characters via their dialog, and in how they interact with the others on your literary stage, instead of in a quick jolt. It's the same way in a stage play, or a movie.

How about letting us get to know her while Jimmy is thinking about her, while he is driving home and then over to her house. He could be fantasizing about what he wants to do with her, remembering how she felt, and smelled, and looked the last time he saw her, etc. That way, we'll learn more about her, and Jimmy; and in a better-paced introduction.

You also get to build more sexual tension that way, and to get into more of how Jimmy feels about her. Breaking up the 'tangential stuff' that MJL touched on, and interspersing it with his plans for her - which most certainly don't start with a cake - can help to set the stage for her scream-and-tackle greeting in the driveway.

Oh, and the repetition of the "Hun" endearment she uses when speaking to Jimmy gets old after a bit. The real Amber may talk like that, but I'd drop some of them from the dialog, or else change some of them to something else.

I hope this helps.

Sin.

 

[tickledkitty]

Ok, I started reading in the middle inadvertently, as well. You might want to fix that link. I'll tell you what I think about the few paragraphs I've read though.

First, I agree with MJL that you need an editor. You can write. It's just a little rough. Your dialogue is a bit odd. I know it's really hard to write sex noises, and sometimes it's better to just skip them. The "Nuuuugh!" for example. Those just kind of caught me wrong. Others might disagree, and that's fine. That alone would not have caused me to back click.

"Fuckin' I love you so much Amber." I Tell her. "I love your tight cunt, I love how slick and wet you are baby."

An editor can help you with stuff like this. Do you think it's a little better this way?

"I fuckin' love you so much, Amber," I tell her. "I love your tight cunt. I love how slick and wet you are, baby."

It's a little easier to read. There were some other places I saw some incomplete sentences and other minor punctuation problems. This is all stuff an editor can take care of for you.

I can feel my cum explode from the head of my penis. Pearl white semen blasting into my love, filling her with thick white sperm. I keep thrusting as I ejaculate into her. One, two, three, four, five, six, six squirts of cum. I can feel it move inside of her pussy, clinging to her vaginal walls, and to my cock. I slow down as the fireworks wean out, and I hold her close to me.

In this paragraph here, I felt like you were using visual description when you can't actually see what's happening. Again, this may just be a little picky point for me, but bear with me.

You start out saying you can feel the cum exploding. The next sentence you say "pearl white semen" and "thick white sperm". First, you'd have to actually see that to know the color and maybe the consistency too. I know we all know what color semen is and all that, but maybe that's a cue to you that maybe you don't need to say that? Also, I wouldn't use "pearl white semen" and "thick white sperm" in the same sentence. They pretty much mean the same thing, right? Then you go back to how it feels inside her pussy.

I'm not saying you can't use visual and nonvisual descriptions in the same paragraph. You can. They're all part of this person's experience. It just doesn't work here for me. I hope this makes sense.

"I... I love you Jimmy." Amber whispers. I nod in response.

"I love you too babe. You, you're the best." She sighs happily.

This dialogue would be a little better like this:

"I...I love you, Jimmy," Amber whispers.

I nod in response.

"I love you too, babe. You, you're the best."

She sighs happily.

The problems here are with punctuation, obviously. Also, where you say I nod in response and She sighs happily it looks like the other person is actually doing it because it's right there with their dialogue. I hope that makes sense to you too.

I agree with pretty much all of what's been said before, except what MJL said about writing in third person. I like first person, especially for erotica. It's more intimate, but it also requires a little skill to avoid the "shopping list" of "I did this, then she did that." Definitely go with past tense though. Present tense is waaaaayyyy too hard to pull off with any skill.

I hope this is helpful to you. I might read the rest and comment more later. Seriously, keep writing. I see a lot of potential there.

 

[sr71plt]

Whoa. It isn't "spot on" to tell writers they either have to or should write only in past tense, third person to have a workable story. That's rubbish. Stories don't work or not work because of the tense or viewpoint used--they work/don't work because of how well the given tense and viewpoint melded with other aspects of storywriting.

I agree with TK that, at least for erotica, the more intimate first person is easier to make work than third person is.

But writers would do best to write a particular story in whatever tense and viewpoint seems natural in the story (for them)--and just to learn to meld all of the elements of good writing well.

 

[tickledkitty]

Ok, I didn't mean that you HAVE to go with first person or third person or anything else I said, for that matter. What I meant was that I disagree with MJL that third person is best. I like third person, but I tend to favor first person for erotica. Also, you can write in present tense if you want to, but in my opinion, for the beginner writer, present tense is difficult.

I'll be more precise next time.

 

[sr71plt]

Ok, I didn't mean that you HAVE to go with first person or third person or anything else I said, for that matter. What I meant was that I disagree with MJL that third person is best. I like third person, but I tend to favor first person for erotica. Also, you can write in present tense if you want to, but in my opinion, for the beginner writer, present tense is difficult.

I'll be more precise next time.

I wasn't disagreeing with you at all, TK (and I didn't index my posting to yours)--in fact, I specifically agreed with a point you made.

On another issue here, that of spinning out a long list of irrelevant activities, I agree that this doesn't help a story. In the American education system (I didn't see this as much in the British-system schools my kids attended), students are encouraged to write "long." They are assigned themes to be "at least" a certain numbers of words. At some point it would be helpful if they also provided excercises of writing to a low maximum of words without losing anything essential in the essay/story. That's how the real world works. Longer is not necessarily better in effective writing. Far from it.

 

[tickledkitty]

I wasn't disagreeing with you at all, TK (and I didn't index my posting to yours)--in fact, I specifically agreed with a point you made.

In addition to being more precise with my feedback, apparently I need to read more carefully.

 

[mjl2010]

*Groan* Here we go again.

I did not say anyone HAD to write in third person past tense. I suggested it and for good reasons.

I myself have written in just about every form there is, save second person past tense, I think. I may have even done that at some point. But I've learned some things here. I've learned what people like to read and I've learned what "sells" on Lit. I've gotten feedback and had people tell me what they like and don't like.

Writing in first person, male pov, women tell me they feel disconnected from the story. They don't "fit" the role of the man telling the story. Yes, first person is very intimate. We get to be there in the narrators shoes, doing what he/she is doing. Making it even more intimate is doing it in present tense. You get to be there, as it happens, IF it is done right. How many here can do that? Not that many.

I empathize with the women here who've told me that they feel disconnected from a story written in First Person, Male POV because I've read stories written in First Person, Female POV and I agree. I'm disconnected from the story. I do not stand in the narrators shoes and enjoy a big cock thrusting into my pussy because I don't have one. I don't connect and I'm not put into the other characters shoes.

First person works best when the reader is able to be easily put into the narrators position when they are reading it. Especially for Erotica.

Enter third person, past tense writing. This is easily read by anyone. No one has to feel left out. Readers can empathize with the character that best fits them. Further, it is easy to learn to write this. You learn quickly and then when you do something in first person, you get it right easier.

I think, sr71plt, that as usual you are looking for things to nit pick at and build yourself up while knocking others down and showing everyone how great and smart you are. I gave solid advice and feedback while at the same time complimented the story line and idea.

You on the other hand, did nothing of the sort. You just criticized my feedback, criticized others who agreed with me and didn't bother reading the story or make any useful comments about it. Again. Just looking to pick a fight.

And now, you'll whine that I pointed all this out or go back and edit one of your posts to make it look like I'm wrong. Fine. Most of us know what you're like and try our best to ignore you.

I'll give you some sage advice sr71plt. Read this carefully instead of skimming and skipping as you usually do and maybe you won't look like a fool like you usually do.

Read Gunslingers story. Don't skim it, read it. Then come back here and give them feedback on their story. No one's asking you edit it for them. Just read it and tell them what you think of the story and TRY to do it without making yourself look like an ass.

MJL

 

[sr71plt]

Yes, I think you were advising to write in third person as opposed to first person, MJL. Yes, I think you were saying not to write in present tense or first person. And, yes, I think a new writer would take that as what you are saying.

No, I don't make these comments to nit pick. I make them when I think bum advice is leading the requestor down a wrong road--and, in most case in this forum, limiting them from taking perfectly legitimate directions because writers with not much, if any, more experience at writing than they have know just enough about the topic to be dangerous to themselves and others.

Actually, in terms of writing development--and coming before trying to post a story--a new writer of erotic will probably develop a feel for it better by writing up something in first person--as a scene/story happening to themselves personally. Whether past or present tense, no matter. Only then do I think they should look at writing it in the third person (and a good exercise is to write the same story in all of the voices and tenses--in separate versions--of course to see the differences the different techniques can bring out). And why first person before third person? Because one of the most frequent aspects of not-so-good fiction writing is in telling the action rather than showing it to the reader--and third person begs to be told and first person begs to show.

(And I don't think you have the edge on leg up on writing experence/success at Lit. to be bringing that up as making you an authority on what others should write.)

 

[tickledkitty]

MJL, I've never had anyone say they felt disconnected from one of my stories because it was written in first person. On the contrary, I think the men actually like getting inside a woman's head a bit. I think it's a turn on.

I've read a lot of stories written in first person by men, as well, and don't recall feeling that way because of them being written in first person. If I feel a disconnect, it's usually for other reasons. Maybe the action is too rough, too immature, too ambiguous? I'm not sure, and I'm not specifically pointing that finger at you either, since it's been a while since I read anything of yours.

I'm just saying I think first person can be done very effectively. I also think first person is a little easier. I just wrote one in third person, and it was hard to assimilate the different voices but still tell the story from one person's POV. That was just MY experience with it. I still like the story, and it was good for me to try it that way. I'm sure I'll do it again.

 

[sr71plt]

Original message deleted--not because it said anything nasty.

Opps. Made a "big" point here originally about a story told in first person which, upon recheck, was told in third person. So, will sit on my hands on this "big" point--at least until I think of a valid example of what I was posting.

Anyhow, I agree with TK above, and thought I had an example to give.

----

Eureka! I came up with an even better example. In this posting, I was offering up a specific story example to support TK's last posting. You can look at my "Time for Grace" in the Non-Erotic category. Written not only in first person, but also in present tense. Whether or not you want to quibble whether you think it's good that way or has sold well enough at Lit., take a look at the public comments, be aware that it got a great review from the reviewer of the Winter Holidays contest, that's it very hot and has a lot of votes and reads for only being up a month. Not noted to get readers but to counter claims of what sells and what doesn't on Lit. with a specific example.

Which evidences why I comment on threads like this. When feedback requestors are told there is one "best" way of doing anthing or told what sells at Lit. and what doesn't (especially by advisers who haven't "sold" much of anything here), I'll entertain the urge to tell the feedback requestor they are getting bum advice. A story isn't good or bad or sellable/unsellable here on the basis of voice or tense--all variations of these are legitimately being used in stories that are good and/or that "sell" here. They are good or bad on the basis of a complex package of how everything fits together--for that specific story.

 

[mjl2010]

*sigh*

I am certainly not the foremost authority on anything to do with writing. I give my opinions and people can take them for what they are worth.

TK, no offense, but I am one of those who feel disconnected from the story when it's first person and from a woman's point of view. I got feedback on my story series "Wife Christina" and "Honeymoon Cabin" that told me the same. I just pointed it out. "Wife Christina" might have stilted dialog, but that and the series are not done that badly. Yet, I still got the feedback. Some anonymous, some not. Some right here in the forum, if I recall correctly.

SR, I stand by my assertation that if you're going to post on a feedback thread by a writer asking for feedback, say something useful about the story presented. Disagree if you like with someone else, but do it nicely. Don't just hack away at their opinions, preferences or what they have learned, not bothering with the story itself. You still haven't bothered to comment to Gunslinger on their story. Why is that?

~~~

I got a lot of help here when I first came here. I try to give some of that back and in the vein of what I have learned as well. If I was that bad or my advice that bad, I'd be hearing how I should shut up.

I'm done and out now, this has gone too far in this thread.

Gunslinger, I'm sorry all this turned up in your request for feedback. Not the first time I'm sorry to say. Won't be the last I'm sure.

If you want any help, first person or otherwise, feel free to PM if you think my stories make me a worthwhile helper. Um, don't judge that on "For my husbands Pleasure" Please. I was kinda sorry I wrote that and not my best effort by any means.



MJL

 

[sr71plt]

*SR, I stand by my assertation that if you're going to post on a feedback thread by a writer asking for feedback, say something useful about the story presented. Disagree if you like with someone else, but do it nicely. Don't just hack away at their opinions, preferences or what they have learned, not bothering with the story itself. You still haven't bothered to comment to Gunslinger on their story. Why is that?

My comment was straight to what I thought was "not good" advice you were giving in your general comments on one particular point. In that, I think I am being helpful to Gunslinger (giving Gunslinger choices on how Gunslinger wants to write). My comments were not to Gunslinger's story. I did, by the way later backup one of your other comments to Gunslinger.

It's ridiculous to suggest I have to do a full review of someone's story just to say your general comments about what voice and tense they should write and that sell at Lit. are off base.

When someone else makes that comment to a new writer seeking feedback, I'll do exactly the same thing. It's bad writing advice and will harm their writing development if they feel they are limited by that advice.

First do no harm. Bad advice is worse than no advice.

 

[starrkers]

Perhaps, folks, it would be better to keep the general first person/third person bickering to a general thread, rather than someone's specific feedback thread.
There is nothing wrong with offering opposing feedback. Let the author make up his own mind and leave the in house fights to other places.

 

[Jet Black]

This is really weird, but you have the exact same problem I had when I started writing. It's kinda a hard distinction to make (and forgive me all for not reading your responses as I wanted this to be fresh) but the whole story seems to have a... A bland quality. Example:

I hold onto her hips as I keep thrusting myself inside her.

I hold onto her hips as I keep thrusting inside her.

It reads as if you're listing off you're every action, and while it's quite immersive, it's also quite boring. I walk into the frontroom. I go through the door. I go this and do that. Then this happens. Followed by this.

I used to do the same damn thing! XD It's weird, but luckily it's a problem I've dealt with. You just need to focus on what's important to the story, you can graze over some things. And if you're trying to immerse us into the story, their are ways to be creative about it. For instance.


Story: A guy comes home and he's angry.

"I pull into the driveway of my house. My mind races as I think about what happens. I turn the key off, take it out and attach it to my belt, opening the door. I shut the door behind me angrily and walk up the sidewalk to my frontdoor, and enter."

To

"I let out a loud sigh as my truck pulls to a stop infront of my garage. The heavy door slams behind me as I make my way to the house, my feet crunching from the freshly fallen leaves. This beautiful weather sickens me. I tear open the screen door, letting it clatter loudly against the siding as I step inside."


Ok, that's probably the worst example I could have probably created, but my point remains valid. Just because you're writing a first person story, and just because it's present tense, doesn't mean it has to be uninteresting, as you've clearly proven (once the action starts to pick up). But even throughout the rather hot parts, there is still the same... I do this.. I do that.

Oh! Here's a tip!

"I love you too babe. You, you're the best." She sighs happily.

Why does she sigh happily? Well she's sighing happily because she just had an amazing orgasm. Oh? Then why do you have to explain she's happy? Didn't your writing already do that for you?

You don't need to tell the readers what they already know, they KNOW she's happy. How about "She sighs, a smile on her face." or "A soft, contended sigh escapes her lips."


Ok, now that I got that outa the way. It seems you've picked like, one of the hardest ways to write xD. Present tense? First person? That's HARD man! Not only are you restricted in what you can say, ie: "She thought that felt great" as opposed to "The look on her face told me she thought that felt great." First person, you have to control your every sentence, every observation. It's, difficult.

And then having it all happen in real time. You're almost forced to describe everything that happens, second by second. I think that's where the problem is stemming from, it might have been where mine was stemming from... were my stories back then first person? *ponders*

Eh, sorry. I would suggest, try writing the story as if you were recalling it from memory, or sitting with a group of your friends, telling them in every detail what happened. That's past-tense, and it's a lot easier to write, in my honest opinion.



Ok! Well, enough ranting outa me. If you make it a little less... tedious (perhaps switching to past-tense to make it easier? <.<) You've got a damned hot story here. Just get an editor for those little grammar and punctuation issues, and I'll want to come back for more ^.^


~Jet

 

[sr71plt]

Perhaps, folks, it would be better to keep the general first person/third person bickering to a general thread, rather than someone's specific feedback thread.
There is nothing wrong with offering opposing feedback. Let the author make up his own mind and leave the in house fights to other places.

Separation isn't not going to work very well when half-baked general "universal" or "best" practice advice is stuck in with specific opinion comment. Perhaps that's what should be omitted in the first place.

 

[MarshAlien]

You have written a decent sex scene, although it is not yet what I would really think of as a story. There is no tension, and certainly no resolution.

I agree with the other comments about the story's pacing; you need to avoid the list of actions and concentrate on those actions that are important to your story. I didn't need to know, for example, how fast Jimmy was driving each time he got into the car. I would have preferred to learn about Amber as the story went along and Jimmy visited her. And I would have liked to learn more as well. Why is Amber home? Why the reference to a "lecture hall" if she's not in college with him?

The biggest problem for me was - why are they stopping to make cake? Obviously the cake means something, since they both blurt out "chocolate cake" at the same time. But what is it? Why is it so important that she wants, and he agrees, to postpone sex in order to make it? You have a chance here to offer us some insight into the characters - insight that your title implies we're going to receive. And that insight, I think, would help give you an avenue to "do something" with your characers other than just allow them to have sex - to grow, to learn, to become, whatever you want.

As for the first person, it didn't bother me at all. You need to go with what is most comfortable for you at this point. All of the stories I've posted are written in first person because that is easiest for me. I'm trying to teach myself to write in third person, but it's difficult. It's obviously a lot easier for other people, but not for me. I haven't had anyone tell me tha they feel disconnected from any of them. If you really try to become good at storytelling, I'm not sure it matters to people how you're telling it. They will get caught up in it unless you kick them back out. In addition, all but one of the stories are in past tense. Again, I'm trying to learn to write present tense because I like the intimacy of it. But that is harder for me.

I think you've gotten some good feedback here. Take it and run with it. Expand this into a real story and try to make it flow a little better, and you'll probably be much more satisfied.