Writing for the approbation of other authors

[EmilyMiller]

It's always nice to get a thumbs up from a fellow writer. Acceptance and appreciation from one's peers is something everyone strives for.

You’d think, right? But opinions vary it seems.

 

[Belegon]

I saw a comment elsewhere that some writers (me included) put greater weight on feedback from other authors than general readers. Contrawise some other writers say they care more about what their readers think than other writers.

I wondered about your motivations. For me, I’m much happier if a writer I respect pays me a compliment, than if it is a non-writer, or a writer whose work I am unfamiliar with does the same.

Does that mean I’m writing for other writers? How about you?

Honestly, I think I'm writing for ME. But I do place greater attention on the feedback I get from other writers than on what I get from the general public. For one thing, when I first started letting this part of myself out into the world, the other writers, ESPECIALLY those here in the AH at the time, made me a much better writer with the responses they shared with me.

I still have that particular bias. a compliment from a fellow writer stirkes me harder than a word from a reader. Not to say that I don't love reader comments. I'm absolutely a feedback slut, and I like to hear responses from everybody.

 

[Actingup]

You’d think, right? But opinions vary it seems.

Informed, considered comment is far better, no matter who it’s from. Emily Miller (theoretically) writing ‘awesome job!!!!!’ is a whole lot less meaningful than Emily Miller (actually! ) telling me she’s broken her incest ban for me. Joe Blogs giving a careful, constructive critique is far more valuable than a ‘name’ author saying something less useful.

What’s universally unhelpful IMHO is authors being really judgy about the motivations of others.

 

[Off_base]

How do you cope when another author that you like, basically rips one of your stories a new ass with a negative comment, dismantling your premise and the behaviors of your MCs, and accuses you of sending terrible messages with your story?
All of the other feedback I've received on the same story has been positive, and the stats are solid.
At the time, I thought I could just move on and agree to disagree, but I haven't.
I'm fairly new to writing and not great at it, but it's been fun to give it a try. Now, however, I have three drafts that are just sitting untouched.
I don't feel the same joy about writing that I did before this happened, and have lost a little of my desire to keep going.
The comment seemed unfounded and petty, and had an almost angry tone. I was surprised by it, and now have discovered that it bothered me far more than I thought, at the time.
If it had been a random reader, I could have filled it away and moved on, but from a respected author, it landed hard.
Any advice on getting past this jump would be appreciated.

 

[Off_base]

How do you cope when another author that you like, basically rips one of your stories a new ass with a negative comment, dismantling your premise and the behaviors of your MCs, and accuses you of sending terrible messages with your story?
All of the other feedback I've received on the same story has been positive, and the stats are solid.
At the time, I thought I could just move on and agree to disagree, but I haven't.
I'm fairly new to writing and not great at it, but it's been fun to give it a try. Now, however, I have three drafts that are just sitting untouched.
I don't feel the same joy about writing that I did before this happened, and have lost a little of my desire to keep going.
The comment seemed unfounded and petty, and had an almost angry tone. I was surprised by it, and now have discovered that it bothered me far more than I thought, at the time.
If it had been a random reader, I could have filled it away and moved on, but from a respected author, it landed hard.
Any advice on getting past this jump would be appreciated.

*getting past this hump

 

[Rob_Royale]

*getting past this hump

I would sit back and take note that every story you have posted has a red H and are filled with glowing positive comments. Some from that same fellow writer. You can't please everyone. It's just not possible. But the goal in writing is to make the reader feel something. I'd say you accomplished that. They were obviously affected by your story and sometimes it's not all smiles and hard-ons. Keep writing knowing it likely won't be the last poor critique you receive. You have to find it in you to be okay with that.

 

[EmilyMiller]

How do you cope when another author that you like, basically rips one of your stories a new ass with a negative comment, dismantling your premise and the behaviors of your MCs, and accuses you of sending terrible messages with your story?
All of the other feedback I've received on the same story has been positive, and the stats are solid.
At the time, I thought I could just move on and agree to disagree, but I haven't.
I'm fairly new to writing and not great at it, but it's been fun to give it a try. Now, however, I have three drafts that are just sitting untouched.
I don't feel the same joy about writing that I did before this happened, and have lost a little of my desire to keep going.
The comment seemed unfounded and petty, and had an almost angry tone. I was surprised by it, and now have discovered that it bothered me far more than I thought, at the time.
If it had been a random reader, I could have filled it away and moved on, but from a respected author, it landed hard.
Any advice on getting past this jump would be appreciated.

If another author rips your story a new ass, you have to ask yourself, “How valuable is their feedback?”

Anyone for whom I have proofread or beta read will say I can be forthright. But to publicly trash your work (assuming that’s actually what they did)? Well I don’t think that makes their opinion so very valid.

 

[StillStunned]

How do you cope when another author that you like, basically rips one of your stories a new ass with a negative comment, dismantling your premise and the behaviors of your MCs, and accuses you of sending terrible messages with your story?
All of the other feedback I've received on the same story has been positive, and the stats are solid.
At the time, I thought I could just move on and agree to disagree, but I haven't.
I'm fairly new to writing and not great at it, but it's been fun to give it a try. Now, however, I have three drafts that are just sitting untouched.
I don't feel the same joy about writing that I did before this happened, and have lost a little of my desire to keep going.
The comment seemed unfounded and petty, and had an almost angry tone. I was surprised by it, and now have discovered that it bothered me far more than I thought, at the time.
If it had been a random reader, I could have filled it away and moved on, but from a respected author, it landed hard.
Any advice on getting past this jump would be appreciated.

Nobody's writing is perfect. Sometimes a story doesn't work for everyone.

Also, it takes practice to give criticism, but also to take it. If the commenter is indeed such a respected author, I'd swallow my pride, look objectively at what they say, and take it on board. You might disagree, but at least try to understand their reasons for the comments.

Harsh criticism is probably the fastest path to improvement. It's nice to be told how wonderful you are, but it's better to get an honest opinion once in a while that makes you think.

 

[EmilyMiller]

Harsh criticism is probably the fastest path to improvement.

I disagree. Fair and balanced criticism, yes. If feedback is harsh, that’s on the reviewer, not the author. Harsh criticism is often just the reviewer wanting to feel superior.

I guess a lot hinges on the meaning of ‘harsh,’ and we have no idea what that was for the OP.

 

[SimonDoom]

How do you cope when another author that you like, basically rips one of your stories a new ass with a negative comment, dismantling your premise and the behaviors of your MCs, and accuses you of sending terrible messages with your story?
All of the other feedback I've received on the same story has been positive, and the stats are solid.
At the time, I thought I could just move on and agree to disagree, but I haven't.
I'm fairly new to writing and not great at it, but it's been fun to give it a try. Now, however, I have three drafts that are just sitting untouched.
I don't feel the same joy about writing that I did before this happened, and have lost a little of my desire to keep going.
The comment seemed unfounded and petty, and had an almost angry tone. I was surprised by it, and now have discovered that it bothered me far more than I thought, at the time.
If it had been a random reader, I could have filled it away and moved on, but from a respected author, it landed hard.
Any advice on getting past this jump would be appreciated.

One suggestion is to realize that even the most esteemed and skilled author, whose stories you admire, can be full of eccentricities and opinions that make no sense and also show pettiness. We can all be small at times. Their success as an author gives them no special authority as a judge of what you do.

I've been doing this for nine years here at Literotica, and over time I've found that as much as I might value the works of some of my colleagues--and I do, often--and as much as I might value what they have to say in this forum, much of the advice or criticism I get is not helpful in terms of assisting me in achieving what I want to achieve with my stories. I sometimes feel I'm being told I should write their story, not the story I want to write. That may be the case here. The problem may be them, not you. And you cannot control them. You shouldn't worry about what you can't control.

It's not unusual, at all, for you to feel down about this criticism. That's normal. It's normal for a human being to get 10 pieces of feedback, 9 positive, and to obsess about the 1 bad one. Try to focus on the positive feedback, and on your own internal purposes for writing. It gets easier with time and experience.

 

[StillStunned]

I disagree. Fair and balanced criticism, yes. If feedback is harsh, that’s on the reviewer, not the author. Harsh criticism is often just the reviewer wanting to feel superior.

I guess a lot hinges on the meaning of ‘harsh,’ and we have no idea what that was for the OP.

I meant "harsh" in the sense of "not pulling any punches", rather than "rude" or "unfair".

 

[justanewsub]

I saw a comment elsewhere that some writers (me included) put greater weight on feedback from other authors than general readers. Contrawise some other writers say they care more about what their readers think than other writers.

I wondered about your motivations. For me, I’m much happier if a writer I respect pays me a compliment, than if it is a non-writer, or a writer whose work I am unfamiliar with does the same.

Does that mean I’m writing for other writers? How about you?

I haven't written stories, and I'm not sure I'm called to it. But I write for a living, and I'm always happier when somebody who I believe writes well appreciates my writing (and even edits my writing, because they would not waste their time if they thought my writing stunk!). Somebody who writes has a better understanding of what I've been through in my writing, and therefore I'm more receptive to their feedback and comments than one who just reads my work.

 

[Nynah]

If it had been a random reader, I could have filled it away and moved on, but from a respected author, it landed hard.

Has this author left you feedback/comments on any of your other works? If so, how are those compared to the one that landed harder?

Maybe drop them a line through Literotica's feedback system on their page? If you exchange emails and can talk things through in private vs. a relatively public forum like your story's comments, you may be able to come to more of an understanding and hopefully clear up any specific worries you may have with what they said.

 

[SimonDoom]

Harsh criticism is probably the fastest path to improvement. It's nice to be told how wonderful you are, but it's better to get an honest opinion once in a while that makes you think.

Sometimes, not always.


My college thesis adviser absolutely savaged my first draft of my thesis, in unsparing language. That was about the harshest criticism I've ever received of my writing. I felt about an inch tall after reading it. But it had a good effect, shocking me into facing how lazy and sloppy I had been and forcing me to double down on writing better. By the time it was done one of my thesis readers, a prominent tenured professor, praised me for "writing extremely well."

I don't think that's the right approach here, however. I think the right approach in criticizing stories at Literotica is to maintain an air of civility and constructiveness, and to go a little light, and always to be respectful that the author is under no obligation to have the same artistic goals you do.

 

[PennyThompson]

How do you cope when another author that you like, basically rips one of your stories a new ass with a negative comment, dismantling your premise and the behaviors of your MCs, and accuses you of sending terrible messages with your story?
All of the other feedback I've received on the same story has been positive, and the stats are solid.
At the time, I thought I could just move on and agree to disagree, but I haven't.
I'm fairly new to writing and not great at it, but it's been fun to give it a try. Now, however, I have three drafts that are just sitting untouched.
I don't feel the same joy about writing that I did before this happened, and have lost a little of my desire to keep going.
The comment seemed unfounded and petty, and had an almost angry tone. I was surprised by it, and now have discovered that it bothered me far more than I thought, at the time.
If it had been a random reader, I could have filled it away and moved on, but from a respected author, it landed hard.
Any advice on getting past this jump would be appreciated.

I think as a general axiom when it comes to feedback, you have to decide if the reviewer's intention was to help or to harm.

Some comments are intended to hurt your feelings and demotivate you, or just to troll random victims, and you should do your best to compartmentalize and disregard those. (easier said than done, I know.)

Some are intended to explain why the reviewer perceived a problem, possibly with some suggestions for improvement, and those can be incredibly valuable if you allow them to be.

Sometimes a comment is meant to be productive criticism, but the tone isn't being sent or received as intended, or personal feelings and tastes are overwhelming more objective feedback.

It can be hard to tell which is which sometimes, because human brains don't always connect with each other the way that we want them to. I haven't read your stories, but I think I see which specific comment you're referring to, and I would probably try to receive it as mostly constructive feedback about character behaviors and motivations, from a writer who cares deeply about the genre.

(I also suspect they would be willing to chat further if you reached out to them, they're really very nice )

 

[Djmac1031]

more than I thought, at the time.
If it had been a random reader, I could have filled it away and moved on, but from a respected author, it landed hard.

Just because someone is considered by some to be a "respected author " doesn't mean they cant be an asshole.

Trust me, I've met several here.

 

[SimonDoom]

I meant "harsh" in the sense of "not pulling any punches", rather than "rude" or "unfair".

I'd probably say, "Pick your punches." The reality is, almost nobody takes criticism well. That's my experience. I think that's particularly true here at Literotica. It's not like work or school, where it's perfectly understandable why your boss or teacher would criticize your bad writing because it's very, very important for it to be good. This is just for fun. It's not consequential. It's deflating to put work into something that's not going to earn you any tangible benefit only for somebody to savage you for it. Even if the criticism isn't nasty, too much criticism can seem like piling on.

In the past I was a harsher critic than I am now. I prefer to take the "go light" approach now, make sure to say some nice, affirming things, and offer a few points where I think things could be improved.

 

[SinclairGroupLLP]

How do you cope when another author that you like, basically rips one of your stories a new ass with a negative comment, dismantling your premise and the behaviors of your MCs, and accuses you of sending terrible messages with your story?
All of the other feedback I've received on the same story has been positive, and the stats are solid.
At the time, I thought I could just move on and agree to disagree, but I haven't.
I'm fairly new to writing and not great at it, but it's been fun to give it a try. Now, however, I have three drafts that are just sitting untouched.
I don't feel the same joy about writing that I did before this happened, and have lost a little of my desire to keep going.
The comment seemed unfounded and petty, and had an almost angry tone. I was surprised by it, and now have discovered that it bothered me far more than I thought, at the time.
If it had been a random reader, I could have filled it away and moved on, but from a respected author, it landed hard.
Any advice on getting past this jump would be appreciated.

Whenever we write for an audience, we have to expect that there will be people in the audience who don't care for what we've done. I read the comment, read the story. I didn't have an issue with it, but they did. That's fine.

Don't let it get to you. The attitude we all need to cultivate in this situation, especially when we think the story is fine and others like it is simple: "I'm sorry you didn't like this one, I hope you'll like the next one."

And it seems clear they did, because they wrote nice comments about stories published after that one.

We all have a tendency to dwell on the negative, but you can't let that suck the fun out of this hobby. As others have mentioned, the vast majority of your stuff is very well reviewed, including by that author, so just chalk this one up to YMMV and keep on trucking.

 

[StillStunned]

Just because someone is considered by some to be a "respected author " doesn't mean they cant be an asshole.

Trust me, I've met several here.

It's probably a coincidence that my ears just started burning.

 

[Trionyx]

I write for myself. I appreciate comments and votes, but I don’t write to get them. A comment about my writing from another author may carry a little more weight but since I get so few of them, it is really a moot point.

 

[Off_base]

Thanks everyone, I'm teary from it. I am very fond of the other author and of this whole community. I wondered if other newbies had felt the same, and I value all of your input very much.

 

[Nynah]

Thanks everyone, I'm teary from it. I am very fond of the other author and of this whole community.

Tone is very hard to read through text; I try not to read too much into comments (difficult with people pleasing tendencies, ask me how I know ) that appear critical for that reason and especially if they come from someone who has been kind in the past.

I see that most of your work is in Lesbian Sex and my experiences with that particular side of Lit have been quite positive on the whole so I'm hoping that you'll be able to work it out with whoever left you that comment.

 

[SugarStorm]

Any advice on getting past this jump would be appreciated.

I think a lot of us have felt that way when starting out, so you’re definitely not alone. It’s a strange mix of excitement and vulnerability, sharing something so personal and then waiting for how it lands. What you’re feeling just shows how much you care, and that’s a good thing.

This community can be wonderfully supportive, and sometimes a bit blunt too, but most of it comes from people who genuinely love the craft. Keep writing, keep connecting, and don’t let the nerves talk louder than your voice.

And in this specific case, I'd recommend you to nudge the author gently via a PM At least, that's what I would have done.

 

[ThatNewGuy]

How do you cope when another author that you like, basically rips one of your stories a new ass with a negative comment, dismantling your premise and the behaviors of your MCs, and accuses you of sending terrible messages with your story?
All of the other feedback I've received on the same story has been positive, and the stats are solid.
At the time, I thought I could just move on and agree to disagree, but I haven't.
I'm fairly new to writing and not great at it, but it's been fun to give it a try. Now, however, I have three drafts that are just sitting untouched.
I don't feel the same joy about writing that I did before this happened, and have lost a little of my desire to keep going.
The comment seemed unfounded and petty, and had an almost angry tone.

There are two things I'd like to comment on here. First is the criticism itself. Second is the effect it has had on you.

I haven't read the story in question but like @PennyThompson, I read the comment to which you're referring, as well as your comment in response to it. As a writer, you owe it to your craft to weight the criticism and decide whether it's on point or off base. And it's important to remember that even excellent and well-respected authors can offer criticism that sometimes misses the mark.

For what it's worth, it was clear to me that you carefully considered each point raised by the commenter in your response, and you gave solid reasons for disagreeing with their comments. That's the exact right approach. You can (and should!) dismiss criticism if you evaluate it objectively and decide it is off the mark.

Again, I've not read the story, but I agree with your perspective on the boot camp thing. Just because a character derives self esteem from changing her appearance does not mean that you are trying to tell your audience that they have to look a certain way to feel good. In my opinion, the commenter was wrongly assuming that the character's intrinsic motivations aligned with the writer's message to his/her audience. I feel the same way about the commenter's disapproval about a character drinking and driving. That's not a message that you are delivering as a writer. That's the behavior of a flawed character that you are portraying, and that is perfectly fine and acceptable in a work of fiction.

You also provided an explanation for why Stacy never visited home in you response to the comment. Now, maybe the commenter is correct that you didn't do enough as a writer to convey Stacy's reasoning in the story. Or maybe you are correct and the commenter just didn't pick up on the details you included to establish Stacy's motivation. It's up to you as a writer to decide that one.

Putting aside the validity of the criticism itself, I would also suggest that you owe it to yourself and your craft not to let a single comment suck the joy from your writing, regardless of the comment's source. Believe in yourself and your writing. Be receptive to criticism as a way to hone your craft, but keep in mind that any criticism offered in good faith (and I believe that this commenter's criticism was offered in good faith) is a critique of the success of the work itself, not the worth of the writer. There's a reason this same commenter has praised your other work. Don't get so consumed by this single negative comment that you lose sight of all the positive feedback you've received!

As others have suggested, you might PM the person who left the comment. Tone is hard to convey in a comment, and it's very possible that the commenter may be horrified to learn that their words have had such a negative effect on you. A private conversation may help you recover your equilibrium. Best of luck, and please keep writing.

 

[Nightaelf]

Some writers, especially here, just really love to read, so I naturally see them simply as readers. And writers who give feedback about the story itself, rather than about how it’s written, I also see as readers. Personally, I just write my stories for anyone who wants to read them. I don’t value feedback from a writer any more than from a reader. I actually appreciate all feedback I get. I don’t even always know whether someone is a writer or not. Maybe they are, just not active on Literotica. I write for whoever wants to read it. And really, most importantly, I write for myself.