The NFL, concussions, and the importance of Dave Duerson's suicide last Thursday

[RoryN]

"Remember, my brain goes to Boston."

WCW star Daffney kills herself after threatening to on video; she suspected CTE was causing her depression

https://www.tmz.com/2021/09/02/mick-foley-daffney-disturbing-social-media-video-wrestling-wwe-wcw/

 

[RoryN]

Researchers confirm Hall of Famer Bobby Hull had CTE when he died 2 years ago

Bobby Hull, the Hall of Fame forward and two-time NHL MVP who helped the Chicago Blackhawks win the Stanley Cup in 1961, had chronic traumatic encephalopathy when he died two years ago, his widow said in a statement released on Wednesday.

Researchers at Boston University’s CTE Center found that Hull had stage 2 CTE when he died in 2023. He was 84.

Hull struggled with short-term memory loss and impaired judgment over his final decade. He chose to donate his brain after seeing former teammate and fellow Hall of Famer Stan Mikita decline late in his life.

“Seeing the pain and heartache suffered by his lifetime friend Stan Mikita’s family, Bobby felt strongly no other family should have to endure CTE,” Deborah Hull, his wife of 39 years, said in a statement. “He insisted on donating his brain, feeling as though it was his duty to help advance research on this agonizing disease.”

https://www.cnn.com/2025/02/19/sport/bobby-hull-cte-blackhawks-nhl-spt-intl/index.html

 

[RoryN]

I wanted to change gears a bit, and talk about the living or deceased and not-yet-tested.

Here's a list of athletes who I think should probably be checked for CTE (the "while you're alive" test is controversial, but seems to work) if they're still alive, and others whose brains should be tested. These choices are based on behaviors and previous injuries. Please feel free to add names:

Maurice Clarett
Jack Trudeau
Todd Marinovich
Dave Meggett
Mark Ingram
Vince Young
Dexter Manley (already has had brain surgery)
Aaron Hernandez (doesn't fit the profile at first glance, but neither have others)
Ryan Leaf (fits the profile like a glove)
Marcus Dupree
Mike Tyson
Lawrence Phillips (note: just died; brain currently being examined for CTE)
Jeff Hardy (pro wrestling)
Luna Vachon (pro wrestling)
Lex Luger (pro wrestling)
Chyna (pro wrestling)
Jake Roberts (pro wrestling)
Kerry Von Erich (pro wrestling; don't think they saved his brain, but shot himself in the heart like other CTE victims)
Big Vito (pro wrestling; currently suing for brain damage)
Adam Mercer (pro wrestling; currently suing for brain damage)
Axl Rotten (pro wrestling; died today)
Dave Mirra (BMX legend, died today - suicide by gunshot)

Follow-ups from the above, which was originally posted on 2/4/2016:

Jack Trudeau - Positive for CTE

Mark Ingram - Positive for CTE

Aaron Hernandez - Died April 19, 2017. Not just positive for CTE, but now one of the most infamous cases of it.

Ryan Leaf - Not tested, but convinced he has it

Marcus Dupree - Not tested, but convinced he has it

Lawrence Phillips - Positive for CTE

Jeff Hardy - Will be donating his brain to test for CTE, as will wrestler Mick Foley

Chyna - Died April 17, 2016 Brain donated, but too far gone for testing

Jake Roberts - Not tested, but convinced he has it

Axl Rotten - Positive for CTE

Dave Mirra - Positive for CTE

 

[Saint_Ann]

Nobody cares.

 

[LMWM321]

Nobody cares.

Speak for yourself. I care.

And it's relevant to point out that in the US a man can monetize his talent for the sort of brutality that causes CTE to others (and himself) but a person CANNOT monetize their talent for giving sexual pleasure. ..Something that causes no physical harm yet gives some semblance of joy and human tenderness to the lonely and sexually frustrated.

If it's legal to bash one another's brains in for money, it should likewise be legal to charge and pay for sex. So, to my thinking, it's an apropos topic.

 

[Saint_Ann]

Speak for yourself. I care.

And it's relevant to point out that in the US a man can monetize his talent for the sort of brutality that causes CTE to others (and himself) but a person CANNOT monetize their talent for giving sexual pleasure. ..Something that causes no physical harm yet gives some semblance of joy and human tenderness to the lonely and sexually frustrated.

If it's legal to bash one another's brains in for money, it should likewise be legal to charge and pay for sex. So, to my thinking, it's an apropos topic.

So...you want to be a male whore?

 

[LMWM321]

So that’s your take away from my post?

Then yes, that is my life goal. To be a sex worker. Is that a problem for you?

 

[Saint_Ann]

So that’s your take away from my post?

Then yes, that is my life goal. To be a sex worker. Is that a problem for you?

I just find it odd that you managed to tie CTE to male sex workers.

 

[LMWM321]

Well… i do.

 

[RoryN]

Manhattan shooting suspect claimed to have CTE, mentioned NFL in note, sources say

The 27-year-old man who allegedly killed four people and wounded a fifth in a mass shooting at a Midtown Manhattan office building on Monday carried a note in his pocket claiming he suffered from CTE and asking that his brain be studied, police sources told ABC News.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/abcnew...ft-note-mentioning-nfl-cte/story?id=124163966

 

[RoryN]

He was right:

Gunman in shooting at NFL headquarters, had CTE: Medical examiner

Shane Tamura, who drove cross-country from Las Vegas and opened fire at the New York headquarters of the NFL, killing four, had CTE, the New York City Office of the Chief Medical Examiner said Friday, confirming what was in the shooter’s own writings.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=125972038

 

[RjThoughts]

He was right:

Gunman in shooting at NFL headquarters, had CTE: Medical examiner

Shane Tamura, who drove cross-country from Las Vegas and opened fire at the New York headquarters of the NFL, killing four, had CTE, the New York City Office of the Chief Medical Examiner said Friday, confirming what was in the shooter’s own writings.

https://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=125972038

No shit!!
And even NFL current and former players were saying it.

 

[LMWM321]

Not a chance I’d let my kids play football.

 

[BrentJW]

Occupational hazard. Every player signs a contract knowing how dangerous it is.

 

[LMWM321]

Occupational hazard. Every player signs a contract knowing how dangerous it is.

...The damage was already done. Long before signing pro contracts they have already sustained countless head impacts playing youth, high school,, then college football, etc...

While I do enjoy watching football, we should all feel a bit of guilt for watching a bunch of oversized, hyper-testosterone men batter their brains for our amusement.

 

[BrentJW]

...The damage was already done. Long before signing pro contracts they have already sustained countless head impacts playing youth, high school,, then college football, etc...

While I do enjoy watching football, we should all feel a bit of guilt for watching a bunch of oversized, hyper-testosterone men batter their brains for our amusement.

I will partially agree with you, but pee wee football players don’t usually generate enough speed to cause CTE. I recently watch my old high school play a game and my impression is, even there I didn’t see any collisions that were greatly concerning, but will admit these teams were not very good and not representative of the ‘better’ high schools. I think the real issues start at college level, especially division 1 schools. Interesting that colleges, which are supposed to teach intelligence, ignore supporting a sport that causes brain injuries. Money overrules all. I still think that, if you are smart enough to get into college you should understand beating up your brain will not be good for you.
Completely agree that we should feel guilty for feeding the money machine which is football. Although I enjoyed the sport and athleticism once, I stopped watching it years ago because of CTE, just like I stopped watching boxing a long long time ago. Did not let my sons play football.

 

[LMWM321]

I will partially agree with you, but pee wee football players don’t usually generate enough speed to cause CTE.

I hope you're right Brent, but I have my doubts. I recall hearing a neurosurgeon comment that NO cranial impact is completely safe - no matter what speed it happens at. She said it isn't just about the accumulation of concussions, it's about the cumulative effects of the brain being jostled within the skull, which happens during all impacts. Remember, we are living well past our 60's now, so damage that isn't severe enough to show up in our 50's may be bad enough to show up in our 70's.

And one thing is clear - living with CTE is a fucking nightmare. ..It's not merely forgetting names and misplacing car keys, it's not recognizing family members and hearing voices that tell you to do dangerous and violent things, even to the ones you love. Ugh. Because of what I do for a living I know a lot of doctors... I have yet to meet more than one or two who lets their kids play football. And I'd bet EVERY retired NFL player (and pro wrestler, MMA fighter, etc..) suffering from CTE would say it was NOT worth it. A life of sore hips, knees, and neck in exchange for money and fame? Sure, maybe. ..But tormenting brain dysfunction where voices taunt and goad you to do horrible things? ..No.

Our country needs to check its priorities. I drive through rural parts of the US all the time. And I have seen countless undersized, underfunded one-story high schools that are in sore need of capital investment.. And behind quite a few of them stands a fucking football stadium. And why? So the adults in the area can go and be entertained by kids who are trading their long-term health for their amusement. Well, that and the hope of a college scholarship that will likely be meaningless because most college football players don't take their class work seriously enough to parlay their education into a meaningful career. Post graduation, the odds are probably greater they'll end up delivering pkgs for amazon than making it to the pros.

 

[RjThoughts]

I will partially agree with you, but pee wee football players don’t usually generate enough speed to cause CTE. I recently watch my old high school play a game and my impression is, even there I didn’t see any collisions that were greatly concerning, but will admit these teams were not very good and not representative of the ‘better’ high schools. I think the real issues start at college level, especially division 1 schools. Interesting that colleges, which are supposed to teach intelligence, ignore supporting a sport that causes brain injuries. Money overrules all. I still think that, if you are smart enough to get into college you should understand beating up your brain will not be good for you.
Completely agree that we should feel guilty for feeding the money machine which is football. Although I enjoyed the sport and athleticism once, I stopped watching it years ago because of CTE, just like I stopped watching boxing a long long time ago. Did not let my sons play football.

It doesn't take much force at that age to cause problems.

 

[RjThoughts]

I hope you're right Brent, but I have my doubts. I recall hearing a neurosurgeon comment that NO cranial impact is completely safe - no matter what speed it happens. She said it isn't just about the accumulation of full-on concussions, it's about the cumulative effects of the brain being jostled, which happens during all impacts. Plus, remember that we are living well past our 60's now, so damage that isn't so severe that it shows up in our 50's may definitely show up in our 70's.

And one thing is clear - CTE is fucking living nightmare. ..It's not merely forgetting names and misplacing car keys, it's about not recognizing family members and hearing voices that tell you to do dangerous and violent things. Ugh. Because of what I do for a living I know a lot of doctors... I have yet to meet more than one or two who lets their kids play football. And I'd bet EVERY retired NFL player suffering from CTE would say it was NOT worth it. A life of sore hips, knees, and neck in exchange for money and fame? Sure, maybe. ..But tormenting brain dysfunction? ..No.

Our country needs to check its priorities. I drive through rural parts of the US all the time. And I have seen countless undersized, underfunded high schools that are in sore need of capital investment.. And behind many of them is a fucking football stadium. ..So the adults in the area can go and be entertained by kids who are trading their long-term health for their amusement. Well, that and the hope of a college scholarship that will be meaningless because most college football players don't take their class work very seriously.

Football is a religion.