Judaism AMA

[Hel_Books]

Hel_Books said:
The Hamas charter calls for the elimination of Israel. They weren't content with ethnically cleansing the Gaza, where Jews have lived for thousands of years. What did these moslems think would happen?

Perhaps the Hamas charter does call for "the elimination of Jews".
That's irrelevant here and now . . .

Perhaps if the charter had been changed on 6 October, all this unpleasantness could have been avoided?

 

[RobDownSouth]

The genocide slur has always been a permission structure to allow Jew-haters to feel righteous and justified.

Genocidal Israel's policy of deliberate starvation of civilians is all I need to feel "righteous and justified".
The fact that you tacitly approve of this barbarism shows that you have zero morality or humanity left inside of you.

Nattering that "genocide is a slur" and clutching your pearls shows us how you think this is some sort of parlor game, tee fucking hee.

Your continual "but ackshully" rationalizations fall more and more upon deaf ears, as the Genocidal Israeli Narrative ("It's ALLLLLLL HAMAS fault!") resonates with an increasing diminishing number of people in the world.

The world has finally come to the conclusion that Genocidal Israel Is Starving Children, And Diaspora Jews Such As Yourself Give Tacit Approval To War Crimes.

Own your shame, if you have any.

 

[Lance_Castro]

The Israeli government is anti-semitic.

 

[Hel_Books]

Hel_Books said:
If Iran had used all that money they spent arming Hamas (stirring up trouble to give their own people someone to hate other than their repressive theocratic government) on development aid instead, the people of Gaza would be living peaceful, prosperous lives now. But anti-semites don't learn the lessons of 1940: if the Nazis had quit while they were ahead, they would have ended up quite successful. And you'd have just adored that, wouldn't you?

You can sense the palpable stench of desperation in your argument when you attempt to distract from the discussion by invoking Iran,

Iran (and all the other tin-pot dictatorships and crumbling monarchies in the region) gin up hatred of the Jews in order to distract from the misery they've caused their own people. If the moslems hadn't attacked Israel in 1948 they could have left the Jews in a tiny postage-stamp rump state that they would just adore seeing them crammed into now!

But now, like the Nazis losing East Prussia and being forced out of the Sudetenland, the moslems will lose Gaza and probably more of the West Bank as well.

Oh, well, it doesn't really matter anyway, as your inept President has failed to set back the Iranian nuclear program more than a month or two, so eventually, maybe in a decade, maybe in fifty years, Israel will be radioactive waste. Moslems would like that. I was on a business trip to New York City in 2002 and saw the ruins in downtown Manhattan and remembered the scenes of moslems in Gaza dancing and handing out candy in celebration on 11 September.

 

[Hel_Books]

The Israeli government is anti-semitic.

Two Jews, three opinions, yes.

 

[RobDownSouth]

Perhaps not, as the most recent news stories show all that is pure propaganda. But you can tell that just by looking at the photos yourself, without having to read the New York Times retractions. News video and photos from actual famine areas (like, say, Sudan) show stick-figure adults barely able to walk carrying emaciated children. Because they could hardly allow their children to go hungry while they fed their faces, could they? The "news" from Gaza invariably shows well-fed young men in the background waving their weapons and shouting Death to Israel.

"Stories"? That's not a "Story" you've linked to...it's a rabid anti-Gaza editorial, rehashing the NY Times correction and regurgitating the vile blood libel that noor and BrightShinygirl are pushing ('They don't look starving to meeeeee!") If that's the best you've got, then you've got nothing. Try again.

Insinuating that Hamas adults are somehow deliberately starving their own children is absolutely vile. You should be ashamed of yourself. But I think it's pretty clear by now you have no shame. None. It's "Give me teh Genocidal Israeli Narrative, or give me death!" for you. Not everyone in Gaza is starving, but an unacceptable number of them are starving....due to Israel's genocidal policy. You're attempting to spin that as "Look! HE is not starving and HE is not starving, so this "starvation" business is a fabrication!"

And the fact that you are putting quotation marks around the word "news" has made it clear that Genocidal Israel has lost complete control of the Narrative, and relies upon drones like you to "shoot the messenger" 24/7/365.

What the absolute fuck is wrong with you?

 

[Hel_Books]

The world has finally come to the conclusion that Genocidal Israel Is Starving Children, And Diaspora Jews Such As Yourself Give Tacit Approval To War Crimes.

The "world" says that, but they never needed an excuse to try to exterminate the Jews! In 1948 they tried to kill all of them in Israel, and they didn't even have phony pictures of "starving" children as excuses.

 

[Hel_Books]

Insinuating that Hamas adults are somehow deliberately starving their own children is absolutely vile.

Was I insinuating that? I wouldn't put it past them (remember them tossing hand grenades into houses where Jewish women and children were sheltering on 7 October?) though it seems they were only using fake photos, as you can see from the cheerful, well-fed young men in the background waving their weapons and chanting Death to Israel.

 

[Hel_Books]

And the fact that you are putting quotation marks around the word "news" has made it clear that. . . .

I was only reminding you that the photos and videos coming from Hamas shouldn't be treated as legitimate news. That was the reason for the quotes.

 

[Hel_Books]

Hel_Books said:
Perhaps not, as the most recent news stories show all that is pure propaganda. But you can tell that just by looking at the photos yourself, without having to read the New York Times retractions. News video and photos from actual famine areas (like, say, Sudan) show stick-figure adults barely able to walk carrying emaciated children. Because they could hardly allow their children to go hungry while they fed their faces, could they? The "news" from Gaza invariably shows well-fed young men in the background waving their weapons and shouting Death to Israel.

"Stories"? That's not a "Story" you've linked to...it's a rabid anti-Gaza editorial, rehashing the NY Times correction . . .

Gosh, you sound so Trumpy! Are you going to start screaming "Fake News!" about the New York Times now?

 

[RobDownSouth]

Iran (and all the other tin-pot dictatorships and crumbling monarchies in the region) gin up hatred of the Jews in order to distract from the misery they've caused their own people. If the moslems hadn't attacked Israel in 1948 they could have left the Jews in a tiny postage-stamp rump state that they would just adore seeing them crammed into now!

"but...but...77 years ago things happened so now Israel MUST starve the innocent Palestinian children in 2025!"
Good luck waiting for that talking point to gain traction.

But now, like the Nazis losing East Prussia and being forced out of the Sudetenland, the moslems will lose Gaza and probably more of the West Bank as well.

Quite a fan of pogroms, aren't you? As long as it's your side doing the forced displacements.....

Oh, well, it doesn't really matter anyway, as your inept President has failed to set back the Iranian nuclear program more than a month or two, so eventually, maybe in a decade, maybe in fifty years, Israel will be radioactive waste. Moslems would like that. I was on a business trip to New York City in 2002 and saw the ruins in downtown Manhattan and remembered the scenes of moslems in Gaza dancing and handing out candy in celebration on 11 September.

Yep, all Donald Trump's fault. Mmm-hmm.

Say do you remember exactly why Moslems in Gaza were dancing post 9/11?
Like everyone else in the Middle East, they knew the United States was (and to this day IS) funding the genocidal Israeli war machine. Seeing the financier of Israeli atrocities take a black eye turned out to be the only bright spot for them that decade.

And why did Saudi Arabia attack the USA on 9/11? Because Bush Senior twisted senile old coot King Ibn Saud into allowing the USA to build a massive Prince Bandar Air Force base in the Saudi Arabian desert. Lots of Moslem fundamentalist took strong exception to that. Genocidal Israel absolutely loved having superior American air power just a stone's thow away, they could have the American president send its own military to do the fighting for Israel. (Israel troops are too precious to use in battle where there is a chance the enemy might, you know, fire back). Israel reserve it's combat forces for putting the elderly, the infirm and the children "to the sword". Stuff that Americans are loathe to do. Win-win, right? Right?

 

[MiaBabe23]

Perhaps not, as the most recent news stories show all that is pure propaganda. But you can tell that just by looking at the photos yourself, without having to read the New York Times retractions. News video and photos from actual famine areas (like, say, Sudan) show stick-figure adults barely able to walk carrying emaciated children. Because they could hardly allow their children to go hungry while they fed their faces, could they? The "news" from Gaza invariably shows well-fed young men in the background waving their weapons and shouting Death to Israel.

I recommend looking up the definition of the term ‘confirmation bias’

 

[Hel_Books]

Say do you remember exactly why Moslems in Gaza were dancing post 9/11?

Careful, you're going off script!

The official politically correct (i.e. propaganda) line is that there weren't any celebrations by the Gaza moslems, that they were properly sorrowful over the loss of life of anyone anywhere.

 

[Hel_Books]

And why did Saudi Arabia attack the USA on 9/11?

Did Saudi Arabia attack the USA? I thought it was A-Qaeda, and there were just some Saudi nationals involved, to the disapproval of their government. The Saudis do things like dismember helpless journalists, not go to war with actual nation-states.

 

[RobDownSouth]

I was only reminding you that the photos and videos coming from Hamas shouldn't be treated as legitimate news. That was the reason for the quotes.

There you go again, trying to reestablish the Narrative.
"Anything not approved by the genocidal Israeli military propaganda bureau must be from Hamas! IT MUST BE!"

Narrator:
"She knew the words she spoke were likely a complete fabrication, but to admit otherwise would have resulted in the appearance of taking responsibility for her actions, which would be tantamount to desecrating her God, and she was not about to let that happen".

 

[MiaBabe23]

I find the way some people are talking on this thread - of both perspectives, if it can be reduced to a binary, which it can’t - to be really quite alarming
There are vigorous disagreements; but treating such a horrific situation for points scoring is surely below everyone
I get the impression BrightShiny created this thread in good faith, and was brave to do so. I disagree with her views on Gaza, but a thread like this offers an opportunity for actually understanding each other
Do better - you know who you are

 

[RobDownSouth]

Careful, you're going off script!

The official politically correct (i.e. propaganda) line is that there weren't any celebrations by the Gaza moslems, that they were properly sorrowful over the loss of life of anyone anywhere.

Nonsense, I was simply adding context to your latest Blood Libel.

Google AI adds the following

Media reports and video footage from the time suggest that some Palestinians did celebrate in the streets after the 9/11 attacks.
For example, ABC News footage showed dozens of Palestinians in East Jerusalem, many of them young boys, cheering in the streets, with cars honking and some people distributing sweets in celebration. Similar reports emerged from other locations, such as the Ein el-Hilweh refugee camp in Lebanon.
However, it's important to note that these actions were not representative of all Palestinians. Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat, for instance, publicly condemned the attacks, calling them a "terrible incident" and expressing condolences to the American people. Some sources also highlight that these events were sometimes presented in a biased manner by some media outlets, while similar reactions in other parts of the world were underreported.

So let's see here.....Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat condemned the attack, while there's a very good chance that genocidal Israeli strongman Bibi Netanyahu stood up and cheered.

Clear?

 

[Hel_Books]

Hel_Books said:
I was only reminding you that the photos and videos coming from Hamas shouldn't be treated as legitimate news. That was the reason for the quotes.

There you go again, trying to reestablish the Narrative.

I certainly wasn't trying to immanentize the eschaton!

 

[Hel_Books]

Google AI adds

So Skynet has control over you as well?

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

Most obviously, the widespread killing of unarmed civilians, including children. Some obvious examples are the ‘flour massacre’ and similar events; food blockades, causing widespread starvation; the killing of aid workers and burial in shallow graves; attacking non-combatant locations such as hospitals and schools without any forewarning for civilians
There are a range of independent testimonies from UN agencies, aid agencies and civilians themselves
So is it that you’re of the view that what’s being reported is inaccurate, but you would condemn these events as horrific if true?

Yes, there’s a coordinated disinformation campaign about the war in Gaza. For example, the recent photos of children suffering from birth defects as evidence of famine. The only photo of a starving adult from Gaza is of 21-year-old Rom Braslavski who was taken hostage on October 7th.

It’s a war zone. I’m sure some innocents have been killed by the IDF, but the claims of genocide or widespread atrocities are anti-Israel propaganda.

 

[Hel_Books]

So let's see here.....Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat . . .

I'm glad that you mentioned one of the most famous people to have been born in the city of Cairo, Egypt. Now if Egypt would just evacuate all their people from the disputed Gaza strip area . . .

 

[RobDownSouth]

I find the way some people are talking on this thread - of both perspectives, if it can be reduced to a binary, which it can’t - to be really quite alarming
There are vigorous disagreements; but treating such a horrific situation for points scoring is surely below everyone
I get the impression BrightShiny created this thread in good faith, and was brave to do so. I disagree with her views on Gaza, but a thread like this offers an opportunity for actually understanding each other
Do better - you know who you are

I respectfully disagree with your assertion.

To the contrary, I sure as HELL CAN AND WILL reduce this to "a binary".

Either you support government-sanctioned starvation of innocent children in a grotesque attempt to subdue a civilian population....or you don't.

There is no middle ground" here.

None whatsoever.

What side are you on, MiaBabe?

I've made my choice. I stand against starvation of children.

 

[RobDownSouth]

I'm glad that you mentioned one of the most famous people to have been born in the city of Cairo, Egypt. Now if Egypt would just evacuate all their people from the disputed Gaza strip area . . .

Always a big fan of pogroms you are, as long as it's the genocidal Israelis doin' the pogrommin'.

 

[MiaBabe23]

Yes, there’s a coordinated disinformation campaign about the war in Gaza. For example, the recent photos of children suffering from birth defects as evidence of famine. The only photo of a starving adult from Gaza is of 21-year-old Rom Braslavski who was taken hostage on October 7th.

It’s a war zone. I’m sure some innocents have been killed by the IDF, but the claims of genocide or widespread atrocities are anti-Israel propaganda.

I’m not sure which pictures those are. But birth defects have been an ongoing issue for years in Gaza, because of issues of malnutrition and sanitation; the UN has unsurprisingly found this has worsened during the current crisis

Agreed, it’s a horrific situation, and can only hope things improve as soon as possible

The UN, MSF, AI and many others who have concluded that genocide is happening are in the business of saving lives; they’ve often advocated for Israel in different ways, and some Israeli rights organizations are now accepting the assessment. It’s a legal assessment, based on the existence of specific conditions

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

I’m not sure which pictures those are. But birth defects have been an ongoing issue for years in Gaza, because of issues of malnutrition and sanitation; the UN has unsurprisingly found this has worsened during the current crisis

Agreed, it’s a horrific situation, and can only hope things improve as soon as possible

The UN, MSF, AI and many others who have concluded that genocide is happening are in the business of saving lives; they’ve often advocated for Israel in different ways, and some Israeli rights organizations are now accepting the assessment. It’s a legal assessment, based on the existence of specific conditions

The war would end immediately if Hamas released the hostages, surrendered, and laid down its arms. The UN contributed to the food shortage in Gaza by refusing to deliver aid unless they could make sure Hamas got a cut.