Edited v unfiltered: Literotica v This is me

[SinderellaSin]

Hi all

I write on a phone on a small screen just write what comes into my head(sometimes what's happened to me) and yes I have my own style. I can't see how big a paragraph is. So how big should a paragraph be. When I looked at it in page form some of it would be 12 to 16 lines long. Too much? But I can't tell as I type.

So onto editing, god im awful at conversation. So literotica tells me. Rejected twice read this essay on how to improve conversations. I say "this is me". Maybe i like my reader to think whose saying each line, to think how they are feeling, imagine it rather than being told. This is the way I write, everyone's different. I love Dwayne a dom black male to be written in caps when he speaks. But that's wrong. No its right it's dominance in my head.


Anyway I read the literotica essay on constructing conversations and now I'll try to rewrite it as they like, with the help of an editor. Will it lose something. It won't be authentic me. Will it gain something. Yes I'll probably add more detail and yes it will probably be better.


Would I like Literotica to run two different versions of my story. The original non filtered me v the edited and glossy version actually I'd like that just to see what the different reactions are.

So now I'll have to grow up and write proper conversations,, but the story well that is "this is me"


Your thoughts?

Sin x

 

[ElectricBlue]

Your thoughts?

There are writing conventions and rules of grammar for a reason - to make your story intelligible for readers. If you go off and make up your own rules and conventions, you're pretty much wasting your time. If you want to use Lit as a platform for publishing your content, you abide by their rules and requirements.

The several thousands of authors who use this platform to publish their content understand that, and get their content published. It really is that simple.

 

[THBGato]

If you don't like it, try publishing on W**tp*d - there's no editorial control there. You can publish a story with zero paragraphs and zero punctuation if you like.

Of course, nobody will read it, but it'll be authentic to you, I guess.

 

[SinderellaSin]

Sometimes my intent is to make the reader imagine how the characters are feeling without literally feeding them the words. But im learning to conform. Didn't like the thought of others editing it, might judge me

 

[Britva415]

Hi all

I write on a phone on a small screen just write what comes into my head(sometimes what's happened to me) and yes I have my own style. I can't see how big a paragraph is. So how big should a paragraph be. When I looked at it in page form some of it would be 12 to 16 lines long. Too much? But I can't tell as I type.

So onto editing, god im awful at conversation. So literotica tells me. Rejected twice read this essay on how to improve conversations. I say "this is me". Maybe i like my reader to think whose saying each line, to think how they are feeling, imagine it rather than being told. This is the way I write, everyone's different. I love Dwayne a dom black male to be written in caps when he speaks. But that's wrong. No its right it's dominance in my head.


Anyway I read the literotica essay on constructing conversations and now I'll try to rewrite it as they like, with the help of an editor. Will it lose something. It won't be authentic me. Will it gain something. Yes I'll probably add more detail and yes it will probably be better.


Would I like Literotica to run two different versions of my story. The original non filtered me v the edited and glossy version actually I'd like that just to see what the different reactions are.

So now I'll have to grow up and write proper conversations,, but the story well that is "this is me"


Your thoughts?

Sin x

As far as conversation/dialogue goes, Literotica ONLY cares about formatting/typography. They don't care whether the conversation is realistic, evocative, plausible, accented, clumsy, original, authentic, etc.

The only thing they wanted you to take from the "how to" essay was, the conventional way to format conversation.

You still can have your characters say anything you want them to say, any way you want them to say it.

So, "rewriting" isn't what Lit is looking for. Just reformatting.

 

[AwkwardMD]

This is not the right forum for this conversation. This should be in the Authors Hangout.

 

[filthytrancendence]

So now I'll have to grow up and write proper conversations,, but the story well that is "this is me"

To expand a bit on what EB said,

The conventions exist to make your thoughts legible to a reader. It's not that you can't break them. It's that you have to understand and be fluent in them before you can break the conventions in a way that will have the desired effect on your reader.

If you break them without taking the time to become fluent in them, you're very likely to just confuse everyone. It might make sense to you. But that's not what writing fiction is about. It's about guiding your reader into feeling how you want them to feel.

I'm not going to say it's impossible to write a good story where you force your reader to puzzle through who is speaking each line, but that would be a very, very difficult needle to thread. It comes perilously close to being an intrinsically bad thing on its' face. Making your story difficult to parse on purpose in a way that would not immediately cause every reader to completely disengage would require extreme finesse. You don't develop extreme finesse by disregarding the conventions because you don't feel like learning them.

 

[Djmac1031]

I honestly dont mean to be rude here.

But I do mean to be frank.

What this sounds like is someone who just wants to write whatever the fuck they wanna write without regards to proper writing or having to edit.

Do that, if that's what you want. But don't complain when your work is rejected for ignoring basic writing structure and rules, or if readers hate it.

 

[iwatchus]

Hi all

I write on a phone on a small screen just write what comes into my head(sometimes what's happened to me) and yes I have my own style. I can't see how big a paragraph is. So how big should a paragraph be. When I looked at it in page form some of it would be 12 to 16 lines long. Too much? But I can't tell as I type.

So onto editing, god im awful at conversation. So literotica tells me. Rejected twice read this essay on how to improve conversations. I say "this is me". Maybe i like my reader to think whose saying each line, to think how they are feeling, imagine it rather than being told. This is the way I write, everyone's different. I love Dwayne a dom black male to be written in caps when he speaks. But that's wrong. No its right it's dominance in my head.


Anyway I read the literotica essay on constructing conversations and now I'll try to rewrite it as they like, with the help of an editor. Will it lose something. It won't be authentic me. Will it gain something. Yes I'll probably add more detail and yes it will probably be better.


Would I like Literotica to run two different versions of my story. The original non filtered me v the edited and glossy version actually I'd like that just to see what the different reactions are.

So now I'll have to grow up and write proper conversations,, but the story well that is "this is me"


Your thoughts?

Sin x

I think the things you list are not what you dialogue is being rejected on. I think writing one character's speech in all caps is odd, but would not be rejected.

I suspect it is more placement of punctuation than anything else. Which I do not hear you asserting as your artistic prerogative.

If you send me a copy of your rejected story, I can try to give some feedback on what might be causing it. Note, I am not offering to read the entire article or give other feedback, but I will glance at your dialogue and see if I can help you get it formatted acceptably to Laurel.

 

[NotWise]

Just in general, well edited=better, skilled and unfiltered=worse, unskilled. Maybe there are examples where that isn't true, but some cases that might feel unfiltered, are actually composed and edited to get that effect.

 

[MelissaBaby]

Hi all

I write on a phone on a small screen just write what comes into my head(sometimes what's happened to me) and yes I have my own style. I can't see how big a paragraph is. So how big should a paragraph be. When I looked at it in page form some of it would be 12 to 16 lines long. Too much? But I can't tell as I type.

So onto editing, god im awful at conversation. So literotica tells me. Rejected twice read this essay on how to improve conversations. I say "this is me". Maybe i like my reader to think whose saying each line, to think how they are feeling, imagine it rather than being told. This is the way I write, everyone's different. I love Dwayne a dom black male to be written in caps when he speaks. But that's wrong. No its right it's dominance in my head.


Anyway I read the literotica essay on constructing conversations and now I'll try to rewrite it as they like, with the help of an editor. Will it lose something. It won't be authentic me. Will it gain something. Yes I'll probably add more detail and yes it will probably be better.


Would I like Literotica to run two different versions of my story. The original non filtered me v the edited and glossy version actually I'd like that just to see what the different reactions are.

So now I'll have to grow up and write proper conversations,, but the story well that is "this is me"


Your thoughts?

Sin x

I think the piece that is missing in this conversation is that using generally accepted grammar, punctuation, etc. is not about pleasing an editor or moderator, it's about presenting a story that is accessible for the readers. And there is more to that than just whether or not they can follow the narrative or understand the dialogue. You want the reader to immerse themselves in your story, to stay with you until the end. When you deviate too much from the conventions, you break the spell. You don't want your reader to have to work so hard at breaking the code of "this is me" that they pay more attention to your idiosyncrasies than the story you are trying to tell.

 

[Djmac1031]

I think the piece that is missing in this conversation is that using generally accepted grammar, punctuation, etc. is not about pleasing an editor or moderator, it's about presenting a story that is accessible for the readers. And there is more to that than just whether or not they can follow the narrative or understand the dialogue. You want the reader to immerse themselves in your story, to stay with you until the end. When you deviate too much from the conventions, you break the spell. You don't want your reader to have to work so hard at breaking the code of "this is me" that they pay more attention to your idiosyncrasies than the story you are trying to tell.

 

[PapaRomantic]

Sometimes my intent is to make the reader imagine how the characters are feeling without literally feeding them the words. But im learning to conform. Didn't like the thought of others editing it, might judge me

I don't get this comment. You don't want an editor possibly judging you, but your readers will judge you, because that's what readers do. An editor will at least help keep them from judging you for lazy grammar.

 

[XerXesXu]

Would I like Literotica to run two different versions of my story. The original non filtered me v the edited and glossy version actually I'd like that just to see what the different reactions are.

So now I'll have to grow up and write proper conversations,, but the story well that is "this is me"

Any chance of you posting 200 words of the 'real you' which was rejected. It may be semi-literate, it may be high literature, even Joycean, but without sight of a specimen we can't tell.

 

[AwkwardMD]

I don't get this comment. You don't want an editor possibly judging you, but your readers will judge you, because that's what readers do. An editor will at least help keep them from judging you for lazy grammar.

It's a long-winded way of explaining she plans to "Show, don't tell" with just a hind of stylistic defensiveness.

Which is fine. New authors being defensive about their style is common enough, and taking the time to "explain how the real world works" instead of letting nature take its course rarely works out for anyone.

 

[SimonDoom]

I think the piece that is missing in this conversation is that using generally accepted grammar, punctuation, etc. is not about pleasing an editor or moderator, it's about presenting a story that is accessible for the readers. And there is more to that than just whether or not they can follow the narrative or understand the dialogue. You want the reader to immerse themselves in your story, to stay with you until the end. When you deviate too much from the conventions, you break the spell. You don't want your reader to have to work so hard at breaking the code of "this is me" that they pay more attention to your idiosyncrasies than the story you are trying to tell.

I agree with this, and I also think in most cases there is an unwarranted conceit in authors who think that the basic conventions of the English language will restrict them from expressing their art to the fullest and saying what they want to say. The truth is that in almost all cases they simply don't know how to use those conventions well enough and they're too lazy to learn.

Not to pile on, but the OP's posts in this thread show a variety of errors. The OP very likely would do well to see rejection as a learning opportunity rather than as having their creativity stifled.

 

[MelissaBaby]

I agree with this, and I also think in most cases there is an unwarranted conceit in authors who think that the basic conventions of the English language will restrict them from expressing their art to the fullest and saying what they want to say. The truth is that in almost all cases they simply don't know how to use those conventions well enough and they're too lazy to learn.

Not to pile on, but the OP's posts in this thread show a variety of errors. The OP very likely would do well to see rejection as a learning opportunity rather than as having their creativity stifled.

As many of us have learned and expressed, you have to know the rules before you can know how to break them.

 

[Bamagan]

I agree with this, and I also think in most cases there is an unwarranted conceit in authors who think that the basic conventions of the English language will restrict them from expressing their art to the fullest and saying what they want to say. The truth is that in almost all cases they simply don't know how to use those conventions well enough and they're too lazy to learn.

Not to pile on, but the OP's posts in this thread show a variety of errors. The OP very likely would do well to see rejection as a learning opportunity rather than as having their creativity stifled.

It's an approach that sometimes works in other mediums, like painting and visual arts, although there are those who hate such works when they become "too" abstract. I know people sometimes talk about Picasso and Dali as examples, but I'm thinking more of Pollack or Mondrian. So I can kind of understand where people might be coming from, approaching writing the same way, with the hope that splattering words and phrases will evoke an emotional response rather than relay a conventional message. But yeah, I've yet to see one that evoked anything but confusion, frustration, or contempt from readers, probably because it usually is a result of sloppiness rather than a sincere and principled critique or protest about the limitations of language as a medium.
To the OP @SinderellaSin : If you don't want to learn how to write conventionally, maybe resubmit your story as 'free verse' erotic poetry. The people who like free verse might be inclined to give you a pass on shoddy grammar. People who favor literary smut will probably not be as forgiving as they are.

 

[ronde]

Hi all

I write on a phone on a small screen just write what comes into my head(sometimes what's happened to me) and yes I have my own style. I can't see how big a paragraph is. So how big should a paragraph be. When I looked at it in page form some of it would be 12 to 16 lines long. Too much? But I can't tell as I type.

So onto editing, god im awful at conversation. So literotica tells me. Rejected twice read this essay on how to improve conversations. I say "this is me". Maybe i like my reader to think whose saying each line, to think how they are feeling, imagine it rather than being told. This is the way I write, everyone's different. I love Dwayne a dom black male to be written in caps when he speaks. But that's wrong. No its right it's dominance in my head.


Anyway I read the literotica essay on constructing conversations and now I'll try to rewrite it as they like, with the help of an editor. Will it lose something. It won't be authentic me. Will it gain something. Yes I'll probably add more detail and yes it will probably be better.


Would I like Literotica to run two different versions of my story. The original non filtered me v the edited and glossy version actually I'd like that just to see what the different reactions are.

So now I'll have to grow up and write proper conversations,, but the story well that is "this is me"


Your thoughts?

Sin x

Just trying to answer the questions of a relatively new writer. Don't take offense because we've all been there and heard the same things.

The question about paragraph length has been on this forum since 2001 and it's an important question. Unlike when reading a book, you can't just follow along with your fingertip and turn the page. You have to stop reading and scroll down to the next screen of test.

The consensus I've always seen is that ten to twelve lines of text in a paragraph are easy to read on most monitors. On my monitor, a Literotica story shows 34 lines of text, so if you write ten to twelve lines in a paragraph, the reader only has to scroll down once for every three paragraphs or so. I've never attempted to read s story on my cell phone because I have old eyes and even the biggest cell phone has a small screen.

That's also why I write on a laptop or my desktop. I can see how long the paragraphs are. Cell phones have a myriad of uses but writing stories is not one of them unless you upload to an actual computer and check the formatting before you submit.

I'm not sure what you mean about "conversations". If you mean dialogue, you can throw all conventions out the window except for proper punctuation. Phonetic spelling is fine as long as it's not over done. Slang is expected. Writing in all caps smells a lot like chatspeak or textspeak. If you want show a louder voice, most readers would just prefer one exclamation point or a statement before the dialogue like, "She raised her voice." You can show dominance the same way by showing the reader facial expressions.

Relating to your rejections, make sure you've started each separate dialogue with the quotation mark and ended that dialogue with another quotation mark. If the dialogue runs more than one paragraph, you only need a quotation mark at the start of subsequent paragraphs and a closing quotation mark at the end. I would suspect that's the cause of your rejections. Another possibility is that you haven't made clear to the reader which character is speaking. It's good to tell the reader that once in a while so they don't end up reading one characters words and thinking a different character is speaking them

As far as "your style", writing is significantly different than any other art form. In any other art form, the viewer may use the senses of sight, hearing, smell and touch to interpret the art. I writing, the reader reads words and those words paint the picture he or she sees, hears, smell, and feels. That required a common language with common rules. Attempting to make up your own "style", meaning you don't follow the rules of grammar and punctuation, will end up with you doing the equivalent of driving down the wrong lane of a road and expecting other drivers to get out of your way. It will not turn out well.

 

[Djmac1031]

Hi all

I write on a phone on a small screen just write what comes into my head(sometimes what's happened to me) and yes I have my own style. I can't see how big a paragraph is. So how big should a paragraph be. When I looked at it in page form some of it would be 12 to 16 lines long. Too much? But I can't tell as I type.

So onto editing, god im awful at conversation. So literotica tells me. Rejected twice read this essay on how to improve conversations. I say "this is me". Maybe i like my reader to think whose saying each line, to think how they are feeling, imagine it rather than being told. This is the way I write, everyone's different. I love Dwayne a dom black male to be written in caps when he speaks. But that's wrong. No its right it's dominance in my head.


Anyway I read the literotica essay on constructing conversations and now I'll try to rewrite it as they like, with the help of an editor. Will it lose something. It won't be authentic me. Will it gain something. Yes I'll probably add more detail and yes it will probably be better.


Would I like Literotica to run two different versions of my story. The original non filtered me v the edited and glossy version actually I'd like that just to see what the different reactions are.

So now I'll have to grow up and write proper conversations,, but the story well that is "this is me"


Your thoughts?

Sin x

So I went and browsed through your stories, and I say browsed through because honestly, they're unreadable.

There's nothing "raw" or "unfiltered" about your writing. You're not some maverick, breaking new ground in the writing word with your unique, individual style.

Your stories read as someone unable to write properly or simply too lazy to care enough to try.

By your post here I'm guessing the latter, since instead of accepting the criticism offered by both readers and those screening your submissions, you reject it in favor of coming here and complaining about it, hoping to find a sympathetic ear.

You won't find that with me, sorry.

Take responsibility for your lazy, sloppy writing and try harder.

 

[Curious_2]

This is not the right forum for this conversation. This should be in the Authors Hangout.

Ppppffffttt!

 

[AwkwardlySet]

So I went and browsed through your stories, and I say browsed through because honestly, they're unreadable.

There's nothing "raw" or "unfiltered" about your writing. You're not some maverick, breaking new ground in the writing word with your unique, individual style.

Your stories read as someone unable to write properly or simply too lazy to care enough to try.

By your post here I'm guessing the latter, since instead of accepting the criticism offered by both readers and those screening your submissions, you reject it in favor of coming here and complaining about it, hoping to find a sympathetic ear.

You won't find that with me, sorry.

Take responsibility for your lazy, sloppy writing and try harder.

You are being too harsh here.

The O.P.'s stories, while riddled with grammar and punctuation problems, are still readable, even if the mistakes interrupt the flow.
Also, coming here to ask for our thoughts seems perfectly rational to me. We even have threads on AH where we amuse ourselves with the absurdity of what some readers say, so it's not strange if the O.P. doubts their input.
The rejection of the O.P.'s submissions could have been purely automated as well. Personally, the two sources of input taken together would make me doubt myself, but again, coming here to ask for our thoughts was a reasonable thing to do.
Now, if the O.P. were to reject all our advice here, then your criticism would be spot on. The O.P. is still to reply to our posts, so let's hope otherwise.

 

[Djmac1031]

You are being too harsh here.

The O.P.'s stories, while riddled with grammar and punctuation problems, are still readable, even if the mistakes interrupt the flow.
Also, coming here to ask for our thoughts seems perfectly rational to me. We even have threads on AH where we amuse ourselves with the absurdity of what some readers say, so it's not strange if the O.P. doubts their input.
The rejection of the O.P.'s submissions could have been purely automated as well. Personally, the two sources of input taken together would make me doubt myself, but again, coming here to ask for our thoughts was a reasonable thing to do.
Now, if the O.P. were to reject all our advice here, then your criticism would be spot on. The O.P. is still to reply to our posts, so let's hope otherwise.

Respectfully disagree.

Read their post again. This isn't someone asking for help or looking for constructive criticism.

The post essentially translates to "Woah as me! I just wanna publish my poorly written completely unedited stories without fixing my mistakes but big bad Literotica won't let me! Why does no one understand my genius? Why must I be forced to conform to standards? I just wanna write the way I wanna do it."

The OP isn't looking for help. They're looking for sympathy. And an audience.

 

[BobbyBrandt]

Sometimes my intent is to make the reader imagine how the characters are feeling without literally feeding them the words

There are several literary techniques that could be used to accomplish your objective.

Here's my suggestion:

Write in your style, then convert that text to speech and listen to it. What you hear is what your readers will hear in their heads as they read your work.

If you want to focus on your style more than literary conventions, simply record your story in your own words, using your voice to set the mood, pauses between words as your punctuation, and post it as an audio story instead of a written one.

 

[onehitwanda]

pictures are often worth a thousands words:



It is a rare creature indeed who can start at position 9. The "rules" are there to ensure you appreciate them; like Chesterton's Fence, they have a function - even if it is not immediately obvious. By throwing away the rule-book to remain "true" to yourself you risk alienating anyone who might be willing to read your works.

Learn the rules, then master them within reason. Then - and only then - break them. The odds that you are a Picasso are slim; but with work and dedication you could become as close to him as makes no difference.