Alternatives to Porn, should we try together?

[MrHereWriting]

Hey, I've only started to publish. For me, Erotica stories have always been an alternative to porn, which I despise as an industry. People get hurt, mostly women, and I want to contribute to others finding their way our of it. I was wondering if other authors relate to the same idea? And if so, should we work on this together? Should we find ways to advertise our work?
In any case, here was my first attempt.
Really interested in what you think and what could be done! Let's keep it arousing and safe
Timmy, lover of stories

I apologize for the aggression, then. Your OP read as very American in the 'whoops, I guess I'll vote for fascists to protect women' kind of way I have the displeasure of witnessing on a daily basis over here. My trigger finger is a little twitchy.

What?

 

[AwkwardlySet]

I've just realized how tough the new image policy has been for Wanda.

 

[SimonDoom]

I'm reading through this exchange between you and @FrancesScott , and I'm reminded of the ending of Casablanca.

Should we book a room .

I'd say that's rushing things.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I'd say that's rushing things.

You know I'm a patient man, the champion of slow burn. Maybe a quiet scene in a café? You know that always works for me. Still, @FrancesScott is new, she might not know these things.

Carry on .

 

[fma20fma]

alternate and better than porn is on line real time txt chat and sometimes cam. simultaneous timing and sync of interests, can be m to m, or g to g, or m to f can be variants,

 

[Astrotrain]

You want some true high quality filth? Read the bible. You think the shit we write here is bad? You've got a guy who was visited by angels, the rest of the guys in the city demanding he send the angels out so they can rape them, the first guy (who is refered to as the only good guy in the city) offering to send his virgin daughters out so they can rape them instead, the other guys refuse so God nukes the city while the first guy and his family flee, the guys wife gets turned to salt because she looked back (offering your daughters up to be raped is A-OK but looking back at an exploding city is a big no no), the guy's daughters are feeling a little frisky so they get their father drunk and rape him so they can get pregnant and carry on the family line.

They go on and on about children accessing porn at a young age and being groomed, but they never mention the exact same thing happens in Sunday school.

 

[FrancesScott]

I'm reading through this exchange between you and @FrancesScott , and I'm reminded of the ending of Casablanca.

Should we book a room .

Can I be Rick, and he’s Renault. I don’t think a mustache would suit me.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Can I be Rick, and he’s Renault. I don’t think a mustache would suit me.

That's okay with me. Just make sure you duck going under the propellers.

 

[FrancesScott]

That's okay with me. Just make sure you duck going under the propellers.

Of all the blades in all the world, you have to walk into these ones…

 

[Cagivagurl]

I've tried to stay out of this thread, because for me it is a trigger.
After seeing all of the pro porn comment.
I have to affer my opinion...
Sorry.
The porn industry is the epitome with everything that is wrong with the world...
It subjugates women and minority groups like trans people.
It prays on those from troubled backgrounds. People who come from families where sexual and physical abuse was a way of life.
They have no life skills, and the sick fucks who run the porn industry jump on them.
Nobody gets sexual satisfaction from some guy jerking off over their face while he holds them down...
That visual is purely misogynistic bullshit.
That's all women are good for. Cleaning, having babies and satisfying the sick urges of men...
Seeing all these pro porn comments pisses me off, but just reinforces what a male dominated forum this is.
You can have your little fantasy's. No harm is done by them right???
Women enter porn volunteerily...
Of course, if you believe that you might find some flying elephants to catch...
The porn industry is a sewer filled with sick people who found a way to make money.
Pandering to the sexual fantasies of men...
Yeah, I get it... I'm prepared for the retorts... I'm a righteous idiot... Who thinks only my opinion matters...
Maybe I am, but I'm prepared to offer it as the counter point here...
It is only my opinion, but it as relevant as every other one here....
My opinion. The porn industry shows the worst sides of humanity...

Cagivagurl.

 

[Astrotrain]

I've tried to stay out of this thread, because for me it is a trigger.
After seeing all of the pro porn comment.
I have to affer my opinion...
Sorry.
The porn industry is the epitome with everything that is wrong with the world...
It subjugates women and minority groups like trans people.
It prays on those from troubled backgrounds. People who come from families where sexual and physical abuse was a way of life.
They have no life skills, and the sick fucks who run the porn industry jump on them.
Nobody gets sexual satisfaction from some guy jerking off over their face while he holds them down...
That visual is purely misogynistic bullshit.
That's all women are good for. Cleaning, having babies and satisfying the sick urges of men...
Seeing all these pro porn comments pisses me off, but just reinforces what a male dominated forum this is.
You can have your little fantasy's. No harm is done by them right???
Women enter porn volunteerily...
Of course, if you believe that you might find some flying elephants to catch...
The porn industry is a sewer filled with sick people who found a way to make money.
Pandering to the sexual fantasies of men...
Yeah, I get it... I'm prepared for the retorts... I'm a righteous idiot... Who thinks only my opinion matters...
Maybe I am, but I'm prepared to offer it as the counter point here...
It is only my opinion, but it as relevant as every other one here....
My opinion. The porn industry shows the worst sides of humanity...

Cagivagurl.

I'm sorry you feel this way or if anything happened to you. But why are you on this website? Do you think because it's written word it's not exploitative? There are plenty of anti porn people who would think the stories here "cater to sick male fantasies" and would want the site shut down.

 

[Cagivagurl]

I'm sorry you feel this way or if anything happened to you. But why are you on this website? Do you think because it's written word it's not exploitative? There are plenty of anti porn people who would think the stories here "cater to sick male fantasies" and would want the site shut down.

I'm here because I enjoy erotica.... I enjoy reading, and writing it. Erotica is fine... It's fun so long as it's consensual, regardless of the genre...
We, the human inhabitants of this Planet are one people. The human race...

As far as this site is concerned. I don't disagree, there are probably stories within Literotica that are as you describe...
Exploitation is everywhere. In every media platform. Music, film, literature. It lives in business, in politics, religion. It is everywhere we look.
My opinion is, Porn is the epitome of the very worst of it.
All of the worst traits of humanity are on show... Making money from others misfortune... Using their positions to force people into situations they don't want to be in...
Porn in film is aimed at the male population because it's visual.
These are only my opinions.
But... I stand behind them...

BTW... Trying to reduce my comments because I may have been hurt, is demeaning. My opinions are as valid as yours or anybody else's.

Cagivagurl

 

[FrancesScott]

I've tried to stay out of this thread, because for me it is a trigger.
After seeing all of the pro porn comment.
I have to affer my opinion...
Sorry.
The porn industry is the epitome with everything that is wrong with the world...
It subjugates women and minority groups like trans people.
It prays on those from troubled backgrounds. People who come from families where sexual and physical abuse was a way of life.
They have no life skills, and the sick fucks who run the porn industry jump on them.
Nobody gets sexual satisfaction from some guy jerking off over their face while he holds them down...
That visual is purely misogynistic bullshit.
That's all women are good for. Cleaning, having babies and satisfying the sick urges of men...
Seeing all these pro porn comments pisses me off, but just reinforces what a male dominated forum this is.
You can have your little fantasy's. No harm is done by them right???
Women enter porn volunteerily...
Of course, if you believe that you might find some flying elephants to catch...
The porn industry is a sewer filled with sick people who found a way to make money.
Pandering to the sexual fantasies of men...
Yeah, I get it... I'm prepared for the retorts... I'm a righteous idiot... Who thinks only my opinion matters...
Maybe I am, but I'm prepared to offer it as the counter point here...
It is only my opinion, but it as relevant as every other one here....
My opinion. The porn industry shows the worst sides of humanity...

Cagivagurl.

First off, I respect your opinion. All of what you say is valid, and I think true of much of the porn industry.

But my perspective is this. There is nothing inherently wrong with manufacturing, it’s how we dragged ourselves out of the dark ages. But… it can also mean children working fifteen hour days and slowly being poisoned by the materials they are assembling to meet some first world need for a cheap gadget.

The problem is us (channeling Taylor Swift). Humans suck. Many humans want to get ahead and don’t care who they climb over to get there. So, same as manufacturing, in porn we get situations where the vulnerable are exploited to line someone’s pockets.

But… also like manufacturing, I don’t believe that porn itself is evil. I think celebrating sexuality is wonderful. Now I know most porn doesn’t exactly celebrate sexuality. But I see the way to improve the lot of sex wokers lies in not demonizing what they do. Maybe then there is space for sex work to become just work. The unhealthy stigma around anything to do with sex is one thing that allows abuse to go on unchecked.

I hope you don’t feel I’m arguing with you. I accept how you describe the current situation. I suppose I have a different view on how to address the undoubted problems.

 

[FrancesScott]

First off, I respect your opinion. All of what you say is valid, and I think true of much of the porn industry.

But my perspective is this. There is nothing inherently wrong with manufacturing, it’s how we dragged ourselves out of the dark ages. But… it can also mean children working fifteen hour days and slowly being poisoned by the materials they are assembling to meet some first world need for a cheap gadget.

The problem is us (channeling Taylor Swift). Humans suck. Many humans want to get ahead and don’t care who they climb over to get there. So, same as manufacturing, in porn we get situations where the vulnerable are exploited to line someone’s pockets.

But… also like manufacturing, I don’t believe that porn itself is evil. I think celebrating sexuality is wonderful. Now I know most porn doesn’t exactly celebrate sexuality. But I see the way to improve the lot of sex wokers lies in not demonizing what they do. Maybe then there is space for sex work to become just work. The unhealthy stigma around anything to do with sex is one thing that allows abuse to go on unchecked.

I hope you don’t feel I’m arguing with you. I accept how you describe the current situation. I suppose I have a different view on how to address the undoubted problems.

And I utterly oppose those who want to ban porn not because they are concerned about women’s welfare, but the total opposite. Those who believe that sex is a sin unless between a married man and woman and ideally for the purpose of procreation, which is a woman’s only true purpose in life. Fuck that shit!

 

[SimonDoom]

Women enter porn volunteerily...
Of course, if you believe that you might find some flying elephants to catch...
The porn industry is a sewer filled with sick people who found a way to make money.


Cagivagurl.

Here's my problem with what you're saying. I do not dispute that for many women the porn industry is this way.

But not ALL women.

Consider the OnlyFans phenomenon. A woman decides she wants to post "pornographic" images and videos of herself online. She does all the work herself. After OF takes its 20% cut, which is by industry standards low, she pockets all the rest. She makes money. She supports herself. At no point in the process does she deal with men who exploit or demean her. She has total control over the content she creates and distributes.

There are women who have done this and who've done interviews and said they're glad they did it, that it was a positive experience, that it allowed them to attain more financial security, express themselves, etc., etc.

I'm not going to get into a debate about how representative or "normal" this is, but there clearly are women who say this is how it was.

Do you just completely discount these experiences? If so, why? What they're doing clearly is porn, but how is it harmful?

To my way of thinking, to say that the "porn transaction" -- a woman choosing to participate in the creation of visual sexual entertainment that involves her own body -- is "inherently demeaning or bad to women" is itself a kind of misogynistic perspective. It denies full agency to women. It's obvious why conservative religious moralists want to do this. It's more interesting why people who identify with the oppposite political perspective ALSO say this.

This is my perspective. Part of what is so fun and "good" about erotica is that it represents the ability of the individual to say "I don't care what the majority's sexual experience is. This is MY experience, and I'm going to celebrate it, dammit. If you don't like it, that's too effing bad." That's part of the good of erotica, but it's also part of the good of visual porn. Your body is your own, to do with as you please.

The campaign against porn ends up as a campaign to stifle the ability of women, and men, to have control over their bodies.

 

[FrancesScott]

It's more interesting why people who identify with the oppposite political perspective ALSO say this.

As per your comment, not all of us.

I support the concept of porn as a way to express sexuality and meet sexual needs. I don’t support some aspects of some parts of the porn industry, maybe the majority of it, I have no way of making that determination.

But I see nothing inherently wrong with porn being produced by consenting adults and consumed by consenting adults. I’d also very much prefer it only portray consensual sex (which can include gang bangs, which can include bukake), but others will think differently no doubt.

 

[SimonDoom]

As per your comment, not all of us.

I support the concept of porn as a way to express sexuality and meet sexual needs. I don’t support some aspects of some parts of the porn industry, maybe the majority of it, I have no way of making that determination.

But I see nothing inherently wrong with porn being produced by consenting adults and consumed by consenting adults. I’d also very much prefer it only portray consensual sex (which can include gang bangs, which can include bukake), but others will think differently no doubt.

I became acquainted with this issue in the 1980s, and I recall reading people like Catherine McKinnon. She was very anti-porn and of the view that porn was, inherently, a form of abuse and subordination of women. That was a more plausible perspective then, because porn was something that was typically manufactured in somewhat seedy places in the San Fernando Valley, and the industry was largely controlled by men. Women in the industry had almost no power.

But in a modern digital gig economy, where increasingly everybody is an independent contractor and for a small price a woman can be her own producer and distributor, this model no longer holds. It's outdated. It may apply to some, but not all.

I disagree with you about the range of what people who create porn "should" create, because I tend to think they should create whatever they want, as long as the act of production does not itself involve abuse or nonconsent. I believe that for the vast majority of people it's understood that this is fantasy, and one can step into a fantasy space, enjoy a naughty little fantasy story, and then step back out into the "real world" unaffected except for having had a moment of pleasure. I suspect it will be difficult for anybody to "win" that debate because the facts are difficult to come by.

 

[Living_in_a_lewd_world]

I've tried to stay out of this thread, because for me it is a trigger.
After seeing all of the pro porn comment.
I have to affer my opinion...
Sorry.
The porn industry is the epitome with everything that is wrong with the world...
It subjugates women and minority groups like trans people.
It prays on those from troubled backgrounds. People who come from families where sexual and physical abuse was a way of life.
They have no life skills, and the sick fucks who run the porn industry jump on them.
Nobody gets sexual satisfaction from some guy jerking off over their face while he holds them down...
That visual is purely misogynistic bullshit.
That's all women are good for. Cleaning, having babies and satisfying the sick urges of men...
Seeing all these pro porn comments pisses me off, but just reinforces what a male dominated forum this is.
You can have your little fantasy's. No harm is done by them right???
Women enter porn volunteerily...
Of course, if you believe that you might find some flying elephants to catch...
The porn industry is a sewer filled with sick people who found a way to make money.
Pandering to the sexual fantasies of men...
Yeah, I get it... I'm prepared for the retorts... I'm a righteous idiot... Who thinks only my opinion matters...
Maybe I am, but I'm prepared to offer it as the counter point here...
It is only my opinion, but it as relevant as every other one here....
My opinion. The porn industry shows the worst sides of humanity...

Cagivagurl.

I read the frustration and pain in your post, and I understand that the porn industry is a deeply polarizing topic, especially given its troubled history and many well-documented abuses. Your concerns about exploitation, misogyny, and harm are valid and important.

However, I think it’s worth considering that the industry isn’t a monolith, and painting it with such a broad brush overlooks important nuances and progress.

I actually don’t know how much of a ‘mainstream’ porn-industry currently still exists but afaik they struggled quite a lot in the last decades as big platforms like Pornhub made the content available for free and on the other hand platforms like Only-Fans and Co. allowed performers to work more independently. One of the problems, that women in the industry currently face are kind of exploitative “managers” which initially promise lots of money for girls going to Only-Fans with harmless stuff and then try to get them to do more and more hardcore things while keeping big parts of the earnings – not everyone is like that, but there are some significant black sheeps.

But there is also a big indie porn scene, that has developed. Many women there aren’t just performers but also producers, directors, and creators who have significant control over their work like Erika Lust, Ovidie or Paulita Pappel. They’re crafting content that aligns with their values, often prioritizing consent, authenticity, and creative expression. Also and in direct connection with that, the gay and queer porn communities have carved out spaces that celebrate diverse identities and challenge traditional norms, often with a focus on empowerment rather than exploitation. These segments of the industry are driven by people who are reclaiming narratives and building ethical frameworks, which is a far cry from the outdated stereotype of predatory practices.

I also understand your dismissal of “Facials” which have become a symbol of misogyny in many critiques of porn, often representing a power imbalance, even humiliation. That discomfort makes sense, especially when these acts are shown uncritical or without clear signs of consent or mutual enjoyment.

But then I think about BDSM, which can appear far more intense - even violent - and yet is widely accepted even in many sex-positive feminist and queer spaces. So what’s the difference?

From what I’ve seen, it’s less the what is shown, and more how it’s made. In ethical BDSM and indie productions, a lot of care is put into consent and communication. There are intimacy coordinators who help advocate for performers and oversee the dynamics on set. Consent checklists are often used before filming, where performers indicate exactly what they’re okay with and what their hard limits are. These checklists don’t just protect performers legally - they also foster trust, clarity and accountability. In higher-quality productions, especially in BDSM, there’s often a check-in afterwards too - sometimes called a debrief or aftercare - to help performers calm down from a process Aftercare is also a very important thing in real-life-BDSM, as especially being the bottom in BDSM can be very exciting but also emotionally exhausting – yet not everybody is like that. I have spoken to people who told me, they rather prefer to be alone afterwards. That’s an individual thing, but must definitely be offered.

Dismissing the entire industry ignores these diverse voices and the progress being made. It also overlooks the real struggles faced by those at the margins - small indie performers, niche fetish creators, and gay and queer sex workers. These folks often face systemic barriers, like being denied credit card payments or banking services simply because they’re labeled “exploitative” by default. They’re not the ones making big money; they’re the ones working hardest to survive in an industry that’s stigmatized. Rather than condemning everyone in the industry, I think one should rather focus on supporting ethical practices and responsible creators.

I’m not a pro in this area - just someone who’s been curious and has had some contact with people performing in and producing indie porn. If you’re open to it, I’d recommend checking out some indie porn platforms created by the producers I mentioned, or looking into porn film festivals like the Porn Film Festival Berlin. They show works that are mostly very different from the stereotypical “facial scenes” you might find on Pornhub - with a strong focus on queer, feminist, and experimental films. You might even get the chance to meet the performers and producers, and hear their perspectives directly. It could be quite different from what you expect.

 

[FrancesScott]

I read the frustration and pain in your post, and I understand that the porn industry is a deeply polarizing topic, especially given its troubled history and many well-documented abuses. Your concerns about exploitation, misogyny, and harm are valid and important.

However, I think it’s worth considering that the industry isn’t a monolith, and painting it with such a broad brush overlooks important nuances and progress.

I actually don’t know how much of a ‘mainstream’ porn-industry currently still exists but afaik they struggled quite a lot in the last decades as big platforms like Pornhub made the content available for free and on the other hand platforms like Only-Fans and Co. allowed performers to work more independently. One of the problems, that women in the industry currently face are kind of exploitative “managers” which initially promise lots of money for girls going to Only-Fans with harmless stuff and then try to get them to do more and more hardcore things while keeping big parts of the earnings – not everyone is like that, but there are some significant black sheeps.

But there is also a big indie porn scene, that has developed. Many women there aren’t just performers but also producers, directors, and creators who have significant control over their work like Erika Lust, Ovidie or Paulita Pappel. They’re crafting content that aligns with their values, often prioritizing consent, authenticity, and creative expression. Also and in direct connection with that, the gay and queer porn communities have carved out spaces that celebrate diverse identities and challenge traditional norms, often with a focus on empowerment rather than exploitation. These segments of the industry are driven by people who are reclaiming narratives and building ethical frameworks, which is a far cry from the outdated stereotype of predatory practices.

I also understand your dismissal of “Facials” which have become a symbol of misogyny in many critiques of porn, often representing a power imbalance, even humiliation. That discomfort makes sense, especially when these acts are shown uncritical or without clear signs of consent or mutual enjoyment.

But then I think about BDSM, which can appear far more intense - even violent - and yet is widely accepted even in many sex-positive feminist and queer spaces. So what’s the difference?

From what I’ve seen, it’s less the what is shown, and more how it’s made. In ethical BDSM and indie productions, a lot of care is put into consent and communication. There are intimacy coordinators who help advocate for performers and oversee the dynamics on set. Consent checklists are often used before filming, where performers indicate exactly what they’re okay with and what their hard limits are. These checklists don’t just protect performers legally - they also foster trust, clarity and accountability. In higher-quality productions, especially in BDSM, there’s often a check-in afterwards too - sometimes called a debrief or aftercare - to help performers calm down from a process Aftercare is also a very important thing in real-life-BDSM, as especially being the bottom in BDSM can be very exciting but also emotionally exhausting – yet not everybody is like that. I have spoken to people who told me, they rather prefer to be alone afterwards. That’s an individual thing, but must definitely be offered.

Dismissing the entire industry ignores these diverse voices and the progress being made. It also overlooks the real struggles faced by those at the margins - small indie performers, niche fetish creators, and gay and queer sex workers. These folks often face systemic barriers, like being denied credit card payments or banking services simply because they’re labeled “exploitative” by default. They’re not the ones making big money; they’re the ones working hardest to survive in an industry that’s stigmatized. Rather than condemning everyone in the industry, I think one should rather focus on supporting ethical practices and responsible creators.

I’m not a pro in this area - just someone who’s been curious and has had some contact with people performing in and producing indie porn. If you’re open to it, I’d recommend checking out some indie porn platforms created by the producers I mentioned, or looking into porn film festivals like the Porn Film Festival Berlin. They show works that are mostly very different from the stereotypical “facial scenes” you might find on Pornhub - with a strong focus on queer, feminist, and experimental films. You might even get the chance to meet the performers and producers, and hear their perspectives directly. It could be quite different from what you expect.

What a thoughtful post. Thank you.

 

[KittyOfSteele]

The porn industry is the epitome with everything that is wrong with the world...
It subjugates women and minority groups like trans people.
It prays on those from troubled backgrounds. People who come from families where sexual and physical abuse was a way of life.

We could say the same about any industry, really. I could tell you about the music industry here that claim to be rescuing people from these troubled backgrounds. Do you want to know what the reality is? They turned the music community into a toxic hell where everyone is competing against each other, turning literal kids onto other kids, and spreading major anxiety issues that ended up in suicide attempts. Do you want to know who are the majority of those children? Those who come from poor neighborhoods and very low-income households; the ones where the choice is either join a gang, or survive to live the next day. Many of them were abused in this exact way too.

Does this means the entire music industry is like that here? No, but the fact that they are not only the biggest portion, but also endorsed by the government already tells they are the ones who set the standard. The problem is that nobody talks about it because [REDACTED] is perfect the way it is! They are doing God's work on keeping the youth at bay from violence through music, and yadda yadda yadda, but how could you call this doing good when you're making children wanting to kill themselves?

I'm redacting that name because I'll probably get in trouble if I whistleblow things with first and last name.

E: Not trying to divert the argument. Just making the comparison to another industry who might actually be just as unethical as you see the porn industry.

Women enter porn volunteerily...
Of course, if you believe that you might find some flying elephants to catch...

TIL I groomed myself to be a webcam model and even make porn of myself just for funsies?

This is just insulting. I get you don't like it, but this generalization right here is where I draw the line.

 

[MelissaBaby]

I've used this in the past when similar issues have come up, but, at the risk of pissing off PSG, I'll quote my own writing here to express my opinion.

From The Gold Dollar Girls, a conversation between a stripper, Charlene (aka Clover), and her lawyer.

"You don't have a very good opinion of sex workers, do you?" Charlene asked.

"Well, my job would be easier if you were a waitress or a secretary," Bridget said.

"I get that. But you, personally. I kind of feel like you look down on me."

Bridget shook her head. "Honestly, I don't. You do what you have to do. But in a general sense, yes, I have a problem with women selling their bodies for money."

"Uh huh. Well, you know what? My Dad worked his whole life down at the old stamping plant. Eight hours a day, punching holes in sheets of metal. I remember, when I was just a little girl, asking him why he only had eight fingers. So, you know, maybe we have different ideas of what it means for a person to sell their bodies."

 

[Astrotrain]

On the facials issue, it's a bit presumptive to assume no woman likes it and it's inherently derogatory. Some women like it and some don't. And there's plenty of men who enjoy it when a woman cums on his face, I can tell you that.

 

[FrancesScott]

On the facials issue, it's a bit presumptive to assume no woman likes it and it's inherently derogatory. Some women like it and some don't. And there's plenty of men who enjoy it when a woman cums on his face, I can tell you that.

All generalizations are erroneous, including the one about Cretans.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

I've used this in the past when similar issues have come up, but, at the risk of pissing off PSG, I'll quote my own writing here to express my opinion.

From The Gold Dollar Girls, a conversation between a stripper, Charlene (aka Clover), and her lawyer.

There is being tolerant, and there is not judging. All of us should arm ourselves with those two when we treat everyone else, regardless of how much we disagree with their choices. But tolerance and not judging are still different from normalizing. In these discussions, here or elsewhere, I always try to emphasize that point.

 

[Cagivagurl]

We could say the same about any industry, really. I could tell you about the music industry here that claim to be rescuing people from these troubled backgrounds. Do you want to know what the reality is? They turned the music community into a toxic hell where everyone is competing against each other, turning literal kids onto other kids, and spreading major anxiety issues that ended up in suicide attempts. Do you want to know who are the majority of those children? Those who come from poor neighborhoods and very low-income households; the ones where the choice is either join a gang, or survive to live the next day. Many of them were abused in this exact way too.

Does this means the entire music industry is like that here? No, but the fact that they are not only the biggest portion, but also endorsed by the government already tells they are the ones who set the standard. The problem is that nobody talks about it because [REDACTED] is perfect the way it is! They are doing God's work on keeping the youth at bay from violence through music, and yadda yadda yadda, but how could you call this doing good when you're making children wanting to kill themselves?

I'm redacting that name because I'll probably get in trouble if I whistleblow things with first and last name.

E: Not trying to divert the argument. Just making the comparison to another industry who might actually be just as unethical as you see the porn industry.



TIL I groomed myself to be a webcam model and even make porn of myself just for funsies?

This is just insulting. I get you don't like it, but this generalization right here is where I draw the line.

I do not disagree, I mentioned in my comment, that those beliefs run in every element of society. Being a musician, I am well aware of the misogynistic exploitive nature of the industry. At least recently, there has been a push to rid the industry of the disgusting pigs who have ruled the roost.
I'm sure everybody reading, can insert other industry's that exploit people.

Porn is the worst, and yes that is my opinion only. It is a sewer pit of humanity. People, not only women forced into horrific acts of degradation to try and make a living.
I'm sure there are people who enter the industry of their own volition. Every rule has an exception. Do they do so because it was their first choice? Because they've always wanted to be a porn star?
I doubt that. They do so (Mostly) due to having no alternative. Again, my opinion only...
You have your views on the world, and I accept we see things differently. Your opinion, is as valid is mine...
I make my comments because there has to be a balance.
The forum is made up mostly of men, so the argument is always stilted. Porn is great... Non consensual sex is amazing... Yes, I get sick of seeing those comments unchallenged....
I do not apologise for my opinions, right or wrong. They are mine and I will continue to make them...
Every coin has two sides....

Cagivagurl