Will the left give DT any credit for his handling of that war so far?

[Rickslaw101]

Been watching MSNBC and scanning social media to find out what the left is saying. Their key points boil down to three laughably lame arguments.

1. The world is more dangerous now because the peace loving, trustworthy Iranian regime has had its uranium enrichment capabilities for military purposes blown to smithereens.

2. By launching a highly successful surprise bombing strike on Iran’s nuclear facilities to fulfill his warning to Iran and his longstanding commitment to eliminating Iran’s nuclear weapons objectives, President Trump proved he’s a chicken.

3. President Trump should be impeached because he, like some of his predecessors (including Obama), launched a tactical military action on an adversarial foreign country, without seeking congressional approval.

This thread has grown remarkably silent since Trump actually took out Iran's nuclear capability. BabyBoomer50, you're spot on. The Dem's are like Iran - they have nothing left to shoot, but they continue to shoot their mouths off. Iran says, "how horrible that America destroyed peaceful Iran's peaceful nuclear program" (that was enriching uranium to 60+% which is absurdly so far beyond the peaceful purity requirement of 3.67%). Nevermind that Iran launched a botched genocidal attack on Israel through their proxy Hamas a year and a half ago. The Dem's say, "Trump must be impeached for launching a military attack on a foreign power" - as if it's never been done before; as if the possible need for quick decisive action on the part of the President was not contemplated by the Commander in Chief provisions of the US Constitution. And nevermind that said foreign power has killed hundreds if not thousands of Americans over the past 40 years and continues to threaten "Death to America."

The Dems are just pissed that as with the border, Trump has called their bluff. Peace and national security CAN be achieved through strength and a strong backbone. Too bad presidents like Trump don't come along more often.

 

[HisArpy]

We're at war with Iran and I'm going to a pool party.

Oh you dirty little B...

 

[HisArpy]

I said yesterday the Orange mouth was bluffing. Now that he's giving it two weeks (where have I heard that before) I know he is bluffing.

Welp, this didn't age well.

I'm not waiting on teh memo explaining about how TACO is now no longer to be used in reference to Trump...

 

[DraggonStone]

Iran will release suicide bombers like flying monkeys

 

[dmallord]

This thread has grown remarkably silent since Trump actually took out Iran's nuclear capability. BabyBoomer50, you're spot on. The Dem's are like Iran - they have nothing left to shoot, but they continue to shoot their mouths off. Iran says, "how horrible that America destroyed peaceful Iran's peaceful nuclear program" (that was enriching uranium to 60+% which is absurdly so far beyond the peaceful purity requirement of 3.67%). Nevermind that Iran launched a botched genocidal attack on Israel through their proxy Hamas a year and a half ago. The Dem's say, "Trump must be impeached for launching a military attack on a foreign power" - as if it's never been done before; as if the possible need for quick decisive action on the part of the President was not contemplated by the Commander in Chief provisions of the US Constitution. And nevermind that said foreign power has killed hundreds if not thousands of Americans over the past 40 years and continues to threaten "Death to America."

The Dems are just pissed that as with the border, Trump has called their bluff. Peace and national security CAN be achieved through strength and a strong backbone. Too bad presidents like Trump don't come along more often.

I'm glad presidents like Trump are few and far between. Not because of his military engagement in Iran, but for a long list of attacks against our Constitution. A topic for another time, meanwhile...

TACO finally stopped equivocating. Good for him. He contradicted himself, saying there would be no wars under his presidency. We are at this point where he found himself having to develop a spine. Now, we face the uncertainty of where and when Iran will retaliate.

His blithe statement of one-and-done strikes is laughable. We aren't done. We've been drawn in and must return to pound the land into rubble or force the political mechanism to accept defeat. That's not in the cards at the moment.

At home, here in the USA, flag-waving folks are cheering. The same ones who demand a secure border and economic gains from the felon who heads our nation in the opposite direction. The cost of this new war effort will add trillions to the controversial budget that is gasping for air in the legislature.

Yep, God help the USA, the Arabs, the Iranians, and the world.

Some here laugh that the uranium was already moved, and presumably that the destruction of those sites was pointless. No so. The billions that it cost Iran to dig those caverns and the equipment replacements are devastating to their economy. If the results of the strikes, which are due out today, confirm their obliteration, it will set back further production abilities to nearly zero for decades.

As near insane as Trump is, I think he got this engagement right. Will he have the guts to follow through and not stop at the one-and-done lunacy statement?

 

[icanhelp1]

I'm glad presidents like Trump are few and far between. Not because of his military engagement in Iran, but for a long list of attacks against our Constitution. A topic for another time, meanwhile...

TACO finally stopped equivocating. Good for him. He contradicted himself, saying there would be no wars under his presidency. We are at this point where he found himself having to develop a spine. Now, we face the uncertainty of where and when Iran will retaliate.

His blithe statement of one-and-done strikes is laughable. We aren't done. We've been drawn in and must return to pound the land into rubble or force the political mechanism to accept defeat. That's not in the cards at the moment.

At home, here in the USA, flag-waving folks are cheering. The same ones who demand a secure border and economic gains from the felon who heads our nation in the opposite direction. The cost of this new war effort will add trillions to the controversial budget that is gasping for air in the legislature.

Yep, God help the USA, the Arabs, the Iranians, and the world.

Some here laugh that the uranium was already moved, and presumably that the destruction of those sites was pointless. No so. The billions that it cost Iran to dig those caverns and the equipment replacements are devastating to their economy. If the results of the strikes, which are due out today, confirm their obliteration, it will set back further production abilities to nearly zero for decades.

As near insane as Trump is, I think he got this engagement right. Will he have the guts to follow through and not stop at the one-and-done lunacy statement?

If only Biden had done his job in the first place!

 

[PaxNurgle]

Been watching MSNBC and scanning social media to find out what the left is saying. Their key points boil down to three laughably lame arguments.

1. The world is more dangerous now because the peace loving, trustworthy Iranian regime has had its uranium enrichment capabilities for military purposes blown to smithereens.

2. By launching a highly successful surprise bombing strike on Iran’s nuclear facilities to fulfill his warning to Iran and his longstanding commitment to eliminating Iran’s nuclear weapons objectives, President Trump proved he’s a chicken.

3. President Trump should be impeached because he, like some of his predecessors (including Obama), launched a tactical military action on an adversarial foreign country, without seeking congressional approval.

The thing is, these are all MORE THAN VALID reasons- to not only criticize Trump, but, for the good of the world and for America, to do what should have been done long ago. Not just impeach him, but remove him from office and throw him in jail.

These are not laughable arguments. These are all very rational and sound. I am certainly no friend or apologist for Iran, but I don't think you realize what he has done here.

The one saving grace about Trump- the one redeeming thing- was that he was not about to get America embroiled in a new overseas conflict. Well guess what boys- he's just started World War Three, and America is the aggressor. America struck a foreign country with no warning or justification. Remember, When the Japanese did this to the U.S. in 1941, it ended badly for them- and we all know how it ended. The world was on America's side in that one.

What happened yesterday is no different than what Japan did to America in 1941. No different. If you support this at all, then fuck you. Seriously. Trump has made the U.S. the bad guys in his new war. The America I grew up in were the good guys.

Hope you are happy.

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

The thing is, these are all MORE THAN VALID reasons- to not only criticize Trump, but, for the good of the world and for America, to do what should have been done long ago. Not just impeach him, but remove him from office and throw him in jail.

These are not laughable arguments. These are all very rational and sound. I am certainly no friend or apologist for Iran, but I don't think you realize what he has done here.

The one saving grace about Trump- the one redeeming thing- was that he was not about to get America embroiled in a new overseas conflict. Well guess what boys- he's just started World War Three, and America is the aggressor. America struck a foreign country with no warning or justification. Remember, When the Japanese did this to the U.S. in 1941, it ended badly for them- and we all know how it ended. The world was on America's side in that one.

What happened yesterday is no different than what Japan did to America in 1941. No different. If you support this at all, then fuck you. Seriously. Trump has made the U.S. the bad guys in his new war. The America I grew up in were the good guys.

Hope you are happy.

This is an excellent example of the kind of thinking that we’ve come to expect from the left. You believe that the US bombing of nuclear weapon facilities of a country run by religious fanatics that sponsor global terrorism, including attacks on Americans, is equivalent to Japan launching a surprise attack on on Pearl Harbor.

Dear Democrats, please get Pax a platform to amplify this kind of messaging.

 

[Rickslaw101]

I'm glad presidents like Trump are few and far between. Not because of his military engagement in Iran, but for a long list of attacks against our Constitution. A topic for another time, meanwhile...

TACO finally stopped equivocating. Good for him. He contradicted himself, saying there would be no wars under his presidency. We are at this point where he found himself having to develop a spine. Now, we face the uncertainty of where and when Iran will retaliate.

His blithe statement of one-and-done strikes is laughable. We aren't done. We've been drawn in and must return to pound the land into rubble or force the political mechanism to accept defeat. That's not in the cards at the moment.

At home, here in the USA, flag-waving folks are cheering. The same ones who demand a secure border and economic gains from the felon who heads our nation in the opposite direction. The cost of this new war effort will add trillions to the controversial budget that is gasping for air in the legislature.

Yep, God help the USA, the Arabs, the Iranians, and the world.

Some here laugh that the uranium was already moved, and presumably that the destruction of those sites was pointless. No so. The billions that it cost Iran to dig those caverns and the equipment replacements are devastating to their economy. If the results of the strikes, which are due out today, confirm their obliteration, it will set back further production abilities to nearly zero for decades.

As near insane as Trump is, I think he got this engagement right. Will he have the guts to follow through and not stop at the one-and-done lunacy statement?

dmallord, I agree with most of your points. You are clearly a thinking Dem, and i respect that. I do wish however that you'd avoid the obvious temptation to tout the "felon in the White House" label which is clearly the label awarded only because of the weaponization of the Justice Department under Joe Biden's minions. As for Trump's "equivocation" on bombing Iran's nuclear sites, please keep in mind the need for "OpSec" and the dilemma of wanting on the one hand to be transparent while on the other hand not tipping one's hand to the enemy who shouts "Death to America" and who seeks to build a nuclear weapon to effectuate that wish. I for one am in awe of the degree to which Trump managed to speak the truth about intentions without damaging OpSec. This was a masterful operation - "Midnight Hammer!" love that!!

 

[LLCox]

Welp, this didn't age well.

Ya can't win'um all.

 

[dmallord]

dmallord, I agree with most of your points. You are clearly a thinking Dem, and i respect that. I do wish however that you'd avoid the obvious temptation to tout the "felon in the White House" label which is clearly the label awarded only because of the weaponization of the Justice Department under Joe Biden's minions. As for Trump's "equivocation" on bombing Iran's nuclear sites, please keep in mind the need for "OpSec" and the dilemma of wanting on the one hand to be transparent while on the other hand not tipping one's hand to the enemy who shouts "Death to America" and who seeks to build a nuclear weapon to effectuate that wish. I for one am in awe of the degree to which Trump managed to speak the truth about intentions without damaging OpSec. This was a masterful operation - "Midnight Hammer!" love that!!

I'll consider calling the felon by his title when others stop referencing Joe Biden as sleepy-eyed, demented, and 'weaponizing the Justice Department by using his minions.' You ask me to refrain, but you continue to use similar terms–you missed the irony?

The attack plan was indeed awesome, designed and carried out by Joint USA military forces... not by any of the felon's minions in his cabinet.

The optics of the mission teeter on the edge of serious violations. The President did not inform Congress nor seek approval for his actions before the strike as is required. Without a declaration of war, the USA attacked a foreign nation first, declared it must submit to unconditional surrender, and then demanded it come to a negotiating meeting. What is there to admire about that aspect of the event?

He point-blank told Iran it had two weeks to realize he meant taking action and allowed that time for them to arrange for peace terms. He lied. Consequently, millions are in the streets of Iran chanting death to America! That is in no way a masterful operation from the political standpoint.

Question: Where is the missing enriched uranium? How much more dangerous is the situation now?

Yes, our military acted spectacularly from the perspective of a singular mission. But the political aspects of that action seem to have failed in a follow-up plan.

 

[Lazaran]

Welp, this didn't age well.

I'm not waiting on teh memo explaining about how TACO is now no longer to be used in reference to Trump...

Derpy, etc, seem to miss that DonOld DID “chicken out” (“CAVED”, actually).

DonOld CAVED to Netanyahu and "the war hawks" - while DonOld simultaneously BETRAYED his MAGAt base who believed DonOld wouldn’t get the US entangled in foreign conflicts. (DonOld ALSO BETRAYED all the Arab / Muslim Americans who voted for DonOld because "they believed DonOld would be better for peace in the Middle East").

Oops.



Also:

Derpy, etc, seem to miss that “two weeks” is more of a joke about how “two weeks” means NOTHING when DonOld says it.

In THIS instance (the attack on Fordo, etc) when DonOld said “two weeks”, it ALSO meant NOTHING.



Ultimately:

TACO certainly STILL applies to DonOld - and when DonOld says “two weeks”, it STILL means NOTHING.

Hope that ^ helps.



Derpy



We. Told. Them. So.

 

[Saint_Ann]

What is it now? A 12 day war?

 

[PaxNurgle]

This is an excellent example of the kind of thinking that we’ve come to expect from the left. You believe that the US bombing of nuclear weapon facilities of a country run by religious fanatics that sponsor global terrorism, including attacks on Americans, is equivalent to Japan launching a surprise attack on on Pearl Harbor.

Dear Democrats, please get Pax a platform to amplify this kind of messaging.

The Japanese used similar justification in their attack on Pearl Harbor. Just saying. It was an unprovoked act of aggression. Just like Japan's act of unprovoked aggression in 1941.

We (the U.S.) was not at war with Iran. Now we are. Iran is Russia's ally. So basically, we may well have just provoked World War 3. (Had Russia launched a sruprise attack on Canada what would the US do?) Does that sound like something admirable? The intel suggested Iran was building nukes. There was no proof or evidence of this, much like the false justification to invade Iraq in 2003 under the pretext of non-existent "Weapons of mass destruction." Afghanistan attacked the U.S, and there was more than enough justification to go to war against them- but there was no justification for Iraq in 2003- and no justification for Iran in 2025. Remember Iran has NEVER directly attacked America on it's own soil.

Most people who supported Trump (and yes, believe it, or not at one time that included me! Prior to the 2016 general election anyway) did so on the pretense that he would avoid getting America entangled in another war halfway across the globe. He broke the one promise, the one redeeming value he could have brought to this country.

 

[Lazaran]

The Japanese used similar justification in their attack on Pearl Harbor. Just saying. It was an unprovoked act of aggression. Just like Japan's act of unprovoked aggression in 1941.

We (the U.S.) was not at war with Iran. Now we are. Iran is Russia's ally. So basically, we may well have just provoked World War 3. (Had Russia launched a sruprise attack on Canada what would the US do?) Does that sound like something admirable? The intel suggested Iran was building nukes. There was no proof or evidence of this, much like the false justification to invade Iraq in 2003 under the pretext of non-existent "Weapons of mass destruction." Afghanistan attacked the U.S, and there was more than enough justification to go to war against them- but there was no justification for Iraq in 2003- and no justification for Iran in 2025. Remember Iran has NEVER directly attacked America on it's own soil.

Most people who supported Trump (and yes, believe it, or not at one time that included me! Prior to the 2016 general election anyway) did so on the pretense that he would avoid getting America entangled in another war halfway across the globe. He broke the one promise, the one redeeming value he could have brought to this country.

Iran and the U.S. have been at war to one degree or another for the past 45+ years.

 

[dmallord]

What is it now? A 12 day war?

I think he meant a two-week war, maybe followed by another in two weeks. Two weeks seems to be the mantra.

 

[Mercury_Maniac]

I was told there were no wars under DT.

Yeah here comes the nobel peace prize

 

[BabyBoomer50s]

The Japanese used similar justification in their attack on Pearl Harbor. Just saying. It was an unprovoked act of aggression. Just like Japan's act of unprovoked aggression in 1941.

We (the U.S.) was not at war with Iran. Now we are. Iran is Russia's ally. So basically, we may well have just provoked World War 3. (Had Russia launched a sruprise attack on Canada what would the US do?) Does that sound like something admirable? The intel suggested Iran was building nukes. There was no proof or evidence of this, much like the false justification to invade Iraq in 2003 under the pretext of non-existent "Weapons of mass destruction." Afghanistan attacked the U.S, and there was more than enough justification to go to war against them- but there was no justification for Iraq in 2003- and no justification for Iran in 2025. Remember Iran has NEVER directly attacked America on it's own soil.

Most people who supported Trump (and yes, believe it, or not at one time that included me! Prior to the 2016 general election anyway) did so on the pretense that he would avoid getting America entangled in another war halfway across the globe. He broke the one promise, the one redeeming value he could have brought to this country.

The Pearl Harbor comparison is silly. The US strike on Iran was not unprovoked. Iran is a hostile country that has been engaged in a proxy war against the US for decades and it is pursuing nuclear weapons capabilities that threaten the entire world.

The strike was nothing like the “endless wars” such as Iraq, Afghanistan, or even Ukraine that Trump campaigned against. Not a single American soldier’s boot touched the ground and the entire operation was completed within a matter of hours, completely undetected.

The bombing mission was a resounding success. Iran’s nuclear weapons facilities have been severely damaged and the strike most certainly did not spark WWIII as some isolationists like Tucker Carlson and Bernie Sanders predicted.

The world is a safer place today than it was a few days ago. Thanks to the stellar military campaign executed by Israel, Iran’s war machine is in shambles. Its symbolic retaliation effort against the US was not only a complete failure, it even drew condemnation from Iran’s own Arab neighbors.

 

[Saint_Ann]

I think he meant a two-week war, maybe followed by another in two weeks. Two weeks seems to be the mantra.

Depends on what the definition of " is" is.

 

[Rickslaw101]

I'll consider calling the felon by his title when others stop referencing Joe Biden as sleepy-eyed, demented, and 'weaponizing the Justice Department by using his minions.' You ask me to refrain, but you continue to use similar terms–you missed the irony?

The attack plan was indeed awesome, designed and carried out by Joint USA military forces... not by any of the felon's minions in his cabinet.

The optics of the mission teeter on the edge of serious violations. The President did not inform Congress nor seek approval for his actions before the strike as is required. Without a declaration of war, the USA attacked a foreign nation first, declared it must submit to unconditional surrender, and then demanded it come to a negotiating meeting. What is there to admire about that aspect of the event?

He point-blank told Iran it had two weeks to realize he meant taking action and allowed that time for them to arrange for peace terms. He lied. Consequently, millions are in the streets of Iran chanting death to America! That is in no way a masterful operation from the political standpoint.

Question: Where is the missing enriched uranium? How much more dangerous is the situation now?

Yes, our military acted spectacularly from the perspective of a singular mission. But the political aspects of that action seem to have failed in a follow-up plan.

DM, all those prerequisites to dropping bombs in another nation don't exist. I know idiots like Massie and Schumer and AOC say otherwise, but they are just wrong. If you don't believe me, you can ask both Clinton and Obama who did exactly the same thing without obtaining Congressional permission.

As for Biden being incompetent, I thought we agreed on that a few exchanges ago. I'm sorry to see you going back to the party line. I said it before and I'll continue to say it. I don't blame Biden. I see him as the victim.

As for the alleged "missing uranium" I've got my money on the fact that Mossad knows more about what's going on in Iran than the Ayatollah. I'm sure it's taken care of. I know it's popular sport to try to make it look like Trump screwed up, and I get that because you're used to seeing Dem administrations do that since Jimmy Carter. I know I'm never gonna convince you, so no point trying, but i will tell you I sleep much better knowing we have a competent President who is running circles around America's enemies.

Thank God for Donald Trump!

 

[PaxNurgle]

Iran and the U.S. have been at war to one degree or another for the past 45+ years.

No, that's the point, they have not.

There was a peace treaty in place from roughly 2011 to 2017, brokered by former president Barack Obama and the Iranian government. No war with Iran during those years. Not even a proxy war. There was a peace treaty in place. Had it remained in place, No war would have been necessary, except...

TRUMP, and thereby the United States (and NOT Iran) backed out of the treaty.
TRUMP, not Iran, started this war. (or, if you prefer, RE-started it.)

People seem to conveniently ignore this fact.

Or they try to justify it with the usual "Yeah but blah-de-blah-de-blah, OBAMA!" because, well, they don't want to give Obama credit for anything positive that he did. (And don't want to call Trump out for the very obvious and blatantly negative stuff that he did and continues to do.)

 

[Saint_Ann]

DM, all those prerequisites to dropping bombs in another nation don't exist. I know idiots like Massie and Schumer and AOC say otherwise, but they are just wrong. If you don't believe me, you can ask both Clinton and Obama who did exactly the same thing without obtaining Congressional permission.

As for Biden being incompetent, I thought we agreed on that a few exchanges ago. I'm sorry to see you going back to the party line. I said it before and I'll continue to say it. I don't blame Biden. I see him as the victim.

As for the alleged "missing uranium" I've got my money on the fact that Mossad knows more about what's going on in Iran than the Ayatollah. I'm sure it's taken care of. I know it's popular sport to try to make it look like Trump screwed up, and I get that because you're used to seeing Dem administrations do that since Jimmy Carter. I know I'm never gonna convince you, so no point trying, but i will tell you I sleep much better knowing we have a competent President who is running circles around America's enemies.

Thank God for Donald Trump!

That just made a lot of heads explode.

 

[PaxNurgle]

^Our president is more about MAKING enemies and placating them, then running circles around them. Or have you been paying attention AT ALL to the news in the last year?

Trump's blatant attack on Iran accomplished NOTHING other than igniting a new Middle East war, and potentially triggering what could be the opening stages of World War 3. Maybe you missed that as well. Iran may or may not have been developing nukes, there was no evidence for this no matter what the Israeli propaganda pieces (and Trump) may claim. But Russia and China DO have nukes, and rest assured, they are not going to sit idly by when their neighbor and ally gets attacked unjustifiably.

Trump has already alienated our European allies and attempted to cozied up the Russia and various neo-fascist dictators like Orban. - and Putin still has no love for the U.S. (much less so now)

Your take on this is utterly invalid and shows a dangerous level of ignorance and complacency. You should be out there protesting this action on the streets like every other true American patriot out there.

 

[JohnEngelman]

It is too early to evaluate Trump's decision to bomb Iran. I think Iran was working on an atomic bomb, and was close to succeeding. A country with all that oil did not need to develop nuclear energy for peaceful purposes.

 

[Lazaran]

No, that's the point, they have not.

There was a peace treaty in place from roughly 2011 to 2017, brokered by former president Barack Obama and the Iranian government. No war with Iran during those years. Not even a proxy war. There was a peace treaty in place. Had it remained in place, No war would have been necessary, except...

TRUMP, and thereby the United States (and NOT Iran) backed out of the treaty.
TRUMP, not Iran, started this war. (or, if you prefer, RE-started it.)

People seem to conveniently ignore this fact.

Or they try to justify it with the usual "Yeah but blah-de-blah-de-blah, OBAMA!" because, well, they don't want to give Obama credit for anything positive that he did. (And don't want to call Trump out for the very obvious and blatantly negative stuff that he did and continues to do.)

The problem is, Iran NEVER stopped attacking Israel (America’s proxy in the region) through its proxies - which is basically attacking the U.S.

There has been a shadow war going on between the U.S. and Iran forever - with brief pauses in the fighting due to several overriding problems (ISIS & Covid, etc). Iran’s push to become a nuclear power only exacerbated the situation.

I know people will try to separate Israel and the U.S., but that is intellectually dishonest.

It is what it is.