I may stop writing one-off stories

[jaF0]

The point is, Lit could facilitate the interaction that many authors crave with some small changes to the website and its interface. They just don't want to do that. It's one of (my) major issues with Literotica.

There are other examples too, like wordcount and tags, but I suspect they don't want to make those happen for different reasons.

As I recall, authors used to be able to reply to comments and feedback, but they disabled that some years ago. I seem to recall some authors used to get into nattering ninny competitions with commenters which prompted the change.

We also seem to forget just how massive an undertaking even small changes can be on a site like this.

Again, this site has been alive longer that some of the contributors, so let's leave the design to those that have made it the success it is.

 

[ElectricBlue]

As I recall, authors used to be able to reply to comments and feedback, but they disabled that some years ago. I seem to recall some authors used to get into nattering ninny competitions with commenters which prompted the change.

Authors can reply to comments (by adding a comment of their own), and if someone provides their email address with Feedback, you can respond.

I've been here a decade, and that's always been the case.

 

[jaF0]

It may have been before that, but I remember when comments could be replied to.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

As I recall, authors used to be able to reply to comments and feedback, but they disabled that some years ago. I seem to recall some authors used to get into nattering ninny competitions with commenters which prompted the change.

We also seem to forget just how massive an undertaking even small changes can be on a site like this.

Again, this site has been alive longer that some of the contributors, so let's leave the design to those that have made it the success it is.

Many of these things can easily be done, there is nothing massive about them. There is no need for a change to the database for most of these small requests we've made over the years. They just don't want to make them happen because they don't seem to care about any of our needs here. And I even understand it. We are all here expendable and replaceable. There are too many content creators on this website.

On the other hand, some super-easy changes, like the changes we asked for the story cards, are a somewhat different story. I suspect they don't want to make those changes because it wouldn't serve their best interests, even if those changes would be of help to both authors and readers.

So yeah, when it comes to the design, I can only criticize as I have no say whatsoever. I am leaving it to them because there are no other options available. And sure, the website has been a success no doubt. Mostly for them.

 

[SimonDoom]

they don't seem to care about any of our needs here. And I even understand it. We are all here expendable and replaceable. There are too many content creators on this website.

We've had this conversation before, but I would add to it this: who speaks for "our needs"? You don't speak for my needs. I don't speak for yours. The general tenor of your comments on these issues suggests that there's a loud chorus demanding change, which they are ignoring, and I don't see that. There are a few voices like yours that want change, but I get the feeling the vast majority of authors are just fine with the way things are. Most don't care. I have long advocated certain changes, but I don't care that much if they aren't made. So I don't think it's fair to say that the site owners "don't care" about our needs, because as far as I'm concerned they care about mine just fine. They are running the site the way they want to, and it isn't the way I would do it in every respect, but it's their site . . . so, OK. The site suits my needs as an author and as a reader just fine, especially considering I don't pay anything for it. As far as I'm concerned, I'm getting extraordinary value here.

The sense I have, from having been here for over 8 years and having sometimes communicated with Laurel and Manu, is that they DO care, and sometimes their choices are just different from the ones you want them to make, or they are constrained by time and money. Of course, I don't have the inside scoop and don't really know any more than you do.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

We've had this conversation before, but I would add to it this: who speaks for "our needs"? You don't speak for my needs. I don't speak for yours. The general tenor of your comments on these issues suggests that there's a loud chorus demanding change, which they are ignoring, and I don't see that. There are a few voices like yours that want change, but I get the feeling the vast majority of authors are just fine with the way things are. Most don't care.

Who are you speaking for now? You are implying that because a huge majority of authors don't even have a presence in the forum, they are fine with everything? That's BS and you know it.
Also "You have a feeling." Fascinating stuff.

The sense I have, from having been here for over 8 years and having sometimes communicated with Laurel and Manu, is that they DO care, and sometimes their choices are just different from the ones you want them to make, or they are constrained by time and money. Of course, I don't have the inside scoop and don't really know any more than you do.

See, once again, you first say how and why Manu and Laurel do something, and then in the next sentence, you admit that you don't really know anything. As I've said, fascinating.

Now, a huge majority of authors aren't present on the forum. That's a fact. So I can only gauge the sentiment by hearing what many among those who ARE present are saying.

A typical example: Manu makes a post and asks for feedback about something - let's take that story-card post of his for example. A majority of people who participated in that thread ask for the same damn thing. You can go back and check this yourself. Manu doesn't even reply, even though he asked for feedback. And anyone with minimal technical knowledge knows how easy it would be to do what we asked for - to just display a number that's already there. So there is no other conclusion I can make but that he either doesn't care one bit about what we want, or that it goes against his own interests. In this particular case, I even suspect it's the latter, and I can maybe even prove it.

I don't know about you, but for me, the people who do speak up are representative enough. Most people are either resigned to the way Lit functions, are staying silent for their own reasons, or as we already concluded, aren't present on the forum at all.

 

[jaF0]

It is what it is and it ain't gonna be nuthin' else, less'n Lit wants it to be.

 

[StillStunned]

Who are you speaking for now? You are implying that because a huge majority of authors don't even have a presence in the forum, they are fine with everything? That's BS and you know it.

But you feel comfortable speaking for "our needs", even when you don't know what those needs are, or even who "we" are.

The fact that thousands of writers still publish thousands of stories here, and have done for more than 25 years, indicates that their needs are being met. You complain about too many content creators on the site. Alright, so what are the criteria for staying? Do you get to choose who's allowed to publish here?

Or are you going to let the site owners do that? Because they've made their choice: anyone who isn't AI can submit a story and get it published. That's the service they provide to writers - and it's all for free.

You complain here that the site doesn't cater to your wishes, but you still make use of the service. If you feel you deserve something more, then do something about it. Walk away from the site and start your own, for instance. But apparently it's not worth that much to you. Easier to just keep shouting how it isn't fair.

 

[Voboy]

I feel like I read this same thread every few weeks. OP complains about ratings, most replies indicate that OP is writing for the wrong reasons, then there's a rehash of the "chaptered vs standalone works" debate, culminating in yet another squabble about the way the site is run.

Lovely.

I wonder, sometimes, how we find the time to get any writing done!

 

[jaF0]

I feel like I read this same thread every few weeks.

Like most AH threads.

 

[StillStunned]

I wonder, sometimes, how we find the time to get any writing done!

By copy-pasting from previous threads, obviously.

 

[Voboy]

By copy-pasting from previous threads, obviously.

I was talking about our stories, but I like your interpretation better.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

The fact that thousands of writers still publish thousands of stories here, and have done for more than 25 years, indicates that their needs are being met.

What kind of logic is this?
Those are not all the same old authors from the beginning of Lit. Actually, numerically speaking, I think that the majority of authors are those who write their one or two-offs and then disappear. Maybe 8Letters has some numbers to share.
Sure, there are authors who have been writing for many years and some of them are still active, more or less. But there are also plenty of those who aren't around anymore for whatever reason. I wouldn't dare speculate how many among them stopped publishing here because their needs hadn't been met. You would, it seems.

That's the service they provide to writers - and it's all for free.

Simon said the same thing. I don't know why you guys keep perpetuating this myth. We are all paying for this. Money is not the only thing that holds value.

You complain here that the site doesn't cater to your wishes, but you still make use of the service. If you feel you deserve something more, then do something about it. Walk away from the site and start your own, for instance. But apparently it's not worth that much to you. Easier to just keep shouting how it isn't fair.

I don't really use the service as an author anymore. I don't publish here anymore.
As a reader, I often browse new stories but I rarely read one. And in the rare cases when I find something I like, I make sure to leave good feedback, especially if it's a new author. The forum is the part of the website I am mostly using. Same as you, I am paying for it.

By the way, I never thought you would be one of those guys who say "If you don't like it here, why don't you go elsewhere." That's a terrific mentality.

 

[SimonDoom]

Who are you speaking for now? You are implying that because a huge majority of authors don't even have a presence in the forum, they are fine with everything? That's BS and you know it.
Also "You have a feeling." Fascinating stuff.


See, once again, you first say how and why Manu and Laurel do something, and then in the next sentence, you admit that you don't really know anything. As I've said, fascinating.

There's nothing fascinating or inconsistent about this at all. My consistent point is that neither you nor I know what Manu and Laurel think or feel other than what they communicate, so it's unfair speculation to say "they don't care." You don't know that. It seems that way to you because they don't respond the way you want them to. The fact that they don't do things the way you want them to doesn't prove that they don't care. They may just want to do things differently. My impression -- admittedly, just an impression, based on limited evidence--is that this site is under-monetized and so as a result they are under-staffed and they have limited resources to make changes happen quickly. Since I joined this place over 8 years ago there have been SOME positive changes, which indicates to me they do care.

Also, my natural inclination, as a default position, is to assume that other people are acting in good faith, unless I have sufficient evidence to believe otherwise, and I don't see evidence here to assume otherwise.

 

[RejectReality]

It may have been before that, but I remember when comments could be replied to.

You could never reply directly to comments — at least since I started in mid 2005, and public comments have only existed since late 2003. The closest you could come was to say @Commenter as the title of a comment ( a feature that has been removed, along with the thermometer ) or in the body of the comment.

While threaded comments are a feature on the update docket, it has never been a thing previously.

 

[Voboy]

I don't really use the service as an author anymore. I don't publish here anymore.

Some might wonder, then, why you seem to care so passionately.

I've gone 'round and 'round with you on the substance of your points; I know what you have to offer, and well-meaning criticism is always valuable. Many of your points make sense. But at this point, hasn't the utility of repeating the same thing so many times worn off?

I respect perseverance, but you yourself have admitted these ideas of yours aren't going to happen... so...

 

[AwkwardlySet]

Some might wonder, then, why you seem to care so passionately.

I've gone 'round and 'round with you on the substance of your points; I know what you have to offer, and well-meaning criticism is always valuable. Many of your points make sense. But at this point, hasn't the utility of repeating the same thing so many times worn off?

I respect perseverance, but you yourself have admitted these ideas of yours aren't going to happen... so...

You are right of course.
Believe it or not, I am tired of making these same arguments, and if you check the whole thread, you will see that my first posts were only about the validity of ratings, which is ironically also a zombie of a topic.

It's just when people pick and prod into these things, and someone says something I find misleading, I can't seem to help myself. Maybe it's about my profession as a teacher, I don't know. I realize I am beating a dead horse and I've known that for a while now, but it seems it's not easy for me to entirely drop it.
Maybe it's also because I truly do want to write more, but I don't feel nearly as good about Literotica as I used to.

So yes, I admit my part in all this useless arguing, but as you surely know, it takes (at least) two for an argument.

 

[jaF0]

I thought that was to tango?

 

[lovecraft68]

As I recall, authors used to be able to reply to comments and feedback, but they disabled that some years ago. I seem to recall some authors used to get into nattering ninny competitions with commenters which prompted the change.

We also seem to forget just how massive an undertaking even small changes can be on a site like this.

Again, this site has been alive longer that some of the contributors, so let's leave the design to those that have made it the success it is.

You used to be able to @ someone in the title of a comment so they'd know you were replying to them if they came back, you can't do that anymore. You can say it in the comment, but if there's a lot of them its not easy to see.

It was a cool feature they just decided to get rid of. Feedback I've only ever seen where you can reply to an e-mail if the sender includes it, but never directly back through feedback.

 

[lovecraft68]

As for the success of the site, I will say two things. One, that it succeeds despite itself-being first to market, of any size at least, is a big help, second with not much effort it could be a damn gold mine. I'm the type that gets frustrated with any type of half ass effort when running a business regardless of what it is.

People like @StillStunned are newish here, and @SimonDoom has been here a decade now, but still not long enough to remember the bold-faced lies told by the site (example the bi-sexual category) and how they have driven off-and allowed the driving off-of many good writers and contributors because they think trolls and forum bullies are funny.

The site is what it is, on the plus side its a platform to post your stories without many restrictions. On the other side, their apathy and lack of shits given about many issues here with site function and people not being able to get stories published, their blatant disregard in enforcing their own rules, favoritism, sketchy sweeps, supporting of the worst posters on the forum, and all around lack of caring if people stay or leave, is frustrating, and its not wrong to say it. All this has trickled down to the forum members here who's favorite thing to say when someone has an issue is if you don't like it leave.

Great way to run a business.

Sucking up is as bad as always complaining and never forget, end of the day the authors are who makes this site money, so the disregard often shown to them is offputting

 

[AG31]

@AwkwardlySet, @Voboy. Might you both be Romanian? My daughter-in-law is and there's a strong bit of folk wisdom that says a Romanian MUST have the last word.

 

[lovecraft68]

@AwkwardlySet, @Voboy. Might you both be Romanian? My daughter-in-law is and there's a strong bit of folk wisdom that say a Romanian MUST have the last word.

These days, that's just called the internet.

 

[Voboy]

@AwkwardlySet, @Voboy. Might you both be Romanian? My daughter-in-law is and there's a strong bit of folk wisdom that say a Romanian MUST have the last word.

What I posted here was, I thought, one of the LEAST argumentative posts I've made in quite some time...

I think it's senseless to keep on having the same thread over and over again. I hardly think that's a hot take.

 

[AwkwardlySet]

@AwkwardlySet, @Voboy. Might you both be Romanian? My daughter-in-law is and there's a strong bit of folk wisdom that say a Romanian MUST have the last word.

Hah! No, I am not Romanian, but I am not too far from the country either. I live in the southern part of Europe.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I think it's senseless to keep on having the same thread over and over again. I hardly think that's a hot take.

Except the OP of the repeat threads is nearly always a newbie, asking what for them is a genuine question, asking it (for them) for the first time.

The multiplicity of answers never changes, because usually the answer is, "It depends," or, "This is what the answer is," when there is only one answer.