For Those Who Might Be Wondering Why We Might Be In Ukraine

[ChloeTzang]

For the next 40 years, Ukraine's version of Mossad is going to make Mossad look like an episode of Sesame Street. Whatever is negotiated with Russia, Ukraine will be hunting down Russian war criminals and executing them.

 

[Lazaran]

Well, say what I will about 46, which is a lot and most of it disparaging LOL, he did leave all the work to the professional political-managerial class, who preferred the established way of doing things and not shaking up anything radically. They may have been timid and wrong on a lot of things, but they obviously preferred the status quo. Yes, it's obvious in hindsight the Biden Administration withheld any military aid that would be substantial enough for Ukraine to win, and it's also obvious in hindsight that Biden's initial response gave Putin the idea that he could go ahead with the invasion - and the initial reactions of Biden and Scholz more or less confirmed that. But in the end they did step up, half heartedly to be sure, but they didn't try to throw Ukraine under the bus the way 47 seems intent on doing.

I think 47 has met his match in Zelensky and Ukrainians tho. This is just one more obstacle they face and it ain't gonna work.

Chloe “Chicongo” Tzang is a traitorous MAGAt that voted for President Musk (and DonOld, etc).

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2025/02/19/europe/zelensky-trump-reaction-intl

From the article:

Trump calls Zelensky ‘a dictator’ after Ukraine’s leader accuses him of living in ‘disinformation space’​

Chloe “Chicongo” Tzang



Also:

We. Told. Then. So.

 

[Rightguide]

Another take on the issue:

The Art of the Sabotage: The Far Left’s Betrayal of Ukraine Is Coming​

Scott Pinsker | 7:23 PM on February 18, 2025

I’ll open with the punchline, but be forewarned — there’s nothing funny about it: The Far Left will betray Ukraine because they hate Trump more than they care about the Ukrainian people.

Those poor, suffering civilians in Ukraine? They’re abstractions — mere cannon fodder for a greater cause. Been that way since the beginning of the conflict, and although the Biden administration never formally admitted it, slaughtering Russians and Ukrainians in a long, protracted bloodbath was America’s objective all along.

Sure, we “dolled up” the policy with high-minded speeches about protecting liberty and Russia being evil and/or Ukraine being pure and good, and vowing that Putin “cannot remain in power,” but we never sought any sort of resolution. Not really. Instead, we armed Ukraine with just enough equipment, weapons, technology, and artillery to maintain the status quo.

It was a bloodbath we wanted, and a bloodbath we got.

From the Far Left’s viewpoint, the plan made sense: Russia was our “enemy” — especially after they interfered in the 2016 election and cheated poor Hillary out of the presidency. And then, in 2022, they invaded a neighboring country. Y’know who else invaded their neighbors? That’s right: HITLER! Clearly, it’s in our strategic interest to weaken the next Hitler.

All the rest here: https://pjmedia.com/scott-pinsker/2...-lefts-betrayal-of-ukraine-is-coming-n4937104

 

[ishtat]

This type of action is indicative of a transitioning. Even if some sort of settlement is forced on this region the Russians have engendered so much hatred that they can anticipate a more or less permanent insurrection for the next 30-50 years. Ukraine and the neighboring parts of Russia will be turned into a permanent hit and run battleground, much as Ireland was for so many years. If some sort of 'peace' is declared in the next few months or years, it will eventually dawn on the Russians that they have already lost. This will be a solid result for both the West and China, because Russia has been economically ruined, booted out of the Middle East, effectively emasculated in Eastern Europe, cut off from Africa and lost domination of Central/Eastern Asia to China.

Even Donald Trump couldn't mess this up.

I forecast this situation a month ago.(4227 27th January) No peace deal without a degree of consent from both sides will stick. My final sentence was however clearly wrong, Trump can mess this up; watch out for Turkey in the next week or two; they are seriously pissed off. The great unknown is what hold does Putin have on Trump and why. I still think that the best interests of the USA are served by a permanent state of low level war/insurrection.

 

[Rightguide]

Well now:

BREAKING: Trump calls for Ukraine to hold presidential election as part of peace deal with Russia​

"We have a situation where we haven’t had elections in Ukraine, where we have martial law, essentially martial law in Ukraine."

Comment Below
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Hannah NightingaleWashington DC
Feb 18, 20252 minute read


President Donald Trump was questioned about talks US officials had with Russian officials on the prospect of peace in Ukraine on Tuesday during a press conference from Mar-a-Lago, including Russia’s reported demand that Ukraine hold elections in order for a peace deal to be signed.

"We have a situation where we haven’t had elections in Ukraine, where we have martial law, essentially martial law in Ukraine," Trump said, adding that the "leader in Ukraine, I mean, I hate to say it, but he’s down at 4 percent approval rating" and most of the country has been "blown to smithereens."

"And yeah, I would say that, you know, when they want a seat at the table, you could say the people have to — wouldn’t the people of Ukraine have to say, like, you know, it’s been a long time since we’ve had an election," Trump continued.

"That’s not a Russia thing, that’s something coming from me and coming from many other countries."

https://thepostmillennial.com/break...al-election-as-part-of-peace-deal-with-russia

 

[Politruk]

Another take on the issue:

The Art of the Sabotage: The Far Left’s Betrayal of Ukraine Is Coming​

Scott Pinsker | 7:23 PM on February 18, 2025

I’ll open with the punchline, but be forewarned — there’s nothing funny about it: The Far Left will betray Ukraine because they hate Trump more than they care about the Ukrainian people.

Those poor, suffering civilians in Ukraine? They’re abstractions — mere cannon fodder for a greater cause. Been that way since the beginning of the conflict, and although the Biden administration never formally admitted it, slaughtering Russians and Ukrainians in a long, protracted bloodbath was America’s objective all along.

Sure, we “dolled up” the policy with high-minded speeches about protecting liberty and Russia being evil and/or Ukraine being pure and good, and vowing that Putin “cannot remain in power,” but we never sought any sort of resolution. Not really. Instead, we armed Ukraine with just enough equipment, weapons, technology, and artillery to maintain the status quo.

It was a bloodbath we wanted, and a bloodbath we got.

From the Far Left’s viewpoint, the plan made sense: Russia was our “enemy” — especially after they interfered in the 2016 election and cheated poor Hillary out of the presidency. And then, in 2022, they invaded a neighboring country. Y’know who else invaded their neighbors? That’s right: HITLER! Clearly, it’s in our strategic interest to weaken the next Hitler.

All the rest here: https://pjmedia.com/scott-pinsker/2...-lefts-betrayal-of-ukraine-is-coming-n4937104

Only an idiot would cite PJmedia.

PJ Media (formerly Pajamas Media, a.k.a. PJM, PJMedia, Open Source Media, or PJTV) is a far-right Christofascist blog founded in 2005 by Roger L. Simon and Charles Johnson and largely financed by Canadian-born software coder Aubrey Chernick.[1] Pajamas Media was described variously as an advertising network, an alt-right conservative blogging network, an Internet aggregator, a multimedia hate site and a sinkhole into which investment dollars vanished. In 2009, Simon officially dissolved Pajamas Media, replacing it with PJTV, a subscriber-supported video hosting site. After the failure of PJTV in 2016, PJ Media devolved into a blog collecting the gibberings of various wingnuts. In 2019, it was acquired by Salem Media Group.https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png[2]

 

[Rightguide]

Only an idiot would cite PJmedia.

PJ Media (formerly Pajamas Media, a.k.a. PJM, PJMedia, Open Source Media, or PJTV) is a far-right Christofascist blog founded in 2005 by Roger L. Simon and Charles Johnson and largely financed by Canadian-born software coder Aubrey Chernick.[1] Pajamas Media was described variously as an advertising network, an alt-right conservative blogging network, an Internet aggregator, a multimedia hate site and a sinkhole into which investment dollars vanished. In 2009, Simon officially dissolved Pajamas Media, replacing it with PJTV, a subscriber-supported video hosting site. After the failure of PJTV in 2016, PJ Media devolved into a blog collecting the gibberings of various wingnuts. In 2019, it was acquired by Salem Media Group.https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/5a/Wikipedia%27s_W.svg/12px-Wikipedia%27s_W.svg.png[2]

Only a real idiot would say what you just said.

 

[Lazaran]

I forecast this situation a month ago.(4227 27th January) No peace deal without a degree of consent from both sides will stick. My final sentence was however clearly wrong, Trump can mess this up; watch out for Turkey in the next week or two; they are seriously pissed off. The great unknown is what hold does Putin have on Trump and why. I still think that the best interests of the USA are served by a permanent state of low level war/insurrection.

This type of action is indicative of a transitioning. Even if some sort of settlement is forced on this region the Russians have engendered so much hatred that they can anticipate a more or less permanent insurrection for the next 30-50 years. Ukraine and the neighboring parts of Russia will be turned into a permanent hit and run battleground, much as Ireland was for so many years. If some sort of 'peace' is declared in the next few months or years, it will eventually dawn on the Russians that they have already lost. This will be a solid result for both the West and China, because Russia has been economically ruined, booted out of the Middle East, effectively emasculated in Eastern Europe, cut off from Africa and lost domination of Central/Eastern Asia to China.

Even Donald Trump couldn't mess this up.

It continues to be apparent that President Biden had the perfect strategy for dealing with / defeating Putin / Russia: The results tell the story.

THANK YOU PRESIDENT BIDEN!!!





Slava Ukraini!!!







Jinx!!!

We. Told. Them. So.

 

[Politruk]

Only a real idiot would say what you just said.

You can't gainsay a word of it. That's what PJmedia is.

 

[ll74]

Only a real idiot would say what you just said.

PJ media is the absolute worst writing on the Internet

 

[ll74]

I think that Ukraine should agree to new elections only after a guaranteed of security
AND
The resignation of Putin followed by Russian elections without Putin on the ballot
AND
A guarantee that Putin will never hold office again.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Incorrect. The Ukrainian Constitution expressly forbids elections during a war. Zelensky is President for the duration. The next election will be after the war is over. Just as it was in the UK in WW2. You just do not do elections during an existential war for survival. That's the way it is.

I'm afraid Trump is way out to lunch on this one. He's now blaming Ukraine for starting this war and that's just sick.

Yah, but you voted for him anyhow, after you were repeatedly warned that this is exactly what he would do.
Fuck off and cry about it elsewhere, you helped make this happen.

 

[Rebel5soul]

The support for the Ukraine in the continuing war has eroded severely with the American public over the past 3 years, as had their confidence that Zelensky is acting in the best interests of the Ukrainian peoples or international stability. The same erosion has occurred with the republican law makers.

Obviously Russia and Putin are not good guys in this drama and it's fitting to be pissed off at what was done, but for third parties not only being willing, but actively encouraging, fighting the Russians to the very last Ukrainian can't be said to be moral or ethical.

Now comes Trump essentially dumping Zelensky. I think too many people are reading this totally wrong, go get yourself a copy of "The Art of the Deal" and read it. Trump is right in character here and is sending a message to Putin and Zelensky. And that message is that he's not going to be sitting on either one of their sides at the table. And you better realize that if he's going to be an honest broker in these negotiations that is exactly where he has to be, in the middle and adversarial to BOTH sides. (And this is where the 'never Trumper's' are fucked up. Not being on Zelensky's side is not the same as being on Putin's side either. This is NOT a binary situation.)

Trumps goal is to stop the bleeding in both blood and treasure. Every person of good sense should be hoping he's successful.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

The support for the Ukraine in the continuing war has eroded severely with the American public over the past 3 years,

Really? Could have fooled me Ish.....


https://www.brookings.edu/articles/...ay-the-course-in-ukraine-as-long-as-it-takes/

 

[Politruk]

Now comes Trump essentially dumping Zelensky. I think too many people are reading this totally wrong, go get yourself a copy of "The Art of the Deal" and read it. Trump is right in character here and is sending a message to Putin and Zelensky. And that message is that he's not going to be sitting on either one of their sides at the table.

That is a lie. He's on Russia's side. He always was.

And you better realize that if he's going to be an honest broker

Never, ever use the word "honest" in even the vaguest association with Trump.

 

[Lazaran]

Really? Could have fooled me Ish.....


https://www.brookings.edu/articles/...ay-the-course-in-ukraine-as-long-as-it-takes/

There WAS some erosion of support for Ukraine from the MAGAt Republican traitors and some "Independents".

It didn’t help that the MAGAts and Musk were CONSTANTLY undermining support for Ukraine for "some" reason. (They were / are traitors who were / are either on Putin’s payroll or sought economic opportunities in Russia), and that the "Independents" were willing to go along with the traitor’s



.

 

[Rebel5soul]

Really? Could have fooled me Ish.....


https://www.brookings.edu/articles/...ay-the-course-in-ukraine-as-long-as-it-takes/

Post stale news.

US support for Ukraine.

 

[ll74]

Post stale news.

US support for Ukraine.

How many support complete capitulation to Russia?

 

[Rebel5soul]

How many support complete capitulation to Russia?

You can support that if you want.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

You can support that if you want.

You support Capitulation....sucks to be a traitor to Democracy. The people who died in war to fight for your freedom to be a fucking traitor are spinning in their graves Ish.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

There WAS some erosion of support for Ukraine from the MAGAt Republican traitors and some "Independents".

It didn’t help that the MAGAts and Musk were CONSTANTLY undermining support for Ukraine for "some" reason. (They were / are traitors who were / are either on Putin’s payroll or sought economic opportunities in Russia), and that the "Independents" were willing to go along with the traitor’s



.

Selfish pricks who only care about the lack of money they have. Mostly through their own faults. Fuck, and they have the gall to pretend to honour the war dead???

 

[Rebel5soul]

You support Capitulation....sucks to be a traitor to Democracy. The people who died in war to fight for your freedom to be a fucking traitor are spinning in their graves Ish.

Apparently you are in favor of pushing the war until the very last Ukrainian is dead. Book a flight, pick up a rifle, show us your dedication.

 

[Fuzzy1975]

Apparently you are in favor of pushing the war until the very last Ukrainian is dead. Book a flight, pick up a rifle, show us your dedication.

Yes I am, and you're not. It's pretty simple. You're the fucking traitor to all those who fought and died so you can post shit like this.

 

[Rebel5soul]

Yes I am, and you're not. It's pretty simple. You're the fucking traitor to all those who fought and died so you can post shit like this.

So you'll be posting from the Ukraine shortly?

 

[jomar]

So @ChloeTzang, you support Ukraine and you’re a card carrying MAGAphile. Where are you on the latest Trump stance backing Putin and calling Zelenskyy a dictator and blaming Ukraine for the war? Also negotiating for an end to the war and not including Ukraine? Or pressing for an Ukraine presidential election, which is against Ukraine law at present? Not that the US hasn’t meddled in foreign administrations, but true to form trump says the quiet things out loud. How do you square your cognitive dissonance?