Trump 47: A Civilizational Fork in the Road?

[BrightShinyGirl]

Even that would be a huge misapplication of money and resources, imho.

Hell, humans haven’t come close to perfecting living in near optimal conditions. Let’s try doing that first.

Building a self-sustaining base in the Antarctica is much cheaper and easier than building one on Mars. The goal is to work out the kinks of the settlement before we pour trillions into rockets that are destined to sit around in the desert like a fleet of cybertrucks.

 

[Lazaran]

Building a self-sustaining base in the Antarctica is much cheaper and easier than building one on Mars. The goal is to work out the kinks of the settlement before we pour trillions into rockets that are destined to sit around in the desert like a fleet of cybertrucks.

That ^ is true, but it is still a waste / misapplication of money and resources at a time when both are in short supply.

How about we do neither???

 

[BrightShinyGirl]

That ^ is true, but it is still a waste / misapplication of money and resources at a time when both are in short supply.

How about we do neither???

Okay by me. I love the unmanned space program: Sending robot probes to distant planets in the solar system, launching cool new space telescopes. Let's spend more money on that instead of the Mars colony dick-waving!

 

[Lazaran]

Okay by me. I love the unmanned space program: Sending robot probes to distant planets in the solar system, launching cool new space telescopes. Let's spend more money on that instead of the Mars colony dick-waving!

My feelings exactly.

 

[JohnEngelman]

Article from Glenn Reynolds on substack (link at end of post)

“This was no ordinary victory. This was a fork in the road of human civilization.”

That was Elon Musk, super-hyped in his Trump inaugural rally victory speech. And he’s one hundred percent right.

The single most important thing that’s happening now, and that will unfold over the next several decades, is humanity’s transition from a planetary to an interplanetary species. (And, eventually, to an interstellar one.) And that’s tied to the election.

For the foreseeable future human colonies on Mars will not pay for themselves. They will be hideously expensive, and not profitable. This is far more true of human colonies of planets orbiting around nearby stars.

 

[JohnEngelman]

Twenty five years, that's all we need............

How much will that cost? How will it pay for itself? Mars has very little atmosphere to burn up meteorites. Colonies on Mars or the moon will always be vulnerable to meteorites.

 

[ll74]

How much will that cost? How will it pay for itself? Mars has very little atmosphere to burn up meteorites. Colonies on Mars or the moon will always be vulnerable to meteorites.

The US will subsidize Musk because he's friends with the big guy

 

[dmallord]

A good step forward to colonizing Mars would be building a self-sufficient human settlement at the South Pole. The environment isn’t as hostile to human life as on the red planet, but the challenges are similar—extreme cold and lack of sunlight.

Until we colonize Antarctica there’s no point in wasting money on big rockets.

Let's focus on getting the most bang for our buck and spend the money fixing and meeting people's needs where they currently live and work before moving to the polar regions, where few benefit.

Time and again, we see massive dollars poured into space efforts at the expense of meeting human needs in our own ecospheres. Why? Space can wait, suffering cannot. Plant a flag for humanity within our atmosphere and let's thrive here before we leap off the stars. They're not going anywhere.

 

[dmallord]

Okay by me. I love the unmanned space program: Sending robot probes to distant planets in the solar system, launching cool new space telescopes. Let's spend more money on that instead of the Mars colony dick-waving!

Care to share a poor woman's grocery bill paid by the by-product of a space telescope? I'll wait.

I'm okay not dick-waving on Mars, too. Don't want to look into a telescope to view that.

 

[dmallord]

By international treaty, Antarctica cannot be colonized.

Treaties are meant to be broken, according to Trump. He would say that gets an executive order removal. Renamed: AntMerica or maybe AntMelania to curry favor and get back into her bed.

Invade it, if the penguins refuse to turn it over.

 

[Politruk]

Personally, I think Reynolds is correct, and so is Musk. The last 4 years of Biden came close to destroying America. 4 to 8 years of Harris would have taken us down a path that would have made civil war inevitable, and in doing so, removed America as a world power. It would also have turned us into a stagnant and decaying society, heading for second or third world status, and left China supreme.

You really are an idiot, aren't you?!

 

[Wat_Tyler]

Personally, I think Reynolds is correct, and so is Musk. The last 4 years of Biden came close to destroying America. 4 to 8 years of Harris would have taken us down a path that would have . . . removed America as a world power. It would also have turned us into a stagnant and decaying society, heading for second or third world status, and left China supreme.

That disaster has now been averted, thanks to Trump and the American voters. What we now need to do is cement that victory in, and keep it rolling forward for the next half century. By which time as should be firmly established on Mars thanks to one man. Elon Musk! That, and we can roll back the leftist nightmare worldwide. Argentina and the USA are only the start. Canada. Europe. The UK.....they're next, along with mass deportations, removing the third world back to where they came from.

We can always recolonize them if they want civilization so much. We did it once before, after all, but they wanted us to leave. If they ask nicely, maybe we could return.

Butbutbut, think who woke we would all be????


https://www.gettysburgmuseumofhistory.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/09/IMG_2851.webp

 

[PaxNurgle]

^This, pretty much sums up Chloe's vision for America. Hopefully not yours as well.

It certainly brought about the height of German civilization, didn't it. Millions rounded up, gassed, fried in ovens, while the Chloe's of the time stood outside the barbed wire fences, cheering and waving flags while watching the prisoners being led to their deaths.

Karma caught up with them, didn't it.

Remember those who died fighting tyranny.
Remember the peasants of the 1300s who fought against oppression. (you probably won't get this reference but oh wll.)

It's time to fight again.

 

[ChloeTzang]

Remember the peasants of the 1300s who fought against oppression. (you probably won't get this reference but oh well.)

LOL. Of course I get that reference, Pax. In an English context, Wat Tyler's Rebellion, - Wat Tyler, John Ball and Jack Straw, John Wycliffe and the Lollards, the more or less rule of John of Gaunt who was a supporter of John Wycliffe, the socio-economic impacts of the Black Death and the Hundred Years War. There were similar impacts and movements in Europe - the Jacquerie in France for example, predating Wat Tyler's rebellion but arising from the same general causes.

The account of the Jacquerie rising by the contemporary chronicler Jean le Bel includes a description of horrifying violence:

I dare not write the horrible deeds that they did to ladies and damsels; among others, they slew a knight and [then] put him on a spit and roasted him at the fire in sight of the lady, his wife and children, and after that the lady was forced and raped by ten or twelve of them, and then they made her eat of her husband, and after made her die an evil death with all her children.

Wat Tyler's rebellion was rather more English by comparison. If you want to read a good fictional account, read Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's "The White Company," and it's sequel, "Sir Nigel." There's a great little chapter on the Jacquerie uprising in a fictional context, and Conan Doyle does a good job of establishing cause and effect.

Funnily enough, Pax, I enjoy history and out of interest, I took an online university course on the Peasants Revolt and this period - I have half a bookshelf of books on this period including a bio of John of Gaunt, stuff on the Hundred Years War, etc etc etc.

But really, I think the late Roman Republic is rather more relevant to where we are. The Gracchi Brothers, for example, whom I would see in a rather Trumpian context, vs the rise of the latifundia and the great landowners and wealthy families who came to dominate Rome for a time.

 

[grey228]

That disaster has now been averted, thanks to Trump and the American voters. What we now need to do is cement that victory in, and keep it rolling forward for the next half century.

Good luck. The Deep State did what they could to steal Congressional seats, though the Uniparty theory is becoming more and more visible.

I find it strange people will allow strangers to destroy their abode, their home; the people in Los Angeles affected by the firestorms are livid with Sacramento and the "Newscum" administration. Whether they do anything solid about it remains to be seen.

California, back in 1978, rallied and put in place Proposition 13, which still is effect today. The powers that wish to be in Commiefornia has been chipping away at it (the most recent attempt was 2024's Proposition 5, which failed with a good margin).

I'm hoping GenZ and GenAlpha will be superbased and conservative as they grow up.

 

[PaxNurgle]

^....and ANOTHER one!

For fuck's Sake Harpy!

Shit dude, are you going for some kind of record? That's like 23 now. Don't you ever aspire to be anything more than a sock-puppet troll on this forum?

 

[Politruk]

Remember the peasants of the 1300s who fought against oppression. (you probably won't get this reference but oh wll.)

It's time to fight again.

I remember that the peasants lost. You have to choose your fights carefully.

 

[Politruk]

Commiefornia

You are an idiot.

 

[PaxNurgle]

LOL. Of course I get that reference, Pax. In an English context, Wat Tyler's Rebellion, - Wat Tyler, John Ball and Jack Straw, John Wycliffe and the Lollards, the more or less rule of John of Gaunt who was a supporter of John Wycliffe, the socio-economic impacts of the Black Death and the Hundred Years War. There were similar impacts and movements in Europe - the Jacquerie in France for example, predating Wat Tyler's rebellion but arising from the same general causes.

The account of the Jacquerie rising by the contemporary chronicler Jean le Bel includes a description of horrifying violence:


Wat Tyler's rebellion was rather more English by comparison. If you want to read a good fictional account, read Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's "The White Company," and it's sequel, "Sir Nigel." There's a great little chapter on the Jacquerie uprising in a fictional context, and Conan Doyle does a good job of establishing cause and effect.

Funnily enough, Pax, I enjoy history and out of interest, I took an online university course on the Peasants Revolt and this period - I have half a bookshelf of books on this period including a bio of John of Gaunt, stuff on the Hundred Years War, etc etc etc.

But really, I think the late Roman Republic is rather more relevant to where we are. The Gracchi Brothers, for example, whom I would see in a rather Trumpian context, vs the rise of the latifundia and the great landowners and wealthy families who came to dominate Rome for a time.

View attachment 2474138 View attachment 2474141 View attachment 2474148

But who does Trump represent?

The oligarchs, the wealthy, and the billionaires- NOT the latifundia. The Musks, Zuckerbergs, Waltons, tech and industrial billionaires. He is the anti-Gracchi brothers. He favors corporate interests over the masses, the wealthy over the middle class and poor who nonetheless may be conned or scammed into supporting him (largely because he preys on their sense of tribalism, fear, and hate of other ethnic groups) but they need only look at who his biggest benefactors are.

Interestingly, Rome in the late 3rd century became ruled by despots like Commodus, Caracalla, and Elagabalus (who you probably would have hated, since he was gay) People who were ruthless, power hungry, and who couldn't give two shits about the masses. Much like Trump today. By the mid 3rd century there was constant power struggles between the military and the emporers, who were constantly at war with both Persia, and sometimes with each other.

 

[Politruk]

But really, I think the late Roman Republic is rather more relevant to where we are. The Gracchi Brothers, for example, whom I would see in a rather Trumpian context, vs the rise of the latifundia and the great landowners and wealthy families who came to dominate Rome for a time.

If the Gracchi were alive in America now, they would certainly be Democrats.

If Trump were a Roman, he would be a patrician reactionary like Sulla.

 

[PaxNurgle]

I remember that the peasants lost. You have to choose your fights carefully.

They did, but I was being ironic, referring to the leader of that uprising who was named Wat Tyler.

The irony being, the guy using that name who posts on this board supports the side of the oligarchs crushing the peasants, rather than the other way around.

 

[Politruk]

By international treaty, Antarctica cannot be colonized.

All the Antarctic treaties were negotiated at a time when everybody saw the continent as useless. If that ever changes, so will the treaties.

 

[Politruk]

The Deep State

You are an idiot.

 

[Politruk]

I'm hoping GenZ and GenAlpha will be superbased and conservative as they grow up.

They won't. They'll be like the Millennials only more so.

 

[ChloeTzang]

If the Gracchi were alive in America now, they would certainly be Democrats.

If Trump were a Roman, he would be a patrician reactionary like Sulla.

Lol. You have it flipped ass about face.

The patrician reactionaries are people like Biden and the Clintons and Pelosi....

The social reformers are the Trump America First team....