The Queernesss Thread

[seela]

I hardly pay attention to that kind of things and I've been wondering if that is, because my native language doesn't differentiate between male and female. No grammatical gender whatsoever.

To me this he/she thing just doesn't really register as a problem. I always figure, that if someone can read what these articles have to offer, it's not really that hard to switch the pronouns while reading. But maybe that's only because both he and she translate to me as a single word and I pay very little attention to gender in general.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I hardly pay attention to that kind of things and I've been wondering if that is, because my native language doesn't differentiate between male and female. No grammatical gender whatsoever.

To me this he/she thing just doesn't really register as a problem. I always figure, that if someone can read what these articles have to offer, it's not really that hard to switch the pronouns while reading. But maybe that's only because both he and she translate to me as a single word and I pay very little attention to gender in general.

I cannot even imagine how much more at peace my entire soul would be, if I had grown up with a language like that.


What language, what's the word?

 

[seela]

I cannot even imagine how much more at peace my entire soul would be, if I had grown up with a language like that.


What language, what's the word?

Finnish. The word is hän (pronounced like hand without d) for both he and she, but in reality even that word isn't used. Instead people use se (pronounced like French c'est), which means it. So even the distinction between animate and inanimate objects is starting to fade, except in official speech and writing.

This one pronoun for third person singular (and plural, except that this isn't a problem with English as it also has only one pronoun for 3rd person plural) leads to stupid things when I'm speaking foreign languages, though. I keep mixing he and she and their equivalents in some other languages, and it makes me sound like a moron, but such is life.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Wow.

And to think one of my worst triggers would have simply not existed if I were born in Finland...

 

[bhndblueyes88]

And maybe there's some other language that has gone the opposite way...it has MORE words for genders. So maybe it has a PERFECT PRONOUN for you.

I think if someone made me pick a career in a field totally unrelated to the one I'm in, I'd be really tempted to pick etymology and linguistics. Languages are just so fascinating O.O

 

[seela]

And maybe there's some other language that has gone the opposite way...it has MORE words for genders. So maybe it has a PERFECT PRONOUN for you.

I think if someone made me pick a career in a field totally unrelated to the one I'm in, I'd be really tempted to pick etymology and linguistics. Languages are just so fascinating O.O

Yes, languages and linguistics are endlessly fascinating, that's why my second degree has everything to do with languages! Unfortunately it's a pretty hard field to find a job.

In Indonesia there's a language called basa ugi. They count five genders, but only use one personal pronoun to refer to all of them as far as I can remember.

In Albania there are (biological) women, who take the role of a man in the society: they do men's work and dress as men. For them grammatically the male category is used, but they are considered being neither women nor men.

In Mandarin Chinese they only distinct he/she in the written form, but not in speech.

In Thai the pronouns are a hot mess. In third person they use different forms not based on gender, but on age and formality. In first person they differentiate between male and female in formal speech, the informal version for first person doesn't differentiate between male and female.

So there are tons of different ways to use language in relation to gender, I just mentioned a couple that popped into my mind.

 

[Stella_Omega]

Just found a really interesting blogger-- Male, he writes short vignettes of female domination. He has a good imagination, knows what he wants, and makes a real effort to imagine what She might get out of it-- possibly with some success.

Hot scenarios, too! The only problem is that some of his vignettes are sequential, and the sequences are reversed so you have to earch back for the first one and read forward. There's a marvellous plugin that makes wordpress into a vary fine fiction archive, but wordpress.com isn't providing it.

http://littlesubmissions.wordpress.com/

 

[Stella_Omega]

I went to a High Tea today.

The rule is: Ladies are guests, men serve. Naked, shaven, and focused ONLY on serving tea.

Ms L wanted me to come as a guest, but was worried that it would be insensitive to ask me to be a girl...

But as it happens, i thought-- why not try crossdressing? So, I borrowed one of my old chiffon tea gowns that I used to wear back in the nineties, back from my daughter.

In the Spirit of "too Much Is never Enough" I added some khol and fire engine red lipstick, and my daughter stuck a fire-engine-red headband on me, twenties-style. Then we draped some jewelry around-- but i wore my big cop boots under the dress because I really can't survive heels anymore. Yes, I was the most elaborately dressed person there. Cross Dressers often are, especially on their first time out-- right?

Mistress Lisa was gratifyingly funny about it, falling on the floor in a dead faint at seeing me in a dress.

I never once was able to forget the lipstick i was wearing, that slick feeling... And seeing red stains on the lip of the cup!

next tea party I'll be a male server, naked except for a (limp) packer harnessed to my hips.

Interesting, the unwitting pressure people put out there-- people kept reassuring me. "You look lovely as a woman!"

Which is nice, but-- not my ambition, you know?

 

[StrayKat]

Why thank you for bumping this thread. I seem to have missed it somehow and now I am reading from the start, very very interesting and educative.
Thank you Stella

 

[Kurokami]

Okay, okay... How did I miss this thread?! This is precisely up ol' Kuro's- and his wife's- alley. Time to get all up in the back pages on this thing

Oh, and Stella? Literally every part of your last post sounds good to me. Makes me wish I had the time to go out and do things

 

[Kurokami]

Actually, while I'm here... I have a question.

I generally identify as bisexual and a switch (basically the most indecisive sexual choices possible, people ) with maybe a slight leaning towards liking women and domming, but the more I think about it the more I begin to realize that's inaccurate. I've got a queer wife, who for long stretches of time, and with varying degrees of intensity, crossdresses, and this sends me through the goddamn roof every time she does it. I've never been able to articulate it really well, but each of her various phases (queer gal all the way up to full on guy mode) have their own distinct attractions, though the two extremes are what I find myself liking most. This is the point in which I'll switch, though oddly this is the only time I'll be dominant with someone approaching my own gender. Whenever I'm with a guy (happening less and less since marriage, regrettably) I'm exclusively submissive.

That's a lot of words with no question, so here it is: what the hell does that make me? Does it even make me anything at all (apart from just plain old Kuro, which is nice enough)? Is there a word for it? I'm hesitant to use the word 'queer' because, acceptable or not, it really does feel like I've got no business using it.

I don't presume to know the first thing about this, because my experience on the subject has always been instinctive and emotional rather than academic (though I keep meaning to change that) but it would be kind of nice to have a word for it, I guess, or at least satisfy my curiosity about it. And so, I open it up to the highly attractive geniuses here. Feel free to call me an idiot if you want

 

[Stella_Omega]

You seem pretty queer to me, Kuro.

 

[bhndblueyes88]

I think you're a unique and beautiful snowflake, Kuro. I mean that both with biting humour toward the phrase, and sincerely.

 

[His_pet_slut]

This. This is wonderful. I have made it through the first page and haven't even started on the links yet, but it is just what I needed.

I never quite fit with any group. Highly sexual from my teens on. Acutely sensitive to touch and sensation. Sensuous. An ethical slut long before the book came out. More like a traditional het male in my attitudes towards sex without love being involved, yet not into having sex with someone I can't have a conversation with. When I began exploring bisexuality I was told by the lesbians I had to pick one or the other. At that time there was no room in the community for bi folks. Particularly ones married to a het male. Into sharing. Then 20 + years down the road the whole BDSM starts coming up. Now days most of my friends are in the LGBQT community. I'm most comfortable with middle aged lesbians for general companionship. Gay men and young lesbians to party with. I affectionately describe my best friend as June Cleaver 2.0 and I am learning gender neutral as my niece prefers that...so we have now coined the term nibbling. I adore my nibbling.

As far as sexually speaking, I still identify as bi, I guess...as it is more about the person than the actual parts. Pretty firmly submissive, but I am a small business owner and hold my own in my professional life. More than a bit of a pain slut...and oh yeah, I have this thing about seeing men together. Does that make me queer or just as my Master says, a trophyslut?

 

[Stella_Omega]

You sound a lot like me!

 

[HottieMama]

This. This is wonderful. I have made it through the first page and haven't even started on the links yet, but it is just what I needed.

I never quite fit with any group. Highly sexual from my teens on. Acutely sensitive to touch and sensation. Sensuous. An ethical slut long before the book came out. More like a traditional het male in my attitudes towards sex without love being involved, yet not into having sex with someone I can't have a conversation with. When I began exploring bisexuality I was told by the lesbians I had to pick one or the other. At that time there was no room in the community for bi folks. Particularly ones married to a het male. Into sharing. Then 20 + years down the road the whole BDSM starts coming up. Now days most of my friends are in the LGBQT community. I'm most comfortable with middle aged lesbians for general companionship. Gay men and young lesbians to party with. I affectionately describe my best friend as June Cleaver 2.0 and I am learning gender neutral as my niece prefers that...so we have now coined the term nibbling. I adore my nibbling.

As far as sexually speaking, I still identify as bi, I guess...as it is more about the person than the actual parts. Pretty firmly submissive, but I am a small business owner and hold my own in my professional life. More than a bit of a pain slut...and oh yeah, I have this thing about seeing men together. Does that make me queer or just as my Master says, a trophyslut?

You sound a lot like me!

With the exception of the "firmly submissive," it sounds a lot like me as well.

 

[His_pet_slut]

You sound a lot like me!

wow, you mean I'm not the only one? I think we are the same age as well.

 

[His_pet_slut]

With the exception of the "firmly submissive," it sounds a lot like me as well.

No wonder I feel at home here. I have such good company.

 

[BiBunny]

I must be the odd one out. I'm bi (don't identify as queer). I love gay men and wish there were more bisexual bears running around. *Fans self* But I don't feel comfortable around a lot of lesbians because I feel as though I'm being judged...or something. I'm not sure if it's reality or if my perception is skewed because I'm viewing everything through paranoid-colored glasses.

On the other hand, I don't feel comfortable around straight people, especially straight couples and especially-especially straight couples with the "curious" female types. Oh, God, FML.

I feel like I have a foot in both worlds, but I'm not really at ease in either. Oh, well, such is life.

 

[Stella_Omega]

I feel like I have a foot in both worlds,

Sort of the definition of Queer, if you ask me...

but I'm not really at ease in either..

We each have that battle to fight. You know?

 

[BiBunny]

Sort of the definition of Queer, if you ask me...

LOL, I thought it when I wrote it. I just hate the damn word.

We each have that battle to fight. You know?

Yes, indeed.

 

[HottieMama]

Bunny... I don't feel comfortable around most lesbians either. When/IF I can get comfortable, I find that's who I have the most in common with, but in the beginning I feel like an awkward, goofy kid. (This may or may not have something to do with the fact that butch women positively make me weak in the damn knees...LOL.) And I totally agree with you about the straight couples with the "curious female types..." I might be bi, but the curiosity (lol) left a long time ago, and I have very little patience with being a teacher. (I'm WAY to much of a "do me Queen" for that bullshit...)

 

[His_pet_slut]

Despite living in the south, my university town has an incredible equality center. It is has it's ups and downs like any organization of this sort, but for the most part, the members are very open to being inclusive of everyone. It has at times been a bit of a battle to break down some of the stereotypes, but they are coming down. We have peer to peer support sessions for just about every thing with the exception of the BDSM spectrum.

This has helped a lot. Honestly, though....most of my friends have a handful of traits in common. They are smart, they are very open minded, they aren't into head games and they are compassionate. Is there a preponderance of lesbians? Yeah, but that is likely because of the fact we have other common interests, such as animal rescue, hiking, etc. With the youngins (as in younger than my kids!)...well...I'll admit to being flattered by the fact they tell me 4 out of 5 lesbians in my town think I'm hot.

 

[Stella_Omega]

And on another tangent...

 

[HottieMama]

Oh I love Iggy Pop...