Category...

[madelinemasoch]

Do not link the Love Your Readers essay in this thread - I've read it and it's unhelpful.

I decided for my most recent story I'm working on to go through literally every category in a process of elimination to find the right one. After the obvious eliminations, the list looks like this in alphabetical order:
- BDSM - My usual. Hardcore fans will like it there.
- Erotic Couplings - Suggested by forums. Low reader count to draw from.
- Horror - Might read as a horror story to some. Sad, and there's blood.
- E/V - Cuckoldry. Exposing and watching, beholding things...
- Fetish - Apparently cuckold stories do well there. I'm a kink-mixer. Don't like the word "fetish", though.
- Group Sex - I've done well there once before. Eleanor has multiple bulls
- Interracial - Suggested on forums. All of the bulls are black, but it's not about them
- Loving Wives - Original idea. Bring back the cuckoldry, drive out the BTBers/"monogamy fetish brigade." Problem: idiotic readership. (I am not taking arguments on that score. This is not a place to ridicule me for pointing it out.)
- Mind Control - Certain forum-goers seem to think that ALL my work could fit here.
- NC/R - See above. I keep being misread as this. See also Horror explanation.
- Novels & Novellas - It is one or the other. Problem: 3 part split.
- Romance - It is one. Problem: dark, sad, playing with bad humors of the heart.
- Transgender - Madeline. However, it's not in her POV and she's not actually in a lot of it.

Then, I decided to rank order all of these remaining categories based on how much I want to put the story there when it's finished. 1 is most likely, 13 is least likely.
13. Mind Control - only fits as a metaphor for Eleanor and Madeline's relationship.
12. Group Sex - not a lot of this in the traditional sense. Cuckoldry is not the same thing
11. E/V - it might fit well there, but that's not the core of the arousal
10. Romance - more mature audience might be able to handle it, but could be too easily disappointed
9. Horror - it's not a horror story in the traditional sense, though horrific at parts
8. NC/R - not what I'm going for. Don't want to venture into that territory again
7. EC - boring catch-all, but I want it to stand out. Low readership in this category
6. N&N - same as above. This shan't even be a category of its own, in my view.
5. Fetish - not enough obscenity to make sense here. Did not so well there once before. Hate the word "fetish"
4. Trans - prominent "theme" in the story, but not the main one. Also not the most representative portrayal; readers there may be disappointed as the Romance ones would be.
3. Interracial - prominent "theme" and closer to the center, but not quite. Might wake up some readers there to the type of problems one can encounter and how one should behave as an interracial cuckoldress.
2. BDSM - tried and true for me. Really just putting the M in it, though.
1. LW - original idea. Still seems best fit technically, because it's about the relationship/marriage itself, not the interracial or trans or even dom/sub aspect alone.

I've been told the lines about "what most readers want" and I don't care to hear them again. I've been told I'm a kink-mixer, like a crossover account, I suppose. Something I've noticed on the forums is that it seems like most people think of the category system first and the story later; that is to say that I see people thinking of it as "don't put too many different kinks in one story because that's not what x category readers are looking for/because it makes it hard to categorize anyway." I think this view is backwards. Instead of bending over, why don't we think of a better way to solve the problem? There literally isn't a cuckold category, especially with the state LW is in (I do not want to relitigate that in this thread.) Those stories like mine are spread thin across the site, from LW anyway to BDSM and Fetish all the way to NC/R. I do not want to put it in Fetish, it feels like degrading the quality of the story I'm trying to tell to call it a "fetish novel." It's simply not my fault that there isn't an interracial BBC femdom cuckoldry feminization category. It's a popular porn genre on the internet, anyway, and we just call it BNWO. The mixture of this nexus is where my writing truly lies. One can say "but ah, those are all fetishes anyway!" only to completely miss my point with the most utter futility to understand imaginable. They aren't fetishes as if one can put them into neat little boxes and grab from them what they want for a particular story. Forgive me for saying that sounds like a bad writing process. It might be good for panderers, but for artists, I don't think it would be. Plus, if I'm a kink-mixer, what does that make the people who jump from the craziest zaniest topics like Non-Human all the way over to Incest and back again? That's just not how I write. I don't consider these things to be "fetishes." Is there even any real human being out there who only gets off to one thing? In 2023? I severely doubt that. It's about the erotic form; it's not even about sexuality, it's about who has power and what they use it for. It's about the intersection, the relation and how it's characterized. Like, come on, the medium of prose writing is perfect for this kind of thing. And still, so many beautiful vibes that this produced were missed in my singular completed LW story, for now (not the subject of this thread)–all because there's some shit in the prologue!

I say all this to say I am not here to please gooners and I always make that very clear. Didn't nut? Too bad! That's not why I wrote the damn thing. Go back to Xvideos where you belong.

 

[ElectricBlue]

Just write the fucking thing and publish it somewhere. This self-justification you put yourself through is just as absurd as poor old JohnSm123 with all his excuses why he can't write.

If your readers "don't get you" - which is mostly what you're saying, I think - maybe that's on you, not your readers. Treat them with a little less contempt, and you might do better. Just a thought.

 

[Altissimus]

Do not link the Love Your Readers essay in this thread - I've read it and it's unhelpful.

I decided for my most recent story I'm working on to go through literally every category in a process of elimination to find the right one. After the obvious eliminations, the list looks like this in alphabetical order:
- BDSM - My usual. Hardcore fans will like it there.
- Erotic Couplings - Suggested by forums. Low reader count to draw from.
- Horror - Might read as a horror story to some. Sad, and there's blood.
- E/V - Cuckoldry. Exposing and watching, beholding things...
- Fetish - Apparently cuckold stories do well there. I'm a kink-mixer. Don't like the word "fetish", though.
- Group Sex - I've done well there once before. Eleanor has multiple bulls
- Interracial - Suggested on forums. All of the bulls are black, but it's not about them
- Loving Wives - Original idea. Bring back the cuckoldry, drive out the BTBers/"monogamy fetish brigade." Problem: idiotic readership. (I am not taking arguments on that score. This is not a place to ridicule me for pointing it out.)
- Mind Control - Certain forum-goers seem to think that ALL my work could fit here.
- NC/R - See above. I keep being misread as this. See also Horror explanation.
- Novels & Novellas - It is one or the other. Problem: 3 part split.
- Romance - It is one. Problem: dark, sad, playing with bad humors of the heart.
- Transgender - Madeline. However, it's not in her POV and she's not actually in a lot of it.

Then, I decided to rank order all of these remaining categories based on how much I want to put the story there when it's finished. 1 is most likely, 13 is least likely.
13. Mind Control - only fits as a metaphor for Eleanor and Madeline's relationship.
12. Group Sex - not a lot of this in the traditional sense. Cuckoldry is not the same thing
11. E/V - it might fit well there, but that's not the core of the arousal
10. Romance - more mature audience might be able to handle it, but could be too easily disappointed
9. Horror - it's not a horror story in the traditional sense, though horrific at parts
8. NC/R - not what I'm going for. Don't want to venture into that territory again
7. EC - boring catch-all, but I want it to stand out. Low readership in this category
6. N&N - same as above. This shan't even be a category of its own, in my view.
5. Fetish - not enough obscenity to make sense here. Did not so well there once before. Hate the word "fetish"
4. Trans - prominent "theme" in the story, but not the main one. Also not the most representative portrayal; readers there may be disappointed as the Romance ones would be.
3. Interracial - prominent "theme" and closer to the center, but not quite. Might wake up some readers there to the type of problems one can encounter and how one should behave as an interracial cuckoldress.
2. BDSM - tried and true for me. Really just putting the M in it, though.
1. LW - original idea. Still seems best fit technically, because it's about the relationship/marriage itself, not the interracial or trans or even dom/sub aspect alone.

I've been told the lines about "what most readers want" and I don't care to hear them again. I've been told I'm a kink-mixer, like a crossover account, I suppose. Something I've noticed on the forums is that it seems like most people think of the category system first and the story later; that is to say that I see people thinking of it as "don't put too many different kinks in one story because that's not what x category readers are looking for/because it makes it hard to categorize anyway." I think this view is backwards. Instead of bending over, why don't we think of a better way to solve the problem? There literally isn't a cuckold category, especially with the state LW is in (I do not want to relitigate that in this thread.) Those stories like mine are spread thin across the site, from LW anyway to BDSM and Fetish all the way to NC/R. I do not want to put it in Fetish, it feels like degrading the quality of the story I'm trying to tell to call it a "fetish novel." It's simply not my fault that there isn't an interracial BBC femdom cuckoldry feminization category. It's a popular porn genre on the internet, anyway, and we just call it BNWO. The mixture of this nexus is where my writing truly lies. One can say "but ah, those are all fetishes anyway!" only to completely miss my point with the most utter futility to understand imaginable. They aren't fetishes as if one can put them into neat little boxes and grab from them what they want for a particular story. Forgive me for saying that sounds like a bad writing process. It might be good for panderers, but for artists, I don't think it would be. Plus, if I'm a kink-mixer, what does that make the people who jump from the craziest zaniest topics like Non-Human all the way over to Incest and back again? That's just not how I write. I don't consider these things to be "fetishes." Is there even any real human being out there who only gets off to one thing? In 2023? I severely doubt that. It's about the erotic form; it's not even about sexuality, it's about who has power and what they use it for. It's about the intersection, the relation and how it's characterized. Like, come on, the medium of prose writing is perfect for this kind of thing. And still, so many beautiful vibes that this produced were missed in my singular completed LW story, for now (not the subject of this thread)–all because there's some shit in the prologue!

I say all this to say I am not here to please gooners and I always make that very clear. Didn't nut? Too bad! That's not why I wrote the damn thing. Go back to Xvideos where you belong.

Ok?

 

[M_K_Babalon]

I would at least aim for a catagory. At least then, it's not so much a quandary.

 

[lovecraft68]

Do not link the Love Your Readers essay in this thread - I've read it and it's unhelpful.

This made my day for a variety of reasons. I'm not saying there isn't some helpful tips to be found there, but I am so tired of that over rated How to and the unimaginative twits who swear by it. That author-equally over rated-was the master of misogynistic stroke and little else...no surprise they're popular here.

Also ignore Electric Blue, the definition of a legend in his own mind because someone has to think so.

Your fundamental issue on this site is the readers want things put in specific boxes and if its in Category X, then that's all they want, no mixing X with Y and Z. Your stories tend to not fall under one genre and your style not overly fawning. You're one of the few here who write what you want, not what others do, the ones bashing you like to claim that, but they're full of it as the neediness shown in threads proves.

Now, if you wanted my advice? Go with LW. You mention it multiple times so its in your head. The drawback is the moron brigade and the fact you're a female daring to enter man baby central is a cause for extra angst. But if its where the story belongs so be it. Your attitude and style scream fuck you, but you seem to hesitate because of what you're told here by a group of eager to please score obsessed types. That's not you, and you should never let it be you.

You can let LW beat you by avoiding it, or you can shove that story so far up their ass that the next time they're the guest of honor at a pegging party they won't even feel it.

Give it them, and hard.

 

[madelinemasoch]

This made my day for a variety of reasons. I'm not saying there isn't some helpful tips to be found there, but I am so tired of that over rated How to and the unimaginative twits who swear by it. That author-equally over rated-was the master of misogynistic stroke and little else...no surprise they're popular here.

Also ignore Electric Blue, the definition of a legend in his own mind because someone has to think so.

Your fundamental issue on this site is the readers want things put in specific boxes and if its in Category X, then that's all they want, no mixing X with Y and Z. Your stories tend to not fall under one genre and your style not overly fawning. You're one of the few here who write what you want, not what others do, the ones bashing you like to claim that, but they're full of it as the neediness shown in threads proves.

Now, if you wanted my advice? Go with LW. You mention it multiple times so its in your head. The drawback is the moron brigade and the fact you're a female daring to enter man baby central is a cause for extra angst. But if its where the story belongs so be it. Your attitude and style scream fuck you, but you seem to hesitate because of what you're told here by a group of eager to please score obsessed types. That's not you, and you should never let it be you.

You can let LW beat you by avoiding it, or you can shove that story so far up their ass that the next time they're the guest of honor at a pegging party they won't even feel it.

Give it them, and hard.

You likewise made my day with this. Thank you. My question has been answered and I will be going at them hard.

 

[NoTalentHack]

This made my day for a variety of reasons. I'm not saying there isn't some helpful tips to be found there, but I am so tired of that over rated How to and the unimaginative twits who swear by it. That author-equally over rated-was the master of misogynistic stroke and little else...no surprise they're popular here.

Also ignore Electric Blue, the definition of a legend in his own mind because someone has to think so.

Your fundamental issue on this site is the readers want things put in specific boxes and if its in Category X, then that's all they want, no mixing X with Y and Z. Your stories tend to not fall under one genre and your style not overly fawning. You're one of the few here who write what you want, not what others do, the ones bashing you like to claim that, but they're full of it as the neediness shown in threads proves.

Now, if you wanted my advice? Go with LW. You mention it multiple times so its in your head. The drawback is the moron brigade and the fact you're a female daring to enter man baby central is a cause for extra angst. But if its where the story belongs so be it. Your attitude and style scream fuck you, but you seem to hesitate because of what you're told here by a group of eager to please score obsessed types. That's not you, and you should never let it be you.

You can let LW beat you by avoiding it, or you can shove that story so far up their ass that the next time they're the guest of honor at a pegging party they won't even feel it.

Give it them, and hard.

For once, I agree with LC. I mean, not with any of his logic about how he arrived there, with his usual counterfactual bugaboos, but the conclusion.

Put it in LW. It’s going to go over like a fart in a church, but you’re being true to yourself. It’s clearly what you want to do, so pull the trigger.

 

[SimonDoom]

I have no idea how to answer because you don't say enough about the story and you don't say enough about what you want to achieve with the category choice.

 

[lovecraft68]

For once, I agree with LC. I mean, not with any of his logic about how he arrived there, with his usual counterfactual bugaboos, but the conclusion.

Put it in LW. It’s going to go over like a fart in a church, but you’re being true to yourself. It’s clearly what you want to do, so pull the trigger.

I think your comment about counterfactual is just being self deluded. The category is a mine field where every step can set off another of the various factions. The fact the category has the lowest aggregate score of any major category is all the evidence anyone needs. All the threads here complaining about the crowd is more...or are they all making it up?

As I said before, your tag lines are all I need to see as to how you squeaked a couple of decent scores there. Pandering to the CMI crowd to the nth degree.

You don't write true to yourself, you write for approval. But don't feel bad, you're in good company with about 95% of the posters here. All talking about "I write for me" and all so desperate for that H and those numbers. Nothing wrong with that, its the only 'payment' one can get here, but the edge lord act some here put on is laughable.

 

[NoTalentHack]

I think your comment about counterfactual is just being self deluded. The category is a mine field where every step can set off another of the various factions. The fact the category has the lowest aggregate score of any major category is all the evidence anyone needs. All the threads here complaining about the crowd is more...or are they all making it up?

Not the difficulty of scoring well in there, no. I mean, you know that from experience. Nor about it being a minefield, but only if you actually think random strangers' opinions on the internet can hurt you.

As I said before, your tag lines are all I need to see as to how you squeaked a couple of decent scores there. Pandering to the CMI crowd to the nth degree.

LOL. Something something books and their covers. If you haven't actually read the stories, there's no point discussing them with you. Or do you think a Farewell to Arms is about an amputee?

And I assume you mean Chronically Mentally Ill? That's a laugh, coming from the guy who knows he needs help but hides behind tinfoil hat ideas about the government wanting to keep everyone medicated. Of the two of us, who's actually a stable, well-balanced individual that can take criticism, respond to it without getting mad, say he's sorry if he's wrong, and not randomly challenge strangers on the internet to meet them in person when they start losing an argument? Which of us hasn't been in jail for anger management issues and violence? Physician, heal thyself.

You don't write true to yourself, you write for approval. But don't feel bad, you're in good company with about 95% of the posters here. All talking about "I write for me" and all so desperate for that H and those numbers. Nothing wrong with that, its the only 'payment' one can get here, but the edge lord act some here put on is laughable.

The only person that regularly crows about their scores on this board, outside the contest threads, is you. If I bring up scores, it's because they seem to be the only thing you care about. I've always said, my favorite thing about writing in LW is the sheer amount of comments, about knowing that people engaged with the work, to see what they found good or bad about it, or original versus tired.

I'll leave it to you to tell the exact same sibcest story over and over again until you get the score-based approval you desperately need. Only one person in this conversation seems to be desperately chasing red Hs, and it ain't me.

Also, a lot of the comments you just made? Sound EXACTLY like Tilan. Man, he'd be proud to see what a miserable, envious little troll you can be when you put your mind to it.