Subspace: The Physical Effects

Someone recently pmed me with a question about their physical reaction during a scene and whether or not it could be attributed to subspace.

I have searched high and low trying to find good links on this topic, but haven't really found anything.

So, if we could talk about what we feel physically or Doms, what you see and how you cope with it, that might be helpful.

As I mentioned to this person, it is very important that the Dominant and the submissive in a scene are aware of any health issues or potential risks. Sometimes, medical issues may mimic what appears to be subspace, so once again, clear communication is a must.

My teeth start chattering like I'm cold even though I'm far from chilly. Sometimes my muscles turn to jell-o and I lose the ability to support my own weight. And there's that lovely glazed look I get in my eyes.

Red Menace said:

My teeth start chattering like I'm cold even though I'm far from chilly. Sometimes my muscles turn to jell-o and I lose the ability to support my own weight. And there's that lovely glazed look I get in my eyes.

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Near perfect description compared to the questions I was asked.

Yep, shivering and trembling are big indicators that she has gone deep.

Do you moan?

Can you think coherently? If so, what are your thoughts when there?

I seem to move much slower, even earlier on into space. If the Dominant speaks to me, my head slowly turns to listen.

Does anybody else moan a lot? I mean a whole lot?

Sounds like possible hyperventilating?

I can think of a number of symptoms that go under the name
'clouding of consciousness' or delirium or dissociation. The person would appear not entirely 'there', would not appear 'responsive' (to questions), would not make sense in what they say--rambling or incoherent. They would appear disoriented--not knowing where they are.

Physically, we're talking of effects of such things as oxygen deprivation, loss of blood, going into shock (which has other symptoms like coldness and trembling). Also something like repeated enemas or dehydration or overhydration could unbalance electrolytes and 'cloud consciousness.'

Another clear symptom is prostration. The person cannot stand, has to lie down, because they are too weak.

Unfortunately, someone who's 'high' may manifest some of the symptoms, 'unresponsiveness, dissociation, incoherence.

I don't think there's an answer, such as 'look for the smile' or talk of bliss, etc. because some bad states could generate a temporary euphoria and not 'feel' that desperate even though the person really is. E.g, in oxygen deprivation. The moral, imho would be to err on the side of caution. Better to have the 'sub' say "Damn it, you interrupted my 'high'" than have a desperately ill sub on your hands, possible one in mortal peril.

Johnny Mayberry said:

Sounds like possible hyperventilating?

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Umm nope!

I don't have any trouble breathing, unless I am exerting myself physically.

Yes, Pure,

The physical attributes of subspace do mirror other potentially harmful symptoms.

I know I have posted this before, but I am hypoglycemic. My symptomology when my blood sugar is low closely resembles subspace in appearance.

MissTaken said:

Umm nope!

I don't have any trouble breathing, unless I am exerting myself physically.

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Well, all it takes is (I think) 5 extra breaths a minute to start hyperventilating...

Johnny Mayberry said:

Well, all it takes is (I think) 5 extra breaths a minute to start hyperventilating...

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Subspace is more akin with an altered conciousness.

Some psychologists say that it is a form of dissociation.

I dont' understand the hyperventilating thing as it has no real impact on my breathing unless I am very physically active during the scene or my breathing changes with arousal, as it does with vanilla sex.

However, it doesnt' take extreme pain to go into subspace. In fact a tone of voice does it for me. But, in a situation where a sadistic sub is being exposed to excessive pain, I could see a risk of hyperventilating amidst tears and screaming.

Is that where you were going with that?

the brush of His hand over my nipples...

my eyes glaze over and i can't think

i feel like i'm breathing molasses

my lips part, my mouth opens slightly, i moan

it is a struggle to keep my eyes open and focused

....

it just goes on from there.

~anelize

MissTaken said:

Subspace is more akin with an altered conciousness.

Some psychologists say that it is a form of dissociation.

I dont' understand the hyperventilating thing as it has no real impact on my breathing unless I am very physically active during the scene or my breathing changes with arousal, as it does with vanilla sex.

However, it doesnt' take extreme pain to go into subspace. In fact a tone of voice does it for me. But, in a situation where a sadistic sub is being exposed to excessive pain, I could see a risk of hyperventilating amidst tears and screaming.

Is that where you were going with that?

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No, I was going more in the direction of breathing being a part of meditation, but how taking it too far can lead to hypoxia, and the symptoms you described, chills and whatnot

Red Menace said:

My teeth start chattering like I'm cold even though I'm far from chilly. Sometimes my muscles turn to jell-o and I lose the ability to support my own weight. And there's that lovely glazed look I get in my eyes.

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This thread has been the hardest for me to read

it brings forth all kinds of memeries of R

anyway the above is what I saw when she went into subspace
I had to be very careful what I did in public cause she could go there so easly

To me this is the pay off for Doming
to have the power to take
the one
to this space

It gives/gave me such a sence of power
that I went some where

I've seen someone go into subspace myself twice and have read a cople dozen first-hand accounts of what it's like, from subs and Doms both.

It reads to me exactly like a hypnotic trance. The submissive becomes highly susceptible to suggestion, reacts slowly or even dreamily, experiences feelings of disassociation or "floating", and extreme muscular relaxation.

My own belief is that subspace is a very narrow form of hyupnotic suggestion, similar to a meditative trance (but closer to the hypnosis). The similarities to what you might see to a stage hypnotist seems to me to be striking. In the vast majority of the time, the Dom uses certain key words and a very specific tone and volume of voice along with certain physical cues to induce subspace. Care of the person while there is very similar to hypnosis, as is the means by which the Dom brings the submissive back from there.

In fact, it might be worthwhile to ask DCL over here to this thread, since he has some experience on both ends of things, as I recall (Hey! Why don't I do that myself? ).

i always have to be careful to let a Dom know that i can and will stop breathing in subspace. This has never bothered me but has sent more than one person into a complete panic.

my heart rate actually slows and blood pressure drops (which is extremely dangerous for me personally - it's at about a 95/50 now and that's -high- for me), which more or less sends my body into a state of shock. This usually doesn't last too long, since it's something else that tends to make people panic and they stop whatever it is that put me in that state, but life sure looks good while i'm there.

Was there not a very long thread here called subspace?

It has its own category in the Library, Richard. A couple of threads actually

~anelize

AnelizeDarkEyes said:

It has its own category in the Library, Richard. A couple of threads actually

~anelize

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see I have not lost my sanity

well not much of it

i do not know that i can claim subspace. i think i am fearful of labels on anything that happens to me through Him.

There are different levels. Mornings where He finds a quick moment to put me on my knees before i am off to work leave me in a certain mental state, similar to being wrapped in a warm blanket.

A slap to the face alone or hard hair pulling leaves me a little more unbalanced, tends to give me that eyes glazed over look, lights on with no one home.

More intense play leaves me in much deeper states as i am sure are common. The closest thing i have been able to relate it to was the lethargy one gets from alcohol, not speaking of drunk but a buzz. It is hard to focus. i shake a lot, all over body shivers. Teeth chatter.

And just to lighten things up a bit, most recently i discovered during an evening of wax play that the sting from hot wax in certain places causes my leg to shake spasmodically...much like a puppy's hind leg would do when scratched in just the right spot. *smile*

zanna

I put a spell on you, because you're mine

It feels very nearly like being drugged to me, and in that same sense that I am more aware and sensitive in some ways, but I'm really too "stoned" to fully comprehend. It kind of starts with a rush and definite shakiness, and when pushed goes into the slow-mo, glazed eyes, unfocused and yet somehow more focused sensation, peaceful but electric... it's like going under, sinking, but floating... and a simple word or a touch can give me very intense, distinct, long trails of tingles or chills throughout my body... thoughts are present but also kind of free floating and unfocused, speaking in complete sentences is difficult. It's feels pretty primal and spacey, dropped way down... lackadaisical, languid, but still intent on Her.

I have never been able to verbalize what it's like satisfactorily - I just feel very "stoned" but unlike any other drug. I don't need pain to go either, just a particular presence. I can also appear somewhat normal shortly "afterwards" but find that can be misleading sometimes when I've been wandering around in public kind of half-conscious and not fully in reality, having to really focus on accomplishing simple tasks, like getting to the underground and getting off at the right stop lol.

Hi LS and others. Those are very moving and articulate descriptions. These are damned hard experiences to put into words, and these people have done rather well. And there are 'threads' on subspace. Almost always it's assumed that all parties know what they're dealing with.

My personal understanding of the question is this--this is how I took it-- From the outside does a person in 'subspace' look distinctly different from one who's, say, suffering lack of oxygen or low blood sugar or disturbed electrolytes.

Or, What should we infer is happening physically to one who shows the SIGNS of subspace-- the euphoria and dissociation?
Which leads to the question, In a situation we do NOT know of (being unable to directly tap into 'subspace' of another person, esp. one who's not talking), but with the external signs, what, if anything, should we do?

To put it differently, Should I lie back and congratulate myself because the 'sub' looks happy and stoned. Well, here are some ideas: One might want to check her oxygen supply, her color, the temp of her hands and feet, etc. etc. You might want to 'review the events'-- if you've just injected a bunch of wine into her anus, these 'stoned' signs may not auger well.

Lots of good points

1. Yep, there is a thread. *shrugs* However, this one did a quick and wonderful job to reassure someone that their first trip to subspace led to normal reactions. Also, new threads and old topics are cool as our population changes with wind, no?

2. In terms of health and well being. I do think it is important that a submissive doesn't play unless she is healthy. Even a cold, or post flu lethargy could feasibly lead to some difficulties, I would think. And, a Dominant should and most do "check in" with the submissive over and over during a scene and are very aware of her safety.

3. Yep, Jim. It is much like hynosis although I have never been hynotized and the "coming back" is an important part of the scene. I can remember times when the Dominant would be looking into my eyes, directing me to "come back" and I moaned a bit and said, "Noooo, not yet." *giggles*

4. Thanks, Johnny for clarification. I haven't had any experience with breathing and that sort of thing being an issue, but it is certainly something to be aware of.

5. Ummm I forgot what my other random thought was!

JazzManJim said:

In fact, it might be worthwhile to ask DCL over here to this thread

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You ask, and I obey. Master.

Stage hypnosis is a bit different than the hypnotic trance you might experience in a doctor's office -- one could be called the "deer in the headlights" version of hypnosis, the other is more "meditative", but both are, essentially, moderated moments of self led concentration (which I prefer to the word "dissociation", which to me more denotes a state of dementia than narrowly directed thought). In any event, neither phenomenon sound like this "subspace" event you're all describing.

I have no idea what "subspace" is, what the derivation of the word is, who coined it, who uses it, who defines it, what its connotations are, and whether or not it's simply slang for a word or phrase already in use that also describes the effect. From what you're all describing here it seems to be brought about by more than suggestion or forced will, but also by direct physical contact, which, aside from making you all comfy with pillows, hypnotists do not do.

So, we're talking sensualism here are we? A heightened awareness of the sexual self that results in a bliss state? Is it akin to what the Christians experience when "born again", or what I feel when a Subway Series hits New York?

No, it seems more than that. Again, all that is just "Whew! Happieness!" What you're all describing sounds almost pharmacalogical, like a psychedellic mushroom induced altered state, or a rapture brought about by fasting and flagellation -- but at the very least, something created by (somewhat risky) physical contact, as well as emotional.

Let's be careful out there.

http://www.stdimension.de/Subspace/subspace.jpg

Dixon Carter Lee said:

Let's be careful out there.

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Here I thought you might post something like this.......

http://www.museum.tv/archives/etv/H/htmlH/hillstreetb/hillstreetbIMAGE/hillstreetb.jpg

I believe subspace is a bit of a pun.

In science fiction, a space ship can be sent across the universe by entering "subspace", a place outside of this world. q.v. hyperspace.

In BDSM, there is a person called the "sub" (as in submissive) who can be sent (by thier Dominant) to a place where they feel outside of this world.

Put the two together....

Actually, in Sci-Fi, Star Trek in particular, Subspace is not where you send ships, but communications. But I get where you're going with the whole "Sub" and "Dom" thing. Now bring me a beer. And if you spill...