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Well it's Waffle House after all. This stuff is gonna happen.

FGB said:
I have always found it odd that as a nation we have backed off a great deal helping the mentally ill.

Add in that Morals have taken a nose dive along with ethics and given the spiritual decline of churches ect. I can understand why the anti-gun people think that Gun control will solve almost all the killing problem.

But the problem will still be with us. The crazies will just turn to explosives, cars and whatever else can be had.

Removing firearms from the violent and mentally ill and such will make a noticeable impact but A huge revamping of mental health care would have more and longer lasting effects.

Just the amount of VFW's alone that need help is stunning.
Click to expand...

Go talk to the ACLU FGB. It was their law suits that emptied the mental hospitals and made it damn near impossible to commit anyone. Can't violate their rights don't ya know?

But now the rest of society is being expected to give up their rights so the criminally insane can enjoy theirs.
 
WoundedKnee said:
Is that a Zimmerman reference? ;) ;)
Click to expand...

That's just one in a long list......

Latinos are almost like Jews and Asians, shit the way things are going they might be doing better than either in the near future, as an entire demographic block of course.

That will solidify their whiteness and confirm all of them as oppressive racist Nazis.

Unless of course shot by a white cop, then suddenly because it's convenient headline for the social justice bigots, but that's as close they will ever get to being REAL minorities.
 
jaF0 said:
You can thank Ronnie of Bonzo fame for starting that trend.
Click to expand...

No, as pointed out, you can thank the ACLU. They were the driving factor and we are the ones who have to adjust, and as pointed out, are being asked to surrender our rights in order that they may bask in the glory of theirs.
 
Cement reinforcers to stop trucks from mowing down civilians in Europe, and metal detectors at the entrance of schools and concerts in the US.

20 years ago, I would have seen such things only in Dystopian movies.

20 years from now, God knows how our cities will look like. The affluent areas will probably look like airport areas, surrounded by armed guards and metal detectors.
 
*chuckle*

Many of them already are. As they lecture us about walls and guns, they hide behind them immune to the very havoc they agitate for. Being shot by criminals and the insane is for "the little people."
 
jaF0 said:
Ronnie started the trend of closing facilities nationwide. Many of the former State Hospitals closed during or shortly after his reign of intolerance.
Click to expand...

Yeah, yeah, yeah...
All problems are rooted in conservatives in general and Republicans in specific.
We get it. You're like a broken record.
 
bellisarius said:
Go talk to the ACLU FGB. It was their law suits that emptied the mental hospitals and made it damn near impossible to commit anyone. Can't violate their rights don't ya know?

But now the rest of society is being expected to give up their rights so the criminally insane can enjoy theirs.
Click to expand...

Got a link for that? It's not how it went down in Michigan.. you know, ANOTHER one of those evil social programs costing money and all.. I'm sure I don't have to mention engler was a republican...

https://www.wxyz.com/news/local-new...come-the-last-hope-for-michigans-mentally-ill

Snip:

In 1997, then-Governor John Engler issued a press release announcing the closure of Michigan’s “underutilized” state mental hospitals, moving most patients out of the state’s 16 mental hospitals and into the care of providers in the community.


------------------

Mental health workers fought it, but many now embrace the end results. A decade ago, then Michigan Governor John Engler closed most state mental hospitals because of budget constraints,


----------------


https://www.metrotimes.com/detroit/...ison-and-the-mentally-ill/Content?oid=2479685

Politics & Prejudices: Prison and the mentally ill

snip:

Thirty years ago, that man would very likely have been sent to a state mental hospital. Mack, who is now the state court administrator, told me Michigan once had 20,000 beds for the mentally ill. But in 1991, under Gov. John Engler, the state began closing most of its mental hospitals to save money, as part of a national deinstitutionalization wave.

By 2004, there were fewer than 1,000 beds for mentally ill people in all of Michigan.

Many of those who were released were by no means ready to re-enter society. They became homeless, slept in the streets, did not take medications they needed (and often couldn't get), committed crimes, and ended up — in prison.
 
WoundedKnee said:
Yeah, yeah, yeah...
All problems are rooted in conservatives in general and Republicans in specific.
We get it. You're like a broken record.
Click to expand...


All? No.. many? Of course. Wait til the gop finds a way to cut off your disability.
 
Slow down Shitslinger.

You're going to make Rory work too hard to stay on top.
 
WoundedKnee said:
*chuckle*

Many of them already are. As they lecture us about walls and guns, they hide behind them immune to the very havoc they agitate for. Being shot by criminals and the insane is for "the little people."
Click to expand...

Well, belisarius is correct.
It's much harder in the US (compared to Commonwealth countries) to commit and keep for observation risky patients. Perhaps a few of the shootings could have been avoided in that way.

But more worrisome are the 'modeling' /immitation, combined with the gun culture.
. I read somewhere that even Russian kids are now engaging in school massacres, with bombs and knives instead of guns.
 
cowslinger64 said:
...

Snip:

In 1997, then-Governor John Engler issued a press release announcing the closure of Michigan’s “underutilized” state mental hospitals, moving most patients out of the state’s 16 mental hospitals and into the care of providers in the community.


------------------

Mental health workers fought it, but many now embrace the end results. A decade ago, then Michigan Governor John Engler closed most state mental hospitals because of budget constraints,


----------------


https://www.metrotimes.com/detroit/...ison-and-the-mentally-ill/Content?oid=2479685

Politics & Prejudices: Prison and the mentally ill

snip:

Thirty years ago, that man would very likely have been sent to a state mental hospital. Mack, who is now the state court administrator, told me Michigan once had 20,000 beds for the mentally ill. But in 1991, under Gov. John Engler, the state began closing most of its mental hospitals to save money, as part of a national deinstitutionalization wave.

By 2004, there were fewer than 1,000 beds for mentally ill people in all of Michigan.

Many of those who were released were by no means ready to re-enter society. They became homeless, slept in the streets, did not take medications they needed (and often couldn't get), committed crimes, and ended up — in prison.
Click to expand...

The trend to close beds for the mentally ill has happened all over the developed world because:

Care in the Community was proven to provide better outcomes and was more effective at treating mental illness than the vast institutions that just housed the mentally ill away from society.

In the UK, the county of Kent was the first to develop and trial Care in the Community. The results in improved mental health and more adjusted individuals needing fewer emergency admissions were startling.

BUT IT CAME WITH A LARGE WARNING.

Care in the Community was not cheaper. It was more expensive, needed more trained staff, and there should always be hospital beds, including some secure hospital beds, for the patients who had a relapse and became a danger mainly to themselves but sometimes to others.

The politicians and administrators ignored the warning. They closed the large institutions and made capital gains on the land released. They didn't fund Care in the Community at the level it needed.

Now we have a crisis. We don't have enough trained staff and we are desperately short of emergency beds.
 
beew said:
Cement reinforcers to stop trucks from mowing down civilians in Europe, and metal detectors at the entrance of schools and concerts in the US.

20 years ago, I would have seen such things only in Dystopian movies.

20 years from now, God knows how our cities will look like. The affluent areas will probably look like airport areas, surrounded by armed guards and metal detectors.
Click to expand...

If gun control worked in any way to prevent mass murder, why would you need those sorts of security measures?
 
beew said:
Well, belisarius is correct.
It's much harder in the US (compared to Commonwealth countries) to commit and keep for observation risky patients. Perhaps a few of the shootings could have been avoided in that way.

But more worrisome are the 'modeling' /immitation, combined with the gun culture.
. I read somewhere that even Russian kids are now engaging in school massacres, with bombs and knives instead of guns.
Click to expand...

The "gun culture" as represented by the likes of the NRA membership do not model or imitate this behavior. The ones who do it are the ones outside of the gun culture per se. They are part and parcel of a culture fostered by the Progressive moral busybodies who have created a culture of misfits alienated by that very culture. They are beset by a nihilistic school of thought that rejects all morality of a more traditional view for one that demands, "Who are you to judge?" and then turns around and judges and attacks everything and everybody who might say, "But can we at least get a hearing?"

The Cruz shooter was a perfect example. He was on everyone's radar, everyone knew he was a ticking time bomb (especially his now moralizing classmates who had bullied him for years with no pushback from authority) and thanks to this new "morality" he was given every opportunity to act out on his threats because everyone in a position to act/intervene is paralyzed to act for fear of the PC blowback.

And then, the same people who created this culture turn around and play judge, jury and hopeful executioners who know exactly who to blame: the law-abiding citizens who happen to be NRA members and the vacuous "assault weapon." There is never a single amount of self-reflection on the part of creators of this drama because their intentions are as pure as the driven snow and they will book no judging of the results of their utopian ideas, no matter how dystopian their efforts truly prove to be.
 
bellisarius said:
Go talk to the ACLU FGB. It was their law suits that emptied the mental hospitals and made it damn near impossible to commit anyone. Can't violate their rights don't ya know?

But now the rest of society is being expected to give up their rights so the criminally insane can enjoy theirs.
Click to expand...

You've been pushing this bullshit for years. Constant repetition won't suddenly make it any less bullshittery.
 
richard_daily said:
If gun control worked in any way to prevent mass murder, why would you need those sorts of security measures?
Click to expand...

Haha I wasn't expecting that.
You 'gun fans' are experts at tossing arguments in your favour, you would give a Greek or Jew merchant a run for his money.

It's just that when I watched "What happened yo Monday" this weekend, I thought: "That's how American cities might look in the future, if their gun problems escalate."

But there are signs that changes are happening (like lowering the age to 21), and the attitude of lawmakers is changing too. Baby steps, but signs of a consistent trend.
 
beew said:
Haha I wasn't expecting that.
You 'gun fans' are experts at tossing arguments in your favour, you would give a Greek or Jew merchant a run for his money.

It's just that when I watched "What happened yo Monday" this weekend, I thought: "That's how American cities might look in the future, if their gun problems escalate."

But there are signs that changes are happening (like lowering the age to 21), and the attitude of lawmakers is changing too. Baby steps, but signs of a consistent trend.
Click to expand...

ETA
I meant increasing the legal age limit for purchase of guns.
 
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