writing short chapters

Hi fellow writers!

I just wanted to get some others' thoughts and feedback.

I'm in the midst of releasing my second story on here, one chapter at a time. I've been generally doing well so far as comments/ratings, but the chief complaint I get (perhaps really the only one, lucky me) is that my chapters are too short.

Most of my chapters tend to be a single scene, word count in the range of 1200-2500 words. Sometimes, multiple scenes have a certain amount of logical relation, in which case they get lumped together into a ~4K chapter.

While I do like to think that my chapters have logical, sometimes dramatic stopping points, that seems very short for what I see submitted here typically.
At the same time, sometimes I go back and look at what I've written, and it's hard for me to see how I could have made the chapter longer.

Of course the solution is very simple... release multiple chapters at once.

BUT I don't like to do this -- the reason being that most of my stories are crafted with some buildup/slow burn, and I've always felt that by giving a little space between chapter releases, the effect is maintained, or perhaps even enhanced (this is based on the presumptuousness that I actually have readers who follow my work closely enough to anticipate/await the next release).

I guess I liken it to the old days of pulp serial releases, though I'm quite sure even those works were longer in length than my chapters.

Since posting on Lit, I've begun to reflect a little bit. What does it say about my writing if reading the whole story in one go robs it of its intended impact? Is it just a cheap gimmick? After all, once the story's been completed, it's out there for anyone to read all in one sitting if they so choose or half at a time, or three chapters at a time. Who am I to attempt to control the pace of actual readership consumption?

Maybe I should just write the whole story and put it out there and save Laurel and myself the extra work of a dozen mini-chapters.

What do others do? What does it mean about me as a writer that my chapters are consistently so short? Are there other mini-chapter makers out there?

Thanks for reading!

-riki

What does it say to who? There isn't one universal reader on Literotica, nor ten, nor 100, nor 1,000, nor . . .

I write multichaptered works without having a check in my mind how long each chapter is for posting value. Then, when I post, I sometimes post standalone short chapters and sometimes combine short chapters into a longer Literotica entry--depending mostly, as you note, on the context of the material. Anything over 750 words will post here. If I get a comment of "this was too short," which I sometimes do, my reaction is "you're not a reader I need because you are anal retentive and focus on the wrong elements of a story." No sweat. There's no one Literotica reader you're trying to please.

I guess I have come to wonder if consistently writing short chapters is a indicator of some.. deficiency as a writer.

My prose is well enough (so I think/hope ) but I suppose I have some self-doubt that there is something lacking in the structural crafting of my stories.

KeithD said:

If I get a comment of "this was too short," which I sometimes do, my reaction is "you're not a reader I need because you are anal retentive and focus on the wrong elements of a story."

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I think this is a little hard; I interpret a comment like that not as a nit, but rather they are interested in the story and wanted there to be more. Maybe that's wishful thinking on my part

rikimaru4 said:

I think this is a little hard; I interpret a comment like that not as a nit, but rather they are interested in the story and wanted there to be more. Maybe that's wishful thinking on my part

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That's lame too (and I've seen that too). Unless it's posted as the last chapter--and I tell the readers up front how many chapters there are, there's going to be more. It's not a very bright comment. I don't see it as an intelligent response to the effort I put into creating the story.

rikimaru4 said:

. . . the chief complaint I get (perhaps really the only one, lucky me) is that my chapters are too short.

Most of my chapters tend to be a single scene, word count in the range of 1200-2500 words. Sometimes, multiple scenes have a certain amount of logical relation, in which case they get lumped together into a ~4K chapter.

Of course the solution is very simple... release multiple chapters at once.

Thanks for reading!

-riki

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Given that a Lit page is reckoned to be about 3700 words, your 'chapters' ARE too short.
(Unless you plan on joining the 750 word short-story Club)
I commend to your consideration running several together as one story (or part thereof).
It might make a more satisfying read.

Good Luck

My advice:

No. 1: What do you want? What do you want to achieve? What is your motive for posting? There's no right answer. You are free to seek whatever you want to from publishing on this site. But I take it from your comment that you care about reader feedback and you want to get the best response to your story that you can. It all depends on what you want. There's no right way to do things. My philosophy of publishing here is to write the story the way I want it to be, according to my standards, but then to take advantage of the tools this site offers and the data available through its various feedback mechanisms to connect my story with as many readers as possible who I think will like it.

No. 2: Forget your preconceptions and look at the data that this site is giving you. You have published two series. The first was a 13 chapter series with chapters averaging well under 1 Lit page from Oct. 2018 through Jan. 19. I didn't read it but it looks like it's done pretty well, with the later chapters in particular getting good scores, so you should be happy about that. But the first chapter had 31,800 views and the last chapter had 9,200 views, so you had a very high attrition rate by publishing it in 13 chapters. Your second series, which is on its 5th chapter, has experienced something similar. Chapter 1, published in May, had 14,000 views, while chapter 4 (I'll ignore the chapter published today) published in June, had 4,300 views. You are getting a very high attrition rate by publishing your stories in many short chapters. You are losing readers. In your latest series there was significant attrition between chapter 3 and chapter 4. What to make of this?

First, if I were you I would scrap your assumption that readers like to be kept waiting because it heightens the excitement. There's no reason to believe that. With every delay, you are losing readers. That's what the data is telling you.

Second, I haven't read your stories, but ask yourself this: do each of the chapters provide the kind of erotic payoff that a reader of a story in that category is going to want from that story? If the answer is no, then there's no good reason to publish the story in separate chapters. Publish it as a single story, or in fewer and longer chapters, each of which provides what readers of that category will be looking for. This way you will better ensure that you have happy readers.

To repeat: there is no right answer. No one can tell you what you want to get out of this site. But if you are interested in maximizing the number of appreciative readers of your stories I would recommend that you reconsider publishing your stories in many very short chapters.

rikimaru4 said:

I guess I have come to wonder if consistently writing short chapters is a indicator of some.. deficiency as a writer.

My prose is well enough (so I think/hope ) but I suppose I have some self-doubt that there is something lacking in the structural crafting of my stories.

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Seriously, don't spend too much time navel-gazing.

Hemingway wrote with long, rambling sentences guaranteed to bring a C- from any college creative writing prof these days. He also won the Nobel Prize for Literature, which says something both for the quality of his work and the lack of judgement in current creative writing professors. His style suited his purpose. Presumably, so does yours.

I would say that those are very short chapters, but that's just me and my style differs from yours - and Hemingway's. If you are accomplishing your aim, then your style is a good one.

rikimaru4 said:

What do others do? What does it mean about me as a writer that my chapters are consistently so short? Are there other mini-chapter makers out there?

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Maybe what it means about you is that you call tell a story in less than one Lit page. Writing complete, short stories was one of my goals when I came to Lit. Turns out that the Lit readers don't reward that.

The first story I published on Lit (since removed) consisted of very short chapters through about the first twelve chapters (which I wrote before coming to Lit), and last nine were more in line with the Lit readers' expectations, but they could have been broken down.

I grouped some of the short chapters together and published them as "parts" but the first five were still very short. If I were to republish the story I'd group more of the short chapters together -- not into one chapter, but into a single "part" containing more than one chapter.

All of my longer stories consist of multiple chapters all in the same document. I see no reason to break them apart because they contain more than one chapter.

rikimaru4 said:

What do others do? What does it mean about me as a writer that my chapters are consistently so short? Are there other mini-chapter makers out there?

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Keep in mind that you're writing erotica, and if you are writing well, your readers will get aroused. If they're aroused, surely they won't want it to all be over in five minutes?

Arousal (if that is one of your writing goals, to turn your readers on) requires a different pace, a different structure to the story telling - more peaks and slow waits.

You mention slow burn - give your readers more time with your writing, I'd say. A multitude of short one scene chapters sounds to me like a quick wank in the toilets at work during a tea-break; whereas what you really want is a fine meal with candlelight and seduction, and a slow walk up long stairs to a comfortable bed.

Maybe that's just me .

I don't read short-chaptered stories, so I don't write them either. I feel a writer who does a bunch of setup and then leaves a cliffhanger is being rude to the reader, who GENERALLY (I'm trying not to paint with an overly broad brush) comes here to cum here. I do appreciate a well-written story, even if it doesn't get me off, but a chapter is not a story. A chapter is a portion of a story. Quit depriving the readers of a proper story.

I never click on the subsequent chapters of writers who do that. I have no way of knowing how many readers are like me. I've written just a couple of multi-part pieces, and every one of them features "chapters" that stand on their own as stories in and of themselves.

There are chapters, and there are submitted pieces. Some of my submitted pieces contain multiple short chapters internally. One episode in another series occupied three submitted pieces.

One-pagers usually don't score well. A string of separate half-page chapters will likely NOT be received well. My free advice: Bundle chapters into submissions 2-4 LIT pages (7.5k-15k words) long. Or twice as long. Or twice again. Longer submissions usually retain faithful readers.

But write what you want. Whatever you submit, you won't get paid, so go hog-wild.

I write lots of chapters but package them together. I break the stories into parts for logical reasons, such as a change in POV. So my first story has 5 parts but dozens of chapters of varying length. Plus until a part is complete, I don't lock-down a chapter.

As a reader, I prefer going that way too, allowing me to get the story in one sitting. Why lose the momentum?

When I read the OP, I immediately thought of the "Daddy Needs His Blowjob" series. Those were all around a single Lit page, but scored well. I thought the series was well-written. https://www.literotica.com/stories/memberpage.php?uid=1537978&page=submissions

My first two submissions to the site were very short, but at that point I did not realize just how many words went into a Literotica page. Those felt "too short" even to me, but they scored well anyway. Bottom line, if your stories are well-written and appeal to the target audience, you'll have receptive readers who appreciate your work.

To me, the length of the chapter goes hand in hand with the style and tone of the story. In a fast paced, action packed narrative, short chapters can work very well.

When I wrote my first series, I had no feel at all for length. I wrote what I thought fit the aims of a particular chapter, then moved on to the next part of the story. In my current one, none of the chapters are as short as the longest one in it's predecessor. What works in conveying your story as you intend to convey it is all that matters.

Hypoxia makes a very important point. There is a difference between a chapter and a submission. You could have a story with 9 chapters and submit it in three parts of three chapters each. Doing something like this might be the way to hit the sweet spot of preserving the artistic integrity of your story while also minimizing the loss of viewers over time, as well as maximizing your score.

Viewer attrition and the downgrading of very short submissions are two observable phenomena here. If you really want to release your story in serial form rather than all at once, but you want to be mindful of your story's views and score, consider grouping short chapters in bunches when submitting parts of the story.

SimonDoom said:

My advice:

No. 1: What do you want? What do you want to achieve? What is your motive for posting?

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OF course posting anything in public means I want people to read my work and to like it. I suppose I've achieved that for whatever it's worth (though could always get mroe views, higher ratings, more comments..!). I am just looking to progress in my writing.

SimonDoom said:

No. 2: Forget your preconceptions and look at the data that this site is giving you. ...You are getting a very high attrition rate by publishing your stories in many short chapters. You are losing readers. In your latest series there was significant attrition between chapter 3 and chapter 4. What to make of this?

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So I don't know what to make of this. I'm not sure that I agree with overall usefulness of the data. Chapter 1 will have the highest views and probably lower/lowest score overall, as readers of all stripes will give it an initial look, love/like/hate it, rate accordingly and move on. If someone publishes a story in one go, there is this amalgamated aspect of the views/ratings.

On the other hand, by the end of my releases, I would think views would skew lower, ratings higher, since the readership has become something of a distilled curated list of interested, committed readers (kind of a cheating a bit perhaps).

What to make of chapters in the middle that have several thousand more views than chapters preceding it? Readers skipping ahead? Re-readbility/wankability?

SimonDoom said:

First, if I were you I would scrap your assumption that readers like to be kept waiting because it heightens the excitement. There's no reason to believe that.

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I wouldn't say that I believe this is what readers want, but more that I feel that a pause between chapters reads better for my stories. An imposed paragraph break, so to speak.

SimonDoom said:

With every delay, you are losing readers. That's what the data is telling you.

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So this is also something I question. What about the average Lit reader who's on here once every few weeks, once a month? How far back through the archives of recent releases will they go back? Don't the majority of readers click on the first few stories at the top and go no further? In which case, releasing a story in entirety risks missing a lot of potential viewership.

NotWise said:

Maybe what it means about you is that you call tell a story in less than one Lit page. Writing complete, short stories was one of my goals when I came to Lit.

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It's very kind to suggest that, but no. Like you, I'd love to be able to craft a well-written complete story in 1K - 2K words, and it remains a goal of mine (to hell with readers not rewarding that ability). I've seen others do it prolifically and I really have no clue how to do it.

electricblue66 said:

Keep in mind that you're writing erotica, and if you are writing well, your readers will get aroused. If they're aroused, surely they won't want it to all be over in five minutes?

Arousal (if that is one of your writing goals, to turn your readers on) requires a different pace, a different structure to the story telling - more peaks and slow waits.

You mention slow burn - give your readers more time with your writing, I'd say. A multitude of short one scene chapters sounds to me like a quick wank in the toilets at work during a tea-break; whereas what you really want is a fine meal with candlelight and seduction, and a slow walk up long stairs to a comfortable bed.

Maybe that's just me .

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I should walk this back a bit. When I refer to slow burn, it's really in reference to the beginning chapters. If you see my first story, the beginning chapters are rated thusly lower. But as the story builds, it's pretty much fire (read: smut) the rest of the way through. But I think that's ok; I look at chapters as something akin to movie sequels -- you don't need the 30 minutes of obligatory intro and exposition because you already know who the players are and you can get right down to it.

I'd say a typical chapter of my story is something like 85% smut, 15% plot progression. A fine candlelit dinner... well I'm working on getting there. Some day

TarnishedPenny said:

Seriously, don't spend too much time navel-gazing.

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I really, really love this comment. Such an apt phrase, and it's totally what I'm doing. But I can't help it -- it's so engrossing!!

SimonDoom said:

Hypoxia makes a very important point. There is a difference between a chapter and a submission. You could have a story with 9 chapters and submit it in three parts of three chapters each. Doing something like this might be the way to hit the sweet spot of preserving the artistic integrity of your story while also minimizing the loss of viewers over time, as well as maximizing your score.

Viewer attrition and the downgrading of very short submissions are two observable phenomena here. If you really want to release your story in serial form rather than all at once, but you want to be mindful of your story's views and score, consider grouping short chapters in bunches when submitting parts of the story.

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'Artistic integrity'... everyone on here is so kind!!!

I'm not sure how much views/score matter to me.

It's been an interesting discussion, thank you to all for taking the time to input! I'll likely finish this story on a per chapter basis so as to not change up the flow abruptly, but I am certainly going to play around with the format in the future. Rather intrigued to see the resulting feedback.

rikimaru4 said:

So this is also something I question. What about the average Lit reader who's on here once every few weeks, once a month? How far back through the archives of recent releases will they go back? Don't the majority of readers click on the first few stories at the top and go no further? In which case, releasing a story in entirety risks missing a lot of potential viewership.

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Question it all you wish. The data are clear. You're quite wrong about this assumption here. Your readers will seek out your work if they like it and want to read it. And, “go no further?” Why would you assume that? Readers aren’t choosing the top three stories, willy-nilly, and getting off to them; readers are looking for something that specifically tickles their interests. If you fill that need for them, they’ll find your work.

If I dislike BDSM, GM, and Text With Audio, but find nothing except those things on the New Stories page, I’m not just going to give up and opt for Jane Austen instead. I’ll keep looking for something I’ll like.

You’re getting A-1 responses here and then you’re resolving to “likely” just continue on as before. That is senseless.

rikimaru4 said:

What to make of chapters in the middle that have several thousand more views than chapters preceding it? Readers skipping ahead? Re-readbility/wankability?




So this is also something I question. What about the average Lit reader who's on here once every few weeks, once a month? How far back through the archives of recent releases will they go back? Don't the majority of readers click on the first few stories at the top and go no further? In which case, releasing a story in entirety risks missing a lot of potential viewership.

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1. When you publish a story in many chapters, there often is not a consistent dropoff in views from one chapter to the next. I assume that's because (a) for whatever reason there are more potential viewers some days than others, and (b) a chapter will get more views if it's particularly popular and gets a high rating.

2. Re your second point: I've thought of this too. It's possible that by publishing a story in multiple chapters you spark interest in the story with each new chapter among readers who might not have seen the earlier chapters. It's possible that this offsets the attrition from chapter to chapter. I do know that when I have published stories in chapters the publication of a late chapter creates a spike in views for the first chapter. That's something that would not have happened had I published the story as a single standalone story one time. So this is something to consider.


There's no right answer. Your story is doing fine both in terms of views and scores, so there's no compelling need to change anything. I tend to think your story would do somewhat better if you published longer chapters, but that's just my guess.

Voboy said:

Question it all you wish. The data are clear. You're quite wrong about this assumption here. Your readers will seek out your work if they like it and want to read it. And, “go no further?” Why would you assume that? Readers aren’t choosing the top three stories, willy-nilly, and getting off to them; readers are looking for something that specifically tickles their interests. If you fill that need for them, they’ll find your work.

If I dislike BDSM, GM, and Text With Audio, but find nothing except those things on the New Stories page, I’m not just going to give up and opt for Jane Austen instead. I’ll keep looking for something I’ll like.

You’re getting A-1 responses here and then you’re resolving to “likely” just continue on as before. That is senseless.

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Which ones are the A-1 responses? Let me guess... the ones that agree with you?

rikimaru4 said:

Which ones are the A-1 responses? Let me guess... the ones that agree with you?

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Why be snide? Everyone here is trying to be honest and helpful.

Good luck in your efforts.

Voboy said:

Why be snide? Everyone here is trying to be honest and helpful.

Good luck in your efforts.

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Perhaps you didn't intend for your tone to read the way that it did (to me). Or perhaps you did but you're some sociopath and therefore don't understand why you'd receive a reciprocal response.

Who could say?? I don't know you, so certainly not me. Thanks for the well wishes!

rikimaru4 said:

Perhaps you didn't intend for your tone to read the way that it did (to me). Or perhaps you did but you're some sociopath and therefore don't understand why you'd receive a reciprocal response.

Who could say?? I don't know you, so certainly not me. Thanks for the well wishes!

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There are many things I’ll never understand. Those who ask internet strangers for advice and then become combative about the advice they receive? That’s just one of them. I don’t get it.

Many are telling you that short, choppy chapters don’t work in the way that you think they do. At best, Melissa is wisely telling you it’s a tool. One of many. I tend to be blunt because that’s what I respond to. If you want a false saccharine response, or if you want me to blow sunshine up your ass, please just say so at the outset so I won’t waste my time.

Otherwise, I’d advise that you focus on my response rather than on your perception of its “tone.” As a reader, I’ve got no patience for writers who (as you put it) “impose” paragraph breaks on me. I’m pleased you stated it that way in your post this morning; it confirmed what I thought you were trying to do all along.

“Impose?” Never. I’d never do that to my readers, nor would I view my relationship with them as something I’d want to control or dominate to that extent. I’m happy to give them what I produce. I’m gratified they like my work. I don’t need to preach to them.

Voboy said:

There are many things I’ll never understand. Those who ask internet strangers for advice and then become combative about the advice they receive? That’s just one of them. I don’t get it.

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You are confused because that's not what's at issue here. But if confusion rather than self reflection suits you better, by all means.

Since you're too "blunt" to have manners, I'd advise you grow thicker skin to the subsequent "snide" responses you receive.