Yet Another Boy Scouts Thread
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Problem Child
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This is a tough one for me. I was a Boy Scout and thoroughly enjoyed my time in the organization.
I believe that a private organization should have the right to set it's own membership standards. It's called freedom of association. I don't remember any cases where girls have tried to sue the Boy Scouts to gain entrance, but I'm sure it's happened. Wouldn't depriving girls of entrance to the organization be just as discriminatory as disallowing gays?
I think the difference is that girls have their own organization in the Girl Scouts. Still, if they are interested in equality and freedom from discrimination, why haven't they pushed harder to get into the Boy Scouts?
Could it be that gays are using the Boy Scouts as a very visible platform to publicize their fight for equality? I think that is probably the case. It's an easier fight than trying to gain full acceptance into the military, and for the most part they are winning the battle in the employment arena. The last obstacle is private organizations like the Scouts. If gaining admittance into Boy Scouting isn't a political goal, why don't they just form a Gay Scouting organization? I think the answer is obvious- they gain nothing politically by that. If they wear down the Boy Scouts, then they gain a huge precedent for entrance into other private organizations.
I don't begrudge gays their opportunity to gain equality in any walk of life. I don't like to see any group discriminated against. I'm just sorry to see the fight happen to an organization that does a lot of good for kids. They need to be having fun camping and learning skills that will help them in their lives, and not caught up in what is basically an adult argument.
I believe that a private organization should have the right to set it's own membership standards. It's called freedom of association. I don't remember any cases where girls have tried to sue the Boy Scouts to gain entrance, but I'm sure it's happened. Wouldn't depriving girls of entrance to the organization be just as discriminatory as disallowing gays?
I think the difference is that girls have their own organization in the Girl Scouts. Still, if they are interested in equality and freedom from discrimination, why haven't they pushed harder to get into the Boy Scouts?
Could it be that gays are using the Boy Scouts as a very visible platform to publicize their fight for equality? I think that is probably the case. It's an easier fight than trying to gain full acceptance into the military, and for the most part they are winning the battle in the employment arena. The last obstacle is private organizations like the Scouts. If gaining admittance into Boy Scouting isn't a political goal, why don't they just form a Gay Scouting organization? I think the answer is obvious- they gain nothing politically by that. If they wear down the Boy Scouts, then they gain a huge precedent for entrance into other private organizations.
I don't begrudge gays their opportunity to gain equality in any walk of life. I don't like to see any group discriminated against. I'm just sorry to see the fight happen to an organization that does a lot of good for kids. They need to be having fun camping and learning skills that will help them in their lives, and not caught up in what is basically an adult argument.
Purple Haze
Literally Stimulated
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I really have a tough time taking a side in this issue, and others just like it.
Why do people need to be so concerned where somebody puts their penis in the privacy of their own bedroom?
Why do people on the other side need to advertise where they put their penises?
Will people ever mind their own fucking business?
Why do people need to be so concerned where somebody puts their penis in the privacy of their own bedroom?
Why do people on the other side need to advertise where they put their penises?
Will people ever mind their own fucking business?
WriterDom
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Start up the gay scouts. I'm sure they'd have snappier uniforms than the paramilitary boy scouts. But then you'd have to have the atheist scouts. As long as they are private organization then why force the issue? Why belong to a group if you disagree with their value system?
Texan
'nuf said
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PC... I agree completely
PH... good, plain and simple logic..... not too common these days
If the gay community admires the Boy Scouts so much, as to be so terribly distressed that gays are not allowed in, then why are they trying so hard to destroy the organization?
PH... good, plain and simple logic..... not too common these days
If the gay community admires the Boy Scouts so much, as to be so terribly distressed that gays are not allowed in, then why are they trying so hard to destroy the organization?
Problem Child
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Why should sexual orientation be an issue at all?
Why should 8-18 yr. old boys have to deal with whether someone is gay or not? That issue has no place in Scouting.
I think the Boy Scouts are wrong for setting an anti-gay policy, but legally they are within their rights. They are a very traditional organization, and they are simply trying to protect that tradition.
I have no problem with gays fighting discrimination where they find it. I just think a youth organization is a crappy place to have a battle over the acceptance of a sexual lifestyle.
Scout Troops are being shut out of buildings they have used for decades, and charities are cutting off their funding.
The big losers are the kids.
Why should 8-18 yr. old boys have to deal with whether someone is gay or not? That issue has no place in Scouting.
I think the Boy Scouts are wrong for setting an anti-gay policy, but legally they are within their rights. They are a very traditional organization, and they are simply trying to protect that tradition.
I have no problem with gays fighting discrimination where they find it. I just think a youth organization is a crappy place to have a battle over the acceptance of a sexual lifestyle.
Scout Troops are being shut out of buildings they have used for decades, and charities are cutting off their funding.
The big losers are the kids.
Pyper
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Despite my differences with the Boy Scouts, I worked for them for two years. I worked at a camp in the San Gabriel council, and they had a sort of "don't ask don't tell" policy about homosexuality and atheism.
I don't understand what the big freakin deal is about letting gays and atheists into the organization. Girl Scouts are open to lesbians (hell, if Girl Scouts banned lesbians, there wouldn't be a Girl Scout council) and are open to atheists as well, who can change the scout oath from "God" to whatever principle they choose.
All I see in the Boy Scouts is outright discrimination with no basis. Nobody here has provided a valid reason for gays to be excluded other than the same old "it's a private organization" litany. If the Boy Scouts decided to ban African Americans, would you all feel the same?
I don't understand what the big freakin deal is about letting gays and atheists into the organization. Girl Scouts are open to lesbians (hell, if Girl Scouts banned lesbians, there wouldn't be a Girl Scout council) and are open to atheists as well, who can change the scout oath from "God" to whatever principle they choose.
All I see in the Boy Scouts is outright discrimination with no basis. Nobody here has provided a valid reason for gays to be excluded other than the same old "it's a private organization" litany. If the Boy Scouts decided to ban African Americans, would you all feel the same?
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Mustang Sally
Wanna go for a ride?
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800,000 people turned out for the gay pride parade in Toronto yesterday, and I didn't hear any reports of protesters. It was a peaceful celebration. Very slowly society is becoming more accepting of homosexuality.
This BSA discrimination is obviously not helping the process. Winning this battle would be a very big deal -- a message to everyone, most especially the children of boy scouts, that people are people.
If we're going to get anywhere on this, we have to teach our children acceptance and tolerance, etc. Not "Stay away from Joey, son. He's different. I don't want you hanging out with him."
This BSA discrimination is obviously not helping the process. Winning this battle would be a very big deal -- a message to everyone, most especially the children of boy scouts, that people are people.
If we're going to get anywhere on this, we have to teach our children acceptance and tolerance, etc. Not "Stay away from Joey, son. He's different. I don't want you hanging out with him."
Since discrimination is merely the exercise of one's right to choose, what you are supporting is one person's inclination to force upon another an undesired association. Don't you find that just a tad at odds with your declaration that the Scouts are within their legal rights to freely choose their associations?
As citizens of a free society, do they not have the right to choose their associations? They have an established set of values they have held for a long period of their history. Their values do not espouse harming others or forcing their views upon others. Can you say the same for their adversaries in the present debacle? The Boy Scouts are under assault by a political activist group intent on forcing their values upon the Boy Scouts.
I marvel that in a free society, there are so many people supporting the use of force against a group that merely chooses to exercise their freedom of choice while not violating the rights of anyone.
Where is the tolerance for the views of others that the Left is always claiming to advocate and support? Or does that tolerance only apply to their political supporters? And their persecution is reserved for those who don't share their politically correct views.
And I must agree with you, PC, it's the kids who lose and their loss is at the hands of political activists who REQUIRE acceptance of and compliance with their values while preaching tolerance for disparate views.
