Writing for a category you can't relate to

[Lovepotion69]

I've just started writing two stories, one gay and one lesbian. As I hadn't checked out the gay stories on Lit I went there the other day. Kinda to get some ideas what makes the audience within that category tick.

When you write for another category that you can not relate to, or that doesn't turn you on, or even from the opposite sex's pov, how do you go about doing it?

How do you give the reader what she/he wants?
If you have no clue whatsoever about the subject (e.g. BDSM), do you read a few stories within that category and just try to mimic them, hoping to get it right?

I'm personally worried I might end up giving in to cliches when writing within certain categories.

/LP

 

[Svenskaflicka]

I'm gonna try to overcome part of my homophobia by writing a lesbian story for the Survivor Contest - I have to, since I don't get any immunity points! - and I have a plan how to do it. I'm gonna write a common het story, and then I'm gonna re-write it, change the male name for a female name, and change the cock-sucking for clit-licking, and the penetration for finger-penetration.

*sigh*

I want an immunity point!

 

[gauchecritic]

Why are you writing for categories you can't relate to in the first place? Is it a competition? A dare? I always thought the first rule of writing was; write what you know.

If you don't know then you must research. Write it and ask someone of that bent (no pun) to read it for you. Or ask them before you write it.

There are some good guides in the 'how to' section. I recently used info from there about an anal episode. (Thanks S.S.Sarah)

Gauche

 

[Lovepotion69]

Gauche,
It's for the Survivor contest, but also for fun. I guess I can write a story for gay/lesbian categories, but I don't want to stereotype it too much. I mean, honestly, the first thing that popped into my head when thinking of a gay story is heaps of graphic sex scenes. Then I saw that Jfinn's chapters on the top list hardly had sex in them, mainly just plot and they got good ratings. I just keep thinking that knowing hetero males they want the graphic stuff, so theoretically the gay men should too, or?

I just don't like the idea of ending up with a bunch of cliches and stereotypes. If I judged all categories by the top list or majority of stories, I'd end probably writing flat predictable stuff. On the other hand I'd be giving the majority of readers what they want I guess...hmmm...

Svenska, seriously it's not that hard to write lesbian sex scenes. I keep thinking that they do everything a hetero couple do, apart from the whole penetration thingy. Same with gay men really, but since I'm not very familiar with anal, that's probably where I'm going to get stuck.

 

[Svenskaflicka]

The whole point of the Survivor contest, is to write in EACH of the categories - IF you're not lucky enough to win an immunity in the weekly lottery.

Besides, I'm hoping it will make me develop as a writer.

 

[Guest]

Lovepotion,

I call my Lit. stories 'BDSM Light so people who want hardcore won't be disappointed. I have NO experience in the sexual activities narrated in my stories and have never been to Japan, but they leant themselves to the place and culture I wanted to depict (Japanese kink) and the odd characters I wanted to create.

A few years ago I researched BDSM over a period of time due to interests in role-play and gender identification, all rather academically. I know Japanese culture, history and literature through personal study, lots of Japanese films, and from a brother who lived there 18 years. I could easily have developed my plots in imperial Russia, another 'era' I know well.

It was only when I began thinking of writing erotica that I put the two above subjects together and thought I could be imaginative, erotic, and evocative using them; but my main interest is in the writing, the actual doing of it. Still, it is satisfying hearing from people who say I 'got Tokyo right', or feel empathy for my main character.

There are many categories for which I can't write merely because they hold no interest, nor do I know enough to fill out a plot.

Best to you, Perdita

Edit: sorry, I guess the other posts came in while I was writing this. Good luck.

 

[oggbashan]

Research

Start with the top rated stories in that category and analyse what they say about the particular pov, then write your own story from that pov.

Review what you have written against what you discovered from the first exercise, post the story and find out from the votes and feedback just how wrong you were.

Repeat the process ad infinitum.

Og

 

[Svenskaflicka]

Svenska, seriously it's not that hard to write lesbian sex scenes. I keep thinking that they do everything a hetero couple do, apart from the whole penetration thingy. Same with gay men really, but since I'm not very familiar with anal, that's probably where I'm going to get stuck.

But see, that's the problem! I don't want to think up a story of two women cuddling and touching, it makes me shudder! It's a whole different thing with gay male, I've read quite a few such stories, and the only difference between gay male stories and het stories, are that there's no boobs and no pussy, so all penetration is oral or anal. Piece of cake!

I have a problem with the sexual organ of my own gender. I think pussies are gross. My own one is acceptable, because it gives me lots of joy, but other than that, I prefer to think of the world as full of dicks and Barbie dolls - flat plastic pussies with no dripping holes!

Oi, I'm gonna have problem writing for this category...

 

[MathGirl]

Originally posted by Svenskaflicka I want an immunity point!

Dear Svenska,
Okay, you Swedish cutie, you got it. Just tell 'em that MG said it was okay.
MG
Ps. I don't think I could write about something I hadn't experienced myself, but I admire those who can. I couldn't even begin to know where to start a story about gay men or BDSM. I just don't "get" either of those, and I guess I don't have enough imagination to put myself there.

 

[jfinn]

Gauche,
It's for the Survivor contest, but also for fun. I guess I can write a story for gay/lesbian categories, but I don't want to stereotype it too much. I mean, honestly, the first thing that popped into my head when thinking of a gay story is heaps of graphic sex scenes. Then I saw that Jfinn's chapters on the top list hardly had sex in them, mainly just plot and they got good ratings. I just keep thinking that knowing hetero males they want the graphic stuff, so theoretically the gay men should too, or?

I just don't like the idea of ending up with a bunch of cliches and stereotypes. If I judged all categories by the top list or majority of stories, I'd end probably writing flat predictable stuff. On the other hand I'd be giving the majority of readers what they want I guess...hmmm...

You're right to be confused. There is choice when you're writing a gay story for Lit because most of them aren't really geared for a gay audience.

My experience is traditional gay erotica is generally a story with some sex, not sex with some story. Since I primarily post on gay sites, that's what I write. I only post them here because I post everything here. In fact I was amazed that people even read them because they're quite a bit different than what you see normally at Lit though they're pretty run of the mill at other sites.

If you look at the lists, you'll see the majority of stories here (though this seems to be changing) are about two straight guys who suddenly have this irresistable urge to suck each other. Then there are the ones where a straight guy is humiliated, but secretly turned on by being made to have sex with another guy(s). Don't get me wrong, a lot of those stories are good and quite hot, but you almost never find their counterpart on the gay sites. That fantasy seems to be more for straight and bi-curious folk. I've also noticed that while my mail from a gay site is usually from guys, most of it from Lit is from women who like the romantic storyline.

What you do see in stories directed specifically at gay men are a lot of coming out stories and a lot of relationship stories. Some of those are posted to Lit too. Wavyscribe (The Magic In Your Touch)has her work here, so does Griffendor (City of Dreams), and Keith Mystery and I wrote one together that's here under his name(Samhain Chanted Evening). All of them are big time writers on the major gay sites and they've done well here too. There are some other writers here that write the more traditional story too, like MlledeLaPlumeBleu (1762, or "A Monk's Progress), Casey D (Scott's Little Brother)and Collier (We're Not Gay) which are all excellent, but not on any other sites from what I can tell.

As for cliches and stereotypes there are lots. Some are the same as straight stories, 13 inches etc, but there are some that are seen more or only in gay erotica. Unlimited wealth, every guy in town is gay, your best friend who you've been secretly in love with for years admits he's also gay and secretly in love with you and all pizza boys are hot for your body, are a few that spring to mind. Also, contrary to what a lot of the stories would have you believe at Lit, adult men don't suddenly realize they're gay very often. They may hide it, but usually the age of knowing is like 13 or about the onset of puberty though some say it was much earlier for them.

As far as the mechanics of gay sex. That's really not that difficult to fake. If you don't care to actually read a zillion stories with mm sex then there are tutorials on the net. That's where I got my info and I've been told by a lot of my gay readers that I have an uncomfortably accurate understanding of the male sex act.

I don't know if I've helped at all, probably confused you more, but that's one of my gifts. LOL Good luck however you decide to handle it.

Jayne

 

[MlledeLaPlumeBleu]

an uncomfortably accurate understanding of the male sex act.

*lauGH*

"...and that's why Auntie Jayne writes such lovely stories, children. Now who wants some tapioca pudding?"

Seriously, I agree with you- J. Additionally, I've always felt the best thing about "real" gay erotica was that it's the perfect synergy of "male" and "female" erotica, straddling the line between porn and romance. I always found prototypical romance wasn't anywhere near graphic enough for my taste, and while porn was graphic, I missed exposition. Traditional gay stories generally encompass both, in an ideal fusion.

Miss Blue Pen

 

[MlledeLaPlumeBleu]

Oh, Svenska!


You like oral sex from a guy, right? [if you say "no" I'm so going to go all "Draco Malfoy" on your ass..]

Well, voila. Now it's a woman. No one says your character has to touch the scary pussy- she can recieve the whole time!

mlle

P.(u)S.(s): it's not that bad!

 

[Svenskaflicka]

Oh, Svenska!


You like oral sex from a guy, right? [if you say "no" I'm so going to go all "Draco Malfoy" on your ass..]

Well, voila. Now it's a woman. No one says your character has to touch the scary pussy- she can recieve the whole time!

mlle

P.(u)S.(s): it's not that bad!

Oh, thanks a lot! Now I can never enjoy oral sex again! And Hubby's so good at it...

 

[MlledeLaPlumeBleu]

Well, I've figured out Svenska's kryptonite.

Run at her with a joint and a vagina and she'll be out for the count.


*laugh*

 

[LustiRusti]

Why are you writing for categories you can't relate to in the first place?

I have to agree with this question here. Sure, it can be fun to challange yourself in a new area but you should still at least write about things you enjoy instead of forcing the tale out.

You've already had some great advice here. (Such as "write what you know" or "research your topic"... Also, I think it's a good idea to read a few of the top rated stories in a cxategory to see what the audience likes.) Looks like I don't really have anything new to say. All of the good stuff is taken! lol


~Kenzie

 

[Dirty Slut]

Finding that nugget....

When I'm forced to write about something that I have no experiance with, or a personal distaste for, I do a great deal of research. But what I look for is that little hook in there that would interest me somehow. It may take weeks of reading what I consider boring platitudes, and inuendoes to find that nugget, but it eventually pops out at me. And when I do find that nugget, I use that as my basis of empathy to write from about that subject, and pretty much steer clear of what would make me gag otherwise.

For instance in Flicka's case, it might be how much the woman's clit resembles a very small penis with an over abundance of foreskin instead of delving into what surrounds that clit. Or how the woman's breast resembled a scoop of her favorite ice cream topped with a Valintine pink wrapped Hershey's Chocolate Kiss. Presuming of coarse that she's into chocolate. <giggle>

As for the relationships between samesex individuals, one just needs to think about what they themselves think, and do in any given situation. Both their good, or light side, and their bad, or dark side, and intermingle them. After all, the story is coming from you.

In all, you will still be writing about what you know best, and that's the secret of writing good stories in any category.

DS

 

[Guest]

Hooray!

The real Svenskayushka is back in AV form. Love that attitude, I practice it every morning before stepping out into the world.

Perdita

 

[Lovepotion69]

I've written about six ages so far on my gay male story. Actually, I can't believe how much easier it's been to write this one compared to my straight stuff. Perhaps I'm getting comfortable writing fiction by now. Or it could be that I'm writing in first person perspective.

Jayne, thanks for all the input. Your post was very helpful. I think I've already ended up with a story cliche; two straight guys in a shower.

I guess my gay/les stories would be directed towards bi-curious people. Easier for me to identify with.

Svenska, I agree with MlledeLaPlumeBleu. Oral is just a mouth/tongue on genitals. If you close your eyes, you probably wouldn't tell that much difference if it was a woman or man. On the other hand, I know what you mean about aversion towards pussies. I had a friend who just felt sick thinking about them. She got damned turned on by watching gay sex though. Personally I've not read much gay fiction, but quite a few f/f stuff. Guess because there's more of it out there.

/LP

 

[FlyontheWall99]

Wow, I'm not sure many writers would write a story for a category that they don't personally read or like. All the more power to you though. Some writers do like a challenge though, and I guess everyone hits that point where they want to write something new and interesting.....

 

[Dirty Slut]

As an added note...

I recently wrote in a lesbian scene, and it should be posted pretty soon. You may want to take a look at it and see if that's a way for you to go Flicka.

DS

 

[SlickTony]

Why are you writing for categories you can't relate to in the first place? Is it a competition? A dare? I always thought the first rule of writing was; write what you know.

I think it's good for you to give your imagination a good stretch, and write stuff that you haven't experienced, let alone written about. Hell, I have never experienced incest and I wrote three incest stories; the riff I wrote on Lot and his daughters is still being read by folks; I got a piece of feedback on it not long ago and I wrote it way last year.

I confess to being a tad puzzled by your attitude towards pussies, Svenska. I mean, I have never eaten one myself, but like licking my juices off my man's lips after he's eaten mine, and think it's odd to expect someone to want to do something for you that you wouldn't want to do yourself. Just my opinion, though.

 

[Svenskaflicka]

Well, I've figured out Svenska's kryptonite.

Run at her with a joint and a vagina and she'll be out for the count.


*laugh*

Two words: Bill & Monica!

 

[destinie21]

I'm gonna try to overcome part of my homophobia by writing a lesbian story for the Survivor Contest - I have to, since I don't get any immunity points! - and I have a plan how to do it. I'm gonna write a common het story, and then I'm gonna re-write it, change the male name for a female name, and change the cock-sucking for clit-licking, and the penetration for finger-penetration.

*sigh*

I want an immunity point!

If you don't find lesbian sex erotic think of the things you do find erotic and build on them. like setting and all that. For instance I've never found public bathrooms or toliets to be erotic so you'll never find them as a setting in one of my stories. even when I read an erotic story or see a porno for that matter I never can really get into it if it's set in a public bathroom or involves some one sitting on a toilet.

Also you could write a story that is erotic but contains minimal amounts of sex. That's what I did in the first part of an on going series called the Bitch simply because it was my first story and I wasn't comfortable with the "language" of erotic writing. If you want to check it out use the link below.

The Bitch ch 1

As others have said you could also reasearch the topics you are uncomfortable with to see what readers are looking for. Although if th topic doesn't appeal to you , You most likely won't want to schlep through the stories.


I really enjoy the story more than the sex anyhow. That's how I judge if the writer is good (Imo).

pS. I really enjoy your stories especially those in the interracial category. room-mating and the tweleve hearts 3 (in novels and novellas) are personal fav's of mine bravo to you for shying away from the cliches that often make these stories in this theme (interracial sex) intolerable

 

[Svenskaflicka]

Svenska, I agree with MlledeLaPlumeBleu. Oral is just a mouth/tongue on genitals. If you close your eyes, you probably wouldn't tell that much difference if it was a woman or man.

This keeps getting worse... now I can never close my eyes during sex, either!

 

[Svenskaflicka]

pS. I really enjoy your stories especially those in the interracial category. room-mating and the tweleve hearts 3 (in novels and novellas) are personal fav's of mine bravo to you for shying away from the cliches that often make these stories in this theme (interracial sex) intolerable

Thank you! That's my favourite category, and I want to raise it a bit above the level of the traditional "jungle-bunny-with-11"-schlong-fucks-white-cumhungry-slut".