Writer's assumption of the intelligence level of their Readers

[Sextified]

I do have a question for Author's writing more 'complicated' stories and series.

The subject came up when I was trying to be "too clever by half" and just repeatedly hinted at an important detail. I thought that I had left enough bread crumbs, for the readers I was trying to lead into the 'dark and scary' woods, but a few of them got 'lost'.

Let me state VERY clearly - it was MY fault for being far too obscure - not theirs for failing to follow my poor lead.

Other 'more established' genres had strict 'Rules' quantified for them a very long time ago. The classic realm of 'pure detective' fiction is one such place. Here is an excerpt of one such rule. I'll paste in the link to the full article at the bottom of this post.



[[[ The "sidekick" of the detective, the Watson, must not conceal from the reader any thoughts which pass through his mind: his intelligence must be slightly, but very slightly, below that of the average reader. ]]]



Some erotica writers are VERY literal, and lead their charges firmly by the hand. They leave absolutely nothing for the reader to imagine on their own. Others deliberately leave some 'breathing room' and let their audience fill in some of the blanks from their own desires and experiences. A few just write with a full air of mystery, like a ghost story, letting their followers make of the clues what they will.


- - - Is there some MINIMUM amount of hand holding that you adhere to when writing a story? - - -


What self-imposed Rules do you make for YOURSELF, and do you often break them?

Have you ever bewildered a particular reader so much that their so-called 'wrong assumption' shocked you? Going back, and reviewing your own written words, did you agree that you had been in error? How do you make sure that those things don't keep happening?

What level of responsibility do you feel or take to keep people on 'the same page' as you? Where do you draw the line, if you even do, about being perhaps too blunt with your descriptions of action and clues? Does such 'over controlling' detail stifle your creativity sometimes?

Are there standard rules somewhere for Erotica, like below, or is it still the Wild West out there as it was ten and twenty years ago. Are we finally 'Mainstream" enough that we have to follow at least 'some' literary conventions?

https://agathachristie.fandom.com/wiki/The_“Rules”_of_Detective_Fiction

 

[YDB95]

I make a point of not talking down to my readers. Every now and then I do get a comment that shows the reader missed the point completely (or didn't even read beyond the first few paragraphs), but so be it.

 

[jaF0]

I tried something that I thought would be unique and self-explanatory if only people would READ.

Somebody here told me it wouldn't work.


It didn't.



Readers are idiots.

 

[TxRad]

A lot of readers have something far from related to plots and clues in mind as they read here. It does not make them stupid or idiots, just distracted.

 

[HeyAll]

My main philosophy is this: If someone read my story at a casual pace, would they understand it?

I try to write and revise my writing so that it's easy to understand. It's erotica, after all, and my stories are mostly 2 Lit pages, designed for brisk reading.

I enjoy using interesting plots for erotica, such as criminal investigations, big buisness, etc... But I try to simplify the writing so it's as clear as possible.

 

[TadOverdon]

I assume they're at least as smart as I am. That's not a particularly high bar, I don't think.

I don't assume that means they'll like what I like.

 

[lovecraft68]

I don't think its a question of intelligence as much as most here are reading to be aroused. Not that they mind a good story to go with the good dirty stuff, but they're not here to analyze and look for clues like this is a best selling crime thriller

When I write my stories I'm not thinking will the reader pick this up, if they do they do, if not, I don't worry about it.

I'm sure I've made some jokes or references in my stories a lot of people didn't get, but all that means is I have a different sense of humor or might be referring to things they have no clue about.

Its another thing I don't feel is worth thinking of worrying about.

 

[NotWise]

I try to use a common vocabulary. Aside from that, readers' understanding of stories seems to depend more on what they choose to skip or skim than on intelligence.

 

[KeithD]

I try not to write above my vocabulary level or more flowery than I would enjoy reading. Beyond that I don't make assumptions about my readers. I let them find me and enjoy me--or not. If they say not, I welcome them to go read someone else's stories. There are lots and lots of authors and writing styles out there.

 

[SamScribble]

Whether I’m writing fact or fiction, I try to keep it simple. Fiction plots can be complex. Good fiction characters are almost invariably complex. But I try to communicate them simply. I try to ensure that the reader will quickly recognise that the cat is sitting on the mat. But I certainly don’t fret if some of the readers are ailurophobes. Or if they have no experience, direct or indirect, to which they can fasten the idea of a mat. I write for the readers who ‘get it’, and I leave the others to seek their kicks elsewhere.

 

[LAHomedog]

I write as if I was on here reading it. If I don't dig it as a reader, I rewrite it or trash it.

I am also a very big believer that you have to bring the reader along. Introduce them to your story and your characters and give them every opportunity to get into the story and enjoy it. (No matter why they are here and reading it.)

When I was at Disney there was a saying, "Lower the threshold of entry." Make it as easy as possible for folks to enter and enjoy themselves. I don't think in writing that means talking down to your reader, as I said, I think it is giving them an opportunity to become involved with the tale you are telling.

 

[PennameWombat]

I named two minor characters in my recent Geek Pride story Martin Amis and David Henry Lawrence. For no reason other than I could. Anyone who’s never heard of them would simply read on, the characters were both generic American college students and those names are reasonably generic enough for such. If you’d ever been a graduate student in an American university some elements of the story would’ve offered more depth.

A long plot arc in a multi-chaptered story would’ve offered more depth if you understood orbital mechanics. Same with the references to parkour that story brings up every so often.

But I tried to make sure that readers didn’t have to be or have been a grad student or an astrophysicist to enjoy the stories. I’m not exactly the one to best decide if I hit the marks but those aren’t the issues what few comments I get bring up. But having some of that is what I enjoy reading and writing. That I mostly get good ratings and have a goodly number of Hs but have never been close to placing in a contest I cannot say whether these play into that.

From experience my vocabulary is above average but I try to avoid being overly ornamental.

 

[Kumquatqueen]

I write what I like to read, so there's some 'advanced' vocab and some undercurrents of ideas floating around, which at least some readers appreciate - a lot of my characters work in a scientific research institution because I can't be bothered to invent a new workplace. Some people resent any discussion vthat isn't about sex, some like the fleshing-out of the scene, some nitpick the science.

A lot of readers are put off by my UK English. Sometimes the dialogue and dialects are important to the story so I keep them; other times I try to make sure it's comprehensible to the average American, at least at the start, with someone reading a couple pages or more for me. Of course then there's my friend Anon commenting on behalf of the below-average Americans...
I did put my own comment on one story "note to self: clearly calling someone Rapeyfucker McBastardface is not a clear enough indicator that they are in fact a rapist" given a number of complaints that the main character should have had sex with him.

A short stroke piece will have less complex ideas and imagery than a novel. I have a draft novel elsewhere - fanfic in a fandom where the reader is expected to keep up and look up references as necessary, bit like Dorothy Sayers - which readers liked but pointed out where some of the shadowing of subplots and references hadn't quite worked. Mostly I agreed with them.

There's a lot of bland stories out there providing little background, new imagery, and not making me think about their topic in any new way. I have no interest in adding to them. I'm not saying my stories here are literature but they should be at least something different.

 

[ElectricBlue]

I write what I like to read, so there's some 'advanced' vocab and some undercurrents of ideas floating around, which at least some readers appreciate...

I'm the same - I write to an audience who I assume to be like me, and frankly, it never occurs to me to worry if folk might not know some of the words I'll use, because... dictionaries, right?

I never bother to justify, excuse or explain my Australian cultural references - I can figure out stories set in other countries, so surely other readers can.

Other than one or two inane comments about spelling over the years, 99% of the comments received are in some way about the stories themselves, and nearly always thoughtful and very often, heartfelt. So I figure I'm writing for the readers who read me.

I take great pleasure in the comments received along the lines of, "This is not like the norm around here, cudos." And a favourite recent comment: "An erotic story on an erotic story site. Who knew!"

 

[holliday1960]

I'm the same - I write to an audience who I assume to be like me, and frankly, it never occurs to me to worry if folk might not know some of the words I'll use, because... dictionaries, right? "

No. This isn't about definitions, EB. I wrote a quickie Valentine's Day Event story with NO sex. Put it in romance. The plot was simple; what goes around, comes around. What was, will be. History repeats. The apple doesn't fall far from the tree... yaddah, yaddah, yaddah.

Some readers were completely lost. I was speechless so I didn't even bother to answer their comments. The story (Heart of a Woman) was short, simply written and didn't require a grade school education to understand. A sponge couldn've soaked it up without using a dictionary. It was a WTF moment for me as a writer. These days, I talk to rocks for entertainment. They don't leave comments or 1*s.

 

[SimonDoom]

I had to think about this one, because I wasn't sure what my answer was.

I think my answer is that I don't make any assumptions. I'm aware that there are a gazillion Literotica readers and their intelligence and education run the gamut (if you need evidence of this, check out the Politics and General Boards).

I don't write with an average Literotica reader in mind. I write for myself. I write to please myself as a reader. I've been an avid reader for five decades and I have strong ideas about what I like. Generally, I like clean, grammatically correct prose, so that's what I try to write (others can judge whether I succeed). Sometimes I get a bit flowery, or include words that I don't normally use in everyday conversation, because I like writing that stretches me as a reader, and I like the idea that I'm taking full advantage of all that the English language has to offer, and I aspire to be an author that does that.

I'll add that while I write for myself, I'm aware that there a lot of highly intelligent and educated authors and readers at this Site. I value their feedback, and while I don't write for them I also don't want them to read my stories and think, This guy's an idiot.

 

[Zeb_Carter]

Oops...

 

[Zeb_Carter]

I was accused by a reader of writing at a high school level. I shook my head as most comment on how easy it is to read my stuff. I had to wonder what he was looking for as he is on a free site with most of the stories about people fucking. Surely, Lolita, wasn't written above the high school level nor any of the romance novels out there.

I too, do not try to write above my vocabulary level. I don't use a lot of long words they will have to look up in a dictionary, even though I know what those words mean, I figure the reader might not.

My philosophy is KISS, Keep it simple stupid.

 

[Comshaw]

I do have a question for Author's writing more 'complicated' stories and series.

The subject came up when I was trying to be "too clever by half" and just repeatedly hinted at an important detail. I thought that I had left enough bread crumbs, for the readers I was trying to lead into the 'dark and scary' woods, but a few of them got 'lost'.

Let me state VERY clearly - it was MY fault for being far too obscure - not theirs for failing to follow my poor lead.

Other 'more established' genres had strict 'Rules' quantified for them a very long time ago. The classic realm of 'pure detective' fiction is one such place. Here is an excerpt of one such rule. I'll paste in the link to the full article at the bottom of this post.



[[[ The "sidekick" of the detective, the Watson, must not conceal from the reader any thoughts which pass through his mind: his intelligence must be slightly, but very slightly, below that of the average reader. ]]]



Some erotica writers are VERY literal, and lead their charges firmly by the hand. They leave absolutely nothing for the reader to imagine on their own. Others deliberately leave some 'breathing room' and let their audience fill in some of the blanks from their own desires and experiences. A few just write with a full air of mystery, like a ghost story, letting their followers make of the clues what they will.


- - - Is there some MINIMUM amount of hand holding that you adhere to when writing a story? - - -


What self-imposed Rules do you make for YOURSELF, and do you often break them?

Have you ever bewildered a particular reader so much that their so-called 'wrong assumption' shocked you? Going back, and reviewing your own written words, did you agree that you had been in error? How do you make sure that those things don't keep happening?

What level of responsibility do you feel or take to keep people on 'the same page' as you? Where do you draw the line, if you even do, about being perhaps too blunt with your descriptions of action and clues? Does such 'over controlling' detail stifle your creativity sometimes?

Are there standard rules somewhere for Erotica, like below, or is it still the Wild West out there as it was ten and twenty years ago. Are we finally 'Mainstream" enough that we have to follow at least 'some' literary conventions?

https://agathachristie.fandom.com/wiki/The_“Rules”_of_Detective_Fiction

Minimum amount of mental hand holding? To tell the truth, I've never thought about it. While several of my stories have a twist at the end, I don't try to go out of my way to be cleaver with clues and such.

As far as feeling responsible trying to keep them on the same page as me, I feel none, none at all. I have received several comments on stories that show people didn't understand the premise. If I get one of those, I go back and reread the section to which they refer. So far it has turned out that they either misread that part, or like one I put I n Loving Wives, they just took exception to the whole story line and interpreted it through their own bias.

Most of my stories are written by me for me and put here to let others read them if they wish to, so I really don't have readers as an overriding consideration when I write them.

As far as the rules you refer to, why should we adhere to any arbitrary list of rules made up by someone? Language rules, the mechanics of the median, are one thing. Those are constructed and put in place so that a writer can convey to the reader what they are trying to in a consistent manner. Even those rules aren't inviolate. A great example is William Faulkner's writing. One of his stories had a narrative from a character who was relating something said by another character to a third. To signify this he used a single quote mark inside a double quote mark. At the time, the literary world went hermitile because it hadn't been done before.

Additionally, I can't understand binding yourself with rules when stories are supposed to be creative. Long ago a teacher told me, "learn the basic rules. Don't deviate from them UNTIL you are confident in their use. Then you can happily break them."

Exceptionally creative content comes from breaking the rules, from deviating from the norm. That doesn't mean that every time that's tried it works, but exceptional stories come from those who walk a different path, who see the world in a different way than the rest of us. Before anyone makes the assumption, do not think I think I've reach that stage. I've got a hell of a long ways to go, but that's my goal. Will I get there? Who knows, but i'll keep trying for that brass ring, as should we all.


Comshaw

 

[TarnishedPenny]

I write what I like to read, so there's some 'advanced' vocab and some undercurrents of ideas floating around, which at least some readers appreciate - a lot of my characters work in a scientific research institution because I can't be bothered to invent a new workplace. Some people resent any discussion vthat isn't about sex, some like the fleshing-out of the scene, some nitpick the science.

A lot of readers are put off by my UK English. Sometimes the dialogue and dialects are important to the story so I keep them; other times I try to make sure it's comprehensible to the average American, at least at the start, with someone reading a couple pages or more for me. Of course then there's my friend Anon commenting on behalf of the below-average Americans...

A short stroke piece will have less complex ideas and imagery than a novel.

There's a lot of bland stories out there providing little background, new imagery, and not making me think about their topic in any new way. I have no interest in adding to them. I'm not saying my stories here are literature but they should be at least something different.

That sums it up pretty well.

I like to think my works (with some exceptions) are stories with some erotica in them rather than erotica hung on the skeleton of a story. That to me means that there should be a plot, there should be some depth to the characters and so forth. If something is deep enough that it’s possibly above the ‘average’ reader, then I’ll try to explain the basic concept, eg in a conversation.

One example was having to work through the genetic effects of inbreeding. The characters discussed it and got the point across that way. It worked; the story wouldn’t been as good without that subplot and it certainly scored well enough, meaning that the readers liked the tale, genetics and all.

I had another hinge on a genie and his lamp. To make it work, I had to describe the lamp, then talk about the mores of the society which produced it. It worked well enough that I actually got compliments from one reader happy to have learned about all that.

I had one title which sent a reader having to research Ancient Greek literature. They came back with a very positive comment for that reason alone.

My point is that, if you’re careful, you can write almost anything into a tale, even here, and do quite well.

If it matters, I generally write the Queen’s English and haven’t had any nasty feedback on that. Maybe I’m not trying hard enough?

 

[oggbashan]

I try not to write down to any readers and I can use a large (British) vocabulary. I assume, if they don't know, they can use a dictionary, but sometimes the comments disappoint me.

In some of my stories, I include different levels of understanding. There is the basic linear story, but there are also allusions that only someone with a wider knowledge will get. Sometimes they do, and that's great.

But I assume that at least some of the readers can understand what I write. If they don't? I expect them to back-click.

 

[TadOverdon]

I tend to think that my stories are collections of porn fantasy scenarios attached to the sketched-in armatures of generally outlandish stories. I want the various unlikely plot incidents to entertain me and as many of the people who read them as I can manage, and hopefully make us laugh sometimes. And I want the folks who are looking for something to get off to, to get off to my stories.

I find some pretty obscure or peculiar stuff amusing. So there's always a fair question of whether a lot of it really communicates anything beyond "Huh, what's that about?" to some readers.

 

[gordo12]

I do have a question for Author's writing more 'complicated' stories and series.

The subject came up when I was trying to be "too clever by half" and just repeatedly hinted at an important detail. I thought that I had left enough bread crumbs, for the readers I was trying to lead into the 'dark and scary' woods, but a few of them got 'lost'.

Let me state VERY clearly - it was MY fault for being far too obscure - not theirs for failing to follow my poor lead.

Other 'more established' genres had strict 'Rules' quantified for them a very long time ago. The classic realm of 'pure detective' fiction is one such place. Here is an excerpt of one such rule. I'll paste in the link to the full article at the bottom of this post.



[[[ The "sidekick" of the detective, the Watson, must not conceal from the reader any thoughts which pass through his mind: his intelligence must be slightly, but very slightly, below that of the average reader. ]]]



Some erotica writers are VERY literal, and lead their charges firmly by the hand. They leave absolutely nothing for the reader to imagine on their own. Others deliberately leave some 'breathing room' and let their audience fill in some of the blanks from their own desires and experiences. A few just write with a full air of mystery, like a ghost story, letting their followers make of the clues what they will.


- - - Is there some MINIMUM amount of hand holding that you adhere to when writing a story? - - -


What self-imposed Rules do you make for YOURSELF, and do you often break them?

Have you ever bewildered a particular reader so much that their so-called 'wrong assumption' shocked you? Going back, and reviewing your own written words, did you agree that you had been in error? How do you make sure that those things don't keep happening?

What level of responsibility do you feel or take to keep people on 'the same page' as you? Where do you draw the line, if you even do, about being perhaps too blunt with your descriptions of action and clues? Does such 'over controlling' detail stifle your creativity sometimes?

Are there standard rules somewhere for Erotica, like below, or is it still the Wild West out there as it was ten and twenty years ago. Are we finally 'Mainstream" enough that we have to follow at least 'some' literary conventions?

https://agathachristie.fandom.com/wiki/The_“Rules”_of_Detective_Fiction

In my very first story, I did a big reveal and managed to piss off half the species. Women were reading the story as a romance, and when it turned out it wasn't, they got so thoroughly pissed off they abandoned the story. I got emails and comments telling me so. (Including my own wife )

Men, on the other hand, read through. Commented about it. And then complimented me on pulling it back together at the end. rose: Winners!)

Even though there HAD been hints in the story that everything wasn't quite kosher, it taught me a lot about breadcrumbs and making sure they're adequate.

Nevertheless, as someone else mentioned, there are intelligence problems, there are belief problems, and there is skimming, where they fail to get those breadcrumbs.

You do the best you can and don't worry about the individual reader. It's their problem.

I'm not aware of any rules for erotica and wouldn't pay much attention to them anyway.

 

[lovecraft68]

My personal slogan is for anyone old enough to remember the kids show the Electric Company. "Easy reader Says This Book is Easy to read!"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9eX2ajK3A4

The seventies kids shows were more educational than today's school system and they brought the funk.

 

[williepeter]

intelligence level

Being High School Dropout who ended his working career with a BS. I feel qualified in making some observations.
It is very easy for educated people to confuse intelligence with education. I feel
(as in no scientific evidence) That many of the readers just enjoy porn, written at their lever or the PHD level.

When speaking to plain people speak plain or reveal your lack of intelligence.