Why worry about gay rights? Someone asked me.

[PoliteSuccubus]

What I told them was that it's the right thing to do. And I gave them several reasons why it's the right thing to do. But I didn't tell them everything, coz it's none of their business.

I'll tell you what I didn't tell them.

My daughter and her fiancé are bi.

With the mounting evidence of heredity in homosexuality this means there is a good chance that several of my grandchildren (and beyond) will be bi or gay.

What kind of world do I want them to be born into?

Quite a few of the people I know have been shaped by the abuse they've had to undergo.

Quite a few I know never came out in order not to hurt those they loved, or be hurt by them and others.

And there are bad people out there who take advantage of people with low self-esteem, of which young bi/gay youth usually are due to the stress of their sexuality.

I can't change a lot today, but I can be outspoken for change, enlighten a few.

Be a pebble, perhaps, in the pond of the world that moves change along with outward going ripples....

And maybe by talking to the person I did today was one of those ripples.

Hugs, ya all.

 

[69forever]

What I told them was that it's the right thing to do. And I gave them several reasons why it's the right thing to do. But I didn't tell them everything, coz it's none of their business.

I'll tell you what I didn't tell them.

My daughter and her fiancé are bi.

With the mounting evidence of heredity in homosexuality this means there is a good chance that several of my grandchildren (and beyond) will be bi or gay.

What kind of world do I want them to be born into?

Quite a few of the people I know have been shaped by the abuse they've had to undergo.

Quite a few I know never came out in order not to hurt those they loved, or be hurt by them and others.

And there are bad people out there who take advantage of people with low self-esteem, of which young bi/gay youth usually are due to the stress of their sexuality.

I can't change a lot today, but I can be outspoken for change, enlighten a few.

Be a pebble, perhaps, in the pond of the world that moves change along with outward going ripples....

And maybe by talking to the person I did today was one of those ripples.

Hugs, ya all.

Any doubt why I luv ya??? Your openness will rub off on me yet! One of those ripples has already affected my life...given me the courage to be who I am. I am going to talk to our freind...

 

[Queersetti]

People like you make the world a better place, darling.

 

[PoliteSuccubus]

Aw shucks guys! *blushes*

It's just common sense, ya know.

Which I know isn't that common anymore, if ever was.

 

[Pookie]

What a cool post, PS.

The world changes one person at a time, but it takes people like you to cause the changes.

 

[wishbone96]

Thank you- I know of someone who committed suicide-threw himself in front of a train on Thanksgiving Eve. He found out he was gay in his first semester at college and he couldn't live with it. He was a bright, talented and sensitive kid .This was a real tragedy for all who knew and loved him. There is no place for bigotry and hate.

 

[PoliteSuccubus]

I think that more straight people need to stand up for gay rights.

It's really the only way it's going to be heard by some people because they will scoff at gay/bi people saying "Well of course THEY want gay rights!"

But if more straights stand up for it because it's the right thing to do, then those sheep (No offense truly meant) who follow trends rather than their common sense will follow along.

I'm sorry to hear about your friend. It truly is a sad thing, and such a waste.

 

[naudiz]

Gay rights are important because human rights are important. Even if you're not gay or bi, hatred and bigotry are an insult to human dignity, and they affect everyone badly.

I'm bi. I'm happily married to a member of the opposite sex. We're both very lucky that the government smiles on our union. We're also both very pissed off that a group of bible-thumping bigots presume that our marriage needs defended. How dare they?

What needs defended is human dignity, and the right for those who love and want to devote their lives to each other to do so safely.

I worry about gay rights because an attack against gay people is an attack against compassion and dignity.

I seriously want to get a bumper sticker that reads: My Marriage Doesn't Need Defended.

 

[modest mouse]

With the mounting evidence of heredity in homosexuality this means there is a good chance that several of my grandchildren (and beyond) will be bi or gay.

No studies have indicated that homosexuality is gereditary. you have your signals crossed. Evidence shows that homosexulaity or a leanign to that preference can be strongly influenced by genetics, strongly as in almost guarenteed. This has long been thought but only recently proven in some meaningful work.

But to say that homosexuality is hereditary is a leap. There exist certain human traits that are not so much hereditary to certain families and genetic clusters are they are inherent in what it is to be human. Homosexulaity lingers in this area. It isnt so much hereditary as it is one of many human traits that can go in several different directions.

Because you have gays in your family doesnt mean that descendents are more likely to be homosexual. At least thats what all evidence shows now and I tend to agree with it.

***

As far as Gay rights beign the 'right' thing to do. Hogwash. Thats not a good reason to do anything in favor of gay rights. The right thing to do relies on people's own moral code(s) and some people's codes are severely fucked up.

Gay rights is important because its a human right, as naudiz said. Its important because its none of my business what adults do int here bedroom, in their hearts, or otherwise without harming anyone. Its important because we all still have the a desire for 'the pursuit of happiness'.

Fight for gay rights because you're different in some way too, because you know gay people are really just people, and on and on... but its not the 'right' thing to do. Thats reasoning too easily soiled and twisted.

 

[PoliteSuccubus]

I'm sorry but saying:

As far as Gay rights beign the 'right' thing to do. Hogwash. Thats not a good reason to do anything in favor of gay rights.

And then:

Gay rights is important because its a human right, as naudiz said.

is contradictory in my eyes.

Gay's are human, their rights fall under the human rights umbrella, and thus are the right thing to do.

And maybe I'm not up on the sematics but....Doesn't
"strongly influenced by genetics" mean heredity?

 

[Pyper]

And maybe I'm not up on the sematics but....Doesn't
"strongly influenced by genetics" mean heredity?

No. A condition caused by genetics is not the same as a condition that is hereditary. There are many, many factors in our genetic makeup that we do not inherit from our parents, but are simply random mutations.

Whether or not homosexuality is due to genetics, other factors, or genetics and a combination of other factors is still shrouded in mystery.

 

[Johnny Mayberry]

I get what MM is trying to say...if you portray it in a certain light, it is too easliy dismissed. The moral/ethical support for gay rights is based on your morals, which may be different from mine. On the other hand, to explain it to others as a pragmatic decision that my sexual privacy and yours are protected by the same laws that should protect gay people, it is harder to agrue against. It is a way of embracing gay rights, not as 'special rights for queers', but as human rights which extend to everyone, gay, straight, or anywhere in between.

 

[Queersetti]

I get what MM is trying to say...if you portray it in a certain light, it is too easliy dismissed. The moral/ethical support for gay rights is based on your morals, which may be different from mine. On the other hand, to explain it to others as a pragmatic decision that my sexual privacy and yours are protected by the same laws that should protect gay people, it is harder to agrue against. It is a way of embracing gay rights, not as 'special rights for queers', but as human rights which extend to everyone, gay, straight, or anywhere in between.

Of course, there is a difference in how one might answer the questions "Why do you support gay right?" and "Why should I support gay rights?"

In reply to the first question, PS's answer is absolutely appropriate.

 

[ozraven]

I get what MM is trying to say...if you portray it in a certain light, it is too easliy dismissed. The moral/ethical support for gay rights is based on your morals, which may be different from mine. On the other hand, to explain it to others as a pragmatic decision that my sexual privacy and yours are protected by the same laws that should protect gay people, it is harder to agrue against. It is a way of embracing gay rights, not as 'special rights for queers', but as human rights which extend to everyone, gay, straight, or anywhere in between.

Agreed, if people's rights were properly protected and legislated than there would be no need for "splinter group" activists.........

I believe in and support "gay rights" to exactly the same extent that I do "hetro rights"..........I accept that prejudice and hatred are things I don't have to suffer as a result of my sexuality, but I have over the years had many friends that were gay, my lady is bi, I am just me........The laws and cultural mores should be no different for gays than for anyone else, no special, nothing extra, but nothing deficient either.

IMHO

 

[PoliteSuccubus]

No. A condition caused by genetics is not the same as a condition that is hereditary. There are many, many factors in our genetic makeup that we do not inherit from our parents, but are simply random mutations.

Whether or not homosexuality is due to genetics, other factors, or genetics and a combination of other factors is still shrouded in mystery.

Thanks, I stand corrected!

 

[glamorilla]

Interesting thread.

So how do you handle homophobes?

 

[PoliteSuccubus]

Myself personally?

I tell them that they are silly, and that they might want to reconsider a friendship with me because our beliefs are different and they might be uncomfortable among my other friends who aren't homophobic or, are indeed, homosexual or at least bi.

Or, in short, I've been honest with them.


They are allowed their views, it's not like I can stop them, but their way of thinking and mine do not mesh, and depending on how big of a problem that is for them maybe we should just be people who wave when walking by instead of friends who fight.

So far I've got four former homophobes in my group who realized they'd been buying a party line instead of getting to actually know anyone gay.

 

[naudiz]

Most of my family is pretty open-minded, but I have a sibling who is homophobic, as is his family. We've reached a tentative peace treaty in terms of the G word. They know if they bring the topic up, I will put it down, so they don't mention it around me.

The best time was when he told me that the idea of two men in love wasn't so bad, but it was the fact they were committing sodomy that was unbearable. I replied that I found fixating on thy neighbor's kinky sex didn't seem particularly religious nor righteous in the eyes of God.

Funny, it never got brought up again.

 

[Effigy]

I replied that I found fixating on thy neighbor's kinky sex didn't seem particularly religious nor righteous in the eyes of God.

I find it highly righteous

 

[wishbone96]

My question is how do you deal with day in day out barrage of
gay bashing at work, coffee breaks, etc.? At times I just want to get up and walk away but that has earned me "suspected queer" status in the past. Do you pretend to "yuk" it up with the others
or just sit there with a straight face. Given office and work politics in today's world ,its very hard to deal with at times. So yeah, I SUPPORT GAY RIGHTS because the only way to make BIGOTRY go away is to bring it out in the open-So Gay parades and Rainbow Coalitions are GOOD and NECESSARY-How else to get the message out?-can't do it from the closet.

 

[sweetnpetite]

I think that gay rights are important to everybody and here is why:

Many people strongly oppose homosexuality. Do you suppose that it really effects them what two people do in the bedroom?

The real problem is enforcement of gender roles. Women are afraid to act too agressive, or unfeminine, for fear of being labled lesbian, butch, dyke.

Men are afraid to be too flamboyant, too fussy, too 'pretty' for fear of being labled gay, fag, queer.

Straight men and women of course are most strongly effected by this. Even those who think "there is nothing wrong with it" don't want the lable applied to them. Homophobia keeps men and women, "in there place" or at least from straying *too far* from that place. If you erase that stigma, people might act just any old way.

Loss of control. That's what it's about. Certain religios and political groups have a vested interest in contoling the masses through the enforcement of gender rolls. Or does this sound like a conspiracy theory?

 

[Queersetti]

My question is how do you deal with day in day out barrage of
gay bashing at work, coffee breaks, etc.? At times I just want to get up and walk away but that has earned me "suspected queer" status in the past. Do you pretend to "yuk" it up with the others
or just sit there with a straight face. Given office and work politics in today's world ,its very hard to deal with at times. So yeah, I SUPPORT GAY RIGHTS because the only way to make BIGOTRY go away is to bring it out in the open-So Gay parades and Rainbow Coalitions are GOOD and NECESSARY-How else to get the message out?-can't do it from the closet.

I've never worked in such a hostile environment, but I can sympathize.

Maybe you could tell them that you have a close relative or friend who is gay, and that you are offended by their remarks. That might make them reconsider their behavior while maintaining your own safety.

 

[wishbone96]

I agree I need to do that -or else I won't be able to look at myself in the mirror. I hate hypocrisy-but I know odf firsthand what its like when everyone sits two or three chairs away from you at meetings etc. Very hurtful...

 

[Squeezenplease]

What I told them was that it's the right thing to do. And I gave them several reasons why it's the right thing to do. But I didn't tell them everything, coz it's none of their business.

I'll tell you what I didn't tell them.

My daughter and her fiancé are bi.

With the mounting evidence of heredity in homosexuality this means there is a good chance that several of my grandchildren (and beyond) will be bi or gay.

What kind of world do I want them to be born into?

Quite a few of the people I know have been shaped by the abuse they've had to undergo.

Quite a few I know never came out in order not to hurt those they loved, or be hurt by them and others.

And there are bad people out there who take advantage of people with low self-esteem, of which young bi/gay youth usually are due to the stress of their sexuality.

I can't change a lot today, but I can be outspoken for change, enlighten a few.

Be a pebble, perhaps, in the pond of the world that moves change along with outward going ripples....

And maybe by talking to the person I did today was one of those ripples.

Hugs, ya all.

I'm curious, are you bi Polite? Don't have to answer if you don't want to...I am myself

 

[PoliteSuccubus]

I'm not, but my daughter is, my godson is gay, my daughter's BF is bi, and my old best friend (past tense) is gay.

I'm straight, and celibate myself. I sometimes wish I were bi, since I've met so many people who are easy to love and would love me in return if I were...Now isn't that just ironic, considering how many gays and bi's had wished and/or denied their sexuality?