Who Invented Lolita?

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This is very interesting, and explores further the idea of 'stealing' vs. 'borrowing'. In fact, there is a term I had not heard before, cryptomnesia. Also pertinent to some past thread discussions, I've put in bold what to me is a good definition of real style (vs. technique or form). Perdita
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Who Invented Lolita? By CHRISTOPHER CALDWELL, NYTimes Mag., 5.23.2004

n a fictional foreword to Vladimir Nabokov's 1955 mock memoir, ''Lolita,'' a psychologist explains that the book's ''author,'' the pedophile Humbert Humbert, has disguised the names of many personages. But not that of Lolita herself, the 12-year-old object of Humbert's obsessions -- since ''her first name is too closely interwound with the inmost fiber of the book to allow one to alter it.''

Earlier this spring, Michael Maar, a literary scholar, speculated that the name Lolita may have been similarly interwound with Nabokov himself. In Die Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung and in The Times Literary Supplement, Maar alerted readers to a 1916 short story called ''Lolita,'' by an obscure Berlin writer, Heinz von Lichberg. That von Lichberg later served on the editorial board of a notorious Nazi publication heightened the frisson of scandal.

In the earlier work, as in the later, a first-person male narrator describes an obsession with a young girl named Lolita that entails long travels and ends in death. Maar finds the coincidence of plot, narrative and name ''striking.'' He does not accuse Nabokov of plagiarism, since ''he was a genius on his own.'' (As some are too rich to steal, apparently, others are too smart to crib.) Maar prefers the word ''cryptomnesia,'' a process by which things are learned, forgotten and then mistaken for original inspirations when recalled. Since Nabokov lived in Berlin from 1922 to 1937, Maar asks, could he have been under the ''stimulus'' of von Lichberg's story? If so, what does that tell us about one of the last half-century's most famous -- and notorious -- works of fiction?

Von Lichberg's work is an 18-page gothic tale set in Spain. Nabokov's is an American ''Diary of a Madman'' and a word game sustained across some 300 pages. Of course, the coincidence of names is startling. But even if Nabokov did somehow have the name of von Lichberg's heroine in mind, he wasn't necessarily up to anything questionable. Once the narrators' obsessions with youth are accounted for, the other resemblances plainly come with the territory. Maar notes that von Lichberg's narrator falls in love at ''a first, fatal glance, that cannot but remind us of the later Lolita.'' Yeah, along with most love stories ever written. That both novels describe young girls as ''boyish'' is no more surprising than that two novels should describe basketball players as ''tall.''

Nor should you be too impressed with Maar's claim that in the earlier ''Lolita,'' ''she's the one who seduces the narrator, like with Humbert Humbert.'' As any small-town district attorney knows, it is the pattern for sex offenders to depict their crimes in this light: she was asking for it! Whether Nabokov and von Lichberg were guilelessly revealing their own prurience or thinking their way into the minds of their narrators, a depiction of the child as seducer is the first thing you would expect to find in such a fictional memoir.

Nabokov is an unlikely plagiarist. Honing a distinctive literary voice obsessed him. ''Style is not a tool,'' he once said in a lecture, ''it is not a method, it is not a choice of words alone. Being much more than all this, style constitutes an intrinsic component or characteristic of the author's personality.''

Why the fuss, then? Since few books today evoke emotions worth feuding over, postmodern literati settle for having the old literary feuds again and again. Linking von Lichberg with Nabokov lets readers address, as if it were still a burning issue, the question of how dirty a book ''Lolita'' is. Whether you believe the charge of borrowing or not has much to do with whether you think ''Lolita'' is art or smut. If you consider Humbert Humbert an outright pervert with whom only the rare weirdo can empathize, then it's very unlikely that Nabokov arrived at his similarities with von Lichberg by accident. In this case, a compromised protagonist suggests a compromised author.


But you can also consider Humbert's vice, as Lionel Trilling did, a part of the human inheritance that civilization has tried to overcome, or at least tame. While Trilling found ''Lolita'' pornographic and at times shallow, he grants that ''it is not about sex. It is about love.'' Trilling means courtly love -- ''passion,'' with its etymological overtones of suffering and doom. Art does not deal with love in this way nowadays, Trilling says, because ''we have all become so nicely cleareyed, so sensibly Coming-of-Age-in-Samoa,'' that no passion can shock, no amatory choice is despised, no one is doomed. Lovers as jealous as Othello or as thwarted by snobbery as Romeo and Juliet would be implausible. To create a protagonist doomed by his passion, you must seek the only taboo left standing: pedophilia. ''Lolita'' is a bid to rescue love from the forces of health -- marriage on the one hand and psychiatry on the other -- in order to reclaim it for suffering, and for art. If Trilling is right, then ''Lolita'' has an aesthetic rationale so compelling that it is no surprise that two authors should gravitate to it independently.

If this rationale does not exist, though, the similarities are suspicious. That is why the present controversy offers more to ''Lolita'' skeptics than to ''Lolita''-philes. The consensus for the past half-century has been that ''Lolita'' is not smut because it is a work of original genius. The new controversy raises skeptics' hopes that they can now win the argument on a technicality, simply by running it backward: if ''Lolita'' is not a work of original genius, then it is smut. The smart money would seem to be on the proposition that it is both.
 
I heard Michael Maar interviewed on All Things Considered.

The short story is nowhere near like the novel, of course. But I like the idea that the name of the Lolita is now "fixed" like a dye in a swatch of cotton.

Archetypes are created in many ways, and now we know more about the genesis of this one.

cantdog
 
Having always had a fascination for dirty books and other smut, I read "Lolita" long age,, probably in the early sixties. As I recall, the girs's name was Dolores Haze, and her mother, who was a widow, called her Lo or maybe Dolly. As I recall, she called herself Dolly. The author/protagonist referred to her as Lolita but I don't recall that he ever addressed her as that.

HH was a pedophile who married her mother, "the Haze woman", to get close to the daughter and after Mom died in a traffic accident, HH took the name Haze and he and the daughter traveled together. He wanted to have a free hand with Lolita but he was concerned she would reject his advances so he conned a doctor into prescribing sleeping pills that he planned to use to knock her unconscious so he could molest her. The MD Doublecrossed HH and prescribed a mild sedative and Lolita woke up during her molestation. She was no innocent and was more than willing to go along with what was happening. In the book, HH claimed "she seduced me" but he had set up the whole situation and all she did was go along with his plans, so he was the seducer although of a willing victim.

Art being as long as it is, the book should be considered a work of art but it was also smut. The two are not mutually incompatible.

I consider my stories to be smut, and NOT works of art.
 
Box, your plot description is ridiculous because Lolita is not merely a story or novel. Did you read the article above?! HH is not a pedophile, i.e., he is the narrator and not a real person. The girl is not even real to him. Awk! you still upset me with your microscopic view of things.

Perdita (not angry, just flummoxed again by how you think)
 
Thanks, box: "Art being as long as it is..."

A very slick phrase, which i'm going to use as my own whenever I wanna look particularly cool!

Smooth.


cantdog

ps I agree about art and smut, although the article's author obviously has it all wrong.

c
 
I have never read Lolita, but I am currently reading The [short-] Stories of Vladimir Nabokov (in two volumes) and all I can say at this point is the man knew a thing or two about writing. Pure artistry.
 
Basic plot of the book,
A scholar, Humbert leaves Europe for America and moves into a rented room in the home of Charlotte Haze, after meeting her, and spying her twelve-year-old daughter (Dolores Haze, affectionately shortened to "Lo," or Lolita) sunbathing in the garden. Charlotte Haze, a lonely widow, becomes Humbert's unwitting pawn in his silent quest to be near her young daughter. Charlotte soon marries Humbert. In a search of Humbert's room, she finds his diary, containing Humbert's written confessions of indifference to his new wife and impassioned lust for her daughter. She runs away in disgust and, in fleeing the home, is hit and killed by a passing car.

Humbert begins traveling around the United States, from one motel to another, in the company of Lolita, with whom he is now having a sexual relationship. This relationship ends when a rival adult suitor, Clare Quilty, convinces Lolita to leave Humbert and run away with him.

At the end of the novel, when Humbert Humbert briefly reunites with Lolita, it is only to give her the money she has requested so that she and her new husband, Richard Schiller, can make a fresh start in Alaska. Humbert realizes that he still wants her, not because she was one of the class of young girls he refers to as nymphets, but because he has truly fallen in love with her.
~~~~~~~

The novel is a tragi-comedy narrated by Humbert, who riddles the narrative with his wry observations of American culture. His humor provides an effective counterpoint to the pathos of the tragic plot. The novel's flamboyant style is characterized by wordplay, multilingual puns, anagrams, and coinages such as nymphet, a word which has since had a life of its own and can be found in most dictionaries.


Humbert Humbert's first love, Annabel Leigh, is named after the woman in the poem, Anebel Lee by Edgar Allen poe. In fact, their young love is described in phrases borrowed from Poe's poem.

Humbert Humbert's double name recalls Poe's "William Wilson" a tale in which the main character is haunted by his doppelganger.

The term lolita has come to be applied, especially in the marketing of pornography, to any attractive woman who has only recently reached, or is still younger than, the age of consent. For this reason, it is especially worth noting that Nabokov's Lolita is far from an endorsement of pedophilia, since it dramatizes the tragic consequences of Humbert's obsession with the young heroine. Nabokov himself described Humbert as "a hateful person"

The opinion of this reader is it is a work of art that has stood the test, dealing with a very touchy topic. Yet the real topic is can a man love a female under the legal age? Or is it meerly just a fetish to have a young looking female?
 
perdita said:
Box, your plot description is ridiculous because Lolita is not merely a story or novel. Did you read the article above?! HH is not a pedophile, i.e., he is the narrator and not a real person. The girl is not even real to him. Awk! you still upset me with your microscopic view of things.

Perdita (not angry, just flummoxed again by how you think)

Dita, sometimes you puzzle me. When I read "Lolita", it was a book, it was fiction, fairly long, certainly too long to be called a novelet or novella. Ergo, it was a novel. It may also be a metaphor or other things but it is primarily a novel. To me, it was primarily something to beat off to.

I'm well aware that HH is not a real person, nor is Lolita, nor anybody else in the book. There are all ficticious characters in a novel. The book was written in the first person and HH was the narrator and a character. Lolita and the Haze woman and Quilty were also characters.

I did read the article. Mostly, it was about the origin of the book and whether or not it was plagiarized. Having never read the original story, I couldn't say, but it looks like it might have been.

HH, the character, most certainly was a pedo. Early in the book he went on about the attraction young girls had for him, and he went to great lengths to have sex with the 12 year old girl. If those things don't make him a pedophile, I would be interested in knowing your definition of the word.
 
Lolita, the book, is a sensitive masterpiece and a neverending fount of wordplay. Nabokov could write.

The words "nymphet" and "Lolita" are enduring for a reason. The man created an archetype in his underage character.

Archetypes are the shorthand for huge swaths of the real thing. You can't even have a one-liner joke without assuming that the hearer of it already has the things installed in his head. (If you follow me. I've been challenging the system with some chemical additives this evening.) I admire Nabokov's writing, and I envy his having made such a wifty damn impact on the language.

Box had it right. 'Sokay. Let 'im up!

cantdog:rose:
 
I found "Lolita" at the bottom of a stack of books on Mom's side of my parents' bed when I was a very horny fifteen. I read it because it was supposed to be a "dirty" book. I didn't find it arousing, just disturbing. I'd probably appreciate it more if I re-read it now.

It did seem well-written, though. I don't really care if Nabokov stole the idea.
 
A fave novel is Ekaterina by Donald Harington. The main character is a female Humbert who seduces what she calls a faunlet. It's not as brilliant as Lolita but a very good variation on it, and a great sendup of the literary world; also has much of quality to say on writing. The seduction scene is so well done, when I first read it I found myself 'wanting' a twelve year old boy (really). I reread the passage for the pleasure and arousal of it.

Perdita
 
Perdita, mi amor

This is still an issue for me. I told you in the "high school" thread that I'd done the whole school thing two years younger than my classmates. Precocity was always a hot button for me.

I still have a little growl when people say, "16 is just too young for [whatever]" or "But no one of age 12 can be ready for [whatever]." Some people at twenty-six are still not ready for [whatever] and other people could have easily fielded it at fifteen. You have to take people one by one.

Sex included. Setting limits based mechanically on a physical age is just for convenience. With that sort of thing, if the kid is really too young for looking at naked pictures, honestly, she won't be, or he won't be, interested enough to look. Similarly, if someone is discussing sex, at thirteen, and asking questions about it, then they are old enough to hear the answers.

I think we miss a lot by not being able to explore this boundary here in lit. But seeing the Interracial category, I can see how we might regret opening up to that. Man. A lot of those stories are just silly. Embarrassing. And I suppose the Lolita section, or whatever it would be called, Age Play, perhaps, would largely be of a nature to make you cringe. Yet there are important things to say about it.

cantdog
 
Cant, hombre, I hear you. But alas, there are less than a handful of people here that I would discuss this with seriously. Given the openess of the forum, and that I could not exclude certain voices, I'll not enter into it.

Perdita :(
 
Boxlicker101 said:
Art being as long as it is...
Dear Bo,
I've heard of men naming their ... private parts and about men bragging of their size, but it's seldom done in the same sentence.
MG
Ps. Art?
 
MathGirl said:
...I've heard of men naming their ... private parts and about men bragging of their size, but it's seldom done in the same sentence ...

Several days ago, while trying to find a site which would display the difference between German and American bra sizes for Mr. Blacksnake, I ran across a site that compares anatomy and shoe size.

Since it does not involve any part of the anatomy found on a woman, I could not imagine why Google thought it should be included in a search for information about global bra sizes.

Sometimes Googled Results are quite enigmatic, although no knowledge is ever completely wasted.
 
A Swedish author, Unni Drougge, wrote a book called Hella Hell's Bekännelser (= The Confessions of Hella Hell), in which the heroïne, Hella, has an affair with a 13-year old boy. This version is a little less common, but it's probably important to bring up the fact that it's not just "dirty old men" who lust after young girls. Youth has a special appeal to most people.

And the difference between lusting after someone who's young and loving someone who's young, is that in the latter case, you're willing to wait for the person you want to reach the age when he/she is ready to become sexually active.

When is this?

Personally, I know kids who, although they were kids in mind, had a lot of sexual experience.
I think it's as bad to stop a person from having sex just because he/she is under age, as it is to force someone who's a minor to have sex.
You're ready when you FEEL ready.
 
Then there are a few interesting comments speculating on the right size woman's shoe, and (therefore) the right size woman, for each size man's shoe. (There is a "barefoot and pregnant" joke in there somewhere.) Perhaps it's a case of one size fits all.

Thanks, VB. I've bookmarked that site.:D
 
Virtual_Burlesque said:
Several days ago, while trying to find a site which would display the difference between German and American bra sizes for Mr. Blacksnake[/b ............. no knowledge is ever completely wasted.

Dear Vi,
Any knowledge concerning Mr BS is.
MG
 
cantdog said:
Perdita, mi amor

This is still an issue for me. I told you in the "high school" thread that I'd done the whole school thing two years younger than my classmates. Precocity was always a hot button for me.

I still have a little growl when people say, "16 is just too young for [whatever]" or "But no one of age 12 can be ready for [whatever]." Some people at twenty-six are still not ready for [whatever] and other people could have easily fielded it at fifteen. You have to take people one by one.

Sex included. Setting limits based mechanically on a physical age is just for convenience. With that sort of thing, if the kid is really too young for looking at naked pictures, honestly, she won't be, or he won't be, interested enough to look. Similarly, if someone is discussing sex, at thirteen, and asking questions about it, then they are old enough to hear the answers.

I think we miss a lot by not being able to explore this boundary here in lit. But seeing the Interracial category, I can see how we might regret opening up to that. Man. A lot of those stories are just silly. Embarrassing. And I suppose the Lolita section, or whatever it would be called, Age Play, perhaps, would largely be of a nature to make you cringe. Yet there are important things to say about it.

cantdog
Adult / young teen sex doesn't appeal to me, but I became sexually active with my peers at thirteen and have written stories which reflect my early experiences.

Literotica's restriction on under-18 stories seems to be based on legal considerations. I find that understandable but unfortunate. I agree with you that prevents us from posting stories concerning an important part of human experience on Literotica.

I'm writing for entertainment, but I have a greater purpose. Sex is political and erotica is liberating. I like to believe that my writing these stories and your reading them will ultimately make our society less repressive. – from my website
 
Long years ago, before the hysteria about paedophilia, when my now 40+ year old son was a baby, there was a neighbourhood seven year old girl who was inordinately interested in helping my wife bathe him, and especially certain parts of him. We called her "the sex maniac".

It was the man next door who warned me that she was known for accusing various men in the area of trying to touch her genitals. "Nobody round here will believe her," he said, "but one man lost his job before she became so well known as a pathological liar."

So the willing Lolita-type isn't as rare as the politically correct brigade would have us believe.
 
Snooper, I think the use of 'hysteria' is a bit glib. I kinow there are wrongful accusations, but child sexual abuse is an evil reality, merely better exposed today.

Re. the girl in your past, given her age I would think she had a particular history that caused her to act as she did. I recall my sexuality at that age, and younger, but I had no reason to act as she did.

The idea of a "willing Lolita" is generally an outsider's superficial observation. If an older person senses the curiosity or palpable sexuality of a child, they usually only need manipulate from that point on. I would always give a child the benefit of the doubt, never the adult involved.

Perdita
 
cantdog said:
Perdita, mi amor

This is still an issue for me. I told you in the "high school" thread that I'd done the whole school thing two years younger than my classmates. Precocity was always a hot button for me.

I still have a little growl when people say, "16 is just too young for [whatever]" or "But no one of age 12 can be ready for [whatever]." Some people at twenty-six are still not ready for [whatever] and other people could have easily fielded it at fifteen. You have to take people one by one.

Sex included. Setting limits based mechanically on a physical age is just for convenience. With that sort of thing, if the kid is really too young for looking at naked pictures, honestly, she won't be, or he won't be, interested enough to look. Similarly, if someone is discussing sex, at thirteen, and asking questions about it, then they are old enough to hear the answers.

I think we miss a lot by not being able to explore this boundary here in lit. But seeing the Interracial category, I can see how we might regret opening up to that. Man. A lot of those stories are just silly. Embarrassing. And I suppose the Lolita section, or whatever it would be called, Age Play, perhaps, would largely be of a nature to make you cringe. Yet there are important things to say about it.

cantdog


I must admit, I found myself puzzled by the odd fastidiousness that considers forcible rape acceptable, while (to use the extremity as an example) a tale of romantic consensual sex between a 21 year-old and say, an unusually mentally and emotionally mature 17 year-old, is strictly verboten.

Not that I question Literotica; such an entity must be particularly sensitive to prevailing cultural conceptions of morality.

It is the culture in which such an irrational moral conception arises that raises interesting questions.
 
smutpen said:
I must admit, I found myself puzzled by the odd fastidiousness that considers forcible rape acceptable, while (to use the extremity as an example) a tale of romantic consensual sex between a 21 year-old and say, an unusually mentally and emotionally mature 17 year-old, is strictly verboten.

Not that I question Literotica; such an entity must be particularly sensitive to prevailing cultural conceptions of morality.

It is the culture in which such an irrational moral conception arises that raises interesting questions.

I think it's a matter of Lit. covering its collective butts. Currently, in the US, there is a great todo about pedos. I wouldn't call it hysteria either, Dita, because there is a very good reason for the great todo but sometimes things get out of hand and the courts and others lose all reason. I have heard about a person being arrested for drawing a picture of children having sex, under the law that makes having a depiction a criminal offense. A photo would mean that abuse has been committd but a drawing need not have a model so it doesn't mean anything.

Without much effort that same law could be stretched to cover written deipctions of underage sex, especially by overly zelous prosecutors, inspired by Janet Reno or others like her.

Maybe rape stories should be rejected also but rape has long been a part of literature but statutory rape has not, at least not to the same degree. Furthermorem, not all forcible rape is accepted. I had a rape story rejected on the grounds of violence and brutality. It is a short story, about 1,500 words and I can PM it to you if you are interested but I don't want to post it here. It is really a nasty story.

Sex with animals is probably legal, at least most places but such stories are also forbidden here. I believe this is a personal preference of Laurel and/or Manu, and it is their right. Perhaps they have similar feelings about stories of underage sex.
 
I still haven't read Lolita, but I've read another story by Nabakov (and it was good). He was an exite who wrote not in his native tongue. He pulled it off. So, give him a break.

Martin Amis dig him, so it's good enough for me.
 
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