When was the last time you . . .

[Varian P]

. . . changed your mind?

I mean, about a core belief. Something you've been dead certain about, and suddenly (or gradually) decided you were wrong.

Was it that someone finally made the perfect argument that led to see your former position as wrong-headed?

Or did some life experience show you the error of your earlier ways?

 

[McKenna]

I was raised a very devout Mormon. About 10 years ago I walked away from my religion.

Lots of things led up to my desertion, mostly life experiences and personal growth as a result of said life experiences.

I miss the sense of community sometimes, and feeling as though I have all the answers; life is ever-so-much more tricky to maneuver without a guidebook, but strangely worth it.

Nowadays I tend to believe those who seek, and doubt those who claim to have found. I still have Mormon roots, and I'm grateful for the decent things the philosophy (and my parents) taught me, but I won't go back.

 

[Corylea]

When I was in my early 20's, I behaved as if intelligence were the most important human trait. As I got older, it became more and more clear to me that kindness is far more important. I still like to hang around with smart people, but I have been close to a few rather unintelligent people who are kind, responsible, caring folks, and I was glad that I had grown enough as a person to be able to appreciate them.

 

[Varian P]

I was raised a very devout Mormon. About 10 years ago I walked away from my religion.

Lots of things led up to my desertion, mostly life experiences and personal growth as a result of said life experiences.

I miss the sense of community sometimes, and feeling as though I have all the answers; life is ever-so-much more tricky to maneuver without a guidebook, but strangely worth it.

Nowadays I tend to believe those who seek, and doubt those who claim to have found. I still have Mormon roots, and I'm grateful for the decent things the philosophy (and my parents) taught me, but I won't go back.

I can relate... sort of. My mom raised me Protestant, and I walked away from that. But I wasn't walking away from a whole community--we just went to church in a kind of rote way. I admire the strength it must have taken to go your own way, when it meant leaving so much behind.

 

[sr71plt]

I'm sure there's something more recent--I try not to be too doctrinaire--but the first one that sprang to mind (perhaps because I was reading one of your books, Varian) was when I counseled Sara Gruen just to shut up and take the cover the publisher was trying to force on her for her Riding Lessons because I was afraid that if she became a bother to them they'd turn down her manuscript then entitled Jacob's Ladder, which I had started reading and was a little iffy about. A week later I told her I'd changed my mind and to stand her ground on the cover because I thought Jacob's Ladder could sell elsewhere. The title of Jacob's Ladder was changed in production--to Water for Elephants. But then, I think you're a bit better writer, Varian.

My problem is not so much changing my mind but continuing to be two or three minds about most everything because I try to give every angle a fair view. About presidential candidates, and abortion, for instance.

 

[sr71plt]

I can relate... sort of. My mom raised me Protestant, and I walked away from that. But I wasn't walking away from a whole community--we just went to church in a kind of rote way. I admire the strength it must have taken to go your own way, when it meant leaving so much behind.

On religion, I change my mind but then block out my new understanding. I'm pretty sure I'm an agnostic, Unitarian, or Deist--but it's so much more comfortable and convenient continuing to be a Methodist that I pretend there's been no change.

 

[JonTX]

I changed my mind about religion when I was a teenager. After I found out that one of my cousins told my sister that our mother was going to hell because she is a Buddhist. How can any religion talk down so badly about another religion when most of their "core beliefs" are treating people kindly and treating them with the same respect that they would want in return.

To seal the deal about religion, I've traveled to lots of places in this world, I have read lots of things about other countries and it amazes me that any supreme being would let innocent people to continuously suffer under the hands of the corrupt and unjust or just suffer in misery and poverty no matter the situation. Not very caring and compassionate in my opinion of any deity who's known as a loving individual.

I believe in most of the teachings that different religions have to offer but as far as a belief that we are being watched by the all and powerful Oz or whoever floats your boat, just leaves me baffled.

 

[DeeZire]

I changed my mind about supporting MoveOn.org when they ran the 'General betray us' ad a few years ago. It just seemed so juvenile and confrontational.

Back in my younger days, I changed my mind about the undesirability of large women after spending the night with one. Yowsa!

Just tonight, I changed my mind about not spending so much time on the internet when I realized I had nothing better to do.

Speaking of religion, about two weeks ago, I almost changed my mind about being an agnostic when a gorgeous twenty-something chick with Breck hair and Maybelline lashes knocked on my door, offering an incredibly sexy smile and a hand full of Watchtower mags. I was ready to convert, but her husband was with her. Oh well, maybe next time.

 

[rgraham666]

In the early '90s when I realized that Reason is a much lesser thing than we believe it to be. And that raising it to primary status among the human traits is a dangerous thing.

The reason for that change was the book Voltaire's Bastards: The Dictatorship of Reason in the West.

Ever since I've tried to balance out Reason with other traits; common sense, ethics, imagination, intuition and memory. It's worked pretty well, so far.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

I change my mind fairly often. But what does it for me is a good case that's articulated well.

I'm reading a book about Jesus. The author is an authority on the subject. He says that Jesus was an illiterate peasant with an incredible ability to reduce complex blather to simple, straight-talk. Jesus also knew how to reframe experience and beliefs so that people changed.

ROB

No! Actually it hasnt worked out for you.

 

[Liar]

Ever since I've tried to balance out Reason with other traits; common sense, ethics, imagination, intuition and memory. It's worked pretty well, so far.

We must have different views of that the world Reason means then. For me it IS common sense, ethics, memory, and in some but lesser degree imagination. (Maybe not intuition.)

 

[Liar]

About six months ago, I realized that my granddad is no longer a human being. Alzheimer's has reduced him to a random voice box in clothes, about as sentient as a parrot.

That redefined my definition of when someone is gone, and allowed me to mourn the loss of him, even though he still walks and talks, but god knows about what.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

Well, as almost any fool knows, reason is the logical linkage of thoughts that flows from awareness to result or conclusion.

 

[gauchecritic]

That redefined my definition of when someone is gone, and allowed me to mourn the loss of him, even though he still walks and talks, but god knows about what.

There are hundreds of thousands of people that would benefit from that realisation.

The last thing I changed my mind about was JBJ, but I changed it back real quick.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

GAUCHE

You make all your important decisions picking petals off daisies, and you still believe in the Marxist Santa Claus.

 

[gauchecritic]

GAUCHE

You make all your important decisions picking petals off daisies,

That's you, but what about me?

and you still believe in the Marxist Santa Claus.

So's your face.

 

[Recidiva]

I believed in fate for a very long time. Thought everything happened for a reason.

Then I realized how much comfort I was getting from that idea, and how it minimized my reason and responsibility for actions and circumstance.

I still believe there is possibly some guidance, some reason, some pattern I can't know.

But I no longer believe in fate. My definition of fate is - if it's happened in the past, it was "fated" - if it's in the future, it's up to you to decide and choose and stick with those choices.

I also gave up an idea of what any afterlife would be because again it was limiting my reason and responsibility. So was an idea of a unversal "law" that resembled karma.

Again, there might be these things, but I act as if they don't exist so I stay here and now and not caught up in some imaginary ego game.

In the beginning it was a choice I didn't want to have to make and would pretty much rather have died than give up the comfort and purpose those ideas gave me.

Now I can't imagine going back to thinking that way or being that person. The freedom of thought and action and compassion I gained was immense.

I've tried to give up ideas that I "can't live without" because I think you can become addicted to thoughts and ideas as easily as you can to substances. I try to go on thought fasts and give up ideas. Those I can't give up like "I should protect my children" stay. Those I can give up like "I was born to save the world!" go.

Once I made that first major shift and saw the benefits from it, I became less frightened of massive personality or ideology shifts in myself and others. I really no longer consider consistency of thought to always be a benefit. Sometimes it can just be someone's inability to cross certain walls of fire in their growth. They defend the line they themselves can't cross out of fear.

It's action that matters. Not the thoughts. Thoughts are wonderful style accompaniments to substance actions. But thought on its own is empty. I've become focused on action and consequence, and dismissed as much thinking about it as possible in terms of myself or any brownie points I might get from the Universe at large. If something's worth doing, do it. Suffer the consequences and don't expect a gold star.

 

[rgraham666]

I believed in fate for a very long time. Thought everything happened for a reason.

Then I realized how much comfort I was getting from that idea, and how it minimized my reason and responsibility for actions and circumstance.

This, in my opinion, is why so many people hold so tightly to their ideas. A lot of people don't really like thinking and really don't like personal responsibility.

 

[Recidiva]

This, in my opinion, is why so many people hold so tightly to their ideas. A lot of people don't really like thinking and really don't like personal responsibility.

Yes. Unfortunately thought gives you far too many justifications and escape valves.

I'm smart enough to talk myself into anything selfish or stupid. It all sounds so...smart and reasonable. To counteract my own personal charm and way with words I had to tell myself to shut up and stick to the facts. Which may be why I do the same to others now. Personal vigilance against bullshit.

First people have to overcome lying to themselves, then they have to overcome lying to others, they they overcome others lying to them.

It's a process that has to go in order, I think. If you don't get one step down, you can't make it to the next.

And it's infuriating and frightening and awful through lots of it. Then I got to a place where lying is so easy for me to pick up on and it doesn't affect me so I just think of liars as lost little children. I've lost a lot of my hatred and anger and I just see how hard it is to escape that mental trap. That's the compassion part.

"You can't cheat an honest man. He has to have larceny in his heart in the first place." - Robert Heinlein

 

[Shwenn]

Reading Manufacturing Consent by Noam Chomsky and Edward Herman.

I thought people who said the media was a propaganda machine were conspiracy nutcases. That book completely convinced me I was wrong.

But, because I had thought the others who believed that were crazy, I don't even want to discuss the subject because I know the people I'm talking to will think the same thing about me.

It gave me a total Cassandra complex.

 

[Recidiva]

Reading Manufacturing Consent by Noam Chomsky and Edward Herman.

I thought people who said the media was a propaganda machine were conspiracy nutcases. That book completely convinced me I was wrong.

But, because I had thought the others who believed that were crazy, I don't even want to discuss the subject because I know the people I'm talking to will think the same thing about me.

It gave me a total Cassandra complex.

I gave up TV for a few years.

When I went back to watching TV almost everything made me burst into laughter, especially commercials. "Is ANYBODY buying this crap?"

Well. Yes. Fortunately not me.

Disconnecting from all media outlets for a good long while did me endless good. Even now if I want any opinion or "news" I try to triangulate from several different sources.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

RECIDIVA

Much of life is fortuitous. Some of what happens you can alter, most you cope with, and occasionally it kills you.

 

[Recidiva]

RECIDIVA

Much of life is fortuitous. Some of what happens you can alter, most you cope with, and occasionally it kills you.

The trick is to not take it personally.

 

[JAMESBJOHNSON]

RECIDIVA

Some of it is personal. The trick, I suppose, is to know when its personal.

 

[English Lady]

Hmm, I change my mind quite alot I'm sure, but thinking on big issues, I'm not sure which one was the last.

At about 17 I completely changed my view on Catholics. I'd been led to bleieve they were little more than a cult (not by my mum, must have been by people in my church) but when I started to go to a Catholic College and Catholic retreat centre I found some of the most devout Christians I've ever known. Real, true, heart deep Christians, too.


Somewhere about the same time, maybe a bit later, my whole attitude to homosexuals changed too, I started to doubt the typical Christian stance and started to believe what I still beleive now, that love, who ever it is between, is a good, God given gift to be cherished.

I'm sure there are more, sure of it, but right now I can't think of anything else off hand.