What does the US get from its alliance with Israel?

[renard_ruse]

It seems pretty one sided to me.

They don't have oil. We don't have bases there. Its so small, its geographically irrelevant.

Also, Saudi Arabia, what is that about? They sponsor Sunni terrorism and stab us in the back.

Iran, on the other hand, has much more to offer the US as an ally and partner in the fight against ISIS.

 

[phrodeau]

They've got nukes, so the US has to make nice.

 

[sexnovella]

Nothing.

Nothing.

 

[sr71plt]

The Israel alliance is comparable to the NRA in special-interest control of policy.

 

[someoneyouknow]

We get to bend over and say, "Please, give me more master". Except without the lube.

 

[Ninwalker]

It's a gift from the US to the Israelis to the tune of $10.2M every single day of the year. Or translated into different terms, each Israeli citizen recieves $500 USD from the US annually.

Given how wealthy the Israeli state is there must come a time when the citizen of the USA should ask themselves if they should continue to give one fifth of all foreign aid to Israel.

We should also ask ourselves if we should continue to give $5M per day to Egypt.

 

[BotanyBoy]

It's a gift from the US to the Israelis to the tune of $10.2M every single day of the year. Or translated into different terms, each Israeli citizen recieves $500 USD from the US annually.

Given how wealthy the Israeli state is there must come a time when the citizen of the USA should ask themselves if they should continue to give one fifth of all foreign aid to Israel.

We should also ask ourselves if we should continue to give $5M per day to Egypt.

Better than giving it to US citizens...THAT would be SOCIALISM!! OHHHHHH SCARY!!!

 

[Rachel_X]

Hummus.

 

[ishtat]

It seems pretty one sided to me.


Iran, on the other hand, has much more to offer the US as an ally and partner in the fight against ISIS.

There are some 15 million Iranian speakers who are culturally Iranian as well who live outside Iran's borders (not counting the Hazara in Afghanistan). They mostly live in the relatively weak states to the south of Russia. It's in America's interests to have all Iranians on side to contain Russia.

Isis killing huge numbers of other Arabs is pretty awful but the deaths of these people don't affect the west's fundamental interests. Eventually the traditional rulers of the Iraq/Syria/Lebanon area will re-assert themselves . The traditional rulers of this area are of course, Turkey and Iran.

The Europeans have more to lose in this part of the world than the USA. They are still oil dependent and have an ongoing refugee crisis.

But the deaths of a couple of hundred thousand Arabs per annum for the next year or two won't affect the major nation's fundamental geopolitical interests.

Israel is slowly becoming less important. Ironically they need a few stroppy Palestinians from time to time, to help arouse traditional support in the USA.

 

[Sean Renaud]

1. Israel is the only functioning democracy and representative state in the Middle East. I know, I know, some other countries play at democracy, but their elections are cooked and we all know it.

2. Geographically, Israel is a strategic partner. We don't have military bases in Israel, because we don't NEED them. Militarily, Israel is head and shoulders better than any other Middle Eastern country, aside from maybe Jordan. Want proof? They still exist!

3. Iran - Wants to "Wipe Israel Off the Map". Is anyone seriously suggesting they would make a reliable partner? Is that sentiment consistent with US values...in any way?

4. Iran - Imprisons, stones (Rajm) and kills their own citizens. Anyone remember their behavior during the Arab Spring?

5. Diversity, LGBT, Basic Freedoms - Does anyone think this website/forum would even exist in Iran? I think it's more likely to exist in Israel.

6. Iran is a state-sponsor of Terrorism. I'm not making that claim...the US state department makes it.

7. Iran wants to start fighting ISIS. LOL. Let's see how that goes. More likely, Iran will let ISIS weaken the middle east, while they sit on the sidelines. When ISIS runs out of steam, and they will, Iran will be in the perfect position to become the dominant power. ISIS helps Iran....

Israel is the only stable partner and ally in the region. Every other country is far too leaky a vessel to put much hope in, and our problems with Iran just got 1000 times worse.

1. I honestly don't pay enough attention to middle eastern politics to know if this is true but it sounds like propaganda. Besides if the last fifteen years have taught us anything its that democracy is not the best system. IT's the best system for us and other people have every right to do shit their way.

2. Well we aid them considerably but ultimately who cares?

3. Depends? Are you voting Republican? IF so yes their values are entirely aligned with ours. They simply chose a single country instead of an entire religion/race.

4. Yes. They are generally bad people.

5. I don't honestly care one way or the other. I don't run Iran, I don't live in Iran and I have no right to tell Iranians how to live so long as they mind their business.

6. The US also claimed until the day before yesterday that Cuba was a state sponsor of terrorism. I'm not saying Iran isn't. I presume that they are but the State has gotten so much wrong here that I don't quite trust their word on it.

7. That's a fantasy of yours.

Even if Israel is the most reliable they are also the source of a lot of our issues with the ME.

 

[BotanyBoy]

1. Israel is the only functioning democracy and representative state in the Middle East.

So? That doesn't mean they need our money....

2. Geographically, Israel is a strategic partner. We don't have military bases in Israel, because

Because this isn't 1500 anymore and we can steam roll any country we want in the ME in 18 hrs from across the planet.

That argument is fucking lame...try again.

3. Iran - Wants to "Wipe Israel Off the Map".

So? Sounds like Israel needs to deal with that.

4. Iran - Imprisons, stones (Rajm) and kills their own citizens.

So do we, we just use nerve gas or high dollar drugs from Company that Contributes to Campaigns inc. at some asshole high price.

5. Diversity, LGBT, Basic Freedoms - Does anyone think this website/forum would even exist in Iran? I think it's more likely to exist in Israel.

So? That doesn't mean we should be taking better care of Israel than our own.

6. Iran is a state-sponsor of Terrorism. I'm not making that claim...the US state department makes it.

Depending on how you look at it so does Israel.

7. ISIS helps Iran....

So? That's not a reason to give Israel fuck tons of money we need and don't have.

Israel is the only stable partner and ally in the region.

No they are a money pit.

 

[BotanyBoy]

5. I don't honestly care one way or the other. I don't run Iran, I don't live in Iran and I have no right to tell Iranians how to live so long as they mind their business.

That concept is simply beyond conservatives....

 

[Sean Renaud]

Especially that it's at the bottom of a long list of things that need fixing. I despise China's human rights and would go as far as to say I wish America and American companies would start putting pressure on them and meaning it. Hell give me that whole "We have to stay competitive" i don't trust the American people to do the right thing most of the time but I feel confident in people to buy Converse over Nike once you say " Converse, made in safe plants. Twelve Nike Factories burned down with children inside. That pork smell in your shoes? It's not Babe the talking pig. It's babies.

 

[BotanyBoy]

Especially that it's at the bottom of a long list of things that need fixing. I despise China's human rights and would go as far as to say I wish America and American companies would start putting pressure on them and meaning it. Hell give me that whole "We have to stay competitive" i don't trust the American people to do the right thing most of the time but I feel confident in people to buy Converse over Nike once you say " Converse, made in safe plants. Twelve Nike Factories burned down with children inside. That pork smell in your shoes? It's not Babe the talking pig. It's babies.

LOL dude I'm with you on that, I make it a point to not spend my money in China and several other slave labor shit holes any time I can. I could be more picky and just do without some things but I don't because ultimately fuck the slaves in China, Burma or Vietnam I need my Iphone so siri can tell me where the fuck I'm going. But I still try to spend the money as close to home as I can any time I have the option so I ignore the Iphone and give myself a gold star for the M'urican made toaster oven.

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/1252275057/image_400x400.jpg

 

[Sean Renaud]

I try to minimize what I buy from China but like you said it's not always easy. But I'm sure within China there are companies that are better than others and if supporting Company A over Company B slowly but surely gets the point across to China I'd be down and I'm sure some of them are already better if for no other reason than random luck of the draw.

 

[BotanyBoy]

But I'm sure within China there are companies that are better than others and if supporting Company A over Company B slowly but surely gets the point across

I'm sure there are.

But I'm pretty sure giving better companies the dollar over shit bag companies is the most surefire way to get that point across.

If you keep giving them money for being scummy they will just keep being scummy. If you make rules and tell them how evil they are and still keep giving them money for being scummy they will find way around those rules to get the money.

Don't give them money and they are powerless to do anything.

 

[Sean Renaud]

Oh, I agree but every choice is important.