What do you do when you know it's crap?

[Djmac1031]

@Mastered_again

I wrote about this in more length recently in another thread, but recently I started a story, got about 2K words in when it died.

A few months later, started a new story and while writing that one realized a large chunk of the old unfinished one would fit perfectly in the new one, with just a few name changes and edits.

So even a "crap" story can be salvaged sometimes.

 

[pink_silk_glove]

I've started Part 12 of my series. I've got the thing outlined through 15 parts ( at least, some might merit further division).

The point is I'm about 1500 words in (each chapter had been 8-12,000), and I just reviewed it. It's crap. There's some snippets of good dialog and the storyline is what i want, but I feel I've chosen the wrong milieu and getting there feels contrived.

I'll save what I've written (for the dialog), but otherwise, I'm starting over.

That's the problem with a serial isn't it? You're publishing stuff and laying down canon before you know how the story goes. Sure you have 2 or 3 or 5 chapters planned ahead but you don't know how it all wraps up and ends. It all starts to meander and sooner or later you will get to a point where you're jumping the shark. So you need advice on how to avoid jumping that shark. Well you're in the same boat as the TV series that has run it's course. There's really not much you can do since you started publishing canon before you knew where it was ultimately headed.

How to avoid this? Prioritize plot over feedback. Map everything out and know where it's going and how it will tie up before you publish anything, which in your case (and in many many cases) is too late. You started a serial and you published early because you prioritized feedback over plot. You got your feedback, now your story is suffering.

Does your favorite novelist publish his novels one chapter at a time? Of course not. He finished the whole story before it publishes. Instead you're writing like a TV show and few TV shows wrap up well. A TV show (especially and American one) can't plan when it ends. That all depends on the ratings. The vast majority get cancelled before they can end. A rare few run much longer than anticipated and so start deteriorating. If you're writing a serial like a TV show then that's the problem that you will ultimately have.

To avoid this, plan the entire thing out or even better write the entire thing out before you publish anything. It's simple logic if think about it. If you just can't wait that long to hit the publish button well then that means that you're jonesing for the bouquets and feedback more than you care about your plot. There's nothing wrong with that but you should understand what you're doing, so that when the ramp is lined up in front of that shark fin you won't be so bummed.

 

[KeithD]

I know it won't fly long before I start writing it, so I don't really have a problem about dropping it.

 

[pink_silk_glove]

I know it won't fly long before I start writing it, so I don't really have a problem about dropping it.

I think that it is likely that the OP would not have a problem neither except that the piece in question is a chapter in a serial.

 

[Mastered_again]

That's the problem with a serial isn't it? You're publishing stuff and laying down canon before you know how the story goes. Sure you have 2 or 3 or 5 chapters planned ahead but you don't know how it all wraps up and ends. It all starts to meander and sooner or later you will get to a point where you're jumping the shark. So you need advice on how to avoid jumping that shark. Well you're in the same boat as the TV series that has run it's course. There's really not much you can do since you started publishing canon before you knew where it was ultimately headed.

How to avoid this? Prioritize plot over feedback. Map everything out and know where it's going and how it will tie up before you publish anything

I think that it is likely that the OP would not have a problem neither except that the piece in question is a chapter in a serial.

The problem has nothing to do with feedback and the story is mapped out. My issue is that the setting/location created issues with the narrative. The dialog was going well. The plan is to change the setting so that it compliments the dialog rather than becoming an obstacle. Therefore, I must go back and rewrite substantial portions. This may also have implications for the dialog, maybe not. Time will tell.

 

[TheRedChamber]

Well, if you're only 1,500 words in, it's not that big a deal to bin the whole thing and start from scratch if that's really what you want to do - I'd echo others and say never delete anything - it sounds like you want to be scooping out some of the dialogue anyway. It's when you get to, say, 10,000 words and there are problems where there's more of a case for trying to stick things out (at least for a while).

I would normally set the story aside for a week or a month, write something else, and then come back to it with fresh eyes. Often, to me, something being 'crap' means there's one specific problem with it - it's too wory, or I haven't worked out who the FMC quite is yet. Once, you have something specific to fix, it becomes a lot easier. Probably not with only 1,500 words, but another alternative is to give it to someone familiar with your work and see what they think. I've done that with complete stories - handed it over saying "This is total crap and almost certainly not worth publishing" and they've gotten back to me saying "I don't see how this is different from anything else you've written."

The other thing you can do, if you're pretty confident that the plot isn't going to change, is just power through. Skip to another scene if needs be, but keep writing. During that process, you might get back into the zone, work out more about your story or characters. Of course, you might write another few thousand words of crap. But the more you write, the more information you're gathering for the inevitable post-mortem.

 

[Mastered_again]

Well, if you're only 1,500 words in, it's not that big a deal to bin the whole thing and start from scratch if that's really what you want to do - I'd echo others and say never delete anything - it sounds like you want to be scooping out some of the dialogue anyway. It's when you get to, say, 10,000 words and there are problems where there's more of a case for trying to stick things out (at least for a while).

I would normally set the story aside for a week or a month, write something else, and then come back to it with fresh eyes.

We'll be on holiday next week, so the writing will as well. Hopefully the change of scenery will provide one the story needs.

 

[pink_silk_glove]

The problem has nothing to do with feedback and the story is mapped out. My issue is that the setting/location created issues with the narrative.

Then I could argue that it's not mapped out as well as you think and therefore, not really finished.

 

[Duleigh]

I've started Part 12 of my series. I've got the thing outlined through 15 parts ( at least, some might merit further division).

The point is I'm about 1500 words in (each chapter had been 8-12,000), and I just reviewed it. It's crap. There's some snippets of good dialog and the storyline is what i want, but I feel I've chosen the wrong milieu and getting there feels contrived.

I'll save what I've written (for the dialog), but otherwise, I'm starting over.

Any suggestions or similar experiences?

I'm kind of new at this writing stuff

Keep what you have, there may be some gold in there, then start over and come back at it from a different angle, introduce something new

 

[Mastered_again]

Keep what you have, there may be some gold in there, then start over and come back at it from a different angle, introduce something new

That's the plan. I've figured out how I'll change things. Just haven't written a lick (literally and figuratively)

 

[Mastered_again]

I just made some cheddar chive biscuits the other day. They were awesome.

I think I need fresh cream of tartar (not Cream from a Tartar, although that might make a good fantasy working title). They came out a little flat. Good flake and flavor nonetheless.

 

[RejectReality]

I have a folder called "half-baked" where I store story ideas that didn't pan out. Every so often, one comes out of the folder and gets finished after some tweaking. Most just get the useful ingredients plucked out of them while what's left gathers dust forever in the back of that cupboard.

 

[mirafrida]

Seems to me you've already done the hard part, which is re-reading with as much of a fresh/independent eye as possible, and acknowledging bluntly that it isn't working.

I think can be hard but useful to try to tease apart why it's not working - identifying what the 'aura' should be, and why this is missing the target. That requires detaching from the words on the paper and trying to refind that 'platonic ideal' of the story that inspired you in the first place.

Another angle to approach it from is to really plunge into the characters' minds. Often, for me, when things are going wrong it's because I have allowed plot to take precedence over characters. If I set my plot needs aside for a while, and just let the characters honestly react to the situation I've put them in, then it often leads to better plot directions - or at a minimum, gives me a clue as to how the situation needs to change in order to give me the plot I had in mind.

As others have said, more often than not, I discover I don't need to dispose of the body, just perform some careful surgery (rewrite a key paragraph or two, reorder major events, drop a digression that I'm attached to but just doesn't work, etc.)

 

[Rob_Royale]

It gets back burnered. Think about it for a few weeks, figure it out. Restart.

 

[Blind_Justice]

If it doesn't turn out as either I or my beta readers think it should turn out, I take the good bits and iterate. For "Mud & Magic" with it's 320k words, I've easily written another 100k in false starts or scenes where I missed the mark on tone, descriptiveness or the end result. I've kept most of that because some of those false starts ended in gratuitous sex scenes I might reuse somewhere else

Don't get discouraged by false starts. Happens more often than you think, even (or especially) to experienced writers. I tend to have a clear outline, a goal where I want a certain section of my story to end up at eventually, but the way to get to said outcome is often uncertain and prone to side treks and hiccups or unforseen blockages. Sometimes just closing the document and approaching the piece from a different angle - another POV, maybe with a bit more (or less) run up can be just the ticket to get things where they are supposed to go.

And then there are other days when, no matter how hard you try, I'll end up with a steaming pile of crap. Brute-forcing doesn't help. Turning off the computer, taking a walk, maybe sleeping on it might help but there have been projects which were beyond saving - even after putting 80k words into them. Like my cyberpunk wrestling/bloodsport story which ended up a stillbirth. I'm still quite devastated, but reworking THAT into something readable would basically requiring a complete rewrite, only keeping the characters and some situations. And I really don't have the stamina for that at the moment...

 

[AchtungNight]

Another possible strategy is to pile on more crap until you have a Golgothan Demon of a story. Then release it to the world and see if you can handle the consequences. Certain artists I know in Hollywood (Kevin Smith is one) have done this to great applause and criticism many times over the years.

 

[JaxRhapsody]

Sometimes when I'm writing them. Sometimes when I'm thinking about them, in which it doesn't get written, a story never written doesn't exist. It's rare that I don't finish a story... eventually, so even if it is crap; there it goes to ruin somebody's day for having read it.

 

[Smuttyandfun]

When I don't like how a story is turning out, I'll sometimes copy it and rework it. Then I can start on a fresh page, and look back and try to see what I liked and where I went wrong. Sometimes it helps to give me a fresh start, especially if I'm feeling really frustrated and ready to delete the whole thing.

 

[Kumquatqueen]

I come back a week or two (or months) later. My first drafts are always crap. I just need a crap skeleton to exist so I can rewrite every paragraph into something better.

It is what it is.

 

[gunhilltrain]

Keep what you have, there may be some gold in there, then start over and come back at it from a different angle, introduce something new

It doesn't always work that way, but sometimes it does. I have an old story that I got back to because it fits into the "City College in the '70's" timeline. (Actually, I completely messed up the timeline on that; maybe it will be a novel someday, like I originally planned. ) So I looked at the draft of this thing, which is years old, and it is, frankly, terrible. Yet I thought I should make an attempt to salvage it, and maybe I can. Just maybe, after years of banging away at these texts, I have learned something.

 

[Duleigh]

It doesn't always work that way, but sometimes it does. I have an old story that I got back to because it fits into the "City College in the '70's" timeline. (Actually, I completely messed up the timeline on that; maybe it will be a novel someday, like I originally planned. ) So I looked at the draft of this thing, which is years old, and it is, frankly, terrible. Yet I thought I should make an attempt to salvage it, and maybe I can. Just maybe, after years of banging away at these texts, I have learned something.

4 years ago I wrote a "Trapped in a Blizzard" story as an exercise and a lot of my stories are based on that story. There were a few gems in there and I want to resurrect the story and publish it but DAMN! That was then, this is now... what the hell was I thinking? You're right, pounding away at the keyboard for several years, getting feedback from readers and fellow authors gets a few neurons firing

Do I have enough time to do an entire facelift on this story before November? We'll see.

 

[gunhilltrain]

I come back a week or two (or months) later. My first drafts are always crap. I just need a crap skeleton to exist so I can rewrite every paragraph into something better.

It is what it is.

I don't know how writers used to use typewriters and, before that, pens and paper. Somebody said it forced them to think more about what they were doing. Maybe, but I can't imagine doing multiple drafts that way.

By co-incidence, I found photos of some texts done by de Sade, perhaps an inspiring figure for some Lit writers. The point is: how many times did he have to do these? He couldn't have possibly just written it once from start to finish? How did he and other writers in that era (before typewriters) handle these things?

https://static.independent.co.uk/s3fs-public/thumbnails/image/2016/11/02/10/marquis-de-sade.jpg

Rolled up, no less:

https://www.dicopathe.com/wp-conten...a_bastille_manuscrit_du_marquis_de_sade_0.jpg

 

[JaxRhapsody]

I still have the unfinshed drafts of the unfinishable stories. If BGCLive was still around, yall could read them. I just don't think they're salvagable. I have been thinking about that abandoned gay gothic romance I was trying to do, but ehhh...

 

[gunhilltrain]

4 years ago I wrote a "Trapped in a Blizzard" story as an exercise and a lot of my stories are based on that story. There were a few gems in there and I want to resurrect the story and publish it but DAMN! That was then, this is now... what the hell was I thinking? You're right, pounding away at the keyboard for several years, getting feedback from readers and fellow authors gets a few neurons firing

Do I have enough time to do an entire facelift on this story before November? We'll see.

Could you remind me, which contest or challenge (if that is what it is) has a November deadline? That's a bit of pressure on you to revise something that old. I'm deliberately taking my time, but it usually takes a while to write anything, new or revised. Some things just can't be rushed. And as you suggested, it takes a lot of practice to learn to write.

 

[Duleigh]

Could you remind me, which contest or challenge (if that is what it is) has a November deadline? That's a bit of pressure on you to revise something that old. I'm deliberately taking my time, but it usually takes a while to write anything, new or revised. Some things just can't be rushed. And as you suggested, it takes a lot of practice to learn to write.

That's the Winter Holidays contest, submissions are open 11/10 to 12/6
Lit 25 also has a November submission time frame, I'm doing a Nonerotic essay for that.