Vampires and Werewolves

[Patryn]

Convoluted story here. I was looking for info on Fright Night....the celeb topic I posted got me thinking about it. That lead me to a vampirism site, which eventually lead me to a werewolf site.

Personally, I don't believe either of them exist except in the movies. There is porphyria, or "Renfield's Disease"...clinical vampirism. It's a blood deficiency that makes the affected person crave blood, meat (preferrably raw), or other iron rich foods. It also causes light sensitivity, and a thinning of the lips. I'm also aware of the history of Vlad the Impaler, which is one possible source of the vampire legend.

Here's the thing though...these people actually believe themselves to be these creatures, or have these spirits within them. As far a werewolves, I'm not talking about things like an animal totem or the Native American spirit guides. I'm talking actual shapeshifters. Some of these people actually have descriptions up of what they look like in animal form.

I can see where the idea would be alluring. As for the vampire, a beautiful evil, an elegant demon who never ages and never dies. Sort of a glorious curse, if you will. The werewolf, being able to express the "beast" or Id that's in us all without consequence. I must admit, I like most people have at one time or another, I believe, have been fascinated with either creature. But for the love of all that masquarades as holy, I don't think I AM one!!!

I really wasn't expecting to see stuff like this...it's not disturbing to me as much as it is curious. Your thoughts? Discuss.

 

[KillerMuffin]

I happen to have a really really really sick fascination with serial killers. One of the many and varied volumes I have read concerning such critters carried the story of what many believe to be the first "vampire." A baronness in whats now Germany. 1100ish, if I remember correctly, it's been a while so my facts are wildly muzzy. Now I'll have to go look it up. Ugh, thanks Patryn, nother excuse to hit the library I'm soooo happy . Hayuhtun. This woman believed that by drinking the blood of young women she too would remain young. She was so obsessed with this notion that eventually, thats all she would ingest. She is reputed to have murdered over 400 women, mostly by hanging them upside down and puncturing their jugular once and suck their blood. After reading about that, any fascination with the vampire was rather diminished.

Personally, I like the idea of werewolves. I always have, something about them seems wildly sexy to me. A transformation that is both freedom and a curse.

 

[teresafannin]

Her name was Countess Elisabeth Bathory. If I remember right, she was a distant relative of the man who murdered Vlad "The Impaler" Tepes, aka Dracula. Her preferred method was to literally shower in blood because she felt it would keep her young forever, I don't remember reading that she drank blood, but it wouldn't be surprising. One prospective victim escaped & brought the authorities. They found 100s of bodies in the dungeon.The household staff who assisted in the murders were burned as witches. The Countess, being of noble blood, was walled up inside her castle in 1610 & died 4 years later. Her family was one of the noblest in Europe, so she could not be burned as a witch.

[Edited by teresafannin on 08-09-2000 at 08:58 PM]

 

[Patryn]

You beat ME to it. hehe...yes, Elizabeth Bathory, or "The Blood Countess" is right. Can you tell I've got a slight fascination with vampires? I just can't fathom them actually existing though, in either a mythical form (ala Drakul or what's been bastardized into Dracula) or the religious form. It is an enthralling idea, however.

My mom was into serial killers. Sometimes I wonder if she wasn't doing a little "self education".

 

[teresafannin]

I love history of all kinds, especially European from the Celtic Tribes up to the Renaissance. I have a subscription to Renaissance Magazine & they did a big article on vampires a year or so ago. I have been fascinated by vampires since I watched "Dark Shadows" as a little kid. I am also a Jeopardy freak, so I have a head full of uselesss knowledge, that occasionally comes in handy.

 

[Skibum]

I wonder if that fascination has anything to do with the popularity of D&D type games.

 

[Xander]

I think you're right Skibum, and the fact that almost everybody, at some point in their lives, has wisjed for powers out of the ordinary.

And these people who claim to be a werwolf, or a vampire. Well who knows. maybe in their own minds they are.
Okay, I can't remember where I saw this, but I'll check into it after work.
There has been documented incidents of unexplainable transformations. Such as unusual hair growth, extra sensitive senses and the such.
I better go through my scientific magazines and see if I can find that particular article again.

 

[Hecate]

May I add to the Lady Bathory discussion ...

.. that from my humble knowledge she was said to mainly bathe in the blood of (female) virgins to maintain her youth and beauty.

There is (at least there was about 10 years ago - geeze I am getting old*g*) even a figurine in her memory in the London wax figures museum called "The Dungeon" (NOT Madamme Tusseauds) which is dedicated to the dark centuries of witch burning and other horrors.

It seems like this is one of the rather well-known stories... so in return it makes me wonder how much has been "changed" for popularity over the centuries *s*

 

[Svedish_Chef]

Thank god I wasn't the only one who automatically knew countess Bathory... and Hecate you are the exception... I knew you would know that.

I'm also not the only one who has over 10 books on serial killers... thank god I am not that sick.

As for the actual question.., I believe in vampires but I wouldn't believe a vampire(IE I believe that it is possible but I don't expect one to turn up at the front doorstep)

Da chef

 

[RonG]

The blood bathing angle on Elizabeth Bathory is pretty well substantiated but the vampire thing of her sucking blood was the result of one of her procurer's accusations after the authorities got involved. Anyhow, you kill that many people, being labeled a vampire is really not piling on.

Porphyria is a really sad disease and the links to vampirism started about twenty years ago. Victims don't actually crave blood but eating raw meat does ease the symptoms a bit so people working the cryptozoology angle linked the two together. Victims tend to be extremely pale and fragile, not the robust Dracula-type vampires with superhuman strength. The old silent pic Nosferatu would be a closer representation to what a porphyric vampire would look like, if such a thing existed.

 

[Skibum]

A couple of years ago I was driving to work on a secluded road through thick woods. It was around 6:30 am on Thanksgiving Day. I was passing a beaver pond, when I saw a car stopped in the road.

I stopped thinking someone was having car trouble. In the car was a tall, thin guy holding a cat and a sketch pad. When I asked what was wrong he said he was sketching a burial site where vampires buried their victims.

I left, in a hurry!

 

[CreamyLady]

Erszebet Bathory was said to have discovered the beautifying effects of blood when she slapped her maid so hard she drew blood, and noticed how the blood improved the texture of the skin on her hand.

Eeeewwww. Increasing the water, staying out of the sun, and upping the vegetables in the diet are far more efficacious, and much easier on the servants, as well.

 

[Patryn]

Xander, you wouldn't be talking about lanugo, would you? Or do you mean a sudden transformation, with an equally suddent transformation back to "normal". There is a family, I believe in Mexico but I could be wrong, where all the members have an unusual amount of body hair. It's a mutation/latent gene, but early members of that family were touted as werewolves.

I don't know if I believe in vampires...let's just say I don't disbelieve in them. Some things exist whether we believe in them or not, and just because you've never seen it doesn't mean it's not there, but I agree with the Chef in that some guy isn't going to come knocking on your door saying "Hi, I'm Bob, and I'll be you vampire this evening". Uh uh...not likely to happen.

 

[Earthgoddess]

I believe the family is South American-and it is a genetic issue as the entire family has it-dark,silky hair all over their skin...the two boys work in a Circus-I think in Mexico City-at one point I think Ringling Bros B train circus(A and B are the two traveling circuses-had them as special guest tumblers-only seen them on tv,but they are very talented and quite hirsuit) as tumblers they are only in the side show in Mexico as American circuses do not tend to have a real miday and freak show any ,more-yes folks thanks to my Father running a side show museum I have all sorts of intriguing tidbits.
On the werewolf issue-I went through an odd stage were i would torment my boyfriend by eating lots of rare beef and talking about werewolves-ok I was a drama major- at any rate we went camping with friends and I was preparing dinner and he swore he heard me growling as I ripped apart the chicken I was about to cook...I think I had him so freaked out that he saw a "wolf" instead of a frutrated cook deboning a chicken with a dull knife-he was so scared that he shrieked and I dropped the chicken..our friends return to camp and find me growling with irritation(think the Marge Simpson Noise) and covered in blood,holding a ripped up chicken -while freaked boy blathers about me being a werewolf...it made for a verry strange dinner...later in bed I was trying to make up and at the last minute decided to bite him on the neck...Big Mistake-i bite harder than I meant to and well-that was that...I never went camping with him again...
So after I gobbled him up and buried the bones-oops am I writing this or thinking this-
my point is that the human mind is far more able to scare itself than any external stimuli-he was convinced i had turned wolven, and so he sw me as such..I did the same sort of thing with the vampire issue...the mind is an amazing organ-and I am damn lucky that I didn't live in the middle ages cause I would definitely be getting toasted for being a shapeshifter...
Sorry for the long,rambling post-

 

[April]

Thank you for that. I really needed a laugh. I can picture the whole thing, too.

 

[Nexxus]

I doan kno nuthin' 'bout bathin' in no blood.
But, I do know that it is rumored that Doris Day bathed in a bathtub of Vaseline every night to keep her skin the way it looked. She's not a Vampire, but there are those who think she sucked.
Go figer!!


Nex

 

[Jade]

Patryn,

I just wanted you to know that I met a young teenage girl who thought she was a vampire at the Renassaince Fair a few years back.. She carried a rat with her and peered at passersby with her lips peeled slightly back into a wicked grin.

I think, that really she was uncomfortable with her self image and that it was her way of dealing?
She was apparently not all that popular in school... as to whether or not this was b/c of the cause of the vampire thing, I haven't a clue... but that was how it was!

 

[Patryn]

Da-amn! No matter how insecure I ever got, I never pranced around as a creature of the night.

A friend of mine had a weird experience. He was walking through the parking lot of one of our buildings at work when he was approached by this guy wearing a black cape and (I hope) fake vampire teeth. This guy wrapped up in his cloak and hissed at Joe, my friend. Oh, did I happen to mention Joe's a priest? Kinda creepy, no?

 

[Bliss]

You know Patryn, I think I've figured something out. If I post right after or close behind you, eyeballs already saw the name Patryn and I can skip through with an opinion, and you get answered, congratulated, hailed, or blamed. heehee

*hopefully my magic powers will work and only you'll be able to see that paragraph*

Anywho, my fascination has always been with witches, and vampires, rather than werewolves. I remember being in the library in elementary school absorbing the dozen or so books all about the Salem trials, "Bloody" Mary and whatever other scant history was available at that time, in an elementary school anyway. Since then I've gone through the requisite Anne Rice worship phase and gotten so over it. A string of bad books tends to dampen enthusiasm quite a bit.

I've always thought that the whole goth movement was odd because black eyeliner definitely does not enhance ones ability to influence the world around you. "I wear gauze skirts and combat mary janes and will only smoke unfiltered Camels" just does not translate to natural gifts of spirit.

 

[Patryn]

Change your name...I was here first. No fair riding my coat tails.

 

[Jade]

Da-amn! No matter how insecure I ever got, I never pranced around as a creature of the night.

A friend of mine had a weird experience. He was walking through the parking lot of one of our buildings at work when he was approached by this guy wearing a black cape and (I hope) fake vampire teeth. This guy wrapped up in his cloak and hissed at Joe, my friend. Oh, did I happen to mention Joe's a priest? Kinda creepy, no?

WELL? What happened ...? Don't leave me hanging.. did your friend go running... did your friend just ignore him, did he say something witty...?

And.. wait a minute.. you have a friend that is a "priest?"
What would he think of you being here.. and finally...


Gosh no kidding... I had several insecure moments as a teenager and often felt different or like as "outsider" but never once did I turn that into being a um ... "vampire." (I wished I was an Xman who hadn't gotten my power yet in my imaginative little head a few times but... uh... so .uh .. yea.. anywayz)...

 

[KillerMuffin]

I knew a guy who got kicked out of the navy for the whole vampire thing. He used to put on black sweats, his boondockers (naval combat boots), his navy issue rain coat, black makeup and fake teeth. He would then manage to hang about the top of the hallway for hours. He'd have a hand and foot braced on each wall and just hang there. One day he dropped on the XO. She was not amused. I met him again about 3 months after he got out and didn't recognize him. He looked, well, preppy, not at all goth.

 

[Patryn]

My friend Joe, the priest, just walked away laughing.

Joe is not what most people's idea of a typical Catholic priest are. He certainly broke the mold in my eyes. He is still an ordained priest...he can give last rights and communion, hear a confession, or say a mass. He is still bound by his vows, he's just not affiliated with a parish right now. He got out of it because he was tired of the church focusing more on money than helping people grow spiritually. He also began to seriously disagree with what he calls the "Catholic guilt" syndrome, or "you're not good enough to be anything but God loves you anyway, be thankful for it".

He's very intelligent and open minded. He doesn't know I come here because the topic's never come up in conversation, but if he did, I know that he would have no problem with it. He might even check it out for himself to see why it interests me.

He's just a normal good natured guy. He likes to kid around, even if it involves double entendre or other "risque" topics. I got out for a beer with him on occasion after work. He respects my spiritual beliefs and why I don't practice a religion, and he feels there's a lot to be learned by my life experiences, many of which he himself has missed. He likes to debate theology, pschycology, and philosophy, and he's always willing to listen to and consider an opposing opinion. He's a great person to go to for advice as he knows a lot about human nature and how powerful emotions can be, and that there's always an exception to any rule you can think of under the right circumstances.

He's not exactly the "corrupted innocent", but he's the closest I've ever come. He's comfortable in himself and comfortable to let others be and discover themselves. I respect that. That and he's just fun.

 

[Bliss]

Change your name...I was here first. No fair riding my coat tails.

Stop Patrynizing me, can't you see I'm in payne?

 

[Patryn]

That was the funniest thing I've heard all day....wait, would that be an insult?